Jack and Bobby

tvnutz

Jack and Bobby starts Monday 28th February 9pm on TV3.I've seen every ep of this so far and it is brilliant.It probably won't survive past its first season since American's don't like to watch intelligent shows that make them think,but it is really good.Thats if you like that sort of show.Its from Greg Berlanti (Everwood, Dawson's Creek), Thomas Schlamme (The West Wing, Ally McBeal) and the Pilot is directed by David Nutter (Smallville, Without a Trace).

It stars the amazing Oscar/Emmy/Golden Globe winning Christine Lahti.If you are one of those people who hate the OC,try this instead!Give the first ep a go to see what you think anyway.

"Two brothers, one of whom will grow up to be the President of the United States. From the co-creators of West Wing and Everwood, the story is set in present day, but also told through retrospective interviews from the year 2049 with White House staffers and the First Lady."

Here is a trailer: http://www.thewb.com/MediaCenter/Main/1,17501,175726~splash,00.html

Don't be fooled that it is on the WB!

Mossy Monk

saw a promo for it last night

i hope it is good seeing as it is replacing The Shield
tough act to follow imo

solice

I saw the add. Hope its as good as the west wing.

Wertz

Mossy Monk wrote:

i hope it is good seeing as it is replacing The Shield
tough act to follow imo

...ain't that the truth.
I miss Mackey already...

tvnutz

I wouldnt go comparing it to the west wing,its not the same type of show,its got that aspect but it also has the family aspect(albeit really screwed up family),hence the Everwood creator.Just dont start comparing it to anything or you may be dissapointed!

JohnK

Glad to see its coming to Irish shores. I've seen the first 3 eps and was very impressed although for some reason I just cant motivate myself to watch the rest of them.

tvnutz

Now you can

doh.ie

Mossy Monk wrote:

saw a promo for it last night

i hope it is good seeing as it is replacing The Shield
tough act to follow imo

Oh, God, *don't* think this is anywhere near The Shield, in content terms
at any rate.

This is - and I cannot believe TV3 think this will work at 9pm on a Monday night - a FAMILY drama. Its politics are barely allowed to get up for air every now and again. The focus are on the family, the brothers and the university's new dean (he moves into town in the pilot.) This show would work on Saturdays or Sundays at 6pm (we're talking 7th Heaven's slot, though it is a world away from that), but trust me when I say this is not what you'll expect at 9pm on a Monday, at least not in place of The Shield.

However they dress it up, with the asides from the future looking back on 2004/5, it is still *a teen show* (which makes the 9pm slot a bit baffling.) I think it's stronger dramatically than The OC (yes, I know that airs at 9pm as well, but it has been racier), and it's very much in the Everwood quality drama mould. But The Shield, or anything like it, it ain't.

tvnutz

well its a totally different show than the shield,so dont expect that!it is quality but I wouldnt say it is a teen drama,it is more intelligent than that.Thats why I think the ratings have been bad,the show is not the typical teen show,and since the WB is mostly the teen network,all the teens either dont get it or dont like to think once and a while.Most adults also stay clear of the WB regardless of good reviews.I think if this show was on CBS or one of the other big networks,it would be doing really well.Likewise that show Clubhouse that tanked after a few eps was too much of a teen show for CBS.

*adele*

aw is that the one with logan lerman in it?he is the cutest thing ever

doh.ie

tvnutz wrote:

it is quality but I wouldnt say it is a teen drama,it is more intelligent than that.

I still think it's a teen drama based on its plots overall (first loves, first time sex, school bullies, fitting in, love triangles etc.). While it does have an edge to it in some of the earlier ones (Republican/Democrat viewpoints, use and legality of marijuana, the US election, the role of women in Muslim society), overall these are still secondary to the family/teen drama elements.

tvnutz wrote:

Thats why I think the ratings have been bad,the show is not the typical teen show,and since the WB is mostly the teen network,all the teens either dont get it or dont like to think once and a while.

I half think it's because the characters are not as appealing as those in The OC or One Tree Hill - they're much more realistic, and this may be a turn-off to teen viewers. The flashbacks from the future are also probably not making sense to casual viewers - I expect these to be ultimately dropped (like Irv's narration from Everwood.) The success of The OC and One Tree Hill does suggest, though, that J&B requires a little too much in the way of thought processes for most viewers.

tvnutz wrote:

Most adults also stay clear of the WB regardless of good reviews.

Not quite true - 7th Heaven, Gilmore Girls, Everwood and Charmed have large adult audiences, even if those shows are not necessarily aimed at adults. (By adults I mean 20-35.)

tvnutz wrote:

I think if this show was on CBS or one of the other big networks,it would be doing really well.

