pumped cavity insulation "Warmfill Silver"

qazxsw

Thinking of going with pumped bonded bead insulation for the new house...

http://www.warmfill.com/
"Warmfill" claim to have a new bead (Warmfill Silver), slightly denser than they previously used that will give the magic U value of 0.27 in a standard 100mm cavity. Claim to have the british cert for this but are awaiting the IAB cert

Has anyone had any dealings with this co and/or what do they think of full fill bonded bead cavity insulation in general - anyone had this done and had probs or any success stories ?

rooferPete

Hi,

If you click on the IAB logo on the front page of their web site you will view what appears to be the current IAB certificate for this product.

I would be inclined to ask why an IAB cert is on their web site next to the BBA cert and they say it is Pending ?

I know there are installers of similar products in Ireland, when I was asked to research the other system regarding an installation the distributers also based in N.I. refused to answer technical questions and hung up the telephone.

Further research showed the company I was researching had some twenty "Shelf Companies" complete with the same certification pointing back to the one head office.

That to me suggested the question was regarding the installation not the product, both BBA and IAB certificates are expensive, both have installation patterns on the certificates.

If you are happy that the materials you are getting are what is certified and installed in compliance with the cert then you should have no problem.

I was looking at their installers and recognise one company who I know to be reputable, I expect if you are happy that you are getting an honest service the system is very good.

.

qazxsw

THANKS,

FYI,
I may have cased some confusion w.r.t. certs, the cert on their website is for their existing product, the new product is available but doesn't have the IAB cert yet, Im presuming it's a higher density bead - same way Aeroboard upgraded from the old white cavity insulation boards to the denser black insulation boards.

Salmon

qazxsw,

Did you get this insulation after? What do you think of it?

Builderwoman!

We used the warmfill silver. Excellent. Highly recommend it.

Mellor

qazxsw wrote:

that will give the magic U value of 0.27 in a standard 100mm cavity.

0.27 isn't really an amazing U-Value. It only barely complys with regs for example. And this will be reflected in the buildings BER cert. I'd really like to see u-values pushed passed the min limits. But as always irish mentality is to do just enough to pass.

magpie

How is this stuff for acoustic insulation? Can you only do it with new builds?

mjffey

Mellor wrote:

0.27 isn't really an amazing U-Value. It only barely complys with regs for example. And this will be reflected in the buildings BER cert. I'd really like to see u-values pushed passed the min limits. But as always irish mentality is to do just enough to pass.

When you look at the U-value list from Irish Energy Centre, then a U-value of 0.27 for cavity walls is very good (only surpassed by timber frame), so what's your point?

AJL

Meelor,

your tone leaves alot to be desired. This is supposed to be a friendly site where people can give their opinion what ever their expert level. This kind of comment about the "irish mentality" is not helpful and is childish.
Try and be less of a know all and treat people with a little dignity.

moejoe

We got the Silver Warmfill done and it makes a huge difference. The Silver Warmfill is providing 25% more protection than the old white fill.

We also paid about €1000 for a 1000 square foot 4-bed bungalow.

Builderwoman!

Hi

Agreed with AJL re Mellor...what's your problem??The "Irish mentality" as you so sharply put it of those of us doing self build is in fact to go beyond the min levels of insulation. You have no idea the lengths we are going to to research and expense us self builders here on this site are going to bring our u values down as low as possible. You have do not know the amount of money we spent on other insulation in addition to warmfill and we have a excellently insulated warm house....so please don't comment and use sarcasim where it is not required. What's your agenda??

Back to those interested in topic agree with moejoe it's and excellent job with the silver beads. You can pump beads into existing houses. It's also very successful.

Mellor

mjffey wrote:

When you look at the U-value list from Irish Energy Centre, then a U-value of 0.27 for cavity walls is very good (only surpassed by timber frame), so what's your point?

My point is that 0.27 is the bare min. And it isn't only surpassed by timber. A value of 0.1 is possible with cavity construction, but this is an extreme level of construction.

AJL wrote:

Meelor,

your tone leaves alot to be desired. This is supposed to be a friendly site where people can give their opinion what ever their expert level. This kind of comment about the "irish mentality" is not helpful and is childish.
Try and be less of a know all and treat people with a little dignity.

