Jaw problems

nesf

Not a medical question I've already talked to my dentist about this and he says I'm fine etc.


It's just my jaw is constantly clicking "in and out" and occasionally I get lockjaw. My dentist put it down to martial arts sparring I did while younger (got my jaw dislocated about 5 years ago). Something to do with the little disk of bone in the joint slipping in and out when my jaw moves.

It's more disconcerting than anything else. The constant popping is annoying but other people can hear it, which I find amusing. If I don't stretch my jaw (ie open my mouth too far when yawning etc) it doesn't lock up, so it's not a big issue.

Just wondering if other people get this, it's more than a little annoying.

seamus

I get it on my left hand side.

My doctor referred me to a specialist (dunno what they're called) years back. He charged £80 for a 30 minute session, told me it was OK since I have fairly "loose" joints, but it may become sore later in life. He booked me in for another £160/hour appointment which I promptly did not attend.

Still get it. It gets worse sometimes (usually after a heavy night on the beer - probably to do with dehydration) and sometimes I don't even notice it. Never hurts though.

nesf

I get it on both sides, it's louder on the left though.

It used to hurt for ages. I couldn't close my jaw fully (I went to the dentist about this). He told me that my jaw was just still swollen after the dislocation and that it would get better. He was right. I've had no pain for the past few years, just a constantly clicking jaw.

I've looked into specialists for this, but it's stupidly expensive and not really something that effects me overly. I already pay enough medical bills without adding more onto it tbh.

D

Yeah I get it too if I yawn too widely. But I just push everything back into place wtih my thumb. Have the same problem with my right leg and the the same technique of pushing the muscle/ligament/tendon back into place works.

JMArr

I have a click on both sides and its really annoying. It can be very painful after nights on the beer as well as my jaw is sore and achy all day. My dentist recommended a nightguard (only 200 euro !)which provides some relief but really only makes the 'click' less pronounced and stiff .... I still have it every day.
I think the cause is teeth not aligning properly when they sit together which causes stress on the jaw joint ....I woudl be very interested to know if anyone has gotten this fixed.
Q :are you missing any teeth at the back by any chance?

Kazaanova

I've had something like this for about 6 months too. Today for example I can't open my jaw as wide as I should be able to, but tomorrow I might get a clicking if I open it too wide, and sometimes if I open it wide it feels like my ears just exploded. I can close it fine, so its not lockjaw technically.

Went to the dentist about it and she said I should just try and get it back into place myself moving my jaw around in front of a mirror etc. Havent tried it yet.

It was at its worst about 3 months ago, I remember because I couldnt open my mouth wide enough to eat, that was really annoying. Only lasted for about a day though.

I'm probably wrong, but what I think happened was my jaw got out of place somehow, maybe from grinding my teeth, which I'm pretty sure I don't do but someone said you can do it in your sleep, and then for a while it was out of place still, and a while ago it slipped into ANOTHER place, which isnt right, but thats where it is so its kind of set now.

dudara

I have it on my righthand side. My dentist diagnosed it when I had trouble keeping my mouth open for long periods when he was trying to work. I have to close it regularly, or else it feels like it's going to lock or slam shut.

He asked me if I sleep on that side. I sleep exclusively on my right hand side. He recommended that I try some other position. And hs also that it probably will get worse in later life, as for me, he reckons it is a slight form of arthritis

nesf

I'm not missing any teeth at the back. Have had to get wisdom teeth removed, and had to get a baby molar pulled when I was a kid, but nothing serious.

Read what seemed to be a good FAQ on it a few months back, it consisted of a list of questions by patients and answers by dentists. I'd link to it here, but I don't know enough about dentistry to know if what they were saying is valid, and I'm loath to link to anything that could be considered "medical advice".

That said, most of the time their replies were, "wtf? you haven't seen a dentist in 6 years?!?!? Go see one now...." (paraphrased horribly btw)

up for anything

I had clicky jaws for several months a few years back. Both the dentist and the doctor agreed that it was stress related. Happens to people, women particularly, when they are under stress and unconsciously clench their jaws permanently. I was told to relax and it would disappear. As it happened I was going on holiday a couple of weeks after that and it did stop. Whenever I feel it coming on now I make a conscious effort to keep my jaws relaxed and it stops the problem before the clicking begins again.

