Hit by a bull (almost)

joolsveer

This morning I just missed being hit by a four wheel drive vehicle which had a large chromed steel protuberence on the front. It had an 04 registration. I was driving my not so trusty Mégane and by braking hard I avoided being side swiped. Surely these bull or roo bars are illegal? What is their purpose in Dublin driving?

If these bars are not illegal should they be?
Would the driver of such a vehicle invalidate his/her insurance?

lomb

if he kills someone with them hes in serious **** for sure

BrianD

Insurance company wouldn't be happy though some of these bull bars are made from plastic nowadays.

comanche

Think they are illegal in the uk coz of pedesterian fatalities. If a child hitting a car is given very little chance of surviving as his head will more than likely hit the bull bars as opposed to the bonnet which is designed to give.

Don't think they are illegal here though. Pity the folks over here wouldn't keep an eye on some of the good ideas in other countries!

unkel

joolsveer wrote:

Surely these bull or roo bars are illegal?

Not yet, there's some EU rule in the making that will make them illegal. After that only plastic ones are allowed. Will look even more stupid :rolleyes:

Seanie M

What also bugs me are the jeep drivers who add another set of lights ON the bull bars. Those flippin' things are at eye level with car drivers, and you are getting more than the wattage from 2 high beams coming at you - never mind the fcukers who put FOUR extra lights on their bull bars. I have reported a few jeep drivers before for these, and I won't stop.

In my opinion, those extra lights are dangerous, especially on smaller roads were you are dazzled and can't see properly - you could rung the risk of hitting them, or bouncing off the verge/hedge and into them. To put extra lights on bullbars is illegal I think too.

I don't like it.

Seanie.

jozi

Seanie M wrote:

What also bugs me are the jeep drivers who add another set of lights ON the bull bars. Those flippin' things are at eye level with car drivers, and you are getting more than the wattage from 2 high beams coming at you - never mind the fcukers who put FOUR extra lights on their bull bars. I have reported a few jeep drivers before for these, and I won't stop.

In my opinion, those extra lights are dangerous, especially on smaller roads were you are dazzled and can't see properly - you could rung the risk of hitting them, or bouncing off the verge/hedge and into them. To put extra lights on bullbars is illegal I think too.

I don't like it.

Seanie.

I had someone behind me like that the other day was right up my back side.
Anoyed me so much rather that speed up to go 80 i just stuck at 50, it was only a short distance as i turned of.
Still highly anoying and makes driving harder in my opinion.

Jozi

joolsveer

Bull-Bars Banned

31/5/05



The European Parliament has voted to ban all "bull-bars" on vehicles from January 2006.

Manufacturers had already signed up to a voluntary ban not to fit the rigid bars to new vehicles, but there was nothing to stop people buying them as accessories. The bars significantly increase the risk of injury or death to a pedestrian - after all, they were originally designed to kill stray animals without damaging the vehicle. While all modern vehicles are designed to crumple on impact (albeit a lot less than the unfortunate pedestrian), bull-bars remain totally rigid.

It is hoped that the new law will prevent deaths and injuries in Europe, according to the Transport Research Laboratory.

aodh_rua

I'd an engineering lecturer once who said that 'bullbars can trisect a small human being'. Definitely more of a menace than anything else - especially on vehicles that never see beyond the M50 never mind off any other road.

peasant

The European Parliament has voted to ban all "bull-bars" on vehicles from January 2006.

Good ...and about time.

Never was there anything as lethal and pointless as a bull bar.

PS: I drive a 4x4

PPS: whosoever insists on sticking on a plastic one is just sad,sad,sad

lomb

u guys are missing the point of bullbars. they are so if u had a stray deer or a sheep on a dark mountain road your car isnt totalled.city users dont understand how vulnerable cars are on dark country roads.

they are a nuisance of course to pedestrians as they are misused. i reakon plastic bullbars are a good option though to protect the jeep somewhat against hitting something

30-6shooter

people are just jealous cause they cant afford real jeeps. Bullbars are class! 2 of my uncles have landcruisers and both have bullbars. Me being a youngster bought spot lamps for them and I reckon there pretty sweet looking.It has all the chrome accessories, sidesteps, light guards, and the bullbar is the triple big one and all chrome too.

The other crusier has the same only in stainless steel. You need them out here in the sticks. 1 of my neighours had his 1st car (3dr corolla) written off by a fookin deer and him with only 3rdParty,fire + theft. And these jeeps are hard working jeeps too, not SUV schoolrunner and leave the road every day.

