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who is in th right?

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  • 20-04-2005 11:17am
    #1
    criss
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2 ✭


    my friend left a bike into a reputable bike shop to get a new brakes cable attached. he was told by the shop assistant that they would contact him in a day or two when it was ready. a week later he hadn't heard from them so he rang up the shop and was told his bike was ready and that it was gonna cost...eur108!
    he called into the shop and was shown a reciept for eur108. he asked (same shop assistant) how could it cost this much as it should not even cost eur20 and the bike itself probably wasn't even worth that.
    he was told that the bike had had a full service including new tyres and new mud guards attached! he protested that this was not what he asked for, and asked them to take the mud guards etc off, but was told this would only take eur20 off the bill and he would still have to pay eur88 to get his bike back.
    he tried to contact the owner, but each time he was unavailable.
    he sent a formal letter to the company, but was told the were still charging him eur50. he can't afford this!
    any advice on what should he do?


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    #2
    Gurgle
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,064 ✭✭✭Gurgle


    criss wrote:
    any advice on what should he do?
    Citizen's advice beareau.

    They can't just decide to service the bike because they have nothing better to do.

    If they won't give him back his bike, call the gardai.
    Thats theft.

    Though why would you send a bike into a shop to get brake cables fitted ?
    My 6yo son could do that himself.


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    #3
    criss
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2 ✭criss


    he went to both and was told the agreement was between him and the company, and there was nothing they could really do.
    not to sure about the DIY thing! but i'm sure he'll try it next time..


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    #4
    vinnyfitz
    Closed Accounts Posts: 805 ✭✭✭vinnyfitz


    Did he also try the ODCA helpline? www.odca.ie
    If so what did they say?
    There must be precedent for sorting out this sort of thing.

    Did your friend not even ask what the price was when he left the bike in "how much will that set me back?" Reply "Oh it'll be about €XX". That would have some validity as a verbal contract

    Was it the owner or the assistant who offered the €50 compromise? Was the offer in writing? It sounds like the owner knows he is on dodgy ground here if he is not prepared to engage directly.

    Your friend should get a written quote from another reputable bike shop for replacing brake cables and offer that amount as final settlement and see what they say.


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    #5
    stevom
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10 ✭stevom


    I have no tools to fix it myself, cuz im currently lining away from home so i had no choice to but to go to this bike shop.
    I didnt ask him how much it would cost, as i didnt think i would be taken advantage of!
    I contacted lots of places including the ones mentioned above.
    They say they cannot help me as it is between me and the bike shop,
    got an email today from the ODCA saying they can not give me info via email and to call them.
    My solicitor sent them a letter,
    then they got a solicitor, there offer is €50 of sue them.
    We are currently trying for €30,
    If that doesnt work................! Small claims court i'd say.
    They are totally in the wrong and they know it.
    i don't know why the choose to fight, but im ready & waiting and not backing down.
    If they get away with it on me, they'll only do it again


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    #6
    vinnyfitz
    Closed Accounts Posts: 805 ✭✭✭vinnyfitz


    Do let us know how you get on.


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    #7
    stevom
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10 ✭stevom


    Will do Vinny, Will do!
    Thank you everybody for your help & suggestions


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    #8
    Gillo
    Registered Users Posts: 5,566 ✭✭✭Gillo


    If a service is provided that you did not request, you are not liable for it. eg, if you hire a gardener to cut your grass and he/she without consulting you also planted a bush, you would have to pay for the grass, but not for teh planting of the bush.

    Did you get a docket from the shop when you left the bike in?
    If so did it specify what work was to be done?

    Ultimately it'll probabley be a case of who is more convincing in court, you saying that you only requested the brakes been sorted or the shop saying you requested a full service.

    Incidently what shop was it?

    Where parts are involved I'm not sure what the story is, would you have to pay for the parts in order to keep them or do you get them free, it's possibel the judge may just award you the parts and service carried out.


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    #9
    rondjon
    Closed Accounts Posts: 195 ✭✭rondjon


    stevom wrote:
    I didnt ask him how much it would cost, as i didnt think i would be taken advantage of!

