IT only takes 8 years to say sorry...

mike65

..if its a politicaly timed appology.

The Provos who murdered Garda Jerry McCabe and injured Ben O'Sullivan issued a statement today which includes the following

'we deeply regret and apologise for this and the hurt and grief we have caused to their families. There was never any intent to attack any members of the Garda Síochána'.

Yep thats right we turned up to rob an security van with police protection carrying loaded automatic rifles which unacountably went off discharging 8 rounds of AK47 Kalasnikov ammunition into the head and chest of McCabe who would have avoided injury had he not been there.

**** happens...

totally committed to the peace process', and say they will not allow themselves to be used as 'political pawns or hostages to undermine this process'.

Why do they think they are even on the radar of the process now? They'll be released when thier sentences are served not before.

This missive feels like it was timed to distract some attention from the ongoing post-McCartney fall out while purhaps seeking to soften up public opinion.

Mike.

seamus

mike65 wrote:

This missive feels like it was timed to distract some attention from the ongoing post-McCartney fall out while purhaps seeking to soften up public opinion.

Agreed. Public support for the IRA seems to be falling down around them, while the aims/opinions/goals of the leadership (Sinn Fein) and the membership (IRA) seem to be drifting further apart each day.
Recent statements seem to be making a grab at sympathy and trying to revive the "Friendly neighbourhood terrorist" image that the IRA enjoyed in the past.

Seth Brundle

mike65 wrote:

Yep thats right we turned up to rob an security van with police protection carrying loaded automatic rifles which unacountably went off discharging 8 rounds of AK47 Kalasnikov ammunition into the head and chest of McCabe who would have avoided injury had he not been there.

**** happens...

Aah Mike - you are neglecting to take into account how there was a war on and this was therefore justified and not a crime. Anyway, this is all British propaganda and spin and lies.
Oh and it was Jerry McCabes fault for being there!

flogen

seamus wrote:

Agreed. Public support for the IRA seems to be falling down around them, while the aims/opinions/goals of the leadership (Sinn Fein) and the membership (IRA) seem to be drifting further apart each day.
Recent statements seem to be making a grab at sympathy and trying to revive the "Friendly neighbourhood terrorist" image that the IRA enjoyed in the past.

yeah, the "we'll kill the fella's who did it" was a sure attempt at being the good bad-guys again, but it failed miserably.
This is certainly nothing more than a PR stunt to try and save the IRA's image, because public support in the North is the only thing that keeps them going with the whole "freedom fighter" facade.

I did enjoy the statement from the government, though, basically saying "it's awful nice of you to ask to be taken out of the bargaining process, but you seem to be overlooking the fact that you wern't part of it for a long time".

flogen

BuffyBot

Very conveniently timed, if I do say so myself. They really are pulling out all the PR stops!

Johnny_the_fox

at least they appologised...

many people are waiting 30 years, an Inquiry and £155 million tax payers money... for a recognition of 'wrong doing'.

mycroft

seamus wrote:

Agreed. Public support for the IRA seems to be falling down around them, while the aims/opinions/goals of the leadership (Sinn Fein) and the membership (IRA) seem to be drifting further apart each day.
Recent statements seem to be making a grab at sympathy and trying to revive the "Friendly neighbourhood terrorist" image that the IRA enjoyed in the past.

And the fact that is just a scant few hours before St Paddys day while Adams is roaming the US looking for support well thats just serendipity

Do the IRA/SF honestly expect us to believe that the Mc Cabe killers, were visted by the Ghosts of St Patrick/Pearse/and Mary Lou and understood the true meaning of republicism?

I swear; after the indo report about the report about the living conditions of the Mc Cabe killers with free range birds et all, I have a vision;


Scene; a wintery St Paddys day morning;

The Mc Cabe killers popping over their windows and turning to a tiny child and saying;

"I say boy, boy?"

Little boy "Yes Mister republician terrorist?"

Mc Cabe killer "What day is it?"

Little boy "Why sir, it's St Patricks day"

Mc Cabe killer "Then it's true, thank you ghosts, it was true it was true!!"