Ps: A good solicitor will get anyone out of "possible grey area trouble" if a wanker is whinging because he got hit by a bullbar, and thats a fact cause i know of people who tried to claim the bullbar was responsible for more damage to their car when hit by 1 even tho it was the car at fault, and were just trying to blame the jeep/van driver.

heggie

what pisses me off is the lights as mentioned, they are right in my eyes as I have a low car, nearly blind me

alias no.9

30-6shooter wrote:

people are just jealous cause they cant afford real jeeps. Bullbars are class! 2 of my uncles have landcruisers and both have bullbars. Me being a youngster bought spot lamps for them and I reckon there pretty sweet looking.It has all the chrome accessories, sidesteps, light guards, and the bullbar is the triple big one and all chrome too.

The other crusier has the same only in stainless steel. You need them out here in the sticks. 1 of my neighours had his 1st car (3dr corolla) written off by a fookin deer and him with only 3rdParty,fire + theft. And these jeeps are hard working jeeps too, not SUV schoolrunner and leave the road every day.

Ps: A good solicitor will get anyone out of "possible grey area trouble" if a wanker is whinging because he got hit by a bullbar, and thats a fact cause i know of people who tried to claim the bullbar was responsible for more damage to their car when hit by 1 even tho it was the car at fault, and were just trying to blame the jeep/van driver.

How about driving at an appropriate speed where there's a risk of deer on the road? How about a vehicle that doesn't need half a mile to stop? How about a vehicle that's agile enough to be able to swerve somewhat to avoid an obstacle without risk of rollover?

kermit_ie

Welcome to the country, there is a constant risk of deer on the road.

Imposter

I think they should be allowed on agricultural jeeps but not on others. Using the argument used by the last few posters would mean that people should be allowed to have bullbars on cars! Ok it would look silly but would have the same 'practical' application as having them on jeeps. That is silly.

alias no.9

There's no reason why bulbars could not be designed such that they can be easily detached from the jeep for road use and reattached for 'work' use. There are towbars that can be removed and reattached quite easily and quickly.

lomb

alias no.9 wrote:

There's no reason why bulbars could not be designed such that they can be easily detached from the jeep for road use and reattached for 'work' use. There are towbars that can be removed and reattached quite easily and quickly.

wouldnt be alot of use if a deer runs out in front of u when u doing 60 mph. it happens in canada all the time, can kill the driver and totally demolish the car. turns out some insurance policys wont cover u as its an act of god....especially car rental policies. i know that for a fact. moral of the story rent a cheap car.......or a jeep with a bull bar

Dades

There're pretty big Down Under, too.

Make mincemeat out of kangaroos, dingos, sharks or anything that wanders in front of a car on a moonless night...

:eek:

Imposter

The Atheist wrote:

There're pretty big Down Under, too.

Make mincemeat out of kangaroos, dingos, sharks or anything that wanders in front of a car on a moonless night...

Have you been drinking?

peasant

Nonsense.

You do not NEED a bullbar ...ever.
As if the country was teeming with deer, waiting to jump out and attack you.

And even with a BB attached, hitting a deer at force is still going to do significant damage. All that soft tissue hitting you at a 100 kmh. Doesn't matter if it's pre-broken by the bar ...it'll still hit you.

But you are MUCH more likely to hit another car, a cyclist, a pedestrian, playing children, drunks walking home, ... slicing them up like with an egg-slicer if you do.

They should have been banned long ago.


If your willie isn't big enough, get viagra ...not a bullbar

Dades

Imposter wrote:

Have you been drinking?

Well yes, but only H20...

lomb

peasant wrote:

Nonsense.

You do not NEED a bullbar ...ever.

of course u do, see my post before, mayb not in this country but u need it in canada/oz/alaska/ etc

Scruff

kermit_ie wrote:

Welcome to the country, there is a constant risk of deer on the road.

yes, it is 1029823323.2 times greater risk than hitting another vehicle or pedestrian. bloody deer, they're our version of the cane frog, they're every where.
I opened my fridge the other day and one jumped out from behind a head of lettuce and pranced out my front door, crupmling my car on the way out the gate because i hadnt any bull bars...

lomb

alias no.9 wrote:

How about driving at an appropriate speed where there's a risk of deer on the road? How about a vehicle that doesn't need half a mile to stop? How about a vehicle that's agile enough to be able to swerve somewhat to avoid an obstacle without risk of rollover?

speed has little to do with a deer running in front of u

true braking distance plays a part.

i wouldnt even attempt to swerve even in a sports car, greater chance of more damage, i know this from experiance.

bull bars save lives but not in ireland, like i said they make sense in canada, oz, alaska etc.

http://thecarblog.com/personal_stories/deer_vs_my_car_80mph.php

http://www.brown.twp.franklin.oh.us/deer.htm

http://www.bbc.co.uk/insideout/southwest/series6/deer_crossing.shtml

http://www.enquirer.com/editions/2002/11/14/loc_deercrash14.html

"Across the state, drivers hit a deer almost 31,600 times in 2001, causing seven fatalities - including one in Warren County - and about $63.2 million in damage."

http://www.deercollisions.co.uk/

Kali

The Atheist wrote:

There're pretty big Down Under, too.