Kai

Yea i get it too, normally i can get one really loud crack out of it early in the day and its sorted for the rest of the day. Now what really bothers me is my neck. Every hour or so i can make it Crack/Click quite loudly by rolling my head to the right then the left. Ever see Enter the Dragon before Bruce kicks the shoite out of some guy, well he does a neck crack thing. Its exactly like that only a little louder.

I think it will crack one day and ill just slump in my chair, paralyzed.

Ah well.

Tobias Greeshman

Kai wrote:

Now what really bothers me is my neck. Every hour or so i can make it Crack/Click quite loudly by rolling my head to the right then the left. Ever see Enter the Dragon before Bruce kicks the shoite out of some guy, well he does a neck crack thing. Its exactly like that only a little louder.

I suffer from exactly the same, sometimes the muscles around my neck get sore and I need to move my head to relieve the stress and they crack fairly loudly. It tends to freak a lot of people out apparantly.

Gordon

I get it a bit too. It can be extremely bad if I have to eat very chewy food. Have you looked into the possibility that you grind your teeth at night? a friend of mine uses a mouth guard to protect her jaw and teeth from grinding. Not sure if she has clicky jaw syndrome but it might be an idea to ask the dentist about it.

nesf

I found this FAQ interesting. Some practical advice given in it for people with more of an annoyance than something being wrong.

If it's really a problem it's definitely something that needs seeing to by a dentist though. There is very little anyone else can do to help you.


If the above link is "unsuitable" btw please feel free to remove it.

Gordon

nesf wrote:

If the above link is "unsuitable" btw please feel free to remove it.

That goes without saying.

nesf

Gordon wrote:

That goes without saying.

Yeah but it's so close to the line that I wasn't 100% sure if it'd be suitable. If you know what I mean.

fozzle

I've that too, the left hand side of my jaw has clicked for as long as I remember, my mum's does it too. It used to lock if I was using it a lot (oh good god! the innuendo! I meant when I was singing regularly people!) but now it's back to just clicking, tis a bit annoying to other people (but i don't care!) and I barely notice it anymore.

Squirrel

Kai wrote:

Now what really bothers me is my neck. Every hour or so i can make it Crack/Click quite loudly by rolling my head to the right then the left. Ever see Enter the Dragon before Bruce kicks the shoite out of some guy, well he does a neck crack thing. Its exactly like that only a little louder.

I think it will crack one day and ill just slump in my chair, paralyzed.

Ah well.

I get that but it's more a constant grinding

Victor

If I move my jaw from left to right, it clicks, is this what ye are talking about?

Isn't this normal?

nesf

Victor wrote:

If I move my jaw from left to right, it clicks, is this what ye are talking about?

Eh specifically, for me:

It clicks in and out when i move it any direction. It constantly feels like there is something in there on my right hand side like theres something rolling around in the joint itself.

My jaw locks if I open too far (normal enough complaint) and it swells up and is painful to open sometimes, not frequently though (one every few months or thereabouts).

Cianan2

Ive got this! On the left side of my jaw....everybody can hear me when im chewing my food! I think it happened when i yawned a big 'un, and it just kept clicking since-always wanted to know what it was,why it only seemed to happen to me...Now im not alone!

LadyJ

Just keep your mouth closed at all times!

Beruthiel

LadyJ wrote:

Just keep your mouth closed at all times!

helpful comments only please
B

JMArr

Nesf, read that FAQ ...check out this link it was recommended by one of the docs in answer to this problem.
looks like this device can help...but you will need your dentist to order it.

www.headacheprevention.com
www.nti-tss.com

BEAT

My aunt has what you have and her dentist says it is caused by TMJ...has your dentist ruled that out for you?

nesf

LATIN BEAT wrote:

My aunt has what you have and her dentist says it is caused by TMJ...has your dentist ruled that out for you?

He put it down to taking too many hits in the chin when I was younger. Considering that the whole thing just appeared after I dislocated my jaw, I'm inclined to agree.

Never had any problems before said dislocation.

Edit: Oh and thanks for the links but I did read the FAQ, I did post the link originally. I don't suffer from headaches or migraines, well not in the last 2 years.

