Port Tunnel article

hawkmoon269

Anyone see the Evening Herald article today saying the Port Tunnel opening is now delayed til '07? Is this correct? Thoughts, opinions on this, anyone.

antoinolachtnai

Well, it has to be finished before the next election.

DubTony

Didn't see the article, but would anyone be surprised? A late friend used to talk about "the triumph of optimism over experience".

I think that said it all. How could we expect that it would open when we all know what's happened to project like Luas, M50, M7, Metro, Second terminal at Dublin airport, M3, etc. etc. Dithering, indecision, lack of penalty clauses on projects and late alterations all lead to massive delays.

2007 is probably very optimistic.

Tony

The Black Oil

They seem to be putting on a layer on top of the exposed area at Whitehall these days and the blue boarding is coming down in places. Is there much digging still going on?

Traffic

All the major civil work is nearing completion and should be completed in the next few months then the tunnel needs to be fitted out n then a few months of testing is required

And i expect the tunnel to be open by march 2005 ya shoudlnt believe all ya read in the papers especially the evening herald!

Lennoxschips

March 2005?

They'd want to hurry up then!

Victor

Well the Luas reaches the airport in Spring 2005! Spring is over! I'm getting the Luas now.

Traffic

Sorry bout that slight error on mybehalf that should of course read March 2006.

spacetweek

2007 is probably very optimistic.

Nonsense, construction work is scheduled to be finished in only about 6 months. The max it will take to test/fit out the tunnel would be another 4-6 months, that puts the opening at this time next year.

hawkmoon269

spacetweek wrote:

2007 is probably very optimistic.

Nonsense, construction work is scheduled to be finished in only about 6 months. The max it will take to test/fit out the tunnel would be another 4-6 months, that puts the opening at this time next year.

Jeez, I hope you're right. I know the Herald isn't the most reliable but whenever I read a story about infrastructure delays I usually tend to believe it. Cynical old pessimistic me.

strassenwolf

Today's Indo wrote:

€12 toll to deter cars from using port tunnel . . . but lorries go free

CAR drivers will have to pay up to €12 to use the Dublin Port Tunnel, while lorries go free.

The toll for car drivers using the €714m tunnel is being doubled from the amount originally approved by the Government, the Irish Independent has learned.

The announcement of the increased toll - which is designed to make it prohibitively expensive for cars to use the facility - is expected to be made in the next few weeks by the National Roads Authority (NRA).

A toll of £3 was the figure approved by the Government five years ago. But there was also an allowance for an annual increase to match inflation, bringing the figure to about €6 when the tunnel will open early next year.

The decision to double the toll fee from €6 to €12 was taken for safety reasons, according to sources.

The cost will act as a deterrent to ensure there is no build-up of cars in the tunnel and to discourage car drivers from using it as a fast 'rat run' into the city.

Heavy goods vehicles will not, however, be tolled - instead, they will be encouraged to use the tunnel to reduce congestion on city centre approach roads and the quays.

The new tolls levied on car drivers will vary, depending on the time of day the tunnel is being used. Tolls will be higher at peak traffic times and higher charges will apply to those entering the city than those leaving the port area.

Since the original toll was approved by the Minister for the Environment, new EU rules on fire risks in tunnels have led to concerns about having any build-up of traffic.

A public oral hearing is expected to be held, probably in September, into the proposed new charges.

The decision to increase the toll was taken following a full-scale review by the authority of the adequacy of the original agreed amount.

It was felt that it was not sufficiently high to deter many car drivers from using the tunnel at peak times, leading to congestion and build-ups in the tunnel.

This was deemed vital in light of the new EU directives on fire safety in tunnels.

"We cannot contemplate a situation where there would be any traffic congestion in the tunnel," a source said yesterday.

"To avoid any serious safety issue, the level of the toll charge will have to be high enough to provide a sufficient deterrent for fast and efficient traffic movements."

The Dublin Transportation Office strategy is to permit no increase in the number of cars coming into the city and to instead accommodate commuters on improved public transport modes.

