What is the reason for life or living?

ctrl-alt-delete

if there is a meaning of life - it is to be here now - i.e. if you are reading this message, maybe this place has a meaning in your life, or maybe the meaning or path of your life requires for you to be here now.....this however opens up endless arguements about how life is random and not predefined...

so we live and so we die,
but thats not to say there's a reason,
so we ponder and so we try,
but thats not to say we find reason,
and so i hear the shadows cry,
theres never a meaning behind believing.

Kizen

For us to have a reason for being here does that not mean that we must have a use or funchtion to somebody or something out side of our little planet. I was reading a book called "The Infinit Book" and in it came up the idea of Universes being created by observers (eg. we would be considered observers, I think it's intelligent life in general). This would mean that Universes could be created for expariments.
Another theory is that Universes could be simulated on computers and again used for expariments or perhaps even entertainment for the "Obsevers", (entertianment tends to be one of the most lokerative of industeries).
We could then be just be here as an expariment or worse a created for entertainment.

Please shread these theories if you want to as I'm new to this and will learn form it.

Fysh

On the matter of universes....it could be argued that each sentient and conscious creature perceives a different subset of physical stimuli which it records as memory. Since it is highly improbable that two creatures will have the same set of perceptions, each individual creature may be assumed to have a unique memory which, because of the mind-body problem, be interpreted as being effectively a personal universe. As in, if you had to try and create the universe based solely on your personal experience, it wouldn't be the same as the one I created, etc. This is all down to perception, but hey.

As for creating universes....well, there are some theories that purport we will be able to create "bubble universes" within our own universe. And as soon as that becomes possible, it'll only be a matter of time before someone decides that Big Brother (only with an entire universe) is the next big idea in entertainment...

spyro_2001ie

Is there a reason for living, I belive the answer lies in the question.

Is the purpose of the universe to create life ?

If it is then were doing bang up job and were (as far as we know) the highest example of life, and can remain happy in the knowledge that were doing what were supposed to be doing. Living

However Life could be a by-product of a superior or grander function, and our universe is in exsistance for that purpose rather than creating life.

Still no matter what way you look at it, were here and do exsist and that means were present in some sort of process. So what it boil down to is that the meaning of life is to ensure there is still life after your dead and gone.

Make babies.

Sex and survival the fundementals of life.

fragile

spyro_2001ie wrote:

So what it boil down to is that the meaning of life is to ensure there is still life after your dead and gone.

Then surely the universe would be much better off without us as the rest of the species on this planet would stand a much better chance at survival if humans weren't around. I am talking about global warming, nuclear-fallout, hunting species to extinction, chemical warfare, destruction of the rain forests, poisoning of the oceans etc..
If the meaning of life is the proliferation of life then surely mankind is only getting in the way of things...

Dades

spyro_2001ie wrote:

Sex and survival the fundementals of life.

I don't think the fundamentals should be confused with a "meaning" or "reason".

Maybe due to a lack of a "reason" for life we are left with simply survival.

And I agree with fragile - long term survival might be safer in the hands (or paws) of animals...

Cy

42 is the answer to what? Lets start a 5 million year boards debate on what the question is. then the mice will be happy.

Maybe the question is "How many roads must a man walk down..."

I think Fragile and The Atheist might be on to something but basically life is just here to be enjoyed.
Even if there isn't an afterlife or any point to living, i'll take it anyway. i'm just having too much fun living to think about whether there's a point aside from enjoying it

Dades

Much as I have my reservations about certain thing American, I think they were on to something when their Declaration of Independence used the phrase:

Life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness.

That about sums it up for me.

solo1

There is no "meaning" in anything other than what you ascribe to it. The very word "meaning" pre-supposes a brain through which something is filtered.

WHEELER4

I read a lot of responses that are Nihilistic.

The meaning of life, "Life is War". It is about survival. Who survives and who dies! Life is a battlefield. Nature kills off the losers. Nature rewards the winners.

Nihilism is a loser ideology. That is why most of those who are Nihilists end their lives in suicide.

