For the attention of Bored of ie members

Drakar

As you may be aware, Bored of ie was set up to allow Irish World of Warcraft players a place to work together, help each other out, share information, kill Dudes... er I mean evil alliance etc. It was not intended that this would be a large guild capable of tackling end game bosses, but merely a stepping stone as at the time there didn't seem to be any organised Irish guild which had left most Irish players without any guild, and hence at a significant disadvantage in the game.

At this point many of our players have matured (level wise!) and it is difficult to get pickup groups for high level content. We have already lost two level 60 players who have moved on to larger guilds to allow them to run the top level zones (perfectly understandable and I think everyone wished them well).

It has been mentioned before, but I think we weren't really ready for it then, but perhaps now is the time to look at doing merge with another guild. A larger guild means that it would be easier to get groups for zone runs, however it does also have some disadvantages that people would need to consider.

We have been approached by some guilds looking to do a merge, so that's what this vote is for. I'd imagine the one that we'd be merging with would have around 70 members with 40 over lvl 40. They seem sensible, and speak english :P (http://www.thelastdawn.info/)

Advantages of merging:
- High level players would find it easier to tackle top end content
- All players should find it easier to find guild groups who (should) be less likely to be idiots, or screw people over by ninja looting (stealing drops)
- Larger knowledgebase with people who have answers to weird queries you may have
- We should lose less players who feel they have to leave to progress in the game

Disadvantages of merging
- No longer would we be a purely Irish guild. We could become 'just another guild' instead of the place for Irish horde bladefist people to go (enough adjectives there?).
- We have a small community like feel at the moment, this could be lost by joining a larger guild
- We'd probably lose our name, and we probably wouldn't be leaders of the larger guild (though this shouldn't matter).
- Although a bigger guild would be able to tackle lvl 60 zones, the most difficult end game content would probably still be out of reach unless we allied with other guilds.
- People we merge with may not gel.


Feel free to post any comments, though do only vote if you are in the guild please.

Edited to correct the guild name *cough*

Ivan

No, we're great on our own

My opinion hasnt changed. I still think it would be a very good idea, to merge with another guild.

Ideally it would be great if we could merge with another similarly sized guild, so that we might have some semblance of power, however I realise that may not be practical.

On another note, I really dont think Boreds of Ie is currently, all Irish, and I dont see that as a bad thing. Boards it self isnt all Irish either. With that said, not all of the members from Bored of Ie are from boards, either.

We could still leave our alts in the Bored of Ie guild and move our mains to the new guild, if that helps any.

Anyway, I'll pretty much go with whatever the group decides.

Predje

It's something i'v been thinking over for the last week.I have to say im feeling a bit frustrated about not being able to hit up racial leaders and such.Personally a guild that isn't a pure PvE machine would be desired.I get on well with a couple of guilds who are very much like us, having a handful of 60's, but haven't approached them with the suggestion because im lazy.
What i will say though is, no disrespect to that guild linked ; they don't seem to be ideal by any means looking at their roster.They seem a few months away being able to do the end game.
Also being subject to other peoples demands (.i.e another guilds leader) isn't what i would want for the guild members - a merger would have to leave all people with representation.
An idea I have of allowing this is creating a new neutral guild.
At least we have made a start though , need to get some dialogue going.

Ivan

No, we're great on our own

We need to decide as a collective if we want to merge, before we do anything drastic
[edit]
Hehe, they have my vote : http://www.thelastdawn.info/roster/indexPvp.php?type=guildinfo&guild=Dudes
They have all the infrastructure, website, members. All we would need to do, is join their guild, as ask that one (or two) of our members, become representatives within their guild.
[/edit]

Drakar

If we were joining with Lastdawn we wouldn't have guildleader position, but we would definately have fair representation in the ranks. I wouldn't be overly concerned about not having guildleader, you guys have "been subject to my demands" since we started and I don't think it's been overly taxing hehe. When two guilds come together, both of them can't keep leader position. I'm quite happy to look at other guilds if anyone has any strong suggestions, those guys look a good size for us and seem relatively sane.

Im not sure if their roster is kept up to date, but do a /who g- on them and they look decent. Not the biggest guild ever, but generally bigger than us. It probably would more than double our numbers at the higher levels.

I was aware of the option of creating an entirely new guild and everyone joining that, but instead of inconveniencing two guilds, it makes sense to just do one. In the end I don't care what the guild is called, just that the people who we play with are ok.

I know that neither boards.ie nor bored of ie are all Irish, what I had meant though was that generally everyone who joined was known by someone already there. That kinda thing does contribute to the community feel, and helps reduce the muppetry.

Keep up the discussion, and if your boards.ie name is different it's probably useful to include your character name in your posts so people know who's talking.

