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Kingp35

spockety wrote:

Perhaps because the Spanish FA didn't bother their arses to petition UEFA for a rule change allowing more than 4 teams in?

Thats exactly it it would require a rule change. Rules are rules.You dont go changing them just to accomodate another team.the rules have always been the same each country has a certain amount of representatives.

Liverpool, despite winning the competition couldn't finish in the top 4 of their league!! They did not meet the qualifying criteria. the fact they won the competition is totally irelevant because its set in the rules, which have never been changed and should not be changed, that winning the competition is not a qualification criteria.

Liverpool did not qualify and do not deserve to be in the competition end of story. If you start changing rules to accomodate certain teams the competition becomes a joke. Liverpool did not meet the criteria to qulaify for the competition exactly the same as fulham did not meet the criteria to qualify. why cant they lobby to be allowed into it? Simply they know they didnt meet the criteria just like liverpool.

I agree with everything seansouth said.Small teams have just as much a right to play as big teams.if you take that right away those teams wont develope and this sport wont develope.

Liverpool did not qualify and ill be very disappointed to see them in the competition next year. Obviously liverpool fans are gonna say yeah we should be in because this and that but bite the bullet people, you finished 5th in the league you dont deserve it so hard luck!!

~Rebel~

Tippex wrote:

To be honest if I were an everton fan I would be totally disgusted if the FA turn around and do what the Spanish FA did. It would take compensation of at least £20 million I would say, never mind increasing the tension between both Liverpool and Everton.
Personally I can't see the FA doing that because it will effectively make a mockery of the premiership.

This issue was put to bed weeks ago, Everton are already guaranteed their place in the CL, the only issue is whether Liverpool get a FIFTH english place or not.

Guy:Incognito

Kingp35 wrote:

Liverpool, despite winning the competition couldn't finish in the top 4 of their league!! They did not meet the qualifying criteria. the fact they won the competition is totally irelevant because its set in the rules, which have never been changed and should not be changed, that winning the competition is not a qualification criteria.
!!

Either did Real Madrid, Oh and winning it is a qualifying criteria as long as your league doesnt already have 4 teams in. Victims of a situation they helped create by doing well in Europe.

Guy:Incognito

Kingp3 wrote:

I agree with everything seansouth said.Small teams have just as much a right to play as big teams.if you take that right away those teams wont develope and this sport wont develope.
!!

Nobodays TAKING anything away from TNS, they came up with the idea of a play-off because they are in th ereal world, theyknow that they are goingto get knocked out by Obscureeasterneuropeanteam FC and that money is what rules football now, so a glamour tie against the european champions will net them a lot of much needed money. Money which could keep a team like Shamrock Rovers ticking over for a year or two.

Kingp35

Stekelly wrote:

Nobodays TAKING anything away from TNS, they came up with the idea of a play-off because they are in th ereal world, theyknow that they are goingto get knocked out by Obscureeasterneuropeanteam FC and that money is what rules football now, so a glamour tie against the european champions will net them a lot of much needed money. Money which could keep a team like Shamrock Rovers ticking over for a year or two.

really?? I suppose your right. Well except that shelbourne did terrific last season earning alot of money doing it and almost made the group stages. Maybe your memory aint so good

Guy:Incognito

Nope my memory is fine, I was at all the games, who said anything about Shelbourne?

Kingp35

Stekelly wrote:

Either did Real Madrid, Oh and winning it is a qualifying criteria as long as your league doesnt already have 4 teams in. Victims of a situation they helped create by doing well in Europe.

and would you stop with real madrid thing. That had nothing to do with uefa. If anything that adds more to teh fact that liverpool dont deserve to be put in. Rules didnt change then why should they change now. Your actually backing me up by talking about madrid. Uefa stood firm then as they should now

Kingp35

Stekelly wrote:

Nope my memory is fine, I was at all the games, who said anything about Shelbourne?

I thought shelbourne were a small club. imust be mistaken

Guy:Incognito

UEFA didnt satnd firm, the Spanish FA decided staright away that Zaragoza would be dropped to the UEFA cup, it never got as far as UEFA.

