Irish Shooters Digest - Database of Irish Clubs

rrpc

I just saw a copy of this today, and am surprised enough about a number of notable omissions from this database to start a new thread on the topic.

There didn't appear to be any NTSA clubs listed on this database among others, and considering that many shooters were consulted before publication, including the SSAI PRO (the only one named), it is very surprising that the following were omitted:

Rathdrum Rifle & Pistol Club - Founded 1961 the 1st in Ireland with a website since 1995!
Dublin Rifle Club - founded 1933
Midland Rifle Club
Fassaroe Sporting Club
Dublin University Rifle Club
UCD Rifle Club

This is not an exhaustive list and the reason I am starting this thread is for others to add the names of other clubs omitted. I know I may well have omitted a couple, but I only saw the article once and don't have it to hand now, so any errors I have made are unintentional.

If we can get a full list together, then we can send it to ISD to get their database updated.

What surprises me most, is that you can google any of the above and get a result, with full details of how to contact etc. etc.

Clash

rrpc wrote:

I just saw a copy of this today, and am surprised enough about a number of notable omissions from this database to start a new thread on the topic.

There didn't appear to be any NTSA clubs listed on this database among others, and considering that many shooters were consulted before publication, including the SSAI PRO (the only one named), it is very surprising that the following were omitted:

Oh no, not another conspiracy. There's a blacklist in operation :eek:

Sparks

What's even funnier is that in that ISD article, there's a map swiped (I presume with permission) from here, and that page does have DRC, RRPC, and a few other NTSA clubs, and they're marked on the map that appears in the ISD.

Clash, given who wrote the article, I wouldn't be overwhelmed with surprise

Clash

Sparks wrote:

Clash, given who wrote the article, I wouldn't be overwhelmed with surprise

Who wrote the article then?.

I've looked at that page, some of the links are out of date, but the names of the clubs are all listed, yet didn't make it into the ISD if rrpc is right.

Maybe someone who has the magazine could reproduce the list here for the rest of us to look at, and maybe fill in the gaps as rrpc is asking.

I was only joking about the conspiracy, but now I'm not so sure

rrpc

Clash wrote:

Who wrote the article then?.

I had a look at the end of the article and no name was mentioned, but Sparks appears to know, so perhaps he could elucidate.

Maybe someone who has the magazine could reproduce the list here for the rest of us to look at, and maybe fill in the gaps as rrpc is asking.

Good idea. Sparks - maybe you could also do this to give us a starting point. No point in whingeing about this if we don't try and do something about it.

I was only joking about the conspiracy, but now I'm not so sure

Don't start... we'll have a televsion mini-series going next. Bags I sell it to Oliver Stone

Sparks

Clash wrote:

Who wrote the article then?.

It was Cal Ward's column.

Maybe someone who has the magazine could reproduce the list here for the rest of us to look at, and maybe fill in the gaps as rrpc is asking.

I would but someone's borrowed my copy of this month's ISD (rrpc, it's Dave who has it in case you're looking for it).

I was only joking about the conspiracy, but now I'm not so sure

Naw, I doubt it's an actual deliberate act, I just don't think Cal has much interest in ISSF style shooting.

No point in whingeing about this if we don't try and do something about it.

Beat you to it. Twice.

gouda

rrpc wrote:

I just saw a copy of this today, and am surprised enough about a number of notable omissions from this database to start a new thread on the topic.

There didn't appear to be any NTSA clubs listed on this database among others, and considering that many shooters were consulted before publication, including the SSAI PRO (the only one named), it is very surprising that the following were omitted:

Rathdrum Rifle & Pistol Club - Founded 1961 the 1st in Ireland with a website since 1995!
Dublin Rifle Club - founded 1933
Midland Rifle Club
Fassaroe Sporting Club
Dublin University Rifle Club
UCD Rifle Club

This is not an exhaustive list and the reason I am starting this thread is for others to add the names of other clubs omitted. I know I may well have omitted a couple, but I only saw the article once and don't have it to hand now, so any errors I have made are unintentional.

If we can get a full list together, then we can send it to ISD to get their database updated.

What surprises me most, is that you can google any of the above and get a result, with full details of how to contact etc. etc.

AFIK it was a list of SSAI affiliated Clubs , so I assume the Clubs which were omitted are not SSAI affiliated.

chem

Sparks wrote:

It was Cal Ward's column.


Naw, I doubt it's an actual deliberate act, I just don't think Cal has much interest in ISSF style shooting.


one thing i do know is that the MRC handed Cal Ward back his membership money awhile back. this was due to his out spoken and direct articles about the current firearm laws. The MRC seemed to think that having someone in the club that "did not play ball" was bad for there chances of being used as a range by the gardi firearms units.

Seems abit sad to me that they should have turned there backs on him after him doing so much to reintroduce pistols and rifles over .22. which im sure helped the clubs membership to grow.

As they say if you have an irishman on a spit, you can always find another irishman to turn him!

Sparks

one thing i do know is that the MRC handed Cal Ward back his membership money awhile back. this was due to his out spoken and direct articles about the current firearm laws.