NeoSlicerZ

How about some of that Atari Jaguar action

Just had a peek through their "guild" rules, overly strict imo

Dubhthamlacht

How about some of that Atari Jaguar action

I think a merge is inevitable. I really like the Boards guild but as us boardies who are mid to high level hit 60 it's not gonna solve the problem of doing runs for high level content. there's just too few of us in the first place. You could say we could start recruiting willy nilly around us in WoW for members but thats not a million miles away from merging with another guild. For me the most important aspect is the guild we merge with. Boards has been really good and it's crucial we don't get lost or get treated like outcats in a merge, especially the lower lvl guildes we currently have. So yeah we have to merge but lets be careful who we merge with

DRakE

I think Dudes will still constantly ownerise you all.

abccormac

Lets look at merging later

Personally, I don't see why we don't just start recruiting people. It doesn't have to be "willy-nilly", it shouldn't be too hard for everybody to bring in 1 or 2 people we knoww aren't assholes. If thats not going to happen, then as long as we don't end up merging with some ultra-hardcore ganking machine then I'm not to fussed tbh. (Clarence on wow btw)

Ivan

No, we're great on our own

Its a bit late to be recruiting, most players are already guilded. Even apart from that, at least by merging with another guild we know 90% of them arent muppets, can you say the same from random recruitment?

We should probably consider a recruitment strategy over a merging one, first, though.

Drakar

The problem with recruiting is that good established players already have guilds (if they haven't, what's wrong with them? :P). It would be easy to fill the guild with sub lvl 10s. I don't think that's in our interest. It would be very difficult to recruit say 10 lvl 50+.

[DF]Lenny

No, we're great on our own

Yeah I think its inevitable we merge so the sooner the better i suppose!Will be different being a (very )small cog in a larger machine but hey..Lifes all about change..Onward!! (BTW we will gank Dudes a lot more too)

<Irishpsycho>

Swifty

No, we're great on our own

Yeah I think we should go for it. No point in having all the level 60's in the guild just moping about not being able to do they Q's they've levelled up so hard for. Nothing wrong with a few more people either cause at the minute theres only 2 or 3 active members roughly the same level as me in the guild. Being careful about it at the same time, dont want to be merging with a bunch of moany arseholes.


(Korima)

Caliden

ownerise you all at arathi highlands.

Dubhthamlacht

How about some of that Atari Jaguar action

I looked at the Last Dawn website. They are having a split anyway. They are dumping all their lower lvl players (any player below 40) and making them form their own guild. Me thinks this is retarded. Their rules also make them look anal. Boards is quite informal and I like it that way.

SpooN_9k

No, we're great on our own

i wasnt too pushed about it last time this was mentioned but this time i think we should go with a merge...once they are not a bunch of complete tosser's

koneko

A lot of guilds do that, and you realise when you get to 60 that it makes sense. Organising raids and dungeons (UBRS, MC, Azuregos) and so on is so so much easier when you have more higher lvl people in the guild. For an informal guild though that ruins the atmosphere, that really only works when you have a LOT of high lvl people.

I'm not on your server though, so I'm just adding in my two cents and it probably isn't worth much
The only thing I noticed when I looked at that site is this guy (Wand Specialisation? 2210 HP? wtf?)

NeoSlicerZ

How about some of that Atari Jaguar action

Dubhthamlacht wrote:

I looked at the Last Dawn website. They are having a split anyway. They are dumping all their lower lvl players (any player below 40) and making them form their own guild. Me thinks this is retarded. Their rules also make them look anal. Boards is quite informal and I like it that way.

yeh, i agree, not them anyways. I'm leaning more in favour of recruiting 60s or high 50s that we know and have played with.

otago

No, we're great on our own

I agree with merging, but let's address who to merge with afterwards.

DirtyHarry

How about some of that Atari Jaguar action

I think we should mege too, but as Verm and some others have noticed, some of the guilds they have looked at are complete losers.........So if we do merge, we should make sure who we pick is decent.

CodeMonkey

No, we're great on our own

Dubhthamlacht wrote:

I looked at the Last Dawn website. They are having a split anyway. They are dumping all their lower lvl players (any player below 40) and making them form their own guild.

I actually think a split like that makes sense. There's no point having players lvl 40 and below in a guild that's going to start doing a lot of raids and high level instances. They will just be ignored most of the time anyway and left out so they are better off in their own guild.

Merging... do bored of ie want to be absorbed by a bigger guild or absorb someone else? If you're merging with a guild like The Last Dawn, you're probably better off recruiting 50-60 players and retain your control over the guild cause you don't gain much from a those merges. Guild like that adds some lvl 60 players and 50s and a lot of low level players. In fact, if bored of ie is to be absorbed by a much bigger serious guild, it's probably better all the high levels leave and join the other guild and leave the alts and lower level players in bored of ie. They will most likely have more fun there instead of in the big guild.

I think you should get the level 60 and 50 players in bored of ie to ask good players they've grouped with to see if they want to join an informal guild and do guild pickup raids.

abccormac

Lets look at merging later

Whatever happens it would be nice if boards users still had a place to go when starting out.

otago

No, we're great on our own

Splitting into 2 guilds depends on what you want.

If the goal is to have an elitist guild where the top players don't have to bother with noobs, then splitting is the way to go.

Note that that is not what we have at the moment however.

