Ireland's Central Midfield Problem

colster

One area of the team that's starting to worry me is Central Midfield.
Of Our 4 first choices 3 are all in their 30's (Kavanagh, Keane and Holland).
After these 4 we are really struggling with candidates such as Miller, S.Reid, A.Quinn, A.Reid, C.Healy. J. O'Shea.
With Holland and Keane due retire after the W.C. I think we'll really struggle in the European qualifiers.

Over the years we've been pretty lucky in having some great players in this position, Giles, Brady, Whelan, MacGrath, Keane.
We've usually had at least one. At the moment I don't see any player on the horizon to take over this mantle.

what do you think?

thejollyrodger

kavanagh wont be about much longer either.. so its going to be down to the young guns
Andy Reid and O Shea or Miller.

I just have nightmares of Josh in the centre of the park, regularly giving the ball away and getting caught out of position. Although he has a good physical stature and if he just learnt how to tackle.

Reid is a great passer of the ball and is a bit wasted out on the wing.. maybe its a spot for Mc Geady. Reid's lack of height is a concern.. he is never going to boss midfield around.

Duff___O'Shea__Miller/Reid___McGeady ?

colster

thejollyrodger wrote:

kavanagh wont be about much longer either.. so its going to be down to the young guns
Andy Reid and O Shea or Miller.

I just have nightmares of Josh in the centre of the park, regularly giving the ball away and getting caught out of position. Although he has a good physical stature and if he just learnt how to tackle.

Reid is a great passer of the ball and is a bit wasted out on the wing.. maybe its a spot for Mc Geady. Reid's lack of height is a concern.. he is never going to boss midfield around.

Duff___O'Shea__Miller/Reid___McGeady ?

Still doesn't inspire much confidence in the future. It's a pity as we have a lot of attacking talent but without a strong central midfield we'll find it hard to exploit them.

Cianan2

Why not try Miller and Reid,rather than havin josh in there? (This is in reply to jollyrodgers team,btw...)

thejollyrodger

Keane and Elliott up front ?? but thats another thread

___________Miller/Reid
Duff__________________McGeady ?
___________O'Shea

maybe a diamond might be better, with O Shea designated as the defensive role, Miller is pretty ineffective. Josh rarely wins the ball though (or retains it).

Draupnir

glenn whelan at sheff. wednesday looks a great prospect for the sitting midfield role.

eirebhoy

Aye, Whelan is a much better DMC than O'Shea and will only get better and better.

sleepwalker

id like to see steven reid get a shot in there

applehunter

THere is no problem.

Kilbane Keane Reid and Duff.

Villain

Steven Reid has played in the center for blackburn and is pretty decent, new players will always come along.

Big Nelly

Shef Wed fan here as you all know and Whelan is the future....believe me this boy is class.....bosses the midfield.....can pass the ball and can knock in a few......another one is O'Brien who is with Bolton.....this boy is class.....was with Wednesday for a few months last season and him and Whelan where great together.....good box to box player......highly rated at Bolton but hasnt made the break through yet......already been reports in Sheffield that we are trying to take him on loan for all of next season in the Championship,.....that would be a great move for Wednesday and for him to get a full season playing in Championship footie.......

Kerr should get his head out of his ass and bring Whelan into the squad but still he was with the U21's for the last few games

Team of Future

---

Given

---

Carr

---

O'Brian

---

Dunne

---

O'Shea

Reid

---

Whelan----O'Brien/S Reid

---

Duff

---

Keane

---

Eliott/Morrison

---

Doesnt look too bad and there is always a few players that make the breakj through......I think Reid on the wing because I dont see why people see him as a waste there......thats where he plays at Spurs and that wat he was bought for......needs a few more months in PL and then we will see the true Reid......S Reid deserves to be mentioned because has played well under Hughes.......rest really picks itself

Pigman II

Did Holland actually say he's retiring? Didn't know that!

Also Kilbane is only 28 so all this talk about him being on the way out is a bit premature imho.

Kavanagh gives me the impression that he's grateful just to be there and I reckon he'd hang around as long as Kerr asked him to. He's only 31 now so theres still a couple of years left in him at this level

I don't see guys like Miller or Alan Quiin ever making the grade tbh and will never be more than squad players for us.

I criticise Andy Reid a lot here but I think he is the best prospect for taking a central midfield slot when the Traitor hangs up his boots.