Kingp35

im using shelbourne as an example of what a small team can do. No body knows how well TNS will do. stranger things can happen

Guy:Incognito

Kingp35 wrote:

I thought shelbourne were a small club. imust be mistaken

They are a small clubin European terms, but TNS havent got past the first Qualifying round ever, they are a small club even compared to Shels. The point I was making is that it was their choice to look for a play off, and tbh Shels would probably make more money out of a play off with Liverpool than a run in Europe this year. They're not going to get to the 3rd quakifying round every year.

spockety

Kingp35 wrote:

Thats exactly it it would require a rule change. Rules are rules.You dont go changing them just to accomodate another team.the rules have always been the same each country has a certain amount of representatives.

Liverpool, despite winning the competition couldn't finish in the top 4 of their league!! They did not meet the qualifying criteria. the fact they won the competition is totally irelevant because its set in the rules, which have never been changed and should not be changed, that winning the competition is not a qualification criteria.

Liverpool did not qualify and do not deserve to be in the competition end of story. If you start changing rules to accomodate certain teams the competition becomes a joke. Liverpool did not meet the criteria to qulaify for the competition exactly the same as fulham did not meet the criteria to qualify. why cant they lobby to be allowed into it? Simply they know they didnt meet the criteria just like liverpool.

I agree with everything seansouth said.Small teams have just as much a right to play as big teams.if you take that right away those teams wont develope and this sport wont develope.

Liverpool did not qualify and ill be very disappointed to see them in the competition next year. Obviously liverpool fans are gonna say yeah we should be in because this and that but bite the bullet people, you finished 5th in the league you dont deserve it so hard luck!!

If Liverpool don't meet the "criteria", why have UEFA allocated a place in the Group Stages for the "Title Holders"?

What kind of criteria is that, exactly?

If a German team who finished 10th in their league this year had won the Champions League, they would be entered into next years Champions League, along with 3 other German representatives as normal. Liverpool are discriminated against because they come from a country which already has an allocation of 4 teams.

spockety

Stekelly wrote:

UEFA didnt satnd firm, the Spanish FA decided staright away that Zaragoza would be dropped to the UEFA cup, it never got as far as UEFA.

And the Spanish FA also sent large suitcases of cash in the direction of Zaragoza to "compensate" them.

Kingp35

Stekelly wrote:

They are a small clubin European terms, but TNS havent got past the first Qualifying round ever, they are a small club even compared to Shels. The point I was making is that it was their choice to look for a play off, and tbh Shels would probably make more money out of a play off with Liverpool than a run in Europe this year. They're not going to get to the 3rd quakifying round every year.

why not? Who is to say they wont do better? and no they wouldnt make more money with a one off liverpool game. they filled landsdowne for the deportivo game they would also fill it for liverpool thats equal money plus throw in the money they made from the previous two rounds and the first round of the uefa cup also held in landsdowne. I think that would beat one game against liverpool

Kingp35

Yes england have 4 teams that qualify.Liverpool failed to be one of the 4 best teams in england so why should they get in?

spockety

Kingp35 wrote:

Yes england have 4 teams that qualify.Liverpool failed to be one of the 4 best teams in england so why should they get in?

Because they have won the Champions League?

Have you not listened to a word anyone has said, including the President of UEFA, the President of FIFA, and the head of the English FA?

Everyone seems to think they should return to the Champions League to defend their trophy. Everyone, that is, except a minority bitter rival supporters.

Kingp35

I am not bitter and why if the president of said this do the winners of the world cup have to qualify for the tournament?

I like to see teams qualify through merit and liverpool didnt. Thats what you dont understand. If they had qualified through merit we wouldnt be having this debate but they didnt. Thats what all you liverpool fans dont get. 5th place isnt good enough

RuggieBear

Kingp35 wrote:

I am not bitter and why if the president of said this do the winners of the world cup have to qualify for the tournament?

I like to see teams qualify through merit and liverpool didnt. Thats what you dont understand. If they had qualified through merit we wouldnt be having this debate but they didnt. Thats what all you liverpool fans dont get. 5th place isnt good enough

lol...i reckon winning the ****ing competition is merit enough.

spockety

Kingp35 wrote:

I am not bitter and why if the president of said this do the winners of the world cup have to qualify for the tournament?

I like to see teams qualify through merit and liverpool didnt. Thats what you dont understand. If they had qualified through merit we wouldnt be having this debate but they didnt. Thats what all you liverpool fans dont get. 5th place isnt good enough

And you're not bitter?

Is there no merit at all in winning the European Cup?