I wasn't treating anyone here without dignity. My irish mentality comment refered to the companys and services that only aim to do the bare min for the irish market. And people who try to put a decent effort into their home find it very hard.

Builderwoman! wrote:

Agreed with AJL re Mellor...what's your problem??The "Irish mentality" as you so sharply put it of those of us doing self build is in fact to go beyond the min levels of insulation. You have no idea the lengths we are going to to research and expense us self builders here on this site are going to bring our u values down as low as possible. You have do not know the amount of money we spent on other insulation in addition to warmfill and we have a excellently insulated warm house....so please don't comment and use sarcasim where it is not required. What's your agenda??

Sorry if I cam across that way. But i wasn't refering to you personally, I wasn't saying that your are only working to min levels. Instead, by irish mentality, I was commenting on companys that offer insulation to the public,(not on individual irish people or their homes) its quite common for their service to stop at the min level, and when somebody doing a self build wishes to go past these levels it becomes difficult for them. Large scale projects often only do the min to pass.
I wasn't using any sarcasim, but was trying to show to how difficult it is to achieve more, as the mentality of irish industry is to sell to regs regs min standard.
Sorry again if you felt I was making a personal attack on you, but It was complete the opposite.

My referance to the BER certs was to help selfbuilders. When energy usage is shown to you on paper, people will see in clear writing that mass produced house are done to the bare min, and the hardwork a self builder puts into the extras, despite the lack of services, is worth it.

AJL

Hi Mellor,

thank you for your reply and clarifying your position.

ardara1

moejoe wrote:

We got the Silver Warmfill done and it makes a huge difference. The Silver Warmfill is providing 25% more protection than the old white fill.

PLatinum beam is EPS with a graphite additive it has a perormance of 0.034 w/mk - white bead has a performance of 0.04 - NOT A 25% improvement

have a look at the BBA cert on www.bbacerts.co.uk your fantadtically perofrming wall with 100mm pumpede achieves 0.30 ACCORDING TO THEIR OWN BBA CERTIFICATE - IT DOESN'T MEET THE REGS.

It's popularity is down to one thing - it's cheap and people belive what their told.

ardara1

Raindrops don't keep falling on our heads

By Brendan McWilliams IRISH TIMES
The recent coincidence of heavy rain and very strong winds in many parts will have provided a severe test for even the most sophisticated of building methods and materials. In calm conditions, as we know, a raindrop falls vertically at a speed dictated largely by its size. But when there is a wind, the drops are also carried horizontally on their journey earthwards, producing the familiar illusion of oblique lines that hit the ground at an angle. And when the wind is very strong, the result is the unpleasant phenomenon of the "driving rain" which yesterday attacked pedestrians and buildings in spectacular turbulent eddies and Wagnerian swirls.
All bodies, including raindrops, fall to the ground under the influence of gravity, but they also meet with some resistance from the air. Their speed increases steadily at first, but the faster they fall the greater the resistance from the air, until eventually a stage is reached where it exactly counteracts the pull of gravity and they continue downwards at a constant speed; they have reached their "terminal velocity". Large raindrops have a higher terminal velocity than smaller drops: typically, a 2 mm raindrop falls through the air at about 12 m.p.h., while a large 5 mm raindrop falls earthwards at about 20 miles per hour. The latter, obviously, has much greater wetting power.
With a strong wind, the speed limits above do not apply. The raindrops, large or small, are carried at speeds approaching those of the highest gusts, which may be 60 or 70 m.p.h. In addition, since much of the rain in such circumstances approaches its target almost horizontally, it has great penetrating power on surfaces unprepared for such an onslaught.
Driving rain, for example, can quickly penetrate an exterior wall through small cracks, mostly occurring at the interface between the blocks and mortar. As the block-work becomes saturated, further penetration occurs by capillary action through pores in the material itself, perhaps ultimately affecting the structural fabric of the building or causing damage to interior decoration. At the very least, the absorbed rainwater increases the thermal conductivity of walls, resulting in lower temperatures on the inside face; this may cause condensation, or increase the fuel consumption required to maintain the house at normal temperature.
The best protection against driving rain is "cavity" construction. But even with solid walls, the worst effects can be minimised by large roof over-hangs, protective coatings on exterior surfaces, or similar ploys.
To gauge the extent of the challenge in different regions, meteorologists have devised a "driving-rain index" which comprises the annual average wind speed multiplied by the annual average rainfall at a particular spot.

ardara1

Again - read the full text of their BBA - it's not supposed to be used in exposed areas where there is a threat of rain penetration - these guys are supposed to give a report on the suitability for each and every site they survey - I'd say they asked for the money upfront, sent down 2 guys and left in a hurry?

