SDLP caught lying over McCartney "support"

Mercury_Tilt · 23-03-2005 5:47pm #1

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mike65 · 23-03-2005 5:56pm

Shields up!

Not sure how much this is about the "SDLP" as opposed to ppl who have connection to the party but who also happen to be in business running things like a travel agency...its not like they financed the trip and sent minders with the sisters and to have a PR person is resonable too, its not like they are veterans at working the floor unlike Gerry, Martin etc.

Mike.

mycroft · 23-03-2005 6:02pm

Mercury_Tilt wrote:

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As I understand it their press liason was just some poor bloke who got drafted in at the last minute, and the arranging of credit is fairly common place.

The title of the article says it all "SDLP arranged trip" They sorted out the credit and the kid in the US was working off his own bat and not under an orders from the party.

This reeks of desperation.

Mercury_Tilt · 23-03-2005 6:04pm

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Mercury_Tilt · 23-03-2005 6:05pm

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mycroft · 23-03-2005 6:15pm

Mercury_Tilt wrote:

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these one's?

Interesting that the SDLP would deny offering help to get the sisters across to see Mr Bush.... Why?

What could be so wrong with admitting such simple help as offering to help them get to america? Have they some sinister agenda!?!? Can any party in the North be trusted to tell the truth!?!?!

The article suggests the SDLP organised the trip. 1 member of the SDLP helped in a small way, and one former member helped out.

Do you not think it was possible they (the SDLP) didn't know these people were helping in the first place?

So the original denial was made without being fully aware of all the facts, that one of the members in his capacity as a travel agent, supplied a line of credit?

But the party was truthful in its original denial that they as a political organisation are not helping out?

mike65 · 23-03-2005 6:22pm

from article

Senior SDLP members...

If the party did'nt organise the trip over then they have nothing to deny. The SDLP party was'nt lying. Daily Ireland on the other hand is a provo rag looking to cause the SDLP and the McCartneys some discomfort while giving the SF ammo.

Mike.

23-03-2005 6:28pm

Dr McDonnell, a partner in Arrow Travel, admitted he had given the McCartneys credit approval for the trip.

You know, a few moons ago I rang a travel agent for a trip to Australia aged 22 with no assets and nothing in my arse pocket and got credit approval for the flights...
I didn't need the SDLP or anybody.

Mercury_Tilt · 23-03-2005 6:30pm

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Mercury_Tilt · 23-03-2005 6:35pm

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mycroft · 23-03-2005 6:39pm

Mercury_Tilt wrote:

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There is nothing in the body of the article that follows that suggests the party made that decision. Mc Donnell did. The SDLP did not consciously as a group do so.

Saying it doesn't make it true.

I was going to say I am sure you could do better mike. But then I remembered you cant.

Pot, black, kettle, calling, the.

Please arrange the above words to suit the tone of my reply to that sentiment.

I am sure you will find another article to post up soon enough suit your needs.

:eek:

It would help if the article came from a credible source and not that rag.

uberwolf · 23-03-2005 6:40pm

Mercury_Tilt wrote:

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hmmm indeed, focus on the post and not the poster or you'll be on the outside looking in for a week.

mycroft · 23-03-2005 6:46pm

Mercury_Tilt wrote:

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It doesnt? Really? What about the, y'know, title!

SDLP organised McCartney visit

The body of the text does not support the allegation that the article leads with. It's gutter tabloid journalism of the shabbiest worst kind.

It also clearly states in the article that the SDLP "denied helping" the family get to America. But after some investigative journalism they were caught lying.

The article starts by trying to suggest that the SDLP organised the trip. It undoes itself in the presentation of the facts.

Once again the SDLP didn't organise the trip, one of their members made a couple of calls. The SDLP might have been unaware of this small fact when they made the original denial.

Theres a mole here over there, fling enough dirt on it and viola you have a mountain.

Those are the facts. The measure of help is not in question. Nor the help itself.

Yes it is. Theres a world of difference between the title and body of text.

Why deny such a simple thing?

Maybe try the rest of my questions..

Were they afraid of a political back lash because they were taking advantage of a rather sad situation to enhance the political leverage of the event its self? Did they fear the truth would give voice to various comments that the Sisters were being "used by political parties"?

:eek:

Theres no evidence to support those questions. You've made a straw man argument. The SDLP didn't help, therefore the rest of your questions are moot because the original point isn't valid.

Mercury_Tilt · 23-03-2005 6:52pm

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Slutmonkey57b · 23-03-2005 6:52pm

Well it's an article that reeks of grabbing at straws, but then McGuinness did "warn" the sisters not to be messing with the shinners.

The sisters did admit that they got financial help with the flights but that they were paying their own living expenses, so I don't see how this "new" information constitutes anything to bash either the sisters or the SDLP with (unless you're writing at the behest of someone who wants to smear them). If the Daily Ireland can't find a way to paint the ex-SDLP member who helped them out as being more enthusiastic than thinking "there was more life in a cemetary" than the SDLP, then I think it's a pretty safe bet that he's not acting on behalf of the party.

