Batista pushed to Far

Stalfos

Is it just me or the Batista push becoming more annoying every week.
Over the last few weeks on RAW, Batista has been talked about non-stop and that was ok but when smackdown was brought into it, the whole thing exploded.
The whole of the smackdown show everyone was asking "where's Batista?"
and other superstars were saying to forget about baatista cause thier what everyone should be talking about and No Way Out was even worse and he shows up two minutes before the end and the crowd gives a bigger cheer than they had given all night.
The same happened again on Raw last monday but i'm not totally p***ed off,
I did think was great when

Batista power bombed HHH

, I am just hoping this thing doesnt continue on this way

Unit00

I dont think thet you can say that batista has been pushed too far. He is getting the crowd reaction that indicates that he is getting pushed correctly. Orton was pushed too far.

gimmick

And the biggets and most obvious difference between Batistas push, and Ortoons push, is that batistas happened 'naturally'. It was never the plan to have him Main Event WM with Hunter, but as the weeks were passing with Ortons push, and the more obvious it was becoming that it was a damp squib, the live audiences were getting more and more behind Batista.

Ive enjoyed his push so far, however, I cannot see him lifting the title at Wrestlemania. He will be screwed somehow, quite probably by Orton, who will turn heel again, and re-join Evolotion.

Stalfos

I'm not saying it is done wrong essentially, I'm kinda saying it taking too much away from other wrestlers both on raw and smackdown especially smackdown which didnt need to be brought into it at all. I also think he wont get the title at wrestlemania but probably the month after or something

D-FENS

stalfos wrote:

I'm not saying it is done wrong essentially, I'm kinda saying it taking too much away from other wrestlers both on raw and smackdown especially smackdown which didnt need to be brought into it at all. I also think he wont get the title at wrestlemania but probably the month after or something

I agree with Gimmick, that Batista's rise in popularity has happened gradually and is genuinely what the fans want, unlike Orton.
Plus, although the subject of him did dominate No Way Out, Cena's actions ended the show, therefore pushing him.
And being friends with HHH and being his opponent for WM tends to get you airtime.

Brow

I think theyve learned from their mistakes in the past, kind of with Eugene and mainly with Orton. They realise they need to build up a popularity in order for it to last.

blackbelt

i don't think batista is being pushed too far.he legitimatley got over with the crowd before being pushe and vince and the wwe realise what the fans would like for a change.batista vs HHH is a match that nearly everybody wants to see.

orton was pushed as a face when he's better as a heel.i think a screwjob is likely but not until after wrestlemania.we might see orton turn on batista after wrestlemania but we might not re-join evolution

gimmick

Brow wrote:

I think theyve learned from their mistakes in the past, kind of with Eugene

What mistekes were made with Eugene? Rather than typing again what I types 2 weeks ago -

me wrote:

When Eugene came about first, he was expected to be lower middle card, and to feud with a heel Regal eventually. The fact that he was a major part in a HHH storyline leading to there own feud, suggest a very successful push.

me again wrote:

Eugenes push was unplanned, and not rammed down the fans thoats. His push happened as naturally as a scripted push can be.

Brow

Well, I dont think they were expecting Eugene to be so big so they kind of gradually pushed him before then all of a sudden he was always there. Doing something high profile. Dont get me wrong, im a huge Dinsmore mark and love to see him on telly but it seemed the majority of the public at Summerslam were sick of him by booing him upon entering. Thats when Vince decided to slow down and taken him out of high profile matches.

antifyre

stalfos wrote:

I'm not saying it is done wrong essentially, I'm kinda saying it taking too much away from other wrestlers both on raw and smackdown especially smackdown which didnt need to be brought into it at all. I also think he wont get the title at wrestlemania but probably the month after or something

They tried to buid Cena and Orton (the 'Rising Stars' of each brand,and at the quickest earliest oppurtunity when they realised all Orton can do is jump high and punch people (he's F****** Crap!), they swapped the orders and went with Bastista.

And Rightly so.... Dave is so natural on the mic, he has timing and a poise that Orton really does'nt..... plus the fact that the fans went for him; Happened Stone Cold, Happened the Rock, Happened Jericho.... and now it seems to be happening to the Animal.

RebelRockChick

Batista natural on the mic? Seriously come on , Batista is pretty poor on the mic , you can probably count on one hand the time he's had the mic in the ring. Got a long way to go to be the quality of Rock on the mic. Orton is much more confident on the mic than Batista, micwork is definitely not one of his stronger points which could be a problem if they decide to put him in a feud with a great mic worker.