CJhaughey

ardara1 wrote:

The best protection against driving rain is "cavity" construction. But even with solid walls, the worst effects can be minimised by large roof over-hangs, protective coatings on exterior surfaces

Hmm, funny how the Planning department of my local County Council made it a condition of the planning that I was not to have any overhangs.
Of course I obeyed them and didn't use 500mm overhangs;)

Builderwoman!

Mellor,

Thanks for clarification. Appreciate that we may have taken you out of context.

Ardara1 we used a variety of products to achieve a good uvalue.

Mellor

CJhaughey wrote:

Hmm, funny how the Planning department of my local County Council made it a condition of the planning that I was not to have any overhangs.
Of course I obeyed them and didn't use 500mm overhangs;)

They did what???
they wanted you to build with no soffits, or am i completely taking it in wrong.

qazxsw

To answer the question - yes I did go with warmfill silver in the external cavity walls.

Build Dormer, (3.5k sq ft)

also have 100mm kingspan between the rafters and collars. (extending all the way downto the cavity closers, i.e on all the sloped area of the roof) and insulation backed plasterboard on the sloped portion of the roofs in the upstairs rooms.

Haven't moved in yet but the house seems very warm so-far, even when working up there on frosty nights.

De_man

interested in this, can anyone compare what the "warmfill silver" costs are when compared to the sheets of aeroboard?




a pint of plain is yer only man

ardara1

mjffey wrote:

When you look at the U-value list from Irish Energy Centre, then a U-value of 0.27 for cavity walls is very good (only surpassed by timber frame), so what's your point?

It depends what you put in the timber frame mj - normally 140 stud with fibre = U-value of 0.32 - way out of 0.27 claim - warm-fill same - download the BBA cert and read it.

Jloner2

hi does anyone have a more up to date info on this warm fill?

Trilogy 1982

Got it done in parents house last Nov. 1800 sq ft 1970's bungalow with no insulation in the cavity. Not exactly a state of the art heating system but definitely a noticable difference in heat retention. House stays warm a hell of a lot longer. definitely money well spent.

I'm pretty set on it for my 150mm cavity in my new build. And I've done a LOT of research on various cavity wall insulation setups.

dgkn

This is another website forum covering a similar subject probably in more detail and might helpful to those researching full fill cavity insulations.
http://www.aecb.net/forum/index.php?topic=826.0

Katz83

Builderwoman! wrote: »

We used the warmfill silver. Excellent. Highly recommend it.

Hi i am just wondering was it a new build. We building at moment and so many decision. Thinking of 150mm cavity pumped with warmfill silver Bead
Do you still find the house very warm
What heating system do you also is it oil and if so does it cost much for the year
Thanks

paddy147

Roughly,how much is this warmfill silver suff to have pumped in to the walls??

Can it be pumped in to a cavity wall that allready has insulation baord in it?

Thanks.:)

Katz83

paddy147 wrote: »

Roughly,how much is this warmfill silver suff to have pumped in to the walls??

Can it be pumped in to a cavity wall that allready has insulation baord in it?

Thanks.:)

got a quote for 2000 square foot bungalow of 1850. Not sure aout pumping cavity that already has insolation. i would think yes but i am only new to all this stuff sorry

Moanin

paddy147 wrote: »

Roughly,how much is this warmfill silver suff to have pumped in to the walls??

Can it be pumped in to a cavity wall that allready has insulation baord in it?

Thanks.:)

Don't forget that you get a grant for this also.

Katz83

Moanin wrote: »

Don't forget that you get a grant for this also.

We are a new build and as far as i know no grants for new builds.

paddy147

Katz83 wrote: »

We are a new build and as far as i know no grants for new builds.

Thats a kick in the nuts and not fair.:mad:

There should be,regardless of a new build or existing,as you are still future proofing and being kinder to the enviroment.