A Player's Charter For The Industry.

jem

i subose I have been argueing for events that the organisers are trying to make a few quid from.This is not the case with ourselves, so much of the arguments that have happened are not relevent to our tourney.
We are near enough there in terms of sponsorship so we can state that the prize fund is 75% of all initial buyin- €20, top ups €20 and rebuys €20.
I have asked one of the banks to provide a staff member to count the money with us and be an independant person to insure that all money is above board.I am fairly confident that this will happen, if it doesn't we will at least have a member of St. V de P there with us for all counting.
With regard to the buy backs /top ups what I have in mind was that with each there would be a ticket given out with each, and the rebuys would be per counted into coin bags from the banks, we would therefore have a trible check on the numbers ie the money, the number of bags handed out and also the ticket stub. The reason I was against the name taking was because there was pandamonium in the gresham at times with the rebuys, i saw one of those giving them out with 4/5 around him looking for the chips in order to get back palying, taking names i felt would take too long.
As tap said we will discuss it at our next meeting.

our published structure is initial buyin €20 1500 in chips, rebuy €20 1500 in chips, top up €20 2000 in chips.
I have a computer version of the poster if anyone is interested.
i would hope that we would run this event again for charity in the future so we want to run an event that is sucessful, well run and enjoyed by all. As tap said we are not capping the prize money , the more spent, the more given out.
As I said I was probably argueing for events that I would attend but are not running, where the organisers are trying to make money for themselves. There are a lot of opportunities to play in Dublin but I am sure that this is the first event being run within 50 miles or more of Roscrea. I would like to see more events and personally don't mind if people make decent money out of them, but thats just the businessman in me.

DeVore

I *want* organisers to make money from the game. Otherwise they wont run them again but what I've seen to date has made me sick. Especially in the west where it seems to be usual for the organiser to skim about 40%+ from the pool without saying anything to anyone.

Jem, I think you guys are on the up but you REALLY need to come to Dublin to the Fitz and see how they run tournies there. 100 people games and every name for every buyin is taken and recorded. Its not as much work as you think though you need to be organised!

DeV.

BrendanB

I don't think anyone is arguing against tournaments that make a profit Jem, as long as it's done above board. If you want to charge a 20 quid reg fee and take a 10% cut of rebuys in a tournament you run that's fair enough as long as people can see what's going on.

As far as making a profit goes, I think seems to be an underlying, unstated and possibly unconscious belief that poker players are getting screwed over, and that we need to throw off the shackles of the oppressor and make an heroic stand. A la the house of lords or something. This just isn't the case, tournament regs are extremely low by the costs involved, and in truth tournament players are freerolling at cashgamers expense.

If independent poker tournaments start cropping up more and more often we'll just have to accept that without side games to cover costs, the regs are going to be going up.

As for a poker players association, I can see the point with the increase in the number of unknown organisers - in practical terms it might be tough to get off the ground given that there is no underlying club structure that supports similar bodies in other sports (and calling poker a sport is a little bit optimistic), but I'm sure there's a way.

BigDragon

Interesting article by Ray Cooke on the subject:

Here

jem

we will try to get up to the fitz. a few of the lads are going to the kildare tourney tonight.
We do want it run right and did ask for all the help and sugestions that we could get.
We will come up with a system for keeping the records. the gresham event scared me off doing so, I have to admit.

DeVore

To be honest, while the Gresham event was well run by non-casino standards, there was room for improvement, its easy enough to have a clipboard and photcopies of the sign in list, give them to the rebuy people and split the room in half...

You should buy workman aprons (the kind carpenter use for tools) and put the various chips in the pockets, thats what we do for the big games in the Fitz.

I agree with Brendan too, we should expect to see reg fees go up BUT since the entire prizepool is left for the players, we get MUCH better value for our money. Currently the games *really* should be listed as 25+25 games, cos thats what the money comes to when you look at it closely. Now, if someone comes along and runs a 35+15 game, which is the public going to pick?

I'm also thinking of dropping the requirement for dealers for 10+ reg fees and just leave it that each tournie must detail whether it has deaelers or not and for how much of the tournie (all, last 3 tables, final table).

I dont really want to be determining what numbers are used but just detailing the amount of prior info the players must have. Informed players make informed choices!

Jem, I like the way you guys are conducting things though, asking for advice etc is a good sign! If I'm not working I'll try and get down to Tipp for the night.

DeV.

Shortstack

DeVore wrote:

Jem, I like the way you guys are conducting things though, asking for advice etc is a good sign! If I'm not working I'll try and get down to Tipp for the night.

DeV.

Road trip !

jem

DeVore wrote:

Jem, I like the way you guys are conducting things though, asking for advice etc is a good sign! If I'm not working I'll try and get down to Tipp for the night.

DeV.

Thanks.
Do take a night off, it will do you good and come down and see what life is like past the mad cow
Tickets are now available. and the deal with the hotel stands at €35 pp sharing which is good value.
As it was my idea in the first place and to be honest pushed the others into it.So I hope it will be well supported by the boards crew.
the email acehighroscrea"at"hotmail."com" will get you tickets.
I am now going to ammend my earlied initial notice.

thanks for the help.
james
I have now posted the amended version. I hope that it is ok for everyone.

jem

if I may make a sugestion,
why not make a sticky of the notices of tourneys that shall we say would be recomended by the mods, or have a sticky with links to treads on those tourneys.That way it is to the advantage of those holding them to conform to the ideas of the site. Have the sticky tread locked for posting except by mods.

DeVore

I think stickying tournie announcements isnt a bad idea. Let me think about how it can be done cleanly, I like your suggestion though.

I've gone down the country to play a few times but the experience has left a bad taste in my mouth frequently, hence this charter because to be honest, the Dublin players arent really in need of it, its the country players who have no alternative that are getting screwed.

I'll be down if that doesnt clash with another tournie I have to run.

DeV.

jem

If you want I will do a post linking to each tread that the tourney is discusses on.
If it is ok You can make it a sticky later.

okidoki987

poker is fast becoming a huge sport

That's an understatemnet when you see the likes of Argos selling chips and tables!


And it was going oh so well until....

I have asked one of the banks

DeVore

I'm going to be finalising the charter soon and we'll see how things go.
Already I have one series of tournies that will be run in the North West of the country who have agreed to follow it.

I'm going to change one thing, that is the requirement for regged tournies of 10 euros or more to have dealers. I'm going to change that to all tournaments must declare if they will have dealers or not, that way its up to the players to decide. I'll append the excellent set of questions Hyzepher knocked together too.

I dont want to punish legit operators or charity games, I'd like all the charity games to be able to stamp their flyers "In accordance with the Irish Poker Players Tournament Charter".

Now that the Open I'll have a bit more time...

DeV.