D-FENS

Orton is only good on the mic as a hell, which i hear he'll be going back to shortly to face 'Taker at mania.
Y2J is can work the mic as a face, but he just does'nt have the image/look for me to be top face, again much better as a heel.
Same with Angle, Matt Hardy, Edge and Christian ( best guy on the mic by far )

Really , there is no face who is great on the mic, Eddie is good, but like Jericho he's just not top face material the way Austin or Rock were.T
he only one at the moment who looks like he could become a great face mic worker is Cena. I'm not his biggest fan, either gimmick or wrestling wise, but the guy can talk.

Batista is similar to The Undertaker or Kane in that he can string a few words together, but really it's his image/size that's making him seem cool/tough.

He's never gonna to look beleiveable having the last word against the like of HHH.

Unless they've been saving up his witty one liners and catchphrases for now that he's tuned face, but i doubt it.

Stalfos

Can i just say, i am not saying anything bad about Batista.In fact i think he's really good, It's just every show over the past few weeks has had Everyone talking about Batista. What i would like to see is the WWE tone it down a little and not have everyone talking about Batista or jobbing for him like Edge didnt even need to have a title shot just to lose it. Also this maybe putting too much pressure on batista and it could fall though like the others. I think the WWE should start to bring more wrestlers up so wrestlemania wont be about just one match

antifyre

RRC - yeah he's natural...... he just does'nt shout, or scream, or have cool **** to say yet. He's just concentrating on being very real. He does'nt stumble, look lost or sound corny (Orton definately sounds corny). When he's got experience with the mic, then he's going to really take off.

Mr.Nice Guy

antifyre wrote:

plus the fact that the fans went for him; Happened Stone Cold, Happened the Rock, Happened Jericho.... and now it seems to be happening to the Animal.

The fans went for Batista?Gee,I must've missed that because I seem to remember great athletes like Y2J and Benoit being forced to put him over.Batista is only over with the fans due to his storyline and one or two big impact moves.This does not make him a great wrestler.
Now that the storyline nears its climax at Wrestlemania,I predict that the main event match at WM21 will be poor and that the fans turn on Batista in about two months-quicker than Orton.

If would make more sense for the WWE to have Batista lose to Triple H at WM because they could then develop his character more and maybe have him take the title at Summerslam.If they give the title at WM to a guy who has achieved so little,I'll be shocked.

Seed

Wasn't a fan before. Yes he does seem intimidating in the ring but he seemed a bit rigid. He's getting better though and showing a little more than "grr" in his personality now. He's over and getting more talented each week so, good for him.

Oh and he will lose to HHH.

mackdaddycool

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Seed

I'm going to use a little more tact than Brow here. :P

Yes, we know it's rehearsed. Yes we know these storylines are all written out before hand. Y'see, Wrestling promotions have things called 'Writers' big shock there to everyone here, I know. Guys, don't start crying now!

And no, not everything is fake. You can't 'fake' falling off a ladder. You can't 'fake' being thrown off a 20 foot cage. The blood you see in that ring is real. Well, not if it's part of the storyline so one of the wrestlers can go on holiday or something.

Oh and, I'm a virgin cause I watch wrestling?
Not only is that one of the worst 'insults' I've ever heard. But just to let you know, I'm not a virgin, so that kinda blows a hole in that point. (as retarded as it was, it was still a point)

mackdaddycool

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Seed

They practice 'bumps' - That is falling correctly to limit the pain they recieve. These bumps are for mat and turnbuckle-based moves. For health and safety reasons they can't practice falling of a ladder. Yes the ring has a bit of bounce. That's like that for a reason, so the moves will look more devastating. The mat itself isn't soft though.
And besides, what if they don't land in the ring? What if they land outside the ring from 20 feet in the air, at quite a high speed. And afterwards have to continue with the match? It's not like they go out there, take a hit and go back to the dressing room.

And as for your comments about me. Look at the pic below. Acne, was it?

Stalfos

mackdaddycool wrote:

"you cant fake falling off a 20ft ladder", they obviously practise the stuff, and land in a ring that isnt solid. you are a loser. its people like you ya thick c.nt that have made da owner a billionare,i bet you have all the games and t-shirts and stuff aswell,you are covered in acne,have no friends, and if you actually are not a virgin its because u rode some fcukn mingin lookin clonmel manbeast you ugly c.nt

Your a newbie so maybe you dont know but you cant just go around every forum you find and say this sort or you time here on boards will be short and sweet but maybe you should just leave and never come back cause i've read you posts and you are the biggest idiot i've seen here on boards, so i(and alot of other people aswell) think you should now **** off before your made.