God created us to "have being". "To be or not to be" is the question that Shakespeare wrote that answers the question. God brought us into being. Not to be is not a good. It is good "to be". Then, something sought our destruction so soon as we have received our "being". Life is war. Stupid and deceived people get killed and disappear from the face of the earth. Wise and righteous and knowledgeable people survive and receive immortality. All people have immortality. We live forever. Life is not about drinking-it kills and is a nihilistic response. Ours is to live well and to our duty. Life is War.
Survive it and you win. If you take wrong advice, you die.

Meaning is in the struggle. Meaning is given to by God. He loves all men and seeks their lifes. Life is about community. A community attached to the real essence and meaning of our lives, The True, The Good and the Beautiful--God.

doonothing

hmm.. the whole struggle thing you talk about is life, its not the reason that there is life, nor is it the reason we are living.
if you're not religious, then there appears to be very little meaning in life, besides the trivial matters which are important to us, eg family... (i say trivial as in we are talking about the meaning of life in general, a fairly hefty topic, regardless of how much you love your family)
id like to believe there's meaning..but, i dont...
maybe, there's no meaning, we're the result of the ever continuing process of evolution, and maybe human beings are the first creatures capable/big-headed enough to believe there's a meaning behind our existence..
but i dont like to believe that either... maybe meaning is individual, maybe the search for meaning is more meaningful than anything we can comprehend....

solo1

It is about survival. Who survives and who dies! Life is a battlefield. Nature kills off the losers. Nature rewards the winners.

Is that supposed to be more heartwarming than nihilism?

Stupid and deceived people get killed and disappear from the face of the earth. Wise and righteous and knowledgeable people survive and receive immortality.

Now you know that's not true! Surely you know someone who was quite nice who died young? And surely you know of Pol Pot, who died peacefully in his home some years ago of old age (bless)?

fragile

WHEELER4 wrote:

Ours is to live well and to our duty. Life is War.
Survive it and you win. If you take wrong advice, you die.

Nobody survives life, we ALL die you muppet

WHEELER4 wrote:

Meaning is in the struggle. Meaning is given to by God. He loves all men and seeks their lifes. Life is about community. A community attached to the real essence and meaning of our lives, The True, The Good and the Beautiful--God.

Why am I not surprised that your location is in the USA :rolleyes:

hang on, could it be? is this George W.Bush posting under the alias Wheeler4? it certainly sounds like him..

Dades

WHEELER4

I had assumed you were just a troll, but having looked at your history I see you are actually for real.

I've a question: How many losers did you kill in your career as a marine?

Meaning is given to by God. He loves all men and seeks their lifes.

Especially those of African children. Are are they losers too?

Peddle your crazy someplace else. Don't patronise those on this thread who are secure enough in themselves not to require an agenda from the twisted character you describe.

WHEELER4

Everything is Nature is there for a purpose; i.e. pigeons, ants, rats. They all have a purpose. Theirs is to clean up the environment. They are the cleaners. I have yet to find a purpose for Mosquitos but then .... maybe their purpose is to spread disease to check otherwise uncontrollable populations.

Everything in Nature has a purpose. Every Human being has a purpose. First, it is "to be". To have being. To have being is Good. How can we have spiritual immortality if we don't have physical existence first? That is kind of hard isn't?

My big toe doesn't say, "I am not the Brain or the Heart or the eye so I am just going to off meself". The body needs the big toe. Everything we have we need; even the tiniest insequential part. One can say that One blood cell is unimportant but if all the cells thought so, then where would we be--dead.

Life is hard. That is a famous ancient Greek saying--"The good comes through the Hard". The Hard life makes us better. The law of Thermodynamics is just as valid in the human sphere as it is in the physical realm. Only by putting "energy" in does the world turn, once energy stops, then entropy sets in.

Us, humans are both physical and spiritual. It is the higher ideals that give us meaning and it takes struggle to reach the higher ideals. The True, The Good and the Beautiful.

Dades

Buddy, maybe you should change your name to WHEELER3 because I think one of your wheels is missing.

WHEELER4

What is the meaning of life? It is to have communion with God. God created us to have community with Him. To enjoy the good life.

All human beings are immortal. Death is only a door. Only Christianity explaines this thoroughly.

God is Good. Nothing evil lives with Him. Through envy of the devil, us, humans entered into a path of corruption and evil, thus seperating us from God. We are truly homesick and homeless without God. Our nature is fallen. Jesus is the door to return to this community with God. Our meaning in this life is to experience and build the community of God.

