Getting rid of ciminals in the IRA - sure fire plan. Decriminalise.

FTA69

true wrote:

Photos can be easily doctored. If the IRA have access to stolen Gardai and RUC uniforms, which they have used to impersonate on occassion, it is not beyond the bounds of possibility that this photo is forged in order to discredit the RIR.

Ah yes, the IRA (the cunning sods!) dressed 70 of their members up in British Army uniforms before smuggling them into a British Army base to have their faces plastered all over the media! Bless us...

You are the one saying they stood by, check your facts.

Yes and I am saying it now, what were the RUC (those who weren't taking part) doing while Loyalist mobs burned thousands of people from their homes?

Martyrs?

Yes a martyr, mar·tyr ( P ) Pronunciation Key (märtr)
n.
One who chooses to suffer death rather than renounce religious principles.
One who makes great sacrifices or suffers much in order to further a belief, cause, or principle.

One who endures great suffering: a martyr to arthritis.
One who makes a great show of suffering in order to arouse sympathy.

the reality is Bobby Sands, is just another piece of fundraising merchandise, if Sinn Fein had any respect for him they would'nt be selling his "memorabilia",

Bobby Sands means far, far more to us than fundraising boy. Selling his memorabilia publicises his message and the cause for which he died.

the rest are just forgotten.

By the likes of you maybe, someone who probably couldn't name them in the first place.

jbkenn

FTA69 wrote:

Bobby Sands means far, far more to us than fundraising boy. Selling his memorabilia publicises his message and the cause for which he died.

What message, what cause?, just merchandise.

By the likes of you maybe, someone who probably couldn't name them in the first place.

I did'nt think much of them in 1981, and I care less about them now, all I see is the needless waste of human life, so that some may prosper, and derive some warped legitimacy from their actions.

jbkenn

FTA69

What message, what cause?

The cause of political status for Irish Republican POWs and in the borader sense a free Ireland.

I did'nt think much of them in 1981, and I care less about them now, all I see is the needless waste of human life, so that some may prosper, and derive some warped legitimacy from their actions.

You are of course entitled to your opinion but looking at your earlier posts on the subject it seems you are largely ignorant on the subject of why we sell Hunger Strike items.

jbkenn

FTA69 wrote:

The cause of political status for Irish Republican POWs and in the borader sense a free Ireland.

There never were any POW's, just criminals who got caught.

You are of course entitled to your opinion but looking at your earlier posts on the subject it seems you are largely ignorant on the subject of why we sell Hunger Strike items.

If you are that concerned about spreading the "message" why not give them away for free?, fact is, they are a nice little money spinner.

jbkenn

billy the squid

is there any chance i could get a reply to this from FTA69 seeing as he questioned me on IRA rape gangs.

FTA69

There never were any POW's, just criminals who got caught.

A bit like Terence McSwiney, he was a serial offender he was.

If you are that concerned about spreading the "message" why not give them away for free?, fact is, they are a nice little money spinner.

The money also goes towards continuing the Republican struggle.

is there any chance i could get a reply to this from FTA69 seeing as he questioned me on IRA rape gangs.

The woman mentions an incident of rape which may or may not have taken place. I never said all IRA members were saints and a member may well ahve been involved in the said incident. A Centra employee in my locality was convicted of rape a few years ago, it doesn't mean I bear a grudge against Centra though.

oscarBravo

FTA69 wrote:

The woman mentions an incident of rape which may or may not have taken place. I never said all IRA members were saints and a member may well ahve been involved in the said incident. A Centra employee in my locality was convicted of rape a few years ago, it doesn't mean I bear a grudge against Centra though.

This from the chap who says prison officers are not nice people (how many do you know personally?) - you're pretty handy at turning the generalisations on and off when the mood takes you.

unme

A Dub in Glasgo wrote:

It highlights the hypocrisy of people who pontificate about the non-use of violence when they really mean the violence of the Republican side.

I think it is understood by most thinking people that condemnation of murder and crime applies to all sides. If it is wrong, then it is always wrong. No need for a roll call.

When we have Sinn Fein representatives putting themselves up for election to our democratic institutions, it is to be expected that they will come under extra pressure regarding republican criminality linked to their party.