The 4.6km tunnel, which runs from the M1 Coolock interchange to Dublin Port, is designed to take 9,000 trucks a day off the streets of Dublin.

Yesterday, the Irish Independent exclusively drove the full length of the practically finished underground tunnel.

It was the first time that members of the public were allowed along the entire route.

Treacy Hogan
Environment Correspondent

I was hoping we'd do a bit more than "encourage" HGVs to use the tunnel.

Anyway...

Today's Indo wrote:

End of the road is in sight for rush-hour blues

GIVEN that few car drivers will part with up to €12 for the privilege of taking the Dublin Port Tunnel tour, we can today reveal its secrets.

The Irish Independent was yesterday allowed the first exclusive drive along the full 4.6km underground length of the most expensive single piece of infrastructure in the State now nearing completion.

It tooks year to plan, cost more than €714m to build . . . and will take about 3.5 minutes to pass through.

There is no doubt it will be a trucker's dream and - whisper it - possibly the demise of gridlock on the city's choked quays.

It is now possible to drive the full route in both directions, but the finishing touches are still being applied and it will not be open until next April.

We were the first to put the €714m investment to the test, and it is awesomely impressive.

At a quarter of the 80kph speed limit that will apply, our leisurely sightseeing drive took us just 14 minutes.

We drove beneath the city from the toll plaza at Dublin Port to the M1 interchange at Coolock, where the artery joins up with the notorious M50 motorway.

When the temporary speed limit is lifted, the same journey, right across the city, will take less than four minutes - even at rush hour.

It's the capital's best-kept secret. You have to drive the route more than 33 metres underground to appreciate the enormous scale of the project.

Before driving into the tunnel, with its magnolia painted walls and sombre black roof, we had to strap on the emergency breathing apparatus, reminiscent of World War I gas masks, being carried by all the tunnel workers.

There are, in effect, two separate tunnels, each with two lanes, heading south towards the port and pointing north to link up with the M50.

It is 23 metres from the surface to the top of the tunnel, which has a height clearance of 4.6m. There is another 5m of fittings and concrete encasing this structure with catacomb-like openings along the constantly winding route.

A striking feature of the car trip was the number of giant emergency 'cross-over' escape hatches where trucks or cars will be able to divert to the opposite tunnel in the event of a crisis.

Giant fans, similar to those which featured in the Sylvester Stallone tunnel rescue movie 'Daybreak', send waves of fresh air in the direction of the traffic.

These fans can even ensure that if a fire breaks out in one tunnel, no smoke escapes into the other one.

We were accompanied during our exclusive tour by John Neylon, the Dublin City Council senior executive engineer on the project, and Colin Watson, the construction manager with Mowlem, who pointed out these these huge circular cross-over hatches every kilometre.

Every 250 metres there is an escape hatch for use by pedestrians in the event of an emergency. The entire tunnel system will be monitored by 24-hour CCTV.

At 3.06pm we entered the tunnel and two minutes later we were under Fairview Park. Mr Newlon was able to tick off the invisible landmarks that basked in the summer sunlight overhead.

At 3.09 we cruised under the homes in Marino whose owners complained bitterly about damage to their properties. At 3.11, unknown to anyone on the streets above, we were under Philipsburgh Avenue.

Griffith Avenue at 3.14 and a minute later Collins Avenue beside Whitehall Church. Finally we saw the light at the end of the tunnel and surfaced at 3.20 at the Coolock interchange.

The finishing touches are being applied by an army of 500 workers. The asphalt road surface is still being laid in parts and fittings installed. However, all such work is to be completed by the end of the year and will be followed by a series of commissioning tests. The tunnel is expected to open by April.

Those lucky truckers . . . it's worth the toll fee just to drive your car though the Dublin Port Tunnel. It's the business.

SeanW

Well if car traffic stays as bad as it is, I'm guessing there will be quite a few ppl happy to hand over the E12 for a "rat run" into or out of the city.

murphaph

Why don't they just ban cars at peak times? :rolleyes:
I don't think many will pay €120 a week to get in and out of work but the wealthy might not mind, is that fair?