Anyway this would be my midfield to serve us 2006-2008 : Finnan - Reid - Kilbane - Duff

eirebhoy

Pigman II wrote:

Anyway this would be my midfield to serve us 2006-2008 : Finnan - Reid - Kilbane - Duff

Don't think Kilbane will ever have the ability/composure to play the holding role.

ziggy

This post has been deleted.

Big Nelly

Pigman II wrote:

Finnan - Reid - Kilbane - Duff

No hope of qualifying for anything with that midfield.....

Pigman II

eirebhoy wrote:

Don't think Kilbane will ever have the ability/composure to play the holding role.

Who says I want Kilbane to play that role?

I think Reids excellent passing ability would make him an ideal candidate for that position and I'd like to try him out in a friendly sometime next year to see if he could do a job there.

Pigman II

Big Nelly wrote:

No hope of qualifying for anything with that midfield.....

Thanks for that indepth analysis

Big Nelly

Pigman II wrote:

Thanks for that indepth analysis

Ok Finnan at right midfield.....he is ok for an away game maybe in that position but thats if it is back to the wall....he has no quality going forward as a winger...is ok from right back with a winger in front of him....but no attacking option....maybe he would hold this poistion in Jack Charltons team but no way are we going ball to hoffing the ball from defence into attack again

Kilbane: has done ok in the last year but he is not a long term solution.....cant play in the holding midfield role to protect the back four and not really good enought to play in the attacking midfield role.....I rate him but not as a long term solution in Midfield

Reid.....would play him on the wing where he prefers and plays for Spurs there....no way could he play as the holding midfielder,......not an option......he isnt that type of player.....could maybe playing in a diamond midfield behind the strikers if he had a good holding midfielder helping him

Duff.....you got that one right anyway

eirebhoy

Pigman II wrote:

Who says I want Kilbane to play that role?

I think Reids excellent passing ability would make him an ideal candidate for that position and I'd like to try him out in a friendly sometime next year to see if he could do a job there.

Andy Reid a holding midfielder? Ronaldinho's an excellent passer of the ball but I wouldn't consider him for the holding role in a million years. I just can't picture him in the bracket as:

Roy Keane (of new)
Makelele
Hamann
Butt
Gilberto
gattuso
Galasek
Costinha
Zagorakis
Albelda
Linderoth
Poulsen.

thejollyrodger

I dont think Finnan should really be ever played in Midfeild unless we are really up against it. He is too defensive for my liking. Im not 100% about Andy Reid either, he is good at picking out players with passes , shots etc but doesnt have much physical attrributes and I regularly see him pushed off the ball.

Big Nelly

thejollyrodger wrote:

I dont think Finnan should really be ever played in Midfeild unless we are really up against it. He is too defensive for my liking. Im not 100% about Andy Reid either, he is good at picking out players with passes , shots etc but doesnt have much physical attrributes and I regularly see him pushed off the ball.

Yeah exactly right about Finnan....>Reid doesnt have much physical attributes at the moment but he is gaining them as we speak....not a holding midfielder and never will be because not physical enough.......as a winger thou his build is brillant

~Rebel~

Surely Finnan has to be the 1st choice right back anyway, much prefer him to carr especially based on current form. Hope hes as good next season as he turned out to be this season.

what about this whelan guy people are talking about for the holding role? what age is he? is he anywhere near finished artical yet? I know Bolton's Kevin Nolan wanted to join ireland but Kerr doesn't seem to want him.

If this whelan guy was an answer could have him holding, reid right, duff left, nolan attacking midfield. All of this is very wishful thinking though, and not very likely im afraid. Oh oh make me manager! ah go on...please? i know stuff..

ziggy

This post has been deleted.

Pigman II

It's easy to just go 'well Reid doesn't fit that mould therefore it's not even a consideration' but likewise no-one dreamed of putting Kilbane in the centre 3 years ago and now it's hard to remember a time when he wasn't there. Fair enough you can argue Kilbane may not be the perfect player for that position but were not exactly spoilt for choice right and I know instinctively that Reid can do a job for us somewhere on the pitch. I just don't see it on the RIGHT side of midfield.

Even tho it may be his defacto position at Spurs I don't find Reid remotely effective for us in his current position, he seems lost out there and I'd like to see him in a central position where he can just hover around the centre circle and move back if need be. Kilbane can do the running and leave Reid as the orcestrator.