It is a European Tournament after all, not a domestic one.

Kingp35

spockety wrote:

And you're not bitter?

Is there no merit at all in winning the European Cup?

It is a European Tournament after all, not a domestic one.

Of course there is merit in but obviously not enough for uefa to give a place to liverpool. Answer me this - do you not think that the champions of europe should have the ability to finish in the top 4 of their domestic league and qualify by right?

TheMonster

Of course there is merit - but unfirtunatley for Liverpool there are no rules, there should be rules but in the current situation there are none that support Liverpools situation.
As regards the UEFA site - that part of the site assumes the holders are good enough to qualify. There are other parts of the site that specify how many teams from each country are allowed in.

spockety

My opinion is that Liverpool should defend the trophy, regardless of their domestic form. There is merit in winning the European Cup.

This thread is now a roundabout, nobody will change their minds.

Fact is, Liverpool are Champions of Europe, and the bitters will have to suck it up.

UEFA will decide shortly enough what happens next season. Liverpool will be in the Champions League, of that there is no doubt. And the bitters will have to suck that up as well.

Kingp35

spockety wrote:

UEFA will decide shortly enough what happens next season. Liverpool will be in the Champions League, of that there is no doubt. And the bitters will have to suck that up as well.

that i wouldnt be so sure of and ny the way other people are not bitter I wanted liverpool to win because I always go for the underdogs I like seeing the big boys lose but European champions should be good enough the meet the qualifying rules set out by uefa but liverpool werent.

Rules are rules and liverpool didnt meet them. End of story

spockety

There are no qualifying rules set out by UEFA.
All UEFA do is allocate a number of slots to each country DEPENDING ON THAT COUNTRY'S SUCCESS IN EUROPE.

It is in no small part down to Liverpool's successes that the English FA actually have 4 places in Europe in the first place..!!!!!!!!

Kingp35

spockety wrote:

There are no qualifying rules set out by UEFA.
All UEFA do is allocate a number of slots to each country DEPENDING ON THAT COUNTRY'S SUCCESS IN EUROPE.

It is in no small part down to Liverpool's successes that the English FA actually have 4 places in Europe in the first place..!!!!!!!!

so stop moaning about uefa then will you.

spockety

I'm not moaning about UEFA, I believe they will allow Liverpool in next season.

I'm moaning about people moaning about Liverpool being given that place..

Kingp35

Your jumping the gun there mate I wouldnt be so sure.

If uefa change the rule now then its gotta stay changed.Im not so sure they will be willing to do that

eirebhoy

cregser wrote:

I'm worried that we get distracted by that world club cup. When is that on?

11-18 December '05 in Japan.

spockety wrote:

In the place reserved at the group stage for "TH", ie title holders.
It is on the UEFA site. No country or team has to lose out here.

The only thing preventing Liverpool from being given the TH place is the rule preventing more than 4 teams from any one country coming in. There is no issue with actually accomodating them within the structure already in place.

Look at this, and tell me exactly where in this table there is a team who has to lose out as a result of Liverpool taking that "TH" spot?

http://www.uefa.com/competitions/UCL/news/Kind=1/newsId=268457.html

I've found out a little more about this. Lets say Celtic won the CL this season. Instead of entering the 2nd qualifying round, they'd enter the group stages. Because Liverpool can't qualify and Milan already have a spot in the group stages, the 10th place league (the Turkish league) get an automatic place in the CL. That is all it is.

PHB

I have no problem whatsoever with Liverpool defending the trophy, but I do have a problem doing it at the loss of another team.
If it had been set out At the start of this season that title holders automatically quality then that would be fine, but to do it this season it has to be at the cost of somebody and I don't think its fair to punish them.

tbh I'm happy about Liverpool being in the UEFA cup since they havea decent chance of winning it, making their Europe run much much longer than their probable CL run, effecting their league chances all the more.

I think it would be legendary if Rafa said, **** off, we ain't playing in the UEFA cup, we'll be back in the CL the following year, eliminating Europe but still looking cool.