Nature is beautiful. Nature is evidence of the nature of God. God is beautiful and in this he created us to share in His life.

doonothing

whoa..
i didnt realise christianity explains it thoroughly...
*runs to change entire belief system*

trinitylucan

I take it this is a genuine question and though you might feel corny asking it, it is in fact the most common base question of humanity. Most people do not sincerely address the question and prefer to sidestep it with facetious responses or cynicism.
Theres lots of distractions in life to avoid addressing this question - and many of them are good in of themselves, like snowboarding or travelling, and others are necessary like working or cooking. Then theres the spaces in between. These can usually be filled with some other noise to avoid the question such as the TV or 'talking ****e' as we say in Irl But the question remains
Did you ever see the enthusiasm of a greyhound chasing the rabbit on the track? Running with boundless zeal! And for what - a mechanical replica of another animal. Pathetic?
But what drives us - at the end of the track will you be left disappointed with the prize?
The fact is there is only one lasting reason to life, to our existence. THere is only one shape that fills the vacuum and the longer we spend focussed on perishable pursuits like work or travel or art or even relationships the more is will seem to fail to satisfy and feel like you are chasing the wind.
The answer is a reality to me but is so surrounded with gunk and rejectable nonsense that it is often quickly dismissed.

This is my first ever visit to a boards enviornment or chat room = I think I'll shut up for now and see if I'm making any sense!

Dades

trinitylucan wrote:

This is my first ever visit to a boards enviornment or chat room = I think I'll shut up for now and see if I'm making any sense!

Congratulations to you! Welcome to the snake pit.

Most people do not sincerely address the question and prefer to sidestep it with facetious responses or cynicism.

The problem here is you are assuming that because the question exists, so must an answer.

Many posters including myself see the question as knee-jerk human concept. A need to think that our lives are not as fleeting and meaningless as a light that blinks on and off in the night. IMO a "meaning" to our existence exists in people's minds in the same manner a belief in an afterlife does. It's a comforting concept.

But seeing no meaning in the human sense of the word does not have to leave you cold. It can leave you freer to use your existence to the best you can. To make it better for others while you're here, and ideally for those that follow you.

And if you do not believe in an afterlife (as you have to realise - many do not), then all we are left with are "perishable pursuits like work or travel or art or even relationships". Well, I'll happily concentrate on perishable pursuits, content in the belief that our time as bi-peds is the one shot we'll ever get at anything.

The fact is there is only one lasting reason to life, to our existence.

Speak up then. Surprise us!

Tar.Aldarion

WHEELER4 wrote:

Everything is Nature is there for a purpose; i.e. pigeons, ants, rats. They all have a purpose. Theirs is to clean up the environment. They are the cleaners. I have yet to find a purpose for Mosquitos but then .... maybe their purpose is to spread disease to check otherwise uncontrollable populations

lmfao lol! those poor people who clean for a living, how do you treat them?
and how about that one rat in a million that decides to take a different life choice and not exist solely for the use of humans?
wheeler2

solo1

have yet to find a purpose for Mosquitos but then ....

The "purpose" of mosquitoes is analogous to the purpose of every other living thing: to make little mosquitoes. To discuss the "purpose" of any living thing as though there were some over-arching plan into which each creature would slot their respective abilities fails to address the realities of evolution - the only goal of evolution is survival.

Thrasher

WHEELER4 wrote:

The meaning of life, "Life is War". It is about survival. Who survives and who dies! Life is a battlefield. Nature kills off the losers. Nature rewards the winners.

All joking aside, isn't it true that Hitler had the same philosophy?

WHEELER4 wrote:

Stupid and deceived people get killed and disappear from the face of the earth. Wise and righteous and knowledgeable people survive and receive immortality.

Also a Nazi ethic. Let me ask, who should be enforcing the rules of this battlefield? What about the vast majority of people (throughout time - even before Christ) who have been brought up with a different belief system. Are they responsible in being "deceived"?

Question: I'd genuinely like you to think about this WHEELER4, how do you know with certainty that you are not deceived?

fragile

WHEELER4 wrote:

What is the meaning of life? It is to have communion with God. God created us to have community with Him. To enjoy the good life.

I am enjoying the good life just fine without the interference of any God

WHEELER4 wrote:

All human beings are immortal. Death is only a door. Only Christianity explaines this thoroughly.

