Scum of the Earth Estate Agents

Beruthiel

something I've been pondering over this last few days as I try to purchase a house

first off, how do you know an estate agent is telling you the truth when you put an offer in, he comes back the next day telling you that you've been over bid, so you put in another bid, and he comes back the next day telling you that you've been over bid....

and my second dilemma,
I put in a bid on a house last night, (I’m in the process of selling my apartment) so he calls me back today to say that the other people who saw the property overbid me (they are also selling their place, not sale agreed yet either) but then he says to me, it’s not just about the money, but which ever of us sells our property first will get the house!!
What a load of bollix! The vendors are just looking themselves at the moment and haven’t picked a place yet, what is he playing at and can he do this?!

Jnealon

Sounds like a Remax agent to me

Beruthiel

OMG
it is!
why do you say that, what is the difference?

Haket

>first off, how do you know an estate agent is telling you the truth

As far as I know you dont, I bought last year, put an offer in (which was about 10k under asking as it was a slow time of year, but I would've come up a few 1000) the agent said he wouldn't even make the offer to the owners as it was too low !!!. 6 months later the house sold for 3k under my original offer. Scum of the earth is pretty close description IMO.


>but then he says to me, it’s not just about the money, but which ever of us sells our property >first will get the house!!

Pretty common in the UK as sellers will want their money asap so they can be cash buyers for their new place, a nice barganing chip to have.

NewFrockTuesday

if you think that an estate agent is not being straight with , ring the IAVI and lodge your complaint with them. most estate agents and their firms will be at least associated with it and they will be able to go over the proceedings on your behalf. any reputable agency will belong to this organisation. its the only regulation body the industry has so it has a fair bit of clout. they have no problems with outing those who are not observing best practises, in fact they get really pissed if someone is not conducting themselves in the proper manner. their aim is to improve the image of estate agents . www.iavi.ie

Beruthiel

improve their image!? lol
it was a general question and I would imagine very difficult to actually prove that an estate agent is chancing his arm, that's what annoys me, how can you prove it? there is no real proceedure in place for when you are bidding, at least nothing concrete that you can see.
thanks for the link though, it may be useful before I'm finished with this

threebeards

Beruthiel wrote:

The vendors are just looking themselves at the moment and haven’t picked a place yet, what is he playing at and can he do this?!

Do you know the vendors? Reason I ask is, if you know them, you could come to an arrangement with them directly and cut out the estate agent. It'd probably save you a couple of K and would also save the vendors in agents fees. I've seen this kind of thing happening before and I agree with you - it's a load of bollix!!!

Good luck with it.

Sleipnir

purdee wrote:

if you think that an estate agent is not being straight with , ring the IAVI and lodge your complaint with them. most estate agents and their firms will be at least associated with it and they will be able to go over the proceedings on your behalf. any reputable agency will belong to this organisation. its the only regulation body the industry has so it has a fair bit of clout. they have no problems with outing those who are not observing best practises, in fact they get really pissed if someone is not conducting themselves in the proper manner. their aim is to improve the image of estate agents . www.iavi.ie

They will of course be associated. A self-regulated industry is no regulation at all.
"I'm not happy with my estate agent"

Best practices? How about advertising a property as being in a particular location, when in fact it technically isn't. They're ALL at that.
So how do you know if that lie is being reflected in the advertised price?
If they then change the advertised location will the price drop accordingly?
Will it hell......

Until they are regulated by a 3rd party the bull**** will continue. Bring it on ASAP I say.

Beruthiel

threebeards wrote:

Do you know the vendors?.

no I don't know them, if I did, I wouldn't go near the agent.
I asked him what position they were in, which is how I know that they are in the process of searching for a house themselves.

NewFrockTuesday

Quote[They will of course be associated. A self-regulated industry is no regulation at all.
"I'm not happy with my estate agent"

Best practices? How about advertising a property as being in a particular location, when in fact it technically isn't. They're ALL at that.
So how do you know if that lie is being reflected in the advertised price?
If they then change the advertised location will the price drop accordingly?
Will it hell......