DubTony

murphaph wrote:

Why don't they just ban cars at peak times? :rolleyes:

cos it's always peak time.

Actually what would be best would be if they left it free all the time until a point where traffic was at a safe maximum. Then they could simply lower the gates and make the poor fúckers that got caught pay.
Seriously though, will there be a toll when leaving the city? Seeme to me that a less than penal toll coming out of town might actually be advantageous.

What about that Magnolia paint? Maybe we'll see a tunnel improvement show on TV late next year. Changing Tunnels. The people from Austria will come over here and decorate the port tunnel and our lot can send their 500 guys over there with truck loads of magnolia paint. No supertrucks mind. No, no. None of that stuff around here.

Strange that nobody has pointed out that the time saved by truckers not sitting in traffic on the quays will now be spent by sitting in traffic on the M50. But at least the rest of will probably be able to use the city now instead of the M50. Isn't it great the way stuff balances out.

A woman pointed out this morning on radio that it seems the tunnel entrance is in the middle of the road and cars etc. will bypass the tunnel on the left. Ah yes. A criss-crossing, lane weaving recipe for disaster my friends.

:eek: Just re-read this post. I need to stop listening to Marty Whelan. The bastards rubbing off on me ... for sure.

jubbly

here, if the indo journos can drive down the tunnel then it must be nearly finished.

Traffic

Time must be allocated to the fitting out of the tunnel, eg signs electrics, cctv and then a few months of testing is required.
The Toll plaza and the road network at the port is still not completed

D'Peoples Voice

DubTony wrote:

A woman pointed out this morning on radio that it seems the tunnel entrance is in the middle of the road and cars etc. will bypass the tunnel on the left. Ah yes. A criss-crossing, lane weaving recipe for disaster my friends.

:eek: Just re-read this post. I need to stop listening to Marty Whelan. The bastards rubbing off on me ... for sure.

Coming from the airport direction on the M1,
it's a bit reminiscent of how the M50 & N11 divide up at Shankill(as you are approaching from the Wexford direction).
I'm not out on the N11/M50 junction often enough to say whether it is a bloodbath everyday but I'm sure if it was, we would have heard about it by now.

DubTony

D'Peoples Voice wrote:

Coming from the airport direction on the M1,
it's a bit reminiscent of how the M50 & N11 divide up at Shankill(as you are approaching from the Wexford direction).
I'm not out on the N11/M50 junction often enough to say whether it is a bloodbath everyday but I'm sure if it was, we would have heard about it by now.

The M11 / M50 works because most traffic is going to the M50, so traffic for Loughlinstown simply goes into the left lane. But it seems access to the tunnel will require trucks and cars to effectively switch lanes. Bloodbath could be more appropriate in that situation. Personally I haven't even seen it so I can't be sure, but I'm sure there's an engineer with a plan.

Traffic lights maybe?

Bluetonic

DubTony wrote:

The M11 / M50 works because most traffic is going to the M50, so traffic for Loughlinstown simply goes into the left lane. But it seems access to the tunnel will require trucks and cars to effectively switch lanes. Bloodbath could be more appropriate in that situation. Personally I haven't even seen it so I can't be sure, but I'm sure there's an engineer with a plan.

Traffic lights maybe?

Going north bound won't be too bad. It'll be simply like any other merging with the M1 merging from the left onto the two lanes of the port tunnel.

Going southbound won't be too bad either come to think of it. The M1 will *continue* down into the port tunnel with two lanes while there will be a slip road off to the left which will be to bring you onto the single lane motorway to Whitehall.

Can't see too many problems.

The M1 as it exists now will simply act as slip roads onto and off the M1 before/after the porttunnel. The M1 will be a Newry to Dublin Port Motorway with a lot of slip roads on and off it, the existing raod now simply being a slip road on and off it.

