Willie on Shannon

ishmael whale

Did anyone every actually assess the cost of the stopover to the Irish economy? Or are the politics so fraught they reckoned it just wasn't worth asking the question?

http://www.sbpost.ie/breakingnews/breaking_story.asp?j=2826030&p=z8z6x45&n=2826122&x=

“Former airline chief calls for end to airports split

The Government should end the “crazy” split between Dublin and Shannon airports imposed on Irish airlines, former Aer Lingus chief Willie Walsh said today. Mr Walsh told a meeting of air industry officials at the Institute of European Affairs in Dublin that an “open skies” policy needed to be implemented for the benefit of both airlines and passengers.

“Restrictions on the (US) gateways that the Irish carriers can use and the 50/50 Shannon and Dublin split restricts not only the airlines but the passengers as well. “To move to open skies would greatly increase the number of destinations served and further competition,” he said.

Mr Walsh, who left Aer Lingus two weeks ago, told the meeting that while the company’s flights between Dublin and JFK, New York, made a profit in 10 out of 12 months in 2001, Routes from Shannon to JFK were loss-making for 10 months in the year. “Airlines are being forced to generate profitability on Dublin routes to offset losses on the Shannon routes,” he said……”

jbkenn

ishmael whale wrote:

Did anyone every actually assess the cost of the stopover to the Irish economy? Or are the politics so fraught they reckoned it just wasn't worth asking the question?

Did anyone every actually assess the cost of the abolition of the stopover to the Irish economy? Or are the politics so fraught they reckoned it just wasn't worth asking the question?

In light of your other posts on transport matters, rail etc, a meeting is being called in the Wesht to decide how we can do the honourable thing by our overburdened tax paying fellow citizens in the East.

Among the items on the Agenda are

1. Tolling all bridges across the Shannon, tolls will only be applicable on West to East journeys, East to West will be free, to facilitate aid convoys.

2. Dig up all railway lines, ye can have the rails but as the sleepers are second hand perhaps we could keep them for firewood

3. Disconnect all oilfired central heating, and burn the sleepers instead.

4.Turn off all electricity services, thereby saving the ESB the cost of the totally unnecessary infastructure replacement, currently underway.

5. An immediate ban on the construction of all new homes, with the exception of holiday homes in area's of scenic tranquility, planning priority to be given to people who can produce an 01 phone bill.

6. Close all airports west of the Shannon particularly Shannon Airport, for other than emergency flights, which were Dublin bound, and Cork cant take, besides, we wont be going anywhere anyway, without an arse in our trousers, and if it is a real emergency, we can always get a lift out on one of the returning aid convoys.

7. Control our breathing, so that we dont consume the air that could be better utilised by our betters in the East of the country, and, we seem to be only wasting our breath anyway.

8. Desist from continually generating "hot air" by calling for investment in the West, as "hot air" production is the sole preserve of our tithe paying betters in the East.

9. Any other business.


jbkenn

chewy

isn't this false offset the whole point of shanon ariport?

ishmael whale

jbkenn wrote:

Did anyone every actually assess the cost of the abolition of the stopover to the Irish economy? Or are the politics so fraught they reckoned it just wasn't worth asking the question?

No, I don't think they got much further than deciding that Dublin Airport would take over the cost of building Shannon's new terminal while its own bursts at the seams.

Does anyone seriously hold the belief that the stopover benefits the Irish economy?

jbkenn wrote:

In light of your other posts on transport matters, rail etc, a meeting is being called in the Wesht to decide how we can do the honourable thing by our overburdened tax paying fellow citizens in the East.

It's fine, you don't need to go so far. It would be enough just to take on responsibility for the consequences of your own actions, rather than banging on central government for the next white elephant.

MG

Yerra shure, isn't it only Ismael on one of his anti-regional rants again. Now let's all get back to the pub and spend the postal orders sent down from those nice lads in Dublin.

dmeehan

ishmael whale wrote:

Did anyone every actually assess the cost of the stopover to the Irish economy? Or are the politics so fraught they reckoned it just wasn't worth asking the question?

http://www.sbpost.ie/breakingnews/breaking_story.asp?j=2826030&p=z8z6x45&n=2826122&x=

“Former airline chief calls for end to airports split

The Government should end the “crazy” split between Dublin and Shannon airports imposed on Irish airlines, former Aer Lingus chief Willie Walsh said today. Mr Walsh told a meeting of air industry officials at the Institute of European Affairs in Dublin that an “open skies” policy needed to be implemented for the benefit of both airlines and passengers.

“Restrictions on the (US) gateways that the Irish carriers can use and the 50/50 Shannon and Dublin split restricts not only the airlines but the passengers as well. “To move to open skies would greatly increase the number of destinations served and further competition,” he said.

Mr Walsh, who left Aer Lingus two weeks ago, told the meeting that while the company’s flights between Dublin and JFK, New York, made a profit in 10 out of 12 months in 2001, Routes from Shannon to JFK were loss-making for 10 months in the year. “Airlines are being forced to generate profitability on Dublin routes to offset losses on the Shannon routes,” he said……”

the fact that Ryanair & Easyjet are flying to/from shannon proves that there is a local demand for air travel. no outdated stopover rule forced these airlines to land in shannon. they do so because there is money to be made in shannon.