Keano_sli

You can be sure a way will be found to accomodate Liverpool in next seasons competition, While myself and other United supporters would surely find some minor consolation in the fact that they could not defend the trophy, I'm sure at heart most of us are big enough football fans to admit that the European Champions should be there to defend the title and give us all a chance to beat them in it!
Once the Champions league stopped being a purely champions competition then anything becoae possibly, so I think Yes a way will be found to have 5 English teams in the competition, Everton must not have to give up their place under any circumstances though, What message would it send out to the rest of the teams in the Premiership who see getting 4th and a place in the CL as a more realistic ambition than actually winning the Premiership and achieveing the chance to paly in Europes top competition if only once! Now I'm not putting down Evertons achievment, I think they have had a fantastic season and a great manager who got the best out of his team and dragged them kicking and screaming into 4th place against the odds and must get the chance to reap the rewards that they palyed for.
Anyway here's to 5 English teams in the CL next year

~Rebel~

Keano_sli wrote:

You can be sure a way will be found to accomodate Liverpool in next seasons competition, While myself and other United supporters would surely find some minor consolation in the fact that they could not defend the trophy, I'm sure at heart most of us are big enough football fans to admit that the European Champions should be there to defend the title and give us all a chance to beat them in it!
Once the Champions league stopped being a purely champions competition then anything becoae possibly, so I think Yes a way will be found to have 5 English teams in the competition, Everton must not have to give up their place under any circumstances though, What message would it send out to the rest of the teams in the Premiership who see getting 4th and a place in the CL as a more realistic ambition than actually winning the Premiership and achieveing the chance to paly in Europes top competition if only once! Now I'm not putting down Evertons achievment, I think they have had a fantastic season and a great manager who got the best out of his team and dragged them kicking and screaming into 4th place against the odds and must get the chance to reap the rewards that they palyed for.
Anyway here's to 5 English teams in the CL next year

^^^^^^^^^The most sense i've seen all thread!^^^^^^^^^^^^^

PHB

Keano_sil

Alright, Everton had an amazing season, so you can't cut them out.
Who do you cut out?
Its gotta be somebody? Somebody is gona get punished for it, so who is it?

Kingp35

PHB wrote:

Keano_sil

Alright, Everton had an amazing season, so you can't cut them out.
Who do you cut out?
Its gotta be somebody? Somebody is gona get punished for it, so who is it?

Exactly its not fair on anybody else if england gets 5 teams. Someone loses out and thats why I think uefa will not change their minds. The only way liverpool will get in is if some team offers up their place.

spockety

Em, NOBODY loses out. has anyone been reading this thread?
Has anyone actually looked at the UEFA entry table?

What happens if Liverpool don't get in is that another country GAINS a place that they weren't expecting!!!!!!!!!!!!

~Rebel~

Spockety is quite right, at the moment, someone gets an automatic spot without needing a qualifying place. Its really not a problem to fit in another team at all.

If a German team had won it they get an extra place which is exactly the same as england (or any other country) getting an extra place. The only ONLY issue up for debate is that England may be too dominant in the CL having a quarter of our league in it.

Again just so this doesn't come up again, if any country with 3 or less spots now wins the CL they get an extra spot at the expense of noone, the rule with teams from countries with 4 spots not having an extra one is just to stop there being too many from one country, but it would not be difficult from a feasibilty point of view to put them in at all, they have to decide if they want or dont want a 5th team from england. Personally i would imagine they will get it as it benefits lots of parties but doesn't hamper any.

Big Ears

Kingp35 wrote:

im using shelbourne as an example of what a small team can do. No body knows how well TNS will do.

They will be knocked out in the first qualifiyng round most likely by a 4-5 goal margin . The Welsh League is a contender for the worst in Europe , and TNS are a contender for the worst domestic Champions in Europe . They are an awful side and to state any different would be blatent lieing .

PHB

What happens if Liverpool don't get in is that another country GAINS a place that they weren't expecting!!!!!!!!!!!!

Thats a nice way to put it.
Another way is, another country gains a place so that a ****e little side now has two top class teams to deal with, not one.

Also that thingy on the UEFA site isn't what actually occurs.

eirebhoy

spockety wrote:

Em, NOBODY loses out. has anyone been reading this thread?
Has anyone actually looked at the UEFA entry table?

What happens if Liverpool don't get in is that another country GAINS a place that they weren't expecting!!!!!!!!!!!!

You are only thinking about the group stages though. There is 3 more round before that. Lets say Liverpool get a place in the group stages. That pushes the Turkish team out to the 3rd round qualifiers, that then pushes the Polish team into the 2nd round, that then pushes the Slovakian team out to the 1st round. What we have then is 23 teams in the first round. How do you turn that into 16 teams qualifying after the 3 rounds? Get rid of the team from Kazahkstan?