So a baby that is born with a terminal disease is immortal huh :rolleyes:

WHEELER4 wrote:

God is Good. Nothing evil lives with Him. Through envy of the devil, us, humans entered into a path of corruption and evil, thus seperating us from God. We are truly homesick and homeless without God. Our nature is fallen. Jesus is the door to return to this community with God. Our meaning in this life is to experience and build the community of God.

If you are right and there is a God, then evil does live with him, the evil of apathy for the needless suffering of millions of humans

WHEELER4 wrote:

Nature is beautiful. Nature is evidence of the nature of God. God is beautiful and in this he created us to share in His life.

So you are saying that the Tsunami disaster in Asia is evidence of the nature of God? only somebody completely devoid of reality could claim to call that beautiful

solo1

Well, you are aware of all the fornication going on in Indonesia and Thailand.

Cast Away

Religion made life so much easier. I was born and raised as a Christian. Until not to long ago I believed whole heartedly that when I died I was going to go to heaven.

The delusion is so easy. I envy people like Wheeler4 that hold on to it. How great is it to honest believe that when you die you're going to heaven. To not fear death.

Some of you will say, this isn't great at all. For some people, this may very well be the case. For me, I personally have spent years now trying to cope with the fact that I do know the truth and it is this...

The universe was created on the day I was born, and it will cease to exist on the day that I die.

Cast Away

egon spengler

there is no reason other than being programmed through natural selection with a desire to live

egon spengler

Cast Away wrote:

Religion made life so much easier. I was born and raised as a Christian. Until not to long ago I believed whole heartedly that when I died I was going to go to heaven.

The delusion is so easy. I envy people like Wheeler4 that hold on to it. How great is it to honest believe that when you die you're going to heaven. To not fear death.

Some of you will say, this isn't great at all. For some people, this may very well be the case. For me, I personally have spent years now trying to cope with the fact that I do know the truth and it is this...

The universe was created on the day I was born, and it will cease to exist on the day that I die.

Cast Away

I agree, Id be happier to live with a benign delusive religious belief (by benign I mean not infringing upon anything outside my own context, that includes people, science etc). But God or whatever, is comparable to the existence of Santa Claus (the fictional coke figure, not the real dude) who comes down chimneys in one night across the world. One way I guess that I can (though I dont want to) reconcile myself to my own non existence is the fact that I am a computational outcome from the big bang and hence I am not distinct from the universe but a part of it, so that when I die I will be re-absorbed into the unconcious processes of the universe as a non entity, but at least part of a larger one which is far greater than the grandeur which inheres in any human mind. The other way I can avoid this terrible thought of non existence is in this-genetics are rapidly advancing, 20 years from now therell be organ replacements grown from your own stem cells and maybe anti ageing drugs, so that by the time I reach 200 years of age, therell be another advancement to make me live another 200 and so on ad infinitum.

heres something to dwell upon in relation to gods existence

how can he be both omnipotent and omniscient if knowing what youre going to do leaves you with no choice and hence youre no longer omnipotent (of course god transcends logic and can just do crazy weird stuff which makes us go wow)

Calibos

CerebralCortex wrote:

That's purely opinion and personal perspective. Believing there is a void of non existence after we die makes experience of anything pointless.

Nonsense. The void of non existence that I resided in for the 15 billion years before I was concieved has not affected in any manner shape or form, my ability to enjoy and find value in my experiences of life. Why would the void of non existence that I will reside in from about 2070 onwards for the next 15 billion years have any affect on the point or pointlessness of my current life.

REDZ

Calibos wrote:

Nonsense. The void of non existence that I resided in for the 15 billion years before I was concieved has not affected in any manner shape or form, my ability to enjoy and find value in my experiences of life. Why would the void of non existence that I will reside in from about 2070 onwards for the next 15 billion years have any affect on the point or pointlessness of my current life.

Nice!
Its really just an accident of phyiscs, chemistry and biology that we are here at all.
Life has no meaning in and of itself, people can put a meaning on it, and while useful that meaning has no external validity.
Best just to accept the absurdity of it all and get on with it in a way that makes you happy. no sense arguing about it, as any meaning we try to put on it will always be flawed, as its limited by our ulitmatly insignificant human perspective.