JMArr

nesf wrote:

Edit: Oh and thanks for the links but I did read the FAQ, I did post the link originally. I don't suffer from headaches or migraines, well not in the last 2 years.

ooo touchy :rolleyes: oh yeah lets not forget you posted the link originally ..thats the main thing eh? anyway from what I've read on it the NTI device is a cure for the TMJ problems which can be the cause of clicky jaw ..the migraines and headaches are just other effects of TMJ and bruxism etc ..you mentioned swelling which is another symptom..anyway its a possible solution.I'm def going to check it out with my dentist as I've got all the symptoms listed....

lomb

Im a dentist and its caused by stretching of the ligaments that hold the disc in place. this is caused by dislocation, ageing etc. once the ligaments have streched no one can do anything, including any dentist. just try to exercise your jaw and the muscles attached to it. all the TMJ stuff on the web comes from the USA and is all a total smokescreen to be honest. ps i knew a TMJ specialist who worked over there and he pretty much came to that conclusion after 30 years of practice.

Velvet Vocals

Well I've had it for years and my dentist said that it was because my wisdom teeth were coming down and taking up too much room(how this sounded like it was the cause of the problem, I don't know) so I went in for an operation and had my wisdom teeth removed
And low and behold, my jaw still clicks, its even worse now, very loose and I get lock jaw sometimes. I spoke to my doctor about it and he took a look and said that when you go in for those wisdom teeth operations they dislocate your jaw to work on you and this is probably why my click is worse now then it was before.
But I have discovered what is causing it. I do grind my teeth in my sleep. I have recently been grinding them so badly that I've woken up with the pain and that's how I sussed it out. Sometimes my jaw bones are so sore when I wake up that they are actually a little sore.
So I go fitted for a teeth guard to sleep with, but I can't sleep with it in, I feel like I'm going to choke on it.
So I'm trying to really relax before I go to sleep, burning some lavender essential oils in the room and doing some deep breathing and stuff. It is helping a bit, but I know I'm still grinding most nights :rolleyes:

JMArr

Lomb- TMJ smokescreen??..hmmm well it does come from the USA...but it seems to make logical sense on the other hand....what exercises would you recommend ? repeated opening<click!>and closing<click!> ?ouch or maybe side (crunch)to side(crunch)..youch

SS,I grind my teeth in my sleep as well -and I'm pretty sure thats the root of it -I have clicky/sore jaw , facial pains ,headaches etc on a regular basis .also have a nightguard by it doesnt really help at all ...only protects the teeth from wear really.I'm definitely talking to my dentist about the above splint and give it a try ..it makes sense to me anyway. I've an appointment next week so I'll let ye know if he laughs in my face !

lomb

JMArr wrote:

Lomb- TMJ smokescreen??..hmmm well it does come from the USA...but it seems to make logical sense on the other hand....what exercises would you recommend ? repeated opening<click!>and closing<click!> ?ouch or maybe side (crunch)to side(crunch)..youch

SS,I grind my teeth in my sleep as well -and I'm pretty sure thats the root of it -I have clicky/sore jaw , facial pains ,headaches etc on a regular basis .also have a nightguard by it doesnt really help at all ...only protects the teeth from wear really.I'm definitely talking to my dentist about the above splint and give it a try ..it makes sense to me anyway. I've an appointment next week so I'll let ye know if he laughs in my face !

well, as regards exercises just gentle opening and closing and side to side warming up gently to begin with.

tooth grinding is a differentt condition (bruxism)and that can be caused by teeth not meeting properly, recent extensive dental work where the bite gets thrown off, stress etc. never underestimate the human ability to adapt to a crap bite, but stress does indeed cause this problem thats no smokescreen.
a splint makes sense only if your teeth are being damaged or chipped, then indeed its a very good idea. although ud probably feel like rocky when u sleep

alot of tmj therapy is probably placebo, ie a load of crock, no one really knows,there are no answers other than stress.

sometimes headaches and tmj type symptoms can be caused by a loss of vertical dimension, ie tooth wear. however even thats dodgy as teeth tend to over erupt as does the alveolar bone (jaw bones holding teeth) with loss of vertical dimension. also see below-teeth should rarely ever touch other teeth in usage.