It's newsworthy more as part of the opening broadside in the standard "destroy the victims' character" media tactic the terrorist movement(s) like to use when discovered in the midst of unsavoury dealings.

mike65 · 23-03-2005 6:58pm

Mercury_Tilt wrote:

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Ignoring the personal abuse I'll focus on the salient point of this non-story. Alasdair McDonnell who is a member of the SDLP and a travel agent gave assistance. He is NOT the party and the party is NOT him. So the party
(which remeber is NOT Mr McDonnell) had nothing to acknowledge.

more disussion on this topic

Mike.

Mercury_Tilt · 23-03-2005 7:03pm

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Mercury_Tilt · 23-03-2005 7:06pm

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jbkenn · 23-03-2005 7:08pm

Mercury_Tilt wrote:

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Nice try, Mercury_Tilt, Nice try,

jbkenn

mike65 · 23-03-2005 7:09pm

So what you all are saying is that the or a party cannot be held accountable for actions of its member unless sanctioned at a high level or something to that effect?

He he! I was waiting for that line of thinking, and I don't blame you for raising it as a diversionary tactic.

The difference between the IRA and SF vis a vis the murder, oops Manslaughter of Jerry McCabe or the murder of Robert McCartney and the SDLP and any of its members is this - the SDLP are'nt killing anyone for political or financial gain. The SDLP are'nt alligned with a terrorist "army" the SDLP do not glory in the work of killers at thier Ard Fheis. And so on.

Mike.

The Muppet · 23-03-2005 7:11pm

It's a non story indicating how much Sinn Fein want to detract from the actual issues in the Mc Cartney Murder. The fact that the Sisters were helped by a member of the SDLP is totally understandable. Helping constituents is what civilised politics is about.

Who knows why the SDLP told the lie If they did . It's possible Mr. Attwood was not acting in his capacity as an SDLP advisor when he helped the sisters.

Whether the SDLP lied or not is irrelevant, there are far more serious issues with this story that Sinn Fein should be addressing instead of muckraking.

Mercury_Tilt · 23-03-2005 7:11pm

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Slutmonkey57b · 23-03-2005 7:13pm

Could we have a little less of the hyperbole and attacking the poster while we're at it Mercury? I believe you've already been warned once.

jbkenn · 23-03-2005 7:21pm

Mercury_Tilt wrote:

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You really are clutching at straws

Though I feel it will be handy to quote from this thread in the future.

I have no doubt you will.

jbkenn

Mercury_Tilt · 23-03-2005 7:23pm

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cdebru · 23-03-2005 7:23pm

mike65 wrote:

Shields up!

Not sure how much this is about the "SDLP" as opposed to ppl who have connection to the party but who also happen to be in business running things like a travel agency...its not like they financed the trip and sent minders with the sisters and to have a PR person is resonable too, its not like they are veterans at working the floor unlike Gerry, Martin etc.

Mike.

lol that is a classic line of defence

it was not us it was people with connections to us

mmm i think i have heard it somewhere before

The Muppet · 23-03-2005 7:29pm

Mercury_Tilt wrote:

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The SDLP are a political party and not an Army . As you know there would be hugh difference in command structure so its a null point if you ask me . But nice try all the same.

mike65 · 23-03-2005 7:37pm

cdebru wrote:

mmm i think i have heard it somewhere before

You have, and it was the only reason MT started this thread I suspect.

All a bit lame really.

Mike.

The Muppet · 23-03-2005 7:40pm

Mercury_Tilt wrote:

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I didnt suggest the journalist lied, I said its a non story because by your own admission it's understandable that the SDLP helped and whether they want to admit that publically or not pales into insignificance when you consider the other issues in the Mc Cartney Murder.

Are you suggesting that politicians should not help constituents in such circumstances ?

Sleep tight.

A Dub in Glasgo · 23-03-2005 8:01pm

In my opinion, the McCartney sisters have been used by people with other agendas and those people found the McCartney case a useful conduit to move their agenda forward.

Should this impact on the campaign to get justice for the family of Robert McCartney? It should not but in the realpolitik of the situation, it will probably hurt them especially with initial denials of help.

Nearly everyone questions the backers of justice campaigns. I previously posted a link to the Relatives For Justice website which details the issue of state murder and the apparant legality of it. I was harangued by some on this forum because I posted a link to, in their eyes, an IRA backed propaganda website.

Every case should be taken on its merits but that does not happen in real life and it certainly does not happen on boards.

AmenToThat · 23-03-2005 8:01pm

mike65 wrote:

He he! I was waiting for that line of thinking, and I don't blame you for raising it as a diversionary tactic.

The difference between the IRA and SF vis a vis the murder, oops Manslaughter of Jerry McCabe or the murder of Robert McCartney and the SDLP and any of its members is this - the SDLP are'nt killing anyone for political or financial gain. The SDLP are'nt alligned with a terrorist "army" the SDLP do not glory in the work of killers at thier Ard Fheis. And so on.

Mike.

The topic under discussion is the SDLP and their relationship (or not) with the McCartney sisters.
As usual when the 'SF bashings society' run out of ammunition or find that their arguments are indeed wrong its back to 'old reliable'.
Very predictable and very boring at this stage Im afraid.

SDLP caught lying over McCartney "support"

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