Anyway the old "why do you not mention the British or Loyalists" answer to any question of support for terrorism/criminality got silly a long time ago. When that line is used by republicans to side step a direct question, you can only expect more direct questions.

unme

FTA69 wrote:

A Centra employee in my locality was convicted of rape a few years ago, it doesn't mean I bear a grudge against Centra though.

I just love it when an analogy goes horribly wrong... and this one takes some beating. Can I borrow it please, I will credit you as the originator, I promise

By the way, you really should bear a grudge against Centra if it is discovered that they support rapists. But, of course they don't.

MadsL

Ah, Centra. For the way we live today.

A Dub in Glasgo

unme wrote:

I think it is understood by most thinking people that condemnation of murder and crime applies to all sides. If it is wrong, then it is always wrong. No need for a roll call.

Really?.... the evidence does not back that up

Anyway the old "why do you not mention the British or Loyalists" answer to any question of support for terrorism/criminality got silly a long time ago. When that line is used by republicans to side step a direct question, you can only expect more direct questions.

I offered one reason why it is raised. It is a valid reason as is your mind reader and default violence condemnation theory.

unme

A Dub in Glasgo wrote:

I offered one reason why it is raised. It is a valid reason as is your mind reader and default violence condemnation theory.

mind reader and default violence condemnation theory? I wish I could say I understood your reply

A Dub in Glasgo

unme wrote:

mind reader and default violence condemnation theory? I wish I could say I understood your reply

So could I

I was referring to your 1st paragraph where you stated that it is undestood that most thinking (whatever that means) people condemn all sides by default when it comes to violence (with the additional caveat of if it is wrong). The additional condemnation of Republicans is just that... additional.

unme

A Dub in Glasgo wrote:

I was referring to your 1st paragraph where you stated that it is undestood that most thinking (whatever that means) people condemn all sides by default when it comes to violence (with the additional caveat of if it is wrong). The additional condemnation of Republicans is just that... additional.

OK. By 'thinking people', I meant people who think for themselves, as opposed to those who tend to look for a lead from an organisation or political party.

If you said to me that you condemn murder, I would understand that to mean murder by republicans, loyalists, mafia, drug gangs, everyone alike. Everything I say about republicans criminality equally applies to all. I understand that to be the same for most people, but it may suit some groups to plead victimisation.

A Dub in Glasgo

unme wrote:

OK. By 'thinking people', I meant people who think for themselves, as opposed to those who tend to look for a lead from an organisation or political party.

If you said to me that you condemn murder, I would understand that to mean murder by republicans, loyalists, mafia, drug gangs, everyone alike. Everything I say about republicans criminality equally applies to all. I understand that to be the same for most people, but it may suit some groups to plead victimisation.

It may suit some to plead victimisation but it may suit some people to mean murder only when it is an illegal group. If it is a legal group, apparantly it is a tragedy, collateral damage, lesser of 2 evils, an accident, **** happens etc. I am not convinced that all the people who scream murder when illegal groups do it will scream murder of innocents when the state does it.

As for 'thinking people', a lot of people seem look exclusively to the likes of the Indo for a lead.

true

A Dub in Glasgo wrote:

As for 'thinking people', a lot of people seem look exclusively to the likes of the Indo for a lead.

What sort of people look to an Phoblocht or other republican papers like the Sunday Bus. post or the Daily tripe ? "unthinking people" or "stupid people" or "brainwashed people". Or a mixture of all three?

billy the squid

FTA69 wrote:

The woman mentions an incident of rape which may or may not have taken place. I never said all IRA members were saints and a member may well ahve been involved in the said incident. A Centra employee in my locality was convicted of rape a few years ago, it doesn't mean I bear a grudge against Centra though.

actually that is not the part of the interview I am referring to, and dont say it was because I transcribed it for you, which part I was referring to

here it is again

Marian Finucane

---

Donna?
McCartney

---

Yes I amthe same
Marian Finucane

---

You were saying something about the "rafia"
McCartney

---

Well they are being referred to as the "rafia" now up north.
Marian Finucane

---

What does that mean
McCartney

---

Well it, well we would say RA iinstead of the IRA, we call it RA, so its RA mafia, Rafia instead of mafia, mafia type of activities, racketeering, drugs, rape, intimidation punishment shootings, and murder.

the above is on top of the incident you are referring to, but the above is what I would like your comment on.