That would be the first time I'd heard that version of the story, but if true, it's ironic considering what he's written himself about people who don't necessarily "toe the party line", here for example (his is the fourth comment in). The version I heard was far less flattering of Cal, I'm afraid. However, the point to note here is that this is hearsay - unless MRC and Cal want to actually post what really happened here, it's likely that few will ever know the "real story" behind it all. And if there's one thing you can be sure about something you hear as gossip it's that you can't ever be sure of anything you hear as gossip

That being said, I've never really understood the point in constantly slighting the Gardai in print and in spoken word when they don't get to set the laws, don't get trained for the job of firearms licencing, don't have written guidelines on the matter, and are basicly put in the position of doing what the DoJ instructs, but having their own personal necks on the block if it all goes sideways on them. I mean, it's not like the Gardai never read the Shooters' Digest, y'know.

Seems abit sad to me that they should have turned there backs on him after him doing so much to reintroduce pistols and rifles over .22

Are you sure you're not mixing up Cal Ward and Frank Brophy here?

As they say if you have an irishman on a spit, you can always find another irishman to turn him!

I'm sure they say that. Of course, we're all Irishmen and so one day you're on the spit and the next day you're cranking the handle, it would seem...
...and every so often you may well find genuine problems that, when raised, are called begrudgery and every other name under the sun by those who'd prefer to be cranking the handle than being on the spit...

joecoie

Hi,
I own the webpage mentioned & linked to above, & over the last while have added information (when I can) on Target Shooting Clubs in Ireland. Primarily this has been on Sporting Rifle as this is my main interest.
If anyone has details of other Target clubs (Rifle, Pistol & whatever discipline) please have the relevant club official forward me the details, else if the club has a webpage I can take the details from there.

Joe.

http://homepage.eircom.net/~joecon/irishclubs.html

PS I've fixed the link to RRPC

GreenGun

“One thing I do know is that the MRC handed Cal Ward back his membership money awhile back. This was due to his out spoken and direct articles about the current firearm laws.”

Chem is quite right about this one that is what happened.
I don’t think Cal is “constantly slighting” the Gardai. He highlights obvious lacks in consistency of there approach and ridiculous and unfair treatment of individuals. Sparks you must be fortunate to have a realistic and sensible local sergeant and superintendent. Not everyone in the country is as fortunate.
When applying for a licence for an ISSF 10M air pistol I was told by one of my local sergeants “No one should have a gun of any kind”

“Constantly slighting the Gardai in print and in spoken word” ???
I have spoken to Mr Ward on several occasions and this does not sound like him at all! Sparks, when was the last time you had a conversation with him? Have you ever met him?

Mr Ward has been pointing out the plight of shooters in Ireland in his column and I feel his efforts have certainly helped in the return of pistols and large caliber rifles. He has raised the awareness of the Irish shooters to the unfair treatment of the shooting community (By the DOJ and elements in the Gardai) despite the efforts of (one club) others to silence him.

Oh yea by the way for those of you who don’t know Cal was shooting ISSF disciplines before I and quite a few of you were born!

Keep up the good work Cal!

GreenGun.

Sparks

I have spoken to Mr Ward on several occasions and this does not sound like him at all!

Whoa there green. My bad for not being clear on this, but I wasn't talking about just Cal there, it's an endemic problem throughout the whole shooting community and I've been as guilty of it as everyone else. But Cal does take swipes at them in the Digest an awful lot, as reading his articles will show. And while it's damn hard to live up to the ideal of working with them, it's something that if you don't try, simply won't happen. And if it doesn't happen, we lose a lot more than they do...

Oh yea by the way for those of you who don’t know Cal was shooting ISSF disciplines before I and quite a few of you were born!

That I didn't know, and would never have guessed from reading his columns over the last few years (or from reading the score sheets from competitions for the past decade or two either). ISSF doesn't get much coverage in the Digest, you hear occasional pieces from the NTSA and ICPSA, but there's no regular olympic section. And all of Cal's stuff is very everything-but-ISSF when you read it, it's all logchopping and shooting foxes at 600 yards and that kind of thing. Which isn't bad in and of itself (well, the fox at 600 yards I'd take issue with over safety but the rest is harmless fun at worst), it's just what interests him. Nothing wrong with that, I'd just like to see more ISSF stuff in there is all. I mean, we've got the World Champions in Olympic Trap in Ireland, so you'd think we'd see them everywhere with articles on how they train, what they're up to (did anyone outside the shotgun side know they were in Korea for the World Cup and that they got to within one shot of the finals?) and so on, but you don't see as much of that as you'd imagine.

Sparks you must be fortunate to have a realistic and sensible local sergeant and superintendent.

Well, partially it's luck in that he wasn't incredibly against them when I first met him, but partially it's also from legwork - I'd make sure to call in advance when I needed something from him and take as much time as he needed to go through all the details and to show him exactly what it was that I wanted and that it was all above board and so on. When I went to get my ammunition limit sorted, for example, I brought along an air rifle pellet tin to show him why 100 pellets is a bit daft for an ammunition limit. I've brought in targets and shown him the NTSA website and the photos and all that sort of thing so he knows I'm not going to be putting his ass in a sling with the superintendent over anything.

Yes, there are problem superintendents round the country, I've heard the stories too. I just wonder how much of that we bring on ourselves is all. We've got very adversarial tendencies towards the DoJ and Gardai for well-known historical reasons, but I have to wonder how well those tendencies serve us these days.