its a multifactorial 'condition' and one that no one understands. my advice is not to get any extensive dental work done as it probably wont fix it anyway and will more than likely make everything worse.(sometimes undertaken to increase the vertical dimension (open the bite etc) sometimes opening the bite with a splint fixes the problem but in good cases the splint will disengage the molar teeth on lateral side to side movements and allow the canines to take all the side to side load which is what they are designed to do.

try something for me. try moving ur jaw from side to side while your teeth are in contact. do u feel any side to side pressure on your back teeth? ideally the canines should disengage the back teeth and take all the loads. if you feel a load on your back teeth maybe a splint can help but be warned a splint that can do the above is *INCREDIBLY* expensive to make. i have only ever made one when i was a student and no one i know except the TMJ guy i knew ever made the real ones in practice. in the real world ul get a soft bit of jelly type material although it wont disengage the back teeth on grinding it will however reduce the loads on them.

pain comes from moving the back teeth side to side, they arent designed to take lateral loading at all, thats the bottom line.

however only if u are disfunctional will u b even grinding in the first place. there is only one time teeth should ever touch other teeth in 'normal' function, anyone know the answer and its NOT eating

Velvet Vocals

lomb wrote:

there is only one time teeth should ever touch other teeth in 'normal' function, anyone know the answer and its NOT eating

When your dead?
I don't know... tell me!!!!

JMArr

cheers for the info.

lomb wrote:

tooth grinding is a different condition (bruxism)and that can be caused by teeth not meeting properly, recent extensive dental work where the bite gets thrown off, stress etc. never underestimate the human ability to adapt to a crap bite, but stress does indeed cause this problem thats no smokescreen.
a splint makes sense only if your teeth are being damaged or chipped, then indeed its a very good idea. although ud probably feel like rocky when u sleep

I definitely grind while sleeping most nights.does bruxism then lead to sore jaw muscles and clicky jaw-sore facial muscles, headaches etc?in my case its probably caused by a missing tooth (molar?)3rd from back on right side.my dentist says it could be stress also but it happens even when I'm not feeling stressed.

lomb wrote:

try something for me. try moving ur jaw from side to side while your teeth are in contact. do u feel any side to side pressure on your back teeth?

Yes and my jaw muscles get very tense too..

lomb wrote:

however only if u are disfunctional will u b even grinding in the first place. there is only one time teeth should ever touch other teeth in 'normal' function, anyone know the answer and its NOT eating

A: Smiling???
Also thats what I read on the link for the NTI thing-did you have a read what do you make of it ?hocus pocus?
www.headacheprevention.com

Velvet Vocals

No I don't think it's smiling. I've spent the last few minutes looking like a fool doing diffent smiles at my desk and my teeth didn't touch... at least I don't think they did...

lomb

Saint Something wrote:

No I don't think it's smiling. I've spent the last few minutes looking like a fool doing diffent smiles at my desk and my teeth didn't touch... at least I don't think they did...

not smiling, the only time is swallowing , when u eat theres supposed to b food between them

Ms Beanbag

I have a clicky jaw- have it as long as I remember. I got braces and they made it worse. My orthodontist said I shouldn't bother with surgery as I already have scar tissue due to braces.
She said avoid things like chewing gum, steak, toffee and hard apples as these all make clicky jaws worse... I've cut down on these things and It has made a difference actually

lomb

JMArr wrote:

cheers for the info.



I definitely grind while sleeping most nights.does bruxism then lead to sore jaw muscles and clicky jaw-sore facial muscles, headaches etc?in my case its probably caused by a missing tooth (molar?)3rd from back on right side.my dentist says it could be stress also but it happens even when I'm not feeling stressed.


Yes and my jaw muscles get very tense too..



yes, yes,and one tooth wouldnt make the slightest difference tbh.
the wiring in peoples brains is very complex some reakon it could be some kind of short circuit. theres no real answer, if ur back teeth touch onside to side sliding on your canines then that will cause the fatigue /pain u get AFTER grinding for sure.

get a soft splint made and see does it make a difference. no one i know makes hard splints, they are just too time consuming to do properly and would cost A LOT in any case.