Oh and WRESTLING RULES

mackdaddycool

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Seed

It's actually wrestling from 2005.

Wow, you can't even attempt to insult anyone without making a complete

Listen, I know puberty can be tough, but you'll get used to it.

mackdaddycool

/

mackdaddycool

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Seed

*edit* Nevermind, I'll probably be warned for spam =/

mackdaddycool

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Seed

If you are 'alot older' than me. Then you are one sad sad piece of work. Not only can you not spell, but you also take pleasure out of acting like an ass. Well done.

In response to your statement. Try me.

*edit* whatever.

mackdaddycool

/

bizmark

Seed don’t feed the trolls it only encourages them just ignore and move on.

mackdaddycool

.

antifyre

....and I Agree with you, he should'nt win at WM (cena should probably be the one to pick a title up there)......but I do think he has presence and an ease with speaking on mic, and that will make him get a lot better a lot faster....

Fobia

Hi MackDaddyCool,
Do you have any cousins in Galway? Perhaps you could post a picture of yourself and then I'll umm....give the photo to my cousins and they'll umm...mess you up or summit.

On a level of 1-100, how hard would you rate yourself? At what angle do you wear your bourberry hat? Why are you still posting?

Fobia.

gimmick

Theres a perfectly good thread ruined by some little virgin teenager with no life, or friends.

As for mic work - I was watching Badd Blood 2004 the other night, and Orton cuts his best ever promo, telling everyone how great he is. Pity he couldnt carry that type of mic work as a face.

Seed

Aye, since his face turn he seems to stutter a bit. Its seemed much more natural when he was a heel. He needs to go back.

Brow

Apparently management want to turn him heel again but Orton reportedly begged to remain face.

Stalfos

If he's going to fight the undertaker at wrestlemania,
i dont see how he can do it without turning heel

D-FENS

stalfos wrote:

If he's going to fight the undertaker at wrestlemania,
i dont see how he can do it without turning heel

Orton so needs to turn heel, and fast.
He's much better at it, and hopefully could develeop his mic skills to the ppoint that it woould work if he turned face again down the line.
I think this proposed Legend vs. Legend killer storyline could be brilliant for him and 'taker, as lets face it, neither man have done much to talk about lately.Undertaker's feud with JBL was pointless and him and Heiden =rich reminded me of his old days with the likes of Kamala and Giant Gonzales, complete step backwards.And we all know how much Randy has gone off the boil lately.I know Undertaker is'nt the first legend he tried to kill, but taking his undefeated streak at mania away is a fairly big scalp that can give him the push he needs.Plus i would'nt rule out interference from his Cowboy Bob or even his old running buddy Hot Rod, seens how they'll be there on the night.

TOPDAWG

Its kinda become a running thing for someone to turn heel at mania every year but every year its fairly obvious who it'll be so for once it would be a bit more shocking if it was an unexpected heel turn.

Orton is definitly the odds on for a heel turn this year but id love to see possibly someone like jericho,benoit or even for batista to turn in the main event in the manner austin did against rock. build him up as if his life depends on winning the title and maybe gettin outside help from jbl or something. im just clutching at straws but im so fed up of all the predictabilty of the recaent face/heel turns.

Just because the crowd get behind/turn on someone they turn them and it doesnt always work out, i know ortons the most obvious case but look at jericho. his talents were showcased so much more when he was a heel now resulting in his tilte win. These days he's jobbin to newcomers and some weeks hes lucky if he does a "highlight reel!!" and booker t is probaly the vice versa case when he transferred from raw to smackdown, i know it wasnt fan reaction that changed him but still. Sorry im ranting but im sick with the flu and need to vent my mucus filled venom.

TOPDAWG

just in case anyone thinks so i wasnt puttin jericho down cos i still rate him as one of the best but some weeks it just pains me to see how wasted his talent is.

D-FENS

Y2J or Christian could be top heel no porblem, but that's never going to happen on Raw with HHH around, do i'd be happy with either of them switching to SM, and if it were Jericcho then have him turn at mania

Mr.Nice Guy

Forget about Jericho being top heel,he should be top face.He's been a heel for around two years or so.The fans want to cheer for him now and if he was given a big push he would do great.Jericho's talent is badly wasted.The last two Wrestlemania's he put on fantastic matches but he has been kept back,whether he has been heel or face.

There is a shortage of major heels on Raw.Triple H is the only experienced heel.The others have never held the title.This,in my view,is another example of why Triple H is bad for wrestling.

D-FENS

Mr.Nice Guy wrote:

Forget about Jericho being top heel, he should be top face..