Make mincemeat out of kangaroos, dingos, sharks or anything that wanders in front of a car on a moonless night...

:eek:

Thats where they're needed though.. you travel along any 200km stretch of regional (not urban/suburban) highway in oz and you'll see hundreds (I'm not exaggerating in the slightest) of dead kangaroos on the side of the road, thats due to the fact that theres very little fencing, plus the buggers only come out at night. While deer are nocturnal here, its very rare to come across one at night on the vast majority of roads, the wicklow and kerry mountains being the two major exceptions.

lomb

Kali wrote:

Thats where they're needed though.. you travel along any 200km stretch of regional (not urban/suburban) highway in oz and you'll see hundreds (I'm not exaggerating in the slightest) of dead kangaroos on the side of the road, thats due to the fact that theres very little fencing, plus the buggers only come out at night. While deer are nocturnal here, its very rare to come across one at night on the vast majority of roads, the wicklow and kerry mountains being the two major exceptions.

yep id believe it, i was talking to a doctor who spent 2 years in the wilderness out in canada and he told me u NEED a 4wd, and NEED bullbars, u wont last a month out there. people who say bullbars are unneeded dont know anything. there are places in the world that are different to suburban blackrock where the chance of hitting a roo, or a deer are zero.

peasant

lomb,
I take your point about remote regions in Oz, Alaska, et al

But this is Ireland. You don't need bullbars here. (or in any other European country, for that matter)

They do far more damage to other roads users than they offer (theoretical) protection.

They are just dangerous.


And on a side note: Most of the so called bull bars I've seen fitted, would offer very little protection in a real Roo / Elk (Shark??) collission anyway as they dont really cover the front of the vehicle. They just protrude dangerously.

Another point. Most bull bars (and their fixing points on the frame) actually diminish the off road ability of a 4x4. Same goes for side steps.
Not to mention increased weight/ fuel consumption.

Stupid, pointless and dangerous "ornaments" is all they are.


(Did I mention, that I drive a 4x4 and live in the sticks?)

lomb

peasant wrote:

Stupid, pointless and dangerous "ornaments" is all they are.


(Did I mention, that I drive a 4x4 and live in the sticks?)

if u hit a deer u wouldnt say that especially if ur insurance wouldnt cover the 5+grand of damage it would do because its an act of god its excluded.

the furthur out the better , the idea is too deflect the deer away from the car, ie so it bounces off, the chassis mounts wouldnt be affected. the $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ damage occurs when the deer goes over the bonnet and damages the front end a little, and hits the roof. usually when a cars roof is damaged the vehicle is considered written off as welding in a new roof is seen as dangerous.

the deaths occur when it enters the passanger compartment thru the windscreen and hits the driver/passanger. the doctor guy said cars hitting deer happended all the time where he was (prince edward island)

note i am an animal lover but if u are going to hit a deer at speed it is already dead and the next step is to protect yourself and vehicle. u wouldnt b happy if a deer caused u 40 grand of damage and the insurers wouldnt pay.

magpie

A BMW X5 loaded with shopping travelling from the Dundrum Shopping Centre to Mount Merrion does not require bull bars. It does require a bouncy castle to be attached to the outside of it so the Valium-addled former Miss Bundoran, now married to a millionaire toilet manufacturer, doesn't mow down everything she can't see. Which as she's 18 feet up in the air and has a couple of Gin and Tonics on board is pretty much everything.

Allow bull bars on 4x4s only if pedestrians are allowed to carry Panzerfausts.

Kermitt

i think its interesting to note that it is only full width bull bars that are banned on new vehicles. 'A' bars are still road legal. they are what you see on most 4x4s now. only cover the area of the front grille and section of the bumper. These are mostly a style add on as the mountings are only a few small bolts on the underside of the vehicle.. not always the chassis... We could also ask what is the need for a 4x4 in the city at all? Blast those kerbs!