Deadwing

I had the same problem a few years ago, after a heavy night on the beer i fell flat on my face and buggered my jaw (almost lost an eye too!). It clicked for a few years afterwards and was quite sore at times, until one night it just let out the most almighty crack that everyone in the room heard, and hasnt done it since (touch wood)

lomb

1
clicking is a physical problem, and is caused by damaged ligaments and mayb a damaged disc. this is caused by physical trauma or age (nothing lasts forever) joint surgery is possible but usually makes everything worse so dont even go there)
2
pain is a nonspecific thing which can be multifactorial like contact of the back teeth during abnormal tooth sliding and touching or just being mental (im being serious!)
3
bruxism is caused directly by a short circuit within the neural pathways of the brain, but the short can be caused by alot of things like stress, loss of vertical dimension (wear), just a neural short that no one understands. muscle relaxants help(medication)

there is no consesus on any treatment for the above so many people think its a joke of an area to practice in. still many people have symptoms.

yer man i knew practiced for 15 years in chicago in a top dental hospital treating 'TMJ' (this term encompasses bruxism, pain and clicking) he saw alot of people who had syptoms.

he then practiced in wales like me and in 5 years never saw anyone with pain that could be called TMJ related pain. although like me he did see clicking and wear caused by bruxism. the moral is people in wales havent the slightest bit of stress or interest in their teeth. whereas in the states people are obsessed about their teeth and get 'pain'
go figure

lomb

Deadwing wrote:

I had the same problem a few years ago, after a heavy night on the beer i fell flat on my face and buggered my jaw (almost lost an eye too!). It clicked for a few years afterwards and was quite sore at times, until one night it just let out the most almighty crack that everyone in the room heard, and hasnt done it since (touch wood)

cant explain that one, mayb the disc was displaced and with the new trauma it undisplaced itself?ur lucky anyway dont go out on any major beer sessions now

Capt'n Midnight

Human jaws move side to side unlike those of cats. So like cows we can chew our food. Downside of not having a simple hinge is that stuff like that happens.

My jaw clicks too (not audiablly) , so does my aunts and she was told it might be genetic. You can feel it just in front of my right ear. I can click my knee cap too.

nesf

Thanks Lomb.

Very informative etc.


Just a quick question, when I was looking this stuff up (just browsing really) I came across a lot of mentions of a small disc of bone in the jaw joint. As you said above it's normally kept in place by ligiments. These ligiments could be "damaged"/stretched from trauma etc.

What I'm wondering is if the clicking sound comes from the "free" movement of the disc within the joint? It "slipping in and out of place" or such. Or am I way off?

The jock

I just have it on the left side,and the clicking used drive me and everybody around me mad.People thought i used be doing in to piss them off but i had no control over it.I had it for 3 years when i was 15 to 18.I went to the doctor and the dentist and all they said was to drink plenty milk for the bones in your jaw.Eventually it went away.

LegacyUser

nesf wrote:

Thanks Lomb.

Very informative etc.


Just a quick question, when I was looking this stuff up (just browsing really) I came across a lot of mentions of a small disc of bone in the jaw joint. As you said above it's normally kept in place by ligiments. These ligiments could be "damaged"/stretched from trauma etc.

What I'm wondering is if the clicking sound comes from the "free" movement of the disc within the joint? It "slipping in and out of place" or such. Or am I way off?

yes the noise or click is when the jaw joint(the condyler head of the mandible) moves forward over the emenence and the disc is not moving with the head of it, if u know what i mean, then on closing the disc pops back between, this is the click.

and yes its not a simple hinge joint it slides forward as well as hinging enabling free side to side movement that helps to chew food and shred it.

lomb

yes the noise or click is when the jaw joint(the condyler head of the mandible) moves forward over the emenence and the disc is not moving with the head of it, if u know what i mean, then on closing the disc pops back between, this is the click.

and yes its not a simple hinge joint it slides forward as well as hinging enabling free side to side movement that helps to chew food and shred it.

the clicking going away could be anything, probably the bones in the area maturing and growing. hence the disc no longer got trapped under the articular eminence or the hump thats present on the skull bones and went with the condyler head.

doriansmith

I've had the same problem for almost two years.my jaw locked for no apparent reason one day and ever since i've had a clicking jaw on the right hand side. it locks about once every few months and can be quite sore then if i try to force it open but the rest of the time it doesn't hurt. my doctor told me that once it happens there's nothing you can do, you're basically stuck with it. my dentist gave me jaw exercises to do and said they should help. only did them for a couple of days so don't know if they'd work. i'm so used to the clicking now though that i barely notice it.