A little controversy

It wasn't me!

Junkies get themselves in the situation they're in. It's nobody's fault but their own. It's as simple as that. They are to be blamed for everything they do, and maybe more so because they've ensured they are in a position where they can't help it. Do people deserve to get knifed because some junky needed their wallet for his fix?

Plunky

In short, Dave, No, they don't deserve it!

Raphael

Gah! Liam! Stick! End! Wrong! Frisbee!

*ahem* Sorry, In English that meant: Liam, wtf are you on? You're jumping about like a kobold with 25 dexterity under the influence of a blink spell

Oisín Collins

*shakes head*

Can..........open

Worms.......everywhere

LiamD

It wasn't me! wrote:

Junkies get themselves in the situation they're in. It's nobody's fault but their own. It's as simple as that. They are to be blamed for everything they do, and maybe more so because they've ensured they are in a position where they can't help it. Do people deserve to get knifed because some junky needed their wallet for his fix?

Eh I said that, read back.

No they don't deserve to get knifed I never said they did.I also said that I didn't condone it and I'm actually not trying to justify it.I'm merely saying that I have seen it from another point of view and even though I don't agree with it, knowing that it's not just pure evil or power madness behins it makes it easier to understand.Everyone is motivated to do the things they do, I'm just playing devil's advocate trying to help you understand even a little bit another side to this.

Plunky

R4ph, you shouldn't talk RPG with people who don't understand that people being mugges isn't their own fault, necessarily, and that junkies aren't to be blamed for their actions - they just might not understnad...

Oisín Collins

Just to clarify

Mugging = Bad
Being addicted to drugs = Bad
Knifing people = Bad

What are we arguing about so?

It wasn't me!

I know their point of view:

"****, need some dope. There's a nice little old lady, wonder how much money she's got on her. Maybe my shiny knife'll convince her."


I don't care what you say, that is scum.

Plunky

LiamD wrote:

I'm actually not trying to justify it.

News to me, tbh...

I'm merely saying that I have seen it from another point of view

Really? hmm, my father has been repeatedly threatened by junkie after junkie, and even my sister has been once. Maybe it comes with the territory of working in James' ED, but it still happens, and TBH, when it's your family involved, it's all in a different light...

I'm just....trying to help you understand even a little bit another side to this

Hrmm, you've not been great at accepting the side we're coming from so far imho...

LiamD

I accept that being mugged must be a horrible experience.

Oisín Collins

I got here a little after the party started, but at what point did someone make "scum" the same as "knackers" or "northsiders"?

Scum = Scum, be they knifing someone on the northside or kicking the **** out of some guy outside a nightclub.

Scumbags cross all geographical borders, so can we please not get dragged into an argument about where the most and worst sumbags are. Its stupid and pointless.

My 2 cents.

scum are scum, scum live everywhere, nice people live everywhere, there is no connection bewtween scum and where they live.

Oisín Collins

Deleted User wrote:

scum are scum, scum live everywhere, nice people live everywhere, there is no connection bewtween scum and where they live.

Hear Hear *taps table*

It wasn't me!

True. The worst scumbags I've ever seen were in Killaloe of all places! Oisin's right. Scum is scum, not knacker or northsider, but scum.

Zounds

Just a side-note and please don't let this A de-rail the debate or B become a flamewar but, Liam have you considered putting spaces between your sentences? It would make your posts far easier to read.

Oisín Collins

It wasn't me! wrote:

True. The worst scumbags I've ever seen were in Killaloe of all places! Oisin's right. Scum is scum, not knacker or northsider, but scum.

Success, I'm winning!

Nah, just kidding. Glad that sense has now been restored to the thread though. A little controversy is misleading....

It wasn't me!

Now now John, we all know where that leads. I think the only point that's really being made here with any success is that it really is wrong to stab someone because you're a heroin addict. :rolleyes:

Zounds

I'm curious but too lazy to read all 7 pages of the thread, how did this current debate start?

LiamD

Plunky wrote:

Really? hmm, my father has been repeatedly threatened by junkie after junkie, and even my sister has been once.QUOTE]


Believe me I understand where you're coming from 110% and I think some of you are missing my point.I agree scum is scum but not all people who go out mugging or robbing do it for no reason.Some may have a reason, even though it's self inflicted.This DOESN'T make it right at all, doesn't justify it or anything like that, to me it just says that it's not just evil behind it.

So not all of the people out there mugging and robbing are scumbags, because scumbags just do it for the hell of it which is just scummy.It's when I realise that there is actually a person who probably is sorry that they are harming someone doing it but believes they have no other way out that I find it a little bit easier to take.It doesn't make it right, but it kinda I dunno gives me a bit more faith in people.

Oisín Collins

Isn't it wrong to stab someone....full-stop?

Oisín Collins

So muggers with a conscience are not scumbags?

(clarifier)


Also, if you were mugged by a drug addict, would you feel less aggrieved than if you were mugged by a 13-yr old who did it for the laugh? (To All)

Raphael

Hang on a second....does ANYONE know wtf Liam just said?

StupidLikeAFox

LiamD wrote:

Plunky wrote:

Really? hmm, my father has been repeatedly threatened by junkie after junkie, and even my sister has been once.

Believe me I understand where you're coming from 110% and I think some of you are missing my point.I agree scum is scum but not all people who go out mugging or robbing do it for no reason.Some may have a reason, even though it's self inflicted.This DOESN'T make it right at all, doesn't justify it or anything like that, to me it just says that it's not just evil behind it.

You had an awful roundabout and misleading way of stating the obvious then.

LiamD

Yeah, I got in on Maths not Verbal

It wasn't me!

"I feel bad about it, so that makes it okay. Hand me my machete, I'm going to go make myself really sorry." :rolleyes:

Zounds

Aonghus: not exactly.
Also,
Liam: (based on an earlier post) are you saying that a person who has become completely debilatated by drugs, who has effectively become a slave to their addiction doesn't get the slightest kick out of knowing that they can still have power over someone else's life (the mugging victim), even though they've lost control of their own?

LiamD

I don't think they do it so that they can have power over their victim, I believe they do it for the cash.

Zounds

so, you think my point is invalid?

LiamD

LiamD wrote:

I don't think they do it so that they can have power over their victim, I believe they do it for the cash.

they may not do it for the power, but the very act empower's them, it takes power and dignity away from the victim, making them feel useless. If this isn't their objective does it not make it even worse? that this occurs as a side-note?

LiamD

It means that muggers are among other things, very selfish, that they would put someone else through that.But they really aren't thinking about that, they're purely thinking about what they can get from their victim.

Mugging is not the only situation where a victim feels powerless.A bullying victim feels powerless, they don't necessarily get mugged and it's not necessarily a scumbag doing it.The same with blackmail, by it's very nature it leaves the victim in the complete control of the blackmailer.