    Being really harsh about this mate, tough!!!!

    If you don't ask up front, you're inviting people to take advantage of you and rip you off.

    You didn't do enough to look after yourself in the first place (when it was easiest and best to do so), so you're really pissing against the wind now trying to get other organisations to look after your interests after the fact.

    There was no agreement between you and the shop when you left the bike in. You asked for brake cables, but since you didn't ask how much, they can legitimately tell you that it's €108 for the brake cables and labour for fitting them, and be well within their rights.

    The other stuff is just a smoke screen by them.


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    #10
    stevom
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10 ✭stevom


    Yes i have the a docket stub in front of me which has printed on it

    Name........................
    Nature of Repair:
    Wanted for:..........
    Less Deposit:

    Above this he wrote in front of me a big bloody squiggle, which is unreadable and i just presumed was my name.

    I know I should of asked for the price and believe me i learned my lession.
    But i still believe there are in the wrong and they know that.

    The owner was meant to contact me but didnt,
    I called in twive and he wasn't there. I left messages with the repair man for him to contact me.......but nothing
    I called again yesterday , he wasnt there so i left another msg for him to contact me, but no...............
    He decided to contact a solicitor instead because i contacted mine.
    And i contacted my solictor because the repair man said there's nothing they can do. Well i just proved them wrong...
    But u r right, it does feel like pissing agaisnt the wind, LOL
    Gary Cycles
    Sligo
    Ireland
    Named and shamed!


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    #11
    stevom
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10 ✭stevom


    It looks like its going to the small claims court now,


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    #12
    Enii
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,546 ✭✭✭Enii


    Rightly so. They should have backe down the minute they realised what happened. They made a mistake. You asked for brake cable rpleaced, they serviced. Tough to them. They made a mistake, they lose. You shouldn't be put out by their incompetence. Best of luck with it!


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    #13
    Gurgle
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,064 ✭✭✭Gurgle


    Enii wrote:
    They should have backe down the minute they realised what happened. They made a mistake.
    There's way too much of that crap going on & I don't believe it happens by mistake.

    My mate left his car in for new front tyres a couple of years ago, and they replaced his front shocks too. When he went to collect his car, he was handed a bill for over €400. They claimed he had asked them to 'check it over'. After much arguing, they took the shocks off and put his old ones back on.

    Apart from everything else, he had a pair of (second-hand) shocks sitting in his garage at home waiting to go on the car.


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    #14
    stevom
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10 ✭stevom


    Its a bit of a joke alright,
    And when you go looking for help of consumer affairs etc.......
    They all say the same thing, its not our problem and give you someone elses number to annoy.

    I cant go by fone really, my only option is internet.and they practically ignore my mail...............................
    why bother going to work if your not going to to your job...


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    #15
    RainyDay
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,925 ✭✭✭RainyDay


    Small Claims Court is definitely your best option, though even if you win the case, it's not easy to enforce the judgement if he still refuses to pay up.

    While you do share some blame for not getting a clear estimate beforehand, his failure to fill out the repair docket clearly will be to your benefit.


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    #16
    4Xcut
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,248 ✭✭✭4Xcut


    rondjon wrote:
    Being really harsh about this mate, tough!!!!

    If you don't ask up front, you're inviting people to take advantage of you and rip you off.

    You didn't do enough to look after yourself in the first place (when it was easiest and best to do so), so you're really pissing against the wind now trying to get other organisations to look after your interests after the fact.

    There was no agreement between you and the shop when you left the bike in. You asked for brake cables, but since you didn't ask how much, they can legitimately tell you that it's €108 for the brake cables and labour for fitting them, and be well within their rights.

    The other stuff is just a smoke screen by them.


    Normally iwould agree with you that if someone gats ripped off it serves them right but in all fairness that is bullsh*t. I'd be damn sure you wouldn't stand for that(this happening to you is a hypathetical situation, i didn't say it would so don't come back with"I would'nt be so stupid as to..."). They owe him most of that money back. They may try and say that some of the charge is for storing the bike for several days even though it was them who didn't ring you.