Until they are regulated by a 3rd party the bull**** will continue. Bring it on ASAP ]

And your helpful point in that would be............?
am i to take it you are actively doing something to "bring it on" instead of sitting on your arse venting?

Sleipnir

Yeah, I'm one of the people who decides to regulate industries through legislation.
That's me.

Oh, I did report one estate agent for falsely advertising a property as above.
It was advertised as Terenure when it fact it was in crumlin.
They said it was a mistake until it was pointed out that they had two other properties for sale with the same error.
I wouldn't hire an estate agent if they didn't bother to find out what the address was would you?

NewFrockTuesday

YOU reported an estate agent and the whole industry didnt turn over a new leaf??
who did you report the agent to? you done what any sane person would do. did you end up buying the house?

Sleipnir

I can only report what I see, when I see it.
I can't make other people do the same as I'm not the Batman of Estate Agents.

Oddly enough, the estate agent wouldn't return my call after that!

NewFrockTuesday

oh, who did you report the agent to? im interested in knowing who dealt with the situation. i want to know about your contribution to "bringing it on"

LegacyUser

yes they are scum, but is suppose it'll go full circle.

i just bought a place and reckon the "investor" as the agent called him, i was bidding against was a load of crap.

but when i sell my place, i'm sure the same 5hit will be pulled.

also, they're trying to charge us for a cooker, the agent said came with the gaf, even though they got a rake more than the asking.

simply put, people a greedy fcukers.

NewFrockTuesday

Quote[but when i sell my place, i'm sure the same 5hit will be pulled.[

i think its a case for batman!

Ardent

The industry needs transparency. There should a formal process in place for placing bids on a property, something which would enable "investors" to see documented evidence of a bid from another party before making a renewed one themselves.

They're all crooks.

NewFrockTuesday

I agree with you Ardent. but not everybody would be happy with documented disclosure of their bid and if that were to happen realistically you would be able to ask for the books in any business.
it would make the residential market far easier to navigate but commercial properties would be a whole other kettle of fish.

LegacyUser

maybe we need a drastic change,

the house is given a set value, then instead of bidding, interested parties go through a number of tasks, challenging mind and body, i thinking somthing like the crystal maze, but not as tacky.

the whole process could be shown on sky, the winners not only get the house, but also win a complete house upgrade, lets face it, most gaf's out there need em.

but what would we call such a show? :rolleyes:

GRAB A GAF? that sounds a bit mallets mallet

Oryx

If the vendors live in the house, call to them, find out whats going on, maybe even agree the deal. You wont have cut the agent out, faik you cant, if you do your liable for their fees if the house sells in x months time. If the vendors are legit folks, they may just be happy to have a deal done and dusted. Did this when I bought my first house, the agent was surprised when I called the next day and said the house was sold

Kernel32

The wife and I just sold our house and bought another one, we live in the states. The normal commission on a sale here is 7% of the sale price. We got ours down to 6% because we used the same broker to sell our house and broker the deal for the new house. They way they do it here is they have to split the commision with the broker on the other side of the deal, they also have to kick back money to the real estate agency they work for.

It was a new experience for us trying to buy and sell at the same time. The procedure for making an offer is very offical, proper forms and all that. If your offer depends on you selling your own property they have to add a contengiency clause stating that. What it means is if your offer is accepted it doesn't mean you have it. They can keep taking other offers and if someone can make an offer with no contengiency they can come back to you and give you 48 hours to close the deal or your out of the running. You also have to provide proof from a lending company, bank or whatever, that you are qualified for a mortgage in the range of the price or your broker won't put in the bid because it will immediately rejected. How does that work in Ireland? Do you have to show proof of financing? I am hoping to one day buy a house back there as an investment.