Jericho would not be believable as Top face, I know he's a great wrestler and great on the mic, but his size and image just isn’t right to be the top face/franchise in the mould of Rock or Austin. He’s a great face, but too much of a shortarse pretty boy to be the hero of the show for a long period of time. Can you imagine if DX, or the NWO, or Evolution were beating on 2 or 3 guys and Y2J came down and cleared the ring like Austin? Just wouldn’t be believable.

[/QUOTE]He's been a heel for around two years or so. The fans want to cheer for him now and if he was given a big push he would do great. [/QUOTE]
Eh, he's been a face for a year. And the fans do cheer him, but not to the point that he could be the hero of the show for a long period of time.

[/QUOTE]Jericho’s talent is badly wasted. The last two Wrestlemania's he put on fantastic matches but he has been kept back, whether he has been heel or face.

There is a shortage of major heels on Raw. Triple H is the only experienced heel. The others have never held the title. This, in my view, is another example of why Triple H is bad for wrestling. [/QUOTE]

Couldn’t agree more, the guy is seriously underused. When he came in from WCW, I thought WWE had a future top heel that could match the likes of Rock and Flair when they were champion, and when he won the undisputed title he proved it. But that was when HHH was out injured; as soon as he came back Jericho was out and has been out since. That’s why, now with two brands, there is no reason why he shouldn’t be top heel on Smack down, as he is marginally better than Angle and a whole lot better than JBL.
As for Raw, well it's a sad state of affairs when a guy’s best option if he wants to be big is to try and get on SM.

gimmick

topdawg wrote:

Its kinda become a running thing for someone to turn heel at mania every year but every year its fairly obvious who it'll be so for once it would be a bit more shocking if it was an unexpected heel turn.

Trishs turn last year wasnt that telegraphed to be fair.

topdawg wrote:

Orton is definitly the odds on for a heel turn this year

ID say Eddie is more likely to turn on Rey. That is, if he doesnt turn on him setting up a match at Mania.

d-fens wrote:

Y2J or Christian could be top heel no porblem

Mr Nice Guy wrote:

Forget about Jericho being top heel,he should be top face

Ill start by saying that over the years I have found Jericho to be by far the most entertaining wrestler both in and out of the ring. However, one area where Jericho has fallen down, and this mat raise a few eye-brows is that he has remained on TV full time ever since his debut. His gimmick has never really changed. Look at all the big wrestlers in recent years, who have all had big success - HHH, Austin, Taker, The Rock, Benoit - all have had some sort of lay-offs, and on their return, with adjusted gimmicks have been pushed hard and far - this has never happened Jericho.

Now dont get me wrong, Im not saying he is unlucky because he has never been injured. To look at it another way - does Jericho need the title to be over? IMO no, he doesnt. He is a very versatile character in that he can do the job for a nobody, just as easily as getting the big win over HHH.

You may find this interesting

“Chris says that people come up to him every day and ask him when he will be world champion again. Chris says that there are some people who need the belt more than him. Chris will always be the first Undisputed Champion. He would like to be champion again, but he will continue to wrestle the same way. Chris says that his goals are the same: Have the best match of the night, steal the show, and make sure the fans enjoy his performance and will come to see him the next time he comes to town. That is his same philosophy with Fozzy.”
taken from here

Seems like an odd statement, but if he is entertaining, and happy doing that, why should we be unhappy? Perhaps he feels he would hate to hog the limelight by certain other past and present superstars?

D-FENS

gimmick wrote:

Seems like an odd statement, but if he is entertaining, and happy doing that, why should we be unhappy?

It's a fair point, but it's what the fans want, and personally i think Y2J should be champ again or at least top heel.
I mean, I'm sure HHH is very happy as well, but is anyone else?

Zombienosh

anyways back to the point, batista is being pushed hard yeah but it works....unlike other previous people...

have to say it was just magic finally seeing him put HHH through the table.

D-FENS

AlcoholicA wrote:

anyways back to the point, batista is being pushed hard yeah but it works....unlike other previous people...

have to say it was just magic finally seeing him put HHH through the table.

Indeed, it was a good moment.
And hopefull a sign of things to come.
I hope the guy makes it big, and so far it's looking good.

Mr.Nice Guy

D-FENS wrote:

Jericho would not be believable as Top face, I know he's a great wrestler and great on the mic, but his size and image just isn’t right to be the top face/franchise in the mould of Rock or Austin. He’s a great face, but too much of a shortarse pretty boy to be the hero of the show for a long period of time. Can you imagine if DX, or the NWO, or Evolution were beating on 2 or 3 guys and Y2J came down and cleared the ring like Austin? Just wouldn’t be believable.