Draupnir

i reckon the only fair way is to let liverpool and bohs enter. let them play each other in the first qualifying round.

ButcherOfNog

not too worried if we do get in or not, the only trophy we've not won this decade is the premiership, concentrating on that should be the priority.

Dempsey

Liverpool didnt do enough to secure a chamions league qualification spot. The holders never got automatic qualification when it changed to the champions league. It would lose some of its prestige if this exception was made.

Jivin Turkey

eirebhoy wrote:

You are only thinking about the group stages though. There is 3 more round before that. Lets say Liverpool get a place in the group stages. That pushes the Turkish team out to the 3rd round qualifiers, that then pushes the Polish team into the 2nd round, that then pushes the Slovakian team out to the 1st round. What we have then is 23 teams in the first round. How do you turn that into 16 teams qualifying after the 3 rounds? Get rid of the team from Kazahkstan?

Ive examined the qualification matrix thing and I dont think thats the case.

There are 15 places allocated to particular countries, and one for the TH. You are working on the assumption that the winner of the CL comes in the top two of their league and automatically qualifies for the groups, thus promoting a Turkish team to the groups automatically. Turkeys co-efficient isnt high enough to warrant a automatic group place but as luck would have it, most years they get it by default.

So in summary, no one loses out if Liverpool were put in. The only problem is England having five teams in it, and is that really a problem? Have they not earned it by performing so well in it?

It would also be the first time ever (and Im looking even beyond the CL here back to the fifties) that the champion didnt defend their trophy. If that is not precedent enough I dont know what is.

/edit I think Marseille didnt get a chance to defend the title after they were caught match fixing.

Jivin Turkey

Dempsey wrote:

Liverpool didnt do enough to secure a chamions league qualification spot. The holders never got automatic qualification when it changed to the champions league. It would lose some of its prestige if this exception was made.

Garbage.

Juventus in 1997 and Real Madrid in 2001.

And in case you didnt realise there was football before the CL.

eirebhoy

Jivin Turkey wrote:

Ive examined the qualification matrix thing and I dont think thats the case.

There are 15 places allocated to particular countries, and one for the TH. You are working on the assumption that the winner of the CL comes in the top two of their league and automatically qualifies for the groups, thus promoting a Turkish team to the groups automatically. Turkeys co-efficient isnt high enough to warrant a automatic group place but as luck would have it, most years they get it by default.

Bert's site has it all (bookmark it ):
http://www.xs4all.nl/~kassiesa/bert/uefa/

My other post explains that the title holder get automatic entry into the group stages as long as they have finished in the qualifying positions in their league. For example, while Celtic have to play in the 2nd qualifying round, if they won the CL they would have got a spot in the group stages.

Actually, here's a quote from Bert's site:

The Champions League cup-holder spot will not be used because Liverpool did not qualify for the Champions League based on league position. The English FA said it will enter the top four teams of the Premiership, and UEFA said it will not allow five English teams in 2005/2006. This implies that the champion of the 10th country on the ranking list (Turkey) will gain direct access to the 1st round, and the champion of the 16th country on the ranking list (Poland) will gain direct access to the 3rd qualifying round, and the champions of the 26th and 27th country on the ranking list (Romania and Slovakia) will gain direct access to the 2nd qualifying round.

astrofool

I think its fairly f*cking obvious that someone will lose out if Liverpool get an automatic place, OR a qualifying place. How someone can say otherwise is stupid. As eirebhoy pointed out, someone will always lose out to how it would have been HAD LIVERPOOL MET THIS YEARS QUALIFYING CREDENTIALS.

In an extreme circumstance, you could get teams having a team just to play in the champions league, and be resting them the rest of the time, possibly leading to relegation in the domestic league, but would assure them a champions league place if they won the competition. As most teams that compete on many fronts can see, keeping players rested is essential to a winning formula. Staying out of the FA cup helped manutd in 2000, as they strolled to the title after a holiday in south america. It couldn't be doubted that being knocked out of the FA cup early probably helped Liverpool's champions league campaign, what if teams did this on purpose? or the league became what the league cup has become, with no one caring about it?