To clarify I'm not suggesting turning Reid into a straight Makelele type player that just covers the back4, destroys play and starts moves. I think Reid could be something in between that and what he is currently, perhaps a throwback to the JanMolby type player of the 80's who could control play and pick out players with decent pass.

Unlike most people I don't agree that every team necessarily has to have this so called water-carrier to break up the play. It's just the 'in thing' right now like the fashionable idea back in the early 90's that every team should have a sweeper, now you don't even hear the term anymore. I'm a great believer in picking the best players you have and letting them play to their strengths - not just to some pre-defined rigid structure that may or may not suit them.

Regardless tho, I'd say give it a chance anyway and if it's a disaster then fair enough. But I'd sooner try it out than give roles to guys like Miller,StevenReid or Quinn just because theres no alternative.

Villain

I'm sure a pre-season at spurs will sort him out

Big Nelly

ziggy67 wrote:

He sure does, whens the baby due?

What you mean? not another person who thinks he is over weight?????

The only person last nite who was over weight was Carr......

Draupnir

Finnan ahead of Carr every game these days in my opinion. Poor old Steve was never the same after that bad injury.

ziggy

This post has been deleted.

Big Nelly

ziggy67 wrote:

Nelly we'll have to agree to differ on this one

Ok, but this has been discussed alot over the last while and everyone else has come to the conclusion that he isnt...

sleepwalker

i havent seen this Whelan bloke play but in fairness he is playing for a club that has just been promoted to the championship so i think to start talking about him playing for Ireland is fairly premature

duff - s.reid/miller/kavanagh - kilbane - andy reid

will be the midfield for the euro qualifiers, we still have mcgeady and miller coming through, tis a pity miller went to man united he was being talked about like he was the second coming of christ last year on these boards havent heard a peep from him sicne his move to united.

eirebhoy

sleepwalker wrote:

i havent seen this Whelan bloke play but in fairness he is playing for a club that has just been promoted to the championship so i think to start talking about him playing for Ireland is fairly premature

I don't see how its any more premature than having Miller in there, or even S.Reid. He got MOTM in Wedneday's 3 matches in the playoffs. Its another 14 or 15 months for the qualifiers and from what I've seen of Whelan he's an excellent player. When it comes to predicting future teams you're always going to be guessing if a player will live up to it.

colster

eirebhoy wrote:

I don't see how its any more premature than having Miller in there, or even S.Reid. He got MOTM in Wedneday's 3 matches in the playoffs. Its another 14 or 15 months for the qualifiers and from what I've seen of Whelan he's an excellent player. When it comes to predicting future teams you're always going to be guessing if a player will live up to it.

I think Whelan might be a good option. By the time the EC Qualifiers start (late 2006) he'll have played a season in the Championship so who knows.

It's still the case that whoever is mentioned we will still have a very limited central midfield and in a time when we can't mask it by playing the long ball.

Overall i think we'll struggle.

thejollyrodger

Miller looks like the biggest flop since GAZZA. Mc Geady is suffering bad form. We might have to wait a while for the next generation to come through

ziggy

This post has been deleted.

thejollyrodger

i said mc geady is suffering bad form.. i didnt write him off like miller.

Well in saying that, Millere could well be our next Mr invisible

Slash/ED

There's no doubt we need to have a look at Whelan, who i've been more and more impressed with recently, as we have a seriously lack of holding mid field players. Beyond Keane, we don't really have any, and it's a very very important position. We need to look at options like Whelan and Stuart Byrne, who proved himself in that position against teams like Deportivo where he was absolutley outstanding and outplayed Valeron who he was directly up against, we simply don't have the quality or depth in that position to look beyond players like that.

It's a problem England need to get over too. So many great players, but if they think Gerrard and Lampard will work as a central mid field partnership they've another thing coming, as Euro 2004 should have told them.

PHB

20 is not when footballers reach their peak.
People see Rooney Torres and Robben and go, omg look at those 20 year olds, Miller must be ****e.

The majority of players you now consider to be world class you would never have heard of at age 20, Lampard/Terry are good examples, who have really come into their own only now. Lampard is 27!

Give all these guys time to develop

eirebhoy

PHB wrote:

The majority of players you now consider to be world class you would never have heard of at age 20, Lampard/Terry are good examples, who have really come into their own only now. Lampard is 27!

And Zidane, Nedved and Ronaldinho. I certainly didn't really know any of those when they were 20 (I think).

Chucky the tree

darren potter could be another one for the future. A loan out to championship side next season would be good to see.