Size and image?Eddie and Benoit are no bigger than Jericho yet they were victorious at WM and held the titles for months.To me,Jericho is like RVD.All he requires is the right push.I remember hearing Heyman speak of RVD and he said RVD deserved a title run as he had something that most wrestlers don't - a connection with the crowd.In my opinion,so does Jericho.
Can I imagine Jericho clearing the ring?Yeah.Just give him a chair like they used to do with Eddie.

I'd be more concerned with Jericho's lack of a decent finisher.He needs something more than the lionsault and walls of Jericho.
A heel turn for Jericho would be a step backwards.He was a heel for ages which is why he needed the freshness of a face turn.The WWE are letting him down by not giving him a feud with Triple H.On WWE.com,before the Elimination Chamber match at New Year's Revolution,I remember Jericho led the way for who the fans wanted to see win the match.Did the WWE listen to the fans?Of course not.

As for Batista,his career will end up like the name of his finisher - the Batista bomb!Crap mic skills,poor wrestling ability and his storyline is now reaching its conclusion.I hope the WWE writing team has some good ideas!

D-FENS

Mr.Nice Guy wrote:

Size and image?Eddie and Benoit are no bigger than Jericho yet they were victorious at WM and held the titles for months.To me,Jericho is like RVD.All he requires is the right push.I remember hearing Heyman speak of RVD and he said RVD deserved a title run as he had something that most wrestlers don't - a connection with the crowd.In my opinion,so does Jericho.
Can I imagine Jericho clearing the ring?Yeah.Just give him a chair like they used to do with Eddie.

Were Benoit and Eddie in the same league as Austin, Rock or Undertaker when they were champions ? No.
And like Y2J, both are now back to mid card, a year later.That's not my idea of a top face.
Like Jericho, both are great wrestlers and deserved being champion for a while, but all three are better suited as heels.

But as AlcoholicA said, the topic of this thread was Batista, and i think he should be given the chance to prove himself as the top face.

Mr.Nice Guy

D-FENS wrote:

Were Benoit and Eddie in the same league as Austin, Rock or Undertaker when they were champions ? No.

No?That's your view.I think they were great champions.I think Benoit in particular was the greatest champion since Austin's run in 2001 with the Alliance.

D-FENS wrote:

And like Y2J, both are now back to mid-card, a year later.That's not my idea of a top face.

Come on,you and I both know the reason for that - Triple H.He hogs the spotlight.Both are top faces and have proven it for years.Who's your idea of a top face?Batista?!

D-FENS wrote:

Like Jericho,both are great wrestlers and deserved being champion for a while, but all three are better suited as heels.

Again,that's your opinion.I think both are better as faces.Especially Benoit,who doesn't need a gimmick as much as other guys.His position as face is due to superb technical ability and intensity.

D-FENS wrote:

But as AlcoholicA said, the topic of this thread was Batista, and i think he should be given the chance to prove himself as the top face.

Why should he be given his chance?Because he's part of the new clique?

It seems to me that your decisions on wrestlers who deserve a chance are based purely on gimmicks.I prefer to look at the wrestlers beneath the gimmicks to decide who deserves a chance and who doesn't.
I'd rather a WM main event with Benoit and Jericho instead of Triple H and Batista,but that's just me.

D-FENS

You seem to have mistaken me for a YJ2, Benoit or Gurrerro hater.
Once again, i like Jericho, a lot. Same goes for Benoit and Gurrerro.
I think all three are great wrestlers.Along with Angle, they are pretty much the best WWE have.
But, yes your right, i do like a good gimmick , or at least a guy to have the right gimmick to go along with in ring ability.
And for me, Jericho's cockiness, Eddie's cheating and sneakiness and Benoit's tendency to snap and choke a man till he nearly flatlines, are all qualities best suited to a heel.
Entertaining as faces, but better as heels.
The heel Eddie turning on Taijiri and putting him through his car windshield in '03 and the heel Benoit that nearly broke the Rock in two with the crossface when he challenged him in 2000, were to me a lot more entertaining than their title wins last year.
And Jericho's title win in '01 was up there with the Rock in '98 in terms of a great heel title victory.
And i'd have no problem with a Y2J/Benoit main event, but i'm also looking forward to HHH and Batista, because i think Batista should at least be given the chance, for me he has potential image and ability wise to be a believable, marketable face Champion.As for his mic skills, he's been the Lurch of Evolution for the last two odd years and has'nt be allowed or needed to speak. He only turned face and went out on his own last week, at least give him a chance.
And no i'm not a clique fan, i hate HHH and the politics that go on in WWE as much as anyone.