Of course when I wander into the vision of IRA terrorists volunteering the money from the NIB robbery to cure a multitude of tiny tims crippled by punishment beatings and shootings, to healing their broken knees hands ankles and arms, while they cook the pheasant from the Mc Cabe killers farm, and then they all speak with chirpy voices "God bless us everyone" I push back the vomit and rising bile

monument

It’s very hard to know if there is sincerity at all, but yes, at least they did apologise.

As for Bertie taking the release off the cards, remind me how many times it has been taken off and on ‘the cards’?

And some apologies take more then eight years, but it doesn’t matter we should expect more from the IRA then a state. :rolleyes:

I’m equally cynical and welcoming of both apologise.

AmenToThat

kbannon wrote:

Aah Mike - you are neglecting to take into account how there was a war on and this was therefore justified and not a crime. Anyway, this is all British propaganda and spin and lies.
Oh and it was Jerry McCabes fault for being there!

I agree with the above apart from it being Jerry McCabes faylt for being there.

Seth Brundle

AmenToThat wrote:

I agree with the above apart from it being Jerry McCabes faylt for being there.

Are you serious? :eek:
I was taking the pi$s!

Hobbes

monument wrote:

And some apologies take more then eight years, but it doesn’t matter we should expect more from the IRA then a state. :rolleyes:

I’m equally cynical and welcoming of both apologise.

Blairs was hardly an apology though. Sure didn't they actually charge them a bill for having them in prison for all those years.

bonkey

monument wrote:

but it doesn’t matter we should expect more from the IRA then a state. :rolleyes:

We should expect more from a terrorist organisation than from a democratically-elected government?

How do you make that out?

jc

Phil_321

This "apology" is just a decoy to divert attention from the emerging facts that a number of Sinn Féin members were in McGennis's pub the night McCartney was murdered.

It just reaffirms my belief that Sinn Féin and the IRA are the same organisation.

Pal

AmenToThat wrote:

I agree with the above apart from it being Jerry McCabes faylt for being there.

unbelievable

monument

bonkey wrote:

We should expect more from a terrorist organisation than from a democratically-elected government?

How do you make that out?

jc

I didn’t think the sarcasm tags were needed there, I thought the sarcasm smilie would do - it’s not a view I hold, but a reference to people in other threads expecting more from the IRA then a state, and using the IRA’s actions to justify a state’s actions.

uberwolf

I agree with his McCabes Widow. They shot, stopped shooting and then reopened fire according to her. That's considered intent in my book.

bonkey

Was McCabes' widow present when he was shot?
jc

bonkey

bonkey wrote:

Was McCabes' widow present when he was shot?
jc

She was interviewed on RTÉ last night Bonkey and thats what she said.I presume there were witnesses to coroborate that or she wouldnt have said it, not least probably the other detective who survived.

jman0

Earthman wrote:

She was interviewed on RTÉ last night Bonkey and thats what she said.I presume there were witnesses to coroborate that or she wouldnt have said it, not least probably the other detective who survived.

I highly doubt she was a witness so i'd take her words with buckets of salt.
My own thoughts on the matter are that McCabe was an idiot trying to be some sort of hero for the banking industry and that the perpetrators, if IRA should have been court martialed per violation of Standing Order number 8.

Fascinating insight into your thinking there jman0

Jerrry McCabe according to you was an idiot

Speaks volumes

He was there to ensure law and order - most people would regard him as a hero.

Seth Brundle

jman0 wrote:

My own thoughts on the matter are that McCabe was an idiot trying to be some sort of hero for the banking industry and that the perpetrators, if IRA should have been court martialed per violation of Standing Order number 8.

Jerry McCabe was sitting in his car when he was shot so I don't think he was trying to be a hero!
Furthermore, it was his job to protect the public and to prevent crime!


Also - why would the criminals/murderers involved be court martialled?
And what standing order? What part of our constitution or law is it from?

uberwolf

jman0 wrote:

My own thoughts on the matter are that McCabe was an idiot trying to be some sort of hero

this description wouldn't seem to corroborate your slant.
I've had difficulty finding a good description of the circumstances. Certainly at no point have I seen the suggestion that either Garda fired their weapons nor were given a chance to surrender.

jman0 wrote:

the perpetrators, if IRA

are you questioning whether the perpetrators were IRA members on an IRA mission?


bonkey - pause beteen shots

jman0

kbannon wrote:

Also - why would the criminals/murderers involved be court martialled?
And what standing order? What part of our constitution or law is it from?