Just out of interest do sellers have to provide a disclosure when selling? Over here when your selling you have to disclose various information about your property. Size of you septic system, structural problems you have had. If you don't disclose something like say there is a big crack in the foundation and you knew about it, then the buyer can sue you later on. Its also normal to get a home inspection done. They have these inspectors you pay who spends a few hours going over the house prior to purchase. They check to make sure it meets all the specifications that the house should have, like thickness of insulation in the attic, water pressure, venting of fans, noise insulation, all that type of stuff that the average person wouldn't know how to test for. It gives you great piece of mind and your offer is always contingent on the inspectors report. If you don't like something in the report you can withdraw the offer and face no penality.

Slutmonkey57b

In the land of the ultimate nod nod, wink wink, nudge nudge system of property ownership I can't see estate agents changing any time soon.

joseph brand

I blame Mary Harney and Sir Paul Daniels.






Fact: Paul Daniels was never knighted, but he should be.

Ardent

joseph brand wrote:

I blame Mary Harney and Sir Paul Daniels.






Fact: Paul Daniels was never knighted, but he should be.

Whatever you say.

NewFrockTuesday

Quote [maybe we need a drastic change,

the house is given a set value, then instead of bidding, interested parties go through a number of tasks, challenging mind and body, i thinking somthing like the crystal maze, but not as tacky.

the whole process could be shown on sky, the winners not only get the house, but also win a complete house upgrade, lets face it, most gaf's out there need em.]




Quote[In the land of the ultimate nod nod, wink wink, nudge nudge system of property ownership I can't see estate agents changing any time soon]

lol

LegacyUser

7% commission! holy 5hit, fcuking gangsters.

is it legal to go over the estate agents head?

Kernel32 wrote:

The wife and I just sold our house and bought another one, we live in the states. The normal commission on a sale here is 7% of the sale price. We got ours down to 6% because we used the same broker to sell our house and broker the deal for the new house. They way they do it here is they have to split the commision with the broker on the other side of the deal, they also have to kick back money to the real estate agency they work for.

It was a new experience for us trying to buy and sell at the same time. The procedure for making an offer is very offical, proper forms and all that. If your offer depends on you selling your own property they have to add a contengiency clause stating that. What it means is if your offer is accepted it doesn't mean you have it. They can keep taking other offers and if someone can make an offer with no contengiency they can come back to you and give you 48 hours to close the deal or your out of the running. You also have to provide proof from a lending company, bank or whatever, that you are qualified for a mortgage in the range of the price or your broker won't put in the bid because it will immediately rejected. How does that work in Ireland? Do you have to show proof of financing? I am hoping to one day buy a house back there as an investment.

Just out of interest do sellers have to provide a disclosure when selling? Over here when your selling you have to disclose various information about your property. Size of you septic system, structural problems you have had. If you don't disclose something like say there is a big crack in the foundation and you knew about it, then the buyer can sue you later on. Its also normal to get a home inspection done. They have these inspectors you pay who spends a few hours going over the house prior to purchase. They check to make sure it meets all the specifications that the house should have, like thickness of insulation in the attic, water pressure, venting of fans, noise insulation, all that type of stuff that the average person wouldn't know how to test for. It gives you great piece of mind and your offer is always contingent on the inspectors report. If you don't like something in the report you can withdraw the offer and face no penality.

NewFrockTuesday

7% is huge! its like stamp duty all over again and then some!
afaik its /not illegal/ to go over the estate agents head. all you would have to get the vendor to say is hes taking the house off the market and pay them off for the advertising of the house so far and then toddle off and do the deal yourselves.im wondering why dont more people do this as its pretty foolproof and can save both parties money.
estate agents in dublin have it so easy onve they get the property cos it sells itself. no-one is ever going to buy a stinker of a house that they hate so selling in the true sense of the word doesnt come into it. i hate it when they say...." ill sell your house for you". no..no you wont...you will show people around it and point out features but the house will sell itself. there really is no selling to be done.
i still dont really believe that they make up phantom bids either. the risk is too great. if you thought an agent was doing this, taking sleipnirs point into consideration that a self reg industry is a non reg industry, what would happen if you reported them to the gaurds for suspected fraud? has anyone ever done this?

seamus

Ardent wrote:

The industry needs transparency. There should a formal process in place for placing bids on a property, something which would enable "investors" to see documented evidence of a bid from another party before making a renewed one themselves.