If you'r driving by it and squint your eyes you can see how it will look... there'll be no port tunnel entrance/exit in the middle of the raod... the entrance/exit WILL be the road..

dowlingm

I believe the trucks have to go free or they can't be banned from/tolled on the current route through the city centre. You always have to provide a toll-free route according to d'EU, so that means the tunnel has to be free in order to fulfill the purpose for which it was built.

murphaph

dowlingm wrote:

I believe the trucks have to go free or they can't be banned from/tolled on the current route through the city centre. You always have to provide a toll-free route according to d'EU, so that means the tunnel has to be free in order to fulfill the purpose for which it was built.

But are they fulfilling this though? HGVs fom the N81 round to the M1 are supposed to go throught the port tunnel, but they'll have to pay NTR the priviledge of crossing the Liffey on the West-Link to get there. There is no toll free way from the N11 side because taking the N11 means crossing the East-Link! Is there a way in by the N4 to the north city centre and into the port that way without breaking the ban? What are the rules on the ban again? Inside the canals is banned, right?

Victor

DubTony wrote:

Actually what would be best would be if they left it free all the time until a point where traffic was at a safe maximum. Then they could simply lower the gates and make the poor fúckers that got caught pay.
Seriously though, will there be a toll when leaving the city? Seeme to me that a less than penal toll coming out of town might actually be advantageous.

The plan is to have it tidal, the steepest toll will be for people using the peak direction (into the city in the morning, outbound in the evening)

dowlingm wrote:

You always have to provide a toll-free route according to d'EU

Are you sure? Tell that to the Germans.

Thomond Pk

The EU would never insist on any toll free route it would run contrary to the multiple sustainable transport directives which have great relevance in countries where car use is a choice.

DubTony

Bluetonic wrote:

The M1 as it exists now will simply act as slip roads onto and off the M1 before/after the porttunnel. The M1 will be a Newry to Dublin Port Motorway with a lot of slip roads on and off it, the existing raod now simply being a slip road on and off it.

There's the problem straight away. Most of the traffic is not trucks. Therefore with a penal tol on the tunnel, most of the traffic won't use it. So the slip road will be used more than the "motorway". So, at some point cars coming from north of the airport will have to make their way into the slip road, as trucks from the M50 make their way out of the slip road. At a normal junction this would be ok as trucks simply merge on the inside lane. But now we'll have the situation where trucks will be pulling out as cars are pulling in. It's going to be awkward to say the least.

murphaph wrote:

Is there a way in by the N4 to the north city centre and into the port that way without breaking the ban?

No. Trucks on the N7 are forced to use the M50 to get to the N4 as they are banned from Inchicore. They pass by Heuston and then down the quays. That's not going to happen anymore.

Bluetonic

DubTony wrote:

TBut now we'll have the situation where trucks will be pulling out as cars are pulling in. It's going to be awkward to say the least.

Agreed on that.... and the fact that the M50 slip road onto the southbound M1 is very close to (what will be) the slip road off the M1 and onto the "Drumcondra Raod/Old M1" (<1Km) .... BANG!

D'Peoples Voice

Bluetonic wrote:

Agreed on that.... and the fact that the M50 slip road onto the southbound M1 is very close to (what will be) the slip road off the M1 and onto the "Drumcondra Raod/Old M1" (<1Km) .... BANG!

I see what you're saying, too much criss-crossing. My fear is that they will end up putting in a roundabout(on a bloody motorway!). They may even put traffic lights on it! You know what they are like in this country!

If there is a light at the end of the tunnel so to speak, then it's that most of the junctions of the M50 are being updated.
After a few people are killed on this piece of road over the next few years, they may decide as part of the M50 upgrade, to design the southbound off-ramp from the M50 so that it ends up in the middle lane of the M1 before the Port Tunnel. (perhaps the on-ramp would be the same the other side)
You will need 4 lanes, 2 city bound, 2 tunnel bound on either side!
Heading towards Dublin City
Vehicles coming from the airport direction will split into a V-shape before the M50 southbound off ramp, trucks being forced to go to right of the southbound off-ramp from the M50, while cars are forced to do to the leftmost lane of the southbound Off-ramp from the M50.
Cars can coming down the off-ramp then swerve into the inner left lane while trucks can continue straight on what will be the inner right lane.
Something similar may have to be done on both sides!
But no-one had died yet, so we must wait for someone to die first before we can take action. thats the tradition in this coutry!

murphaph

DubTony wrote:

No. Trucks on the N7 are forced to use the M50 to get to the N4 as they are banned from Inchicore. They pass by Heuston and then down the quays. That's not going to happen anymore.