The fact that this only happened once in the champions league before also points to the fact that the teams that have won it have been teams that have been able to effectively play two competitions at once, and qualify for the competition given the qualifying preconditions.

That being said, the Title holders probably do deserve a place in the competition, and it should be up to UEFA to make sure that there is 0% chance of a situation like this occurring again, as well as having mechanisms in place to ensure that teams would not take advantage of it by playing weakened teams week in week out in the domestic league, to increase the chance of success in the champions league. This decision should not be with the FA, as has been noted, at the start of the season, the clubs knew the top 4 teams qualified for the champions league.

Jivin Turkey

Ive bookmarked the site. Always appreciate useful info for "discussion" purposes

To be honest, while its not an official site, I wouldnt go against it. But it still leaves the only problem as UEFA dont want five teams from a single league.

There is a spot there for the TH, qualified or not. If Celtic were to win it, it just throws up the same scenario that there would only be 11 teams to play the winners of the twelve 1st round qualifying games. Who moves up/down?

There is no issue here apart from UEFA not wanting five teams from a league, which is ridiculous. The tournie can easily accomodate Liverpool in the TH spot, after all they are the TH. No one loses out.

Jivin Turkey

astrofool wrote:

I think its fairly f*cking obvious that someone will lose out if Liverpool get an automatic place, OR a qualifying place. How someone can say otherwise is stupid. As eirebhoy pointed out, someone will always lose out to how it would have been HAD LIVERPOOL MET THIS YEARS QUALIFYING CREDENTIALS.

No one loses out. The is a spot in the groups for the TH which could be filled by Liverpool. It could be argued that a Turkish team "loses out" by not getting an automatic spot in the groups, but they never earned that right in the first place through their co-efficient.

astrofool wrote:

In an extreme circumstance, you could get teams having a team just to play in the champions league, and be resting them the rest of the time, possibly leading to relegation in the domestic league, but would assure them a champions league place if they won the competition. As most teams that compete on many fronts can see, keeping players rested is essential to a winning formula. Staying out of the FA cup helped manutd in 2000, as they strolled to the title after a holiday in south america. It couldn't be doubted that being knocked out of the FA cup early probably helped Liverpool's champions league campaign, what if teams did this on purpose? or the league became what the league cup has become, with no one caring about it?

Thats not a realistic scenario though as it would be a very risky approach for any side with a chance of winning the trophy to adopt.

astrofool wrote:

The fact that this only happened once in the champions league before also points to the fact that the teams that have won it have been teams that have been able to effectively play two competitions at once, and qualify for the competition given the qualifying preconditions.

Its happened twice in CL terms, and many times in the years of the European Cup. But what is your point here anyway?

astrofool wrote:

That being said, the Title holders probably do deserve a place in the competition, and it should be up to UEFA to make sure that there is 0% chance of a situation like this occurring again, as well as having mechanisms in place to ensure that teams would not take advantage of it by playing weakened teams week in week out in the domestic league, to increase the chance of success in the champions league.

I agree that the rule should be set in stone one way or another, its just a shame it took the situation to arise before they realised.

astrofool wrote:

This decision should not be with the FA, as has been noted, at the start of the season, the clubs knew the top 4 teams qualified for the champions league.

No they didnt, it was assumed. If they knew that was the case, why did last year the FA categorically state that the CL winners would take a place instead of the 4th place team?

PHB

Liverpools coefficient must be uber high now after the win, they were 7th, now they must be 4th or so

adeypius

It would also be the first time ever (and Im looking even beyond the CL here back to the fifties) that the champion didnt defend their trophy. If that is not precedent enough I dont know what is.

/edit I think Marseille didnt get a chance to defend the title after they were caught match fixing.

For 1993/94 Champions Cup original seeding had Olympique Marseille and Uefa Cup seeding had AS Monaco. After Marseille disqualification AS Monaco replaced Marseille and AJ Auxerre replaced AS Monaco.

I think it was the French FA that changed the places not Uefa

Take it

Does everyone forget that last year the FA would have put chelsea or arsenal though at the cost of 4th??

I'd love top see rafa telling uefa to stick the uefa cup but i dont think he would be allowed to as it would cost millions something the board wouldn't agree with

I am disappointed that they might not be in it next year but thats life

p.s prob not the right place to ask, but is there anyway to put someone on ignore on the boards so i cant see his posts?