You see, the problem with "Sale by private treaty" is that the sellers can sell or not sell for whatever reason they like. Whether another couple has put a higher bid on the house is irrelevant - the sellers can still choose to sell to you at a lower price.

There should be some process though for bidding for a house through an estate agent. An interested party should have to sign a formal document declaring their bid, which is then available for public show at the estate agents. If an estate agent says that a bid has been made, they should be able to show a document to confirm it. If a person wants to join in on a sale, they can see the activity that has taken place, the interested parties, etc.

NewFrockTuesday

Quote[ The procedure for making an offer is very offical, proper forms and all that. If your offer depends on you selling your own property they have to add a contengiency clause stating that. ]

proper order!
this shroud of mystery is one of the main reasons people dont trust estate agents and if it were removed then the industry would maybe be seen in a better light as they would be purely brokering the deal instead of scuttlling around from party to party. suspected skullduggery adds even more stress.

Kernel32

seamus wrote:

There should be some process though for bidding for a house through an estate agent. An interested party should have to sign a formal document declaring their bid, which is then available for public show at the estate agents. If an estate agent says that a bid has been made, they should be able to show a document to confirm it. If a person wants to join in on a sale, they can see the activity that has taken place, the interested parties, etc.

Making the bid amounts public should never happen. At the end of the day the agreement is between two private parties and by forcing a private person to disclose this information would open the door to all sorts of invasion of privacy. There should be a formal process though, I am surprised there isn't one. Over here the format of the offer forms are controlled by the state government. There is a very strict procedure and the real estate agents follow it or they lose their license.

7% commission! holy 5hit, fcuking gangsters.

is it legal to go over the estate agents head?

I do think 7% is high myself but its a single fee, it covers all advertising, all showings no matter how long it takes to sell. There is no stamp duty here, there is a small state tax on a sale, I forget the calculation but it was around $500 on a $200k sale. Unfortunately you are taxed on your house yearly, we pay $3900 a year to the city for owning our home. But you do see where that money goes, the average town and city around here has so much better facilities than anything I had back in Ireland.

When you sign up with a seller broker you also sign a formal agreement saying you cannot sell the property yourself or through another broker while you have an agreement to sell through your current broker. You can nullify that agreement at any time. They are sneaky though, if you had an offer while under agreement with your seller broker and you rejected it you cannot just sell you house to the person who made the offer for 6 months after your agreement ended with the seller broker. If you do you will have to pay the 7% commision. Basically it stops you as a seller from rejecting an offer, canceling the agreement with the seller agent to avoid the commission and then doing the deal directly.

You can sell and buy yourself but because the process is so formal and regulated you have to be extremely careful. If the forms are not filled out properly and everything isn't filed in time with the correct agencies then at the day of the closing the mortgage company can pull out and leave you high and dry. There's a company that popped up a few years back that does sales at a flat fee, $3k I think. They do some minimum advertising, and they help you with the legal aspects and the rest is up to you.

I found the procedure fairly costly but I never doubted the integrity of the brokers because of how well regulated it all is, checks and balances at every stage to make sure you're not getting ripped of.

NewFrockTuesday

Quote[ Unfortunately you are taxed on your house yearly, we pay $3900 a year to the city for owning our home. But you do see where that money goes, the average town and city around here has so much better facilities than anything I had back in Ireland. ]

what happens if you fil to pay the tax?

Making the bid public would solve more problems than it would create (at least in the res. market). is there a website we can look at the regs for over there on? id be interested to see the ammount of control exerted as compared to here. thanks.