Yeah I know that much, but will there be a legal, toll free way from the N4 cutting across the north of the city to the port or will trucks have to cross the west link to get there? I can see hauliers trying to find shortcuts (or longcuts!) that don't involve the westlink if they can. Certainly wouldn't be surprised to see more trucks cutting across from Maynooth to Dunboyne and onto the M50 there, rather than paying the wstlink toll.

is_that_so

Bluetonic wrote:

Going southbound won't be too bad either come to think of it. The M1 will *continue* down into the port tunnel with two lanes while there will be a slip road off to the left which will be to bring you onto the single lane motorway to Whitehall.

From what I have seen recently the "single lane motorway to Whitehall" will be actually just be a 60 kph single lane. There is no evidence (though I am open to correction) that there is any plan to restore the motorway section from the tunnel entrance to Whitehall.

Traffic

It looks like the section of road from the Swords rd bridge to the entrance to the tunnel is permanent.

mackerski

is_that_so wrote:

From what I have seen recently the "single lane motorway to Whitehall" will be actually just be a 60 kph single lane. There is no evidence (though I am open to correction) that there is any plan to restore the motorway section from the tunnel entrance to Whitehall.

It'll still be a motorway - it was built on a motorway order and you can only get there from the rest of the M1. Similarly, in the Northbound direction, that single-lane stretch leads inescapably to a motorway, so it has to be a motorway too.

The UK has the occasional single-lane, single-carriageway motorway for pretty much this reason. They tend to be spurs off real motorways.

Dermot

Victor

murphaph wrote:

Certainly wouldn't be surprised to see more trucks cutting across from Maynooth to Dunboyne and onto the M50 there, rather than paying the wstlink toll.

Do many do this already? If not, why do you expect it to happen?

murphaph

Victor wrote:

Do many do this already? If not, why do you expect it to happen?

No HGV drivers would do it now as they would be taking the long way round to reach the port! but soon HGVs will be legally obliged to turn off the N4 at the M50 and pay a westlink toll to reach the tunnel. Currently they just drive straight along the N4 through town to the port. If they reach the N3 (probably at Clonee) then they can continue to the tunnel completely toll free.

dowlingm

Thomond Pk wrote:

The EU would never insist on any toll free route it would run contrary to the multiple sustainable transport directives which have great relevance in countries where car use is a choice.

from FG website:

Blueshirts wrote:

Port Tunnel must be free for HGVs - Naughten Monday, 26 May 2003

Contact: Nikki Gallagher Tel: 01 618 3379 / 086 3803189
Issued by: Fine Gael National Press Office, Leinster House, Dublin 2. Tel: 01- 618 3379
From: Denis Naughten T.D. Spokesperson on Transport

The Minister for Transport, Seamus Brennan, must clarify if Heavy Goods Vehicles (HGVs) will be subject to a toll charge if the privatisation of the Port Tunnel goes ahead and he must indicate how he intends to comply with EU regulations that stipulate an alternative route to toll roads must be provided, Fine Gael transport spokesperson, Denis Naughten TD, said today (Monday).

"It would be entirely counter productive for Minister Brennan to allow a charge be put on access to the Tunnel for HGVs. The delays caused would make the route less attractive to hauliers and any additional costs would certainly be passed on to the end consumer, further fuelling inflation.

"EU legislation requires that a free alternative route must be provided for every road tolled. This would mean that the proposed ban of HGVs in Dublin City Centre could not go ahead. Absolute chaos would ensue if Minister Brennan were to proceed with his ban of HGVs in Dublin City Centre in conjunction with a road toll.