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    #17
    rondjon
    Closed Accounts Posts: 195 ✭✭rondjon


    4Xcut wrote:
    They owe him most of that money back.

    You're missing my point.

    Morally, yes, they owe him the money back because they took advantage and did more work for him than he asked, and all that. But businesses are not moral entities.

    Legally, they don't owe him anything. And that's his own fault. Legally, he wasn't ripped off. He was charged for work done to his bike.

    Legally, because he didn't ask for a quote, either verbal or written, he can be charged whatever they like after the fact. If he'd asked for a quote beforehand, in detail in writing, they would have had to stick to that.

    And please don't think that I'm saying that it serves him right, or that he deserved to be ripped off.

    There are simple things that as responsible consumers that we can all do in order to protect ourselves, that will let business know that they can't take advantage, and will eventually build better consumer behaviour.

    In this case, the person didn't do any of those things, and the business took advantage. If he had done those things, the business wouldn't have been able to do so.


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    #18
    stevom
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10 ✭stevom


    Well guys,
    The small claims are of no use to me now,
    I went in to the shop with €50 and asked for my bike, the man said its all going through the courts now...........................So i left another message with him for his boss.......................suprise suprise i go no reply

    I got him this morning, she said I had a certain anmount of time to accept the offer...fair enough, I didnt reply cuz i was waiting on an answer from the samll claims,
    He then had the nerve to tell me that the solicitor i contacted in the first instance would not go to court because my sister works for them and I was only using that to my advantage, Of course i was i didn't think the prick would go this far when he knew he was in the wrong.....

    Well ****, i have to go over this eveing to get the bike and pay €50, better than €108 i suppose but still unfair me thinks,
    Guys n Gals, Thank you very much for ur opinion's over the weeks....
    I'll put it down to experience and I suggest you and everyone else quote aprick on any works being carried out on your possessions
    be cool guys,
    cheers
    stevom :cool:


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    #19
    RainyDay
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,925 ✭✭✭RainyDay


    I don't understand why you are absolutely ruling out the Small Claims Court route? [Note that I'm not necessarily recommending this route, and in practical terms, you may well be better off reaching a settlement].


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    #20
    RicardoSmith
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,264 ✭✭✭RicardoSmith


    Personally I think the whole thing of sticking mud guards and doing the extra work clearly shows that they were trying to add extras to the bill without being asked. Putting mud guards is hardly part of standard service is it? Its also very hard to misunderstand, new brake cables as service & new mud guards. Basically its a scam. I don't see how you could see it otherwise. I'd like to see a break down of the original 108 bill and a breakdown of how it was brought to 88 then 50. What has has been knocked off? Even for the 50 bill I'd want to see a break down of that too.

    I've had cars serviced for less than 108...


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    #21
    stevom
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10 ✭stevom


    The small claims court ruled me out, They said they can't do anything.

    About seeing an itemised bill, I know i would have loved to but when i called in to collect it i just wanted to get out asap (its gone on for too long)
    He put back on my old tyre (gary the boss) and i had to ask for my mudguard as when he produced the bike there was no mud guards at all,

    When i first discoverd what they had done i called in and explained that i couldnt afford to pay and I asked them to replace all the new stuff with the old stuff.They said the old stuff had been thrown out!!!
    Yet I got my old tyre and old mudguard back!!! Crooks, cowboys ted, there a bunch of cowboys, and will never see me or my friends in with them ever again, not eve for a refelector

    €50 was way to dear. He defo ripped me off as we had agreed €50 with new tyre and mud guard.

    I took the bike out for a spin on sunday and got a flat tyre, Ironic ain't it.
    And that wasn't the replace tyre....
    I reckon sabotage guys,


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    #22
    RicardoSmith
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,264 ✭✭✭RicardoSmith


    stevom wrote:
    The small claims court ruled me out, They said they can't do anything......

    Why not? :confused:


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    #23
    jhegarty
    Registered Users Posts: 6,440 ✭✭✭jhegarty


    stevom wrote:
    The small claims court ruled me out, They said they can't do anything.