Hard to say. CBS has gone into full-blown crime-scene show mode, and this would affect perception of the network. I reckon it's about as well placed as it's going to get with what's on offer. Life As We Know It hasn't done well on ABC, despite being more adult than J&B.

Everything in TV seems to run in cycles - back in the 90s it was sci-fi (X-Files spawned The Visitor, VR.5, Nowhere Man, Earth 2, Dark Skies etc.), medical (ER begat Chicago Hope), then young women (Buffy, Felicity, Charmed), then criminal profiling (Millennium, Profiler); in the early 2000s, it was a spate of gameshows (Millionaire, Weakest Link, The Chair etc.) and now it's reality TV (Extreme Makeover, Simple Life, Amazing Race, Fear Factor, Big Brother etc.) Reality TV is king right now, alongside the police procedural (way too many to mention, but including, Cold Case, the CSIs, the Law & Order spin-offs, Medical Investigation, Missing etc.)

The commissing of new teen shows (Jack & Bobby, Life As We Know It) is probably a response to the success of The OC. All of which means when it comes to next year's material, it will be clones of Desperate Housewives and Lost which the US networks will be plunging their cash into...

tvnutz

Jack and Bobby is nothing like the OC and is ten times better.I do not think it was commisioned to be copy of The OC.The WB itself said it wanted J&B to be its adult show,it does deal with the teen aspect,but not as much as the OC,that show is like a soap.

I also think you over estimate the adult audience in the US.CSI has a huge adult audience and gets nearly 30million a week.The WB's top rated show,the horrible 7th Heaven has an average of 5.75million viewers,which is not much at all in the overall scheme of things.They wanted a huge audience,but most adults stay away from the WB.Not all of them,but the majority of them.

I havnt seen Life and We Know It,but its seems just like another teen show as well,but with more adult views on sex.Its also the adults 18-49 demo that matters.

I don't know why to be honest,but hopefully the ratings will pick up,it did have 2 death slots this year though!

doh.ie

tvnutz wrote:

Jack and Bobby is nothing like the OC and is ten times better.I do not think it was commisioned to be copy of The OC.

I didn't say it was commissioned to be a copy, I said it (and others from the 2004/5 season) were commission to duplicate *the success* of the new life breathed into the teen genre in The OC (at least in its first year). The shows are not comparable on any other level other than who they appeal to.

tvnutz wrote:

The WB itself said it wanted J&B to be its adult show,it does deal with the teen aspect,but not as much as the OC,that show is like a soap.

If anything, Everwood is the show which has stronger adult appeal (more adult characters with an equal focus on them as on the kids). J&B, as much as it allows strong development of Grace, is still a show about the brothers.

tvnutz wrote:

The WB's top rated show,the horrible 7th Heaven has an average of 5.75million viewers,which is not much at all in the overall scheme of things.

You said in an earlier post that most adults don't watch the WB. It's true, they don't, but its highest ratings are at the top *because* of the adults watching alongside their teenagers. The channel's successes are down to adult audiences, even if the programmes (or advertisers) are not targetting them. I didn't mention the much wider adult audiences for NBC, CBS and ABC. Obviously those channels have larger adult audiences - it is the newer WB and UPN, and still to a certain extent Fox, which cater for the under 30s market.

tvnutz

ahhhh all the quotes confusing me!Lol I get what you are saying but I think Jack and Bobby is still quite adult,there hasnt been much brother bonding as i thought there would be,there is however the grace and tom thing.I do love Everwood,but I cant stand 7th Heaven.

and on your point about the flash forwards,i dont think the show would be good without them,and im just sitting down to watch everwood S3 E16 and irv is narrating the beginning! :P Thats the first time in a while,isnt it?

doh.ie

tvnutz wrote:

and on your point about the flash forwards,i dont think the show would be good without them,and im just sitting down to watch everwood S3 E16 and irv is narrating the beginning! :P Thats the first time in a while,isnt it?

Yeah, saw that on 3x16. They dropped the Irv voiceover when they decided to reduce his character's role (even more) at the start of s3. I think they brought it back to coincide with his finishing of his novel - this was supposedly what all the previous seasons' voiceovers were narrating - everything from Colin Hart through to the season two events with Linda Abbott, were, presumably, part of this story.

tvnutz

Ye,it was a good ep but it didnt give us anything at all!

doh.ie

It's off for the next several weeks with the return of Summerland tonight, but I do think 3x16 gave a lot beyond

the return of Madison. It was mainly a chance to get Andy and Ephram to bond away from Everwood before the inevitable problems that are to come. I thought it was very well handled as a final episode before a mid-season break, considering the power conveyed in Andy's last shot and the idea that Ephram's descent into the subway would open up a Pandora's box of secrets.

A.S.H.