"Minister Brennan must come clean about his intentions immediately. The Port Tunnel was originally supposed to divert HGVs from Dublin City and ease traffic congestion in the Capital. If the Minister has his way, the entire project will be nothing but an exercise in futility."

ENDS

Lennoxschips

"sufficient deterrent for fast and efficient traffic movements"

Isn't that what we've been doing for the past 30 years? Oh wait, I read that sentence wrong...

jubbly

how come dublin bus wont be using the new tunnel ? it would be a great service from the aerfort into town

Sarsfield

jubbly wrote:

how come dublin bus wont be using the new tunnel ? it would be a great service from the aerfort into town

And Bus Eireann. If the Luas is extended into docklands, it might be worthwhile looking at developing a new bus station to replace Busaras alongside Spencer Dock Station, giving easy access to the tunnel. Even from Busaras it's easy enough to get to. Could save a lot of time and fuel if they avoided all the city traffic - even just to access the N1, N2 & N3.

delly

One lane into town on the Whitehall road is crazy. The space is there, why not use it? One minor to medium accident and the whole road will be blocked. You would think that the government had finally copped on that road usage goes up faster than predictations forecast.

jubbly

all north bound buses should be able to use it. whats the difference between a bus and a truck ?? Plus it will get more cars of the street.

legend99

They have announced they want to complete the Eastern Bypass, utilizing the Port Tunnel....so how would a congestion charge work then??
Second, the main reason, if i recall that they need a toll for cars, is that the tunnel ventilation is not the best that money can buy so it has a limit on the number of vehicles it can have in it...i.e. if the tunnel backs up you need to immeditaly stop vehicles going into it...so will there be gates on it?

The obvious thing to have done surely was to make the Eastern Bypass a tunnel for cars, and meanwhile have built an East-West tunnel more or less following the path of the Liffey out to the M50 by the West Link for trucks. That would have allowed West bound trucks to use the East-West Link. North Bound trucks to have joined the Eastern Bypass North and Southbound trucks to have joined the Eastern Bypass South.
Even make the East-West link usable for cars and toll it, direct city centre link from the West link. it would have seen Dublin with a full ring road with a line in the middle connecting East-West.

Now though, if you are a trucker, and you're going to the South of the Country...why the hell would you want to go North in the current port tunnel and then have to face coming back the whole way along the M50 and having to pay a toll at the West Link...its insane.

Victor

:rolleyes:

So how much will all these tunnels cost? Please see the refereces to the Big-Dig. Creating more roads simply creates more traffic.

Now though, if you are a trucker, and you're going to the South of the Country...why the hell would you want to go North in the current port tunnel and then have to face coming back the whole way along the M50 and having to pay a toll at the West Link...its insane.

Because the slight extra distance you will travel will be offset by shorter journey times, less congestion, less accidents.

DubTony

They'll be using the M50, Victor, so less congestion and shorter journey times won't be the norm.

spacetweek

legend99 wrote:

They have announced they want to complete the Eastern Bypass, utilizing the Port Tunnel....so how would a congestion charge work then??

I don't understand, why won't it work? A congestion charging zone would only apply to the inner city, assumed to be the area bounded by the canal rings. The PT/EB doesn't breach this cordon.

legend99 wrote:

Now though, if you are a trucker, and you're going to the South of the Country...why the hell would you want to go North in the current port tunnel and then have to face coming back the whole way along the M50 and having to pay a toll at the West Link...its insane.

Because you will be required to, since trucks will be banned from the city centre.

Victor

You can have two toll stations and you basicly toll all city bound commuter traffic in the morning and all exiting commuter traffic in the evening.

wwhyte

... so they're really going to leave the old M1 as a single lane in each direction from the entrance to the Port Tunnel to Collins Avenue? Isn't that sheer madness?

sharkman

wwhyte wrote:

... so they're really going to leave the old M1 as a single lane in each direction from the entrance to the Port Tunnel to Collins Avenue? Isn't that sheer madness?