Metrobest

The sooner the Shannon stopover is killed off, the better. Most passengers want to travel to and from Dublin. And they want to fly direct to different parts of the US. The stopover is a throwback to the de Valera era.

I don't believe in subsidising regional airports. It is a waste of taxpayers' money. Ireland is overstuffed with useless airports.

Knock, Sligo, Waterford, Donegal and Galway should have their subsidies ended. These airports are not commercially viable, never will be. The Aer Arran routes to Dublin cost the taxpayer millions. If these were rail routes, they would have been shut down years ago. Why should we subsidise rich businessmen who want to lord it over the rest of us by taking planes from Galway to Dublin, "because they're worth it"?

If these airports can attract low cost airlines, good luck to them. If they can't, then why are we wasting our money on them? By the time one checks in/checks out of Aer Arann the train is almost as quick.

ishmael whale

dmeehan wrote:

the fact that Ryanair & Easyjet are flying to/from shannon proves that there is a local demand for air travel. no outdated stopover rule forced these airlines to land in shannon. they do so because there is money to be made in shannon.

Indeed, Shannon can attract its own business. So why the need for a compulsory stopover?

MG wrote:

Now let's all get back to the pub and spend the postal orders sent down from those nice lads in Dublin.

Nice to see an air of realism finally entering the debate.

dowlingm

Can we get a sticky posted on any transport related BB?

WATERFORD DOES NOT GET A PSO SUBSIDY.

Kerry (Farranfore) does.

chewy

the fact that Ryanair & Easyjet are flying to/from shannon proves that there is a local demand for air travel. no outdated stopover rule forced these airlines to land in shannon. they do so because there is money to be made in shannon.


but isn't it only becuase that there busines model of landing at out of the way airports to be cheaper?? and shannon won't work for all airlines if the compulsory stopover is stopped as it should be,

although im in favour of decentralisation in theory...

of course but i can't resist but to mention that Shannon is so desperate for money that it will refuel planes going to bomb the mideast and cia jets kidnapping people around the world(<fact).

and i also won't mention that two anti-war protestors were able to wander around the arifield for 5 hours undetected but shannon but out a statement saying they were caught after 5 minutes???

to me there lines that shoudn't be crossed just to support the regions!!!

ishmael whale

jbkenn wrote:

Did anyone every actually assess the cost of the abolition of the stopover to the Irish economy?

Speak of the devil. Fair enough, these bods say without the Shannon stopover we’d have 10% more economic activity. So what's the basis of saying there's a cost to the Irish economy in ending the stopover?

http://www.breakingnews.ie/2005/02/15/story189410.html

Open skies could boost economy by 10%, says CCI
15/02/2005 - 12:27:36

The Chambers of Commerce of Ireland has claimed a proposed new "open skies" agreement between the EU and US could boost Ireland's economy by 10%.

The organisation said a report it commissioned found the main beneficiaries of the agreement, if it is implemented, would be Aer Lingus and Dublin Airport.

The report said the "open skies" deal would present some difficulties for Shannon Airport, but would be largely positive for the rest of the country.

The agreement is designed to remove existing regulations restricting air travel between the EU and the US.

(The actual report is here:

http://www.chambersireland.ie/index.asp?locID=133&docID=706)

ishmael whale

Why is it necessary to cloud our approach to the Open Skies agenda with bilateral approaches to the US about Shannon? Surely we should simply enter those negotiations with a policy of maximising benefits for Ireland, rather than striving to drag out the stopover policy that has hobbled us for so long.

Shannon knows what’s coming. It’s debt has been transferred to Dublin and, according to the Irish Times at the weekend, Dublin may also be expected to cover the cost of Shannon’s inevitable redundancy package. That’s enough concessions to give them a “soft landing”.

http://www.unison.ie/irish_independent/stories.php3?ca=9&si=1370784&issue_id=12295

'TOURISM Minister John O'Donoghue last night acknowledged that the mid-west must receive firm guarantees of "a soft landing" as part of the deal for losing its prized transatlantic stopover.

"Negotiations are ongoing between the US authorities and the EU Commission and - in anticipation of the prospect of open skies and the stopover coming to an end - it makes perfect sense for the Government to ensure that Shannon gets a soft-landing," he told a keynote Cork Chamber of Commerce tourism conference.

He said it was important for the Government to discuss the situation unilaterally with the United States.

"We now have three independent airport authorities and the Shannon authority has recently rolled out a plan over the coming years which anticipates the loss of the stopover," he said.

He predicted an unprecedented multi-million euro tourism boom for the country which would see Aer Lingus doubling its US traffic in three years once the controversial bilateral aviation agreement was eased.
The minister said he understood the importance of including guarantees about Shannon's future viability as part of the whole renegotiation process.
However, Mr O'Donoghue stressed that Ireland could not ignore growth opportunities - particularly in light of increasing competition from eastern European countries…..'