Well it also seems to be in trouble in the ratings, from tvtome's site on Jack and Bobby there be more info on show but also, probably, some spoilers so be warned

http://www.tvtome.com/tvtome/servlet/ShowMainServlet/showid-21658/

"February 17, 2005

Ratings Info

Jack & Bobby fell behind UPN's Kevin Hill for sixth place last night. It only managed a 1.8 (2.32 million) in the overnight ratings. "

tvnutz

Ye I know about the ratings,doesnt look good for a 2nd season,but thats americans watching crap like american idol.the first season is well worth the watch,tonight at 9 on TV3.give it a go.

tvnutz

anyone watch it?

Tobias Greeshman

yah I watched it, thought it was fairly intelligent as far as being a product from america goes. I found it interesting to watch, and will continue to watch it if it continues to be as good.

tvnutz

cool...and it does get better rather than worse by the way

tvnutz

anyone watch last night's ep? anyone watching at all!

its rare you see an intelligent show with good acting like this one,it is far better than the OC and Smallville if you are watching them instead of this!especially smallville which is really really really bad this season.

Tobias Greeshman

yeah I watched it last night, its definitely starting to give some depth to its characters. I can really start to see this program expand intelligently, as a really interesting series.

tvnutz

cool,at least one person is watching it!lol

Tobias Greeshman

ya I even sacrificed the funniest show on earth (SCRUBS) to watch it, I guess some well written intelligent script is well above a well written funny script (not so sure about well written, but damn funny).

tvnutz

haha,i know what you mean,i record scrubs and watch it after J&B just before nip/tuck comes on. scrubs is hilarious,i love it but i record it because it works out better to watch it in that half hour gap! lol

Tristram

I have enjoyed watching Jack & Bobby and will be sorry to see it go which seems to likely given its ratings.Dont rate it as great or brilliant though.Its good.

Would agree that it aint an adult show.The adult characters are always peripheral.They function as boundary markers, not much else really.The main focus of the show is always on impact events have on the brothers.

Without the flashforwards I doubt Id watch it tbh.

tvnutz

its more adult in the way it is written...but its not exaclty an adult show in the true sense of the word. Its not adult like the West Wing but its not a teen show either because it is far more intelligent than The OC or One Tree Hill.

Tristram

Ah now dont be slaggin off One Tree Hill.Very intelligent programme there.Any programme that has that Brooke one in it is intelliegently made.

tvnutz

What about hot red haired one from Jack and Bobby!? hahahha

Tristram

roflmao

seriously man tho this aint a laughing matter.That girl is incredibly hot.Jesus, sound like im back in school...lol...in all truth tho she shud be a compulsory character in every programme on the box.

tvnutz

ah yes indeed....we wil always have her lesbian scene in Nip/tuck

Tristram

lol

that was hilarious alrite.Ud think his parents wud hav been proud.

tvnutz

ye think he would have joined in!

Tennis

Enjoy it while it lasts. It was cancelled in by the WB Channel in America yesterday, so there won't be any more seasons.

Tobias Greeshman

aaaarghhhh! I really liked this show, bloody americans and there ratings.

Tristram

Yeah Tennis i saw in one of the other threads the other day.what can ya do?

*Angel*

Tennis wrote:

Enjoy it while it lasts. It was cancelled in by the WB Channel in America yesterday, so there won't be any more seasons.

I'll admit that I've only seen a few episodes but how the hell did it get cancelled while other sh!te shows are still on air. I quite liked it.

tvnutz

It was very good,just americans dont like shows that make you think...well the WB audience anyway. and the extent to which they had to think was to master what the flash forwards were saying. i have seen so many comments about how people didnt like it because of the future scenes.

at least they gave us a pretty decent conclusion and i will be getting a dvd!

Tristram

Seems easy to knock Americans for not liking good tv.Do they actually get the chance to become interested in programmes tho?Sounds like programmes are knocked around the schedules over there so much it must be hard for ne1 to follow programmes.

tvnutz

nah thats not true for every show. 3rd watch was an one though,7 timeslots in 6 years.

Tristram

True for some/most tho?

tvnutz

no most shows get a good slot once they make an impression.

Tristram

but b4 they gain a following are they shifted around constantly?

Tobias Greeshman

I see TV3 finally decided to bring it back, about time too, pity its still on the same time as Scrubs, ah well!

tvnutz

Ye but scrubs is finished for the season now,so you can watch J&B

doh.ie

Was in widescreen last night as well; not sure if the others were. Pity it's only lasted a season, but at least they managed to wrap most plots relatively well by the end.

tvnutz

Ye at least we got an ending...no cliffhanger. It was one good season anyway!

Tobias Greeshman

Yeah I was fairly *****ed off when it ended and just thought it was fúcking typical, but fair play to TV3 they brought it back if just for the last few episodes anyway!