Yes , but aparently the tunnel being under the road , they have decided thet for safety reasons(or something ) to reduce the road to single lane each way .


Was this designed by primary school kids , of course not ....

They would have done a better job !

jubbly

I never thought about the toll on the M50 but the IRish times today was saying that it will be basically paying for the port tunnel (7,000 trucks will probably go through it) hence there is no toll for trucks using the port tunnel

DubTony

Sorry this is slightly off topic. The tunnel is being built without the aid of EU funding, i.e., entirely by taxpayers. In the past the tolling of roads built by public money was illegal. The toll plinths on the M50 access ramps were removed by local councils due to this. Was the legislation changed our did our local councillors decide to fall in line and stay quiet?

Is it now legal to build a road with taxes and then effectively ban the very people that paid for it from using it by charging a penal toll?

murphaph

DubTony wrote:

Is it now legal to build a road with taxes and then effectively ban the very people that paid for it from using it by charging a penal toll?

I totally agree. Either it's a HGV only tunnel or cars are allowed at certain times only, but to pay for it with tax contributions from people on low wages then to only allow the wealthy to use it because they can afford to is quite disgusting. If the project was private then I wouldn't argue, but I helped pay for that tunnel. The idea of charging €6 at 3am is outrageous-as already pointed out, the government takes the lion's share of the tolls the HGVs will be paying at West-Link (Government owns half of NTR and of course they slap 21% VAT on the toll too, so well over half the take goes back to the government, not forgetting the income tax that west-link staff, and the corporation tax NTR pay to the exchequer!!!).

DubTony

Philip, I understood that the toll will be €12. So based on that I've crunched some numbers and figured out how they came up with a €12 toll.

We're told that 7000 trucks a day will use it. Form this we can safely assume that will mean 3500 each way.

The tunnel is 6.5 km long (including 2 km of access roads). If trucks only travelled through the tunnel from say 8 am to midnight, this would provide a 16 hour window of operation.

Based on 3500 trucks travelling each way this would mean that approx. 220 trucks would be travelling in one direction at the same time per hour. This means that less than 5 trucks will enter the tunnel every minute. It will take a truck at 80km/h (:rolleyes:) 12.5 minutes to cover the 6.5 km. By the time one truck leaves the tunnel less than 60 others will have entered. So we can assume that there will be no more than 60 trucks using each side of the tunnel at any one time.

Take the length of a truck and add to that a distance between vehicles of about 40 metres. At 60 trucks a time thats a total length of about 3.5km of road being used at any one time. So, If the tunnel was a single lane road, according to these very rough and basic calculations it would run at about 50% capacity. But it's a dual carraigeway and as truckers just loooove the overtaking lane it means that the tunnel will operate at about 25% of capacity.

And remember that these figures are based on usage of just 16 hours a day.

So, taking the cost of the tunnel into account and a 25% of capacity usage it means that the tunnel was 4 times more expensive than it should have been. But as it's already paid for to the tune of some €700,000,000, it's fair to multiply that by 4 to represent the "underasage" giving a total cost of almost €3 billion. Over a life span of - oh lets say - 100 years this represents an annual cost of €30,000,000 a year. 7000 trucks a day, 365 days means that some 2.5 million trucks a year will use it.

So the cost per use per truck is €12. Hence, a €12 toll for the rest of us.

:eek:

dowlingm

Tony - one problem with the figures is your estimated lifespan. I doubt it is 100 years without being essentially being rebuilt several times over that time.

The Jack Lynch tunnel turned out to be way ahead of traffic projections and has required refitting and repair several times over its short life to date. The upkeep on a tunnel is high because of overhead equipment, lighting, ventilation etc. and if there is an accident you can't just tow it to the side of the road so closures will be lengthy.

I agree with those who say - ban the supercubes. It makes transport planning rational and if a sufficient lead-in period is granted the Irish hauliers can dispose of their fleets to the UK.

jubbly

i agree totally about the super cubes. its only england that use them and the rest of europe doesnt. ban them and solve the problem on irish roads.