I would be more in favor of us finding another guild that has a similar set up to our own (informal and varied), and merging with that, so that all our players have chances of getting a better quality of group member.

Anyone in the guild who feels that isn't what they are looking for, should either speak up now so we can look at options, or move to a guild that does suit them.

Nuturing your noobs and having them in a month or two up there with you helping in those tough instances is a good thing for a guild in my opinion, and as the fact that you have helped these guys from level 1 up, they are more loyal anyways to the guild in general.

My 2 cents:)

Drakar

Based on the above, and discussions with people on the guild channel, I'd suggest we change our recruitment policy from the current "just recruit people one of our players knows outside the game", to a more open also "recruit people who are known to be well established non muppety players".
This would be
1) players say lvl 40+ whom guildies have grouped with a few times
2) from this observation have demonstrated that they know what they are doing
3) aren't asses.

Meanwhile, we would continue to monitor options for persuing potential merges. What a merge may actually mean in effect is that perhaps high lvl players from two (or more) guilds merge together, and the original guilds remain in place to support those still levelling up.

Perhaps we could persue alliances with other guilds where we could group together for raids which would give both guilds a chance to see what the other players are like before merging (I think this is a good idea).

Feel free to post any comments on this or other ideas people may have.

vasch_ro

Lets look at merging later

otago wrote:

Nuturing your noobs and having them in a month or two up there with you helping in those tough instances is a good thing for a guild in my opinion, and as the fact that you have helped these guys from level 1 up, they are more loyal anyways to the guild in general.

My 2 cents:)

Joining the guild really transformed my wow experience , and as a lowbie still
i have received lots of help form higher levels (thanks all ) , this has indeed had the effect of making me more loyal to the guild in general and more disposed to helping others in the guild even lower than me , my concerns would be seeing the needs of of people like myself (who will remain relatively low for a while too come because I cannot devote enough time to levelling , due to my being married , working etc) forgotten about in any merger to come as the emphasis seems to be on catering for level 55's up, i understand the reasons bought , but i would be a shame to lose our indentities
just how many level 60's do u need for an end game situation??

I'm Vaschro in WOW too level 16 ( maybe i should be the lowbies rep !!! )

Dr_Teeth

You will need 20 active level 60s to do the standard set of high level instances regularly (Blackrock Spire, Scholomance, Stratholme). This is also a good number for organised 0wnage in the Battlegrounds.

The next step up from that are the raid encounters Kazzak, Azuregos, Onyxia, and the Molten Core. For which you'd need about 60 active level 60s.

Ivan

No, we're great on our own

Well, as for recruitment policy. I've always been of the opinion that you can teach someone to be better at a game, but you cant teach them to stop being an asshole.

logic1

Drakar wrote:

Based on the above, and discussions with people on the guild channel, I'd suggest we change our recruitment policy from the current "just recruit people one of our players knows outside the game", to a more open also "recruit people who are known to be well established non muppety players".
This would be
1) players say lvl 40+ whom guildies have grouped with a few times
2) from this observation have demonstrated that they know what they are doing
3) aren't asses.

I think you'll have issues here starting off at least. lvl 40+ if they're any good will already have a guild. So basically you'll be trying to poach ppl from their guilds to join Bored. Now what incentive do they have to leave? Around the lvl 40+ coming into 50 people are all looking for guilds with a large number of high lvl members for running raids, instances, end game content.

To start recruiting you'd need to have a fairly well established guild already before you'll get people switching from their current guilds.

Personally I think a merger is probably yer only viable option. Also as you're recruiting 40+'s they still have quite a long way to go before hitting 55+, your current 55+ members will basically have to sit there and try to get pickup groups for high lvl instances while all the recruited 40's work up to a useable lvl.

.logic.

Drakar

I understand and have probably stated most of those concerns in my previous posts hehe. I had said that the majority of high level players are in guilds. Those who are not, we'd have to wonder why (did they get kicked out for some reason for example). However, on the guild channel a number of our players felt they knew people who were looking to switch to a friendly guild. That's the only reason we're doing this recruiting in the interim.

Recruiting doesn't stop us exploring the options for merging. Players at the moment seem to have some issues with the guild which had been suggested, which again I understand. We need to bear in mind that we're not a particularly big guild, so we can't expect to merge with a guild full of lvl 60s (as it's no advantage to them), and on the other side, it's little advantage for us to merge with smaller guilds. The problem we have then is that we're probably not big enough to make an equitable merge with an equally sized guild which looks attractive enough, ie people want to merge with a strong guild, therefore we need to be stronger to make a merge equally attractive to both sides.

I could definately have said that we should only recruit 55+s, but I don't think bored of ie is all about the high level players (nor would I want it to be). I'd like to support players of all levels through the guild, and merely mentioned lvl 40 as players of this level are more likely to know what they are doing and be somewhat independant. I don't think it's in the guild's interest to become elitist. In addition, I'd think players who are lvl ~60 are probably more likely to be less loyal than players who we've helped out at lower levels.

Regardless, for the moment it seems to be the best idea to recruit good players whilst we explore the other merging options.