Because that's the proceedings the IRA Army Council take in such matters and that is something the volunteers would have been informed of and agreed to.
It's not from the Free State constitution.

Edit: from The Green Book The volunteer is told under Standing Order No.8' that the Southern forces are not to be regarded as targets.

seamus

jman0 wrote:

Because that's the proceedings the IRA Army Council take in such matters and that is something the volunteers would have been informed of and agreed to.
It's not from the Free State constitution.

Edit: from The Green Book The volunteer is told under Standing Order No.8' that the Southern forces are not to be regarded as targets.

Does it not make more sense that they were tried and convicted as the criminals they are instead of leaving the punishment up to a criminal organisation?

jman0

seamus wrote:

Does it not make more sense that they were tried and convicted as the criminals they are instead of leaving the punishment up to a criminal organisation?

Perhaps you are confusing my posts with someone elses'. I have not argued that they shouldn't have been prosecuted by RoI.
I have said that they should have been court martialed by the IRA.
This would mean they cannot qualify for early release under the terms of the GFA.

seamus

jman0 wrote:

Perhaps you are confusing my posts with someone elses'. I have not argued that they shouldn't have been prosecuted by RoI.
I have said that they should have been court martialed by the IRA.
This would mean they cannot qualify for early release under the terms of the GFA.

Ah, misunderstood.

Seth Brundle

jman0 wrote:

I have said that they should have been court martialed by the IRA.
This would mean they cannot qualify for early release under the terms of the GFA.

And under what authority does an illegal organisation have to court martial criminals?

The IRA does not reflect the views of the people of Ireland.
It does not have any legal standing in Ireland (apart from being illegal).
It condicts itself by means of intimidation, violence, criminality and murder.
There may be some who can sympathise with some of the views of the IRA but that does not make the organisation right!

By the logic of the IRA members, I could set up a phoney war with someone, kill their people and claim that it is all ok purely because I believe in it?
There may have been a need over the years of the struggle to find a mechanism of protecting the people from the RUC and other British armed forces but that does not apply now (if it does, then how many people were killed using PSNI collusion in the last 12 months?).

jbkenn

jman0 wrote:

I highly doubt she was a witness so i'd take her words with buckets of salt.
My own thoughts on the matter are that McCabe was an idiot trying to be some sort of hero for the banking industry and that the perpetrators, if IRA should have been court martialed per violation of Standing Order number 8.

jman0, to introduce some clarity to your thoughts, Det Gda McCabe was no idiot, he was an ordinary joe, a family man, and a policeman, he, nor Det Gda O'Sullivan, had any chance to draw their firearms to defend themselves, there were witnesses to the murder, not Mrs McCabe, there was evidence given at the trial, there were 17 rounds discharged, if you know anything about firearms it is very difficult to "accidentally" discharge 17 rounds, you might discharge 3 or 4 but 8?, and then "accidently" discharge 9 more.
The members of the gang, would in police parlance, have been known to them, hell, they were known to most people in Limerick,and, a more accomplished shower of wasters, God never put in shoe leather, it was'nt their first robbery, and, it is highly unlikely it would have been their last.
What the RA would or should have done to them, is of no consequence to law abiding democrats.

jbkenn

MT

AmenToThat wrote:

I agree with the above apart from it being Jerry McCabes faylt for being there.

unbelievable

Can we really expect anything else from an apologist?

Can we assume from this that AmenToThat thinks that it was also the fault of every other victim of the IRA for being present when they were beaten or murdered?

I mean just think, if Robert McCartney had had the good sense to have avoided lying on the pavement outside Magennis' bar his stomach might never have grabbed the knife of those good freedom fighting fellows from the local justice and human rights association.

I think some apologists are in need of a reality check.

daveirl

This post has been deleted.

Slutmonkey57b

Let me see if I've got this right - jman0 thinks that Mrs McCabe's opinion should be taken with "buckets of salt" because she wasn't there.
His opinion, that Gda McCabe behaved like an "idiot" and was "trying to be a hero", based on.... ummmm... not being at the scene of the crime perhaps, should be taken as ummm...

On the other hand, as he's quoting from the green book maybe he does have some first hand experience of the case. Do they have net access in those bungalows?