    About seeing an itemised bill, I know i would have loved to but when i called in to collect it i just wanted to get out asap (its gone on for too long)
    He put back on my old tyre (gary the boss) and i had to ask for my mudguard as when he produced the bike there was no mud guards at all,

    When i first discoverd what they had done i called in and explained that i couldnt afford to pay and I asked them to replace all the new stuff with the old stuff.They said the old stuff had been thrown out!!!
    Yet I got my old tyre and old mudguard back!!! Crooks, cowboys ted, there a bunch of cowboys, and will never see me or my friends in with them ever again, not eve for a refelector

    €50 was way to dear. He defo ripped me off as we had agreed €50 with new tyre and mud guard.

    I took the bike out for a spin on sunday and got a flat tyre, Ironic ain't it.
    And that wasn't the replace tyre....
    I reckon sabotage guys,

    not sure where you are, but is there any local radio station that do a call in show... you might get to tell your story on air ... warn other people , and make that the hardest €50 he ever took in...


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    #24
    rondjon
    Closed Accounts Posts: 195 ✭✭rondjon


    RicardoSmith wrote:
    Why not? :confused:

    Because there is nothing to dispute.....

    There is no original quote, and therefore there is no evidence that this shower of wasters has ripped off our consumer or not.

    There is nothing there for the Small Claims court to rule on. Since our consumer did not ask for a quote for specific work to be done, and a specific price for that work, there's no proof as to what actually happened.

    If there had been, and the wasters had not followed the quote, and had done the extra work, and charged more, then obviously, the Small Claims court can make their judgement based on the evidence.

    Moral of the story - get a written quote for any work that you need done... from anyone....


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    #25
    base2
    Closed Accounts Posts: 370 ✭✭base2


    I always try and intimidate people that give you the go around like that. Works a treat. Demand action be taken if not take it physically.


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    #26
    The General
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,148 ✭✭✭The General


    Brake into bike shop
    Take back your bike
    Burn the place down
    Stand outside laughing
    Send him a letter saying he owes you €108 for lighting the fire

    Sorted, thats €108 please


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    #27
    stevom
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10 ✭stevom


    I would love to burn them out of it alright!!!
    Nothing less than what he deserves,
    I was in dunnes stores the other day and are sellinga new bike with suspension and the lot for €99.99

    It just shows ya, I was aswell buying a new one!!! LOL


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    #28
    pollyantic
    Closed Accounts Posts: 223 ✭✭pollyantic


    Why dont you name them here. Help us all to avoid them.


    There is no law against it.
    You are just telling the name of the shop you got your bike repaired in.

    You can email them this thread too. In fact email it to a radio station.

    Then send the bike shop an invoice for €108 for emailing them :)


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    #29
    Larianne
    Registered Users Posts: 35,954 ✭✭✭✭Larianne


    Try ringing Joe Duffy, Gerry Ryan or 98 FM Phone Show (even if you are in Sligo). Businesses don't want bad press. Ring up Watchdog even!! My mother did that regarding an incident with a catalogue company and the guy rang up straight away and sorted out the problem!!!

    The fact that they are being such assholes about the thing. Take them down!!!!


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    #30
    joe.
    Registered Users Posts: 1,077 ✭✭✭joe.


    Gary Cycles
    Sligo
    Ireland

    he did name them. I would of went to the shop with a few big friends and stayed there until I got my bike off him. Not do anything illegal. Just look a bit menacing


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    #31
    stevom
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10 ✭stevom


    I did email ray darcy but heard no word back and i dont think they mentioned it on the the show either!
    I had thought about going over to him with a few of my larger friends.

    Im 6ft odd, i think he was a bit startled when we final met face to face.
    I must say, you guys bar a few mates are the only people who would actually help and give your valuable opinions
    Im more pissed off with the government bodies who go to work every day and help people like me with similar problems, but not me or my problem,
    Just cuz im a student and its inly a bike! the feckers........... :eek:


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