Eircoms Next Special Offer Yellowpack BB 20 Hours a Month

pepsiman

I was looking for some t&c's earlier for the Broadband Time product which I found here:

http://www.eircom.ie/bveircom/images/btime_tcs.doc

Solair wrote:

From the kind of coverage we're getting you'd sware that eircom were still Telecom Eireann

The above t&c's were written yesterday by a D. Braiden who works for ... "Telecom Eireann" according to the Word document's properties... (The Terms & Conditions document also state that 'terms and conditions apply'...)

eircomtribunal

Where are the specifics of eircom's wholesale offer on this product?

P.

eircomtribunal

"The range of products available to other operators to re-sell in the Republic would be the envy of operators in many European countries." Eircom's David McRedmond in his Irish Times article.

And with these products Eircom pretends to bring the "new wave" of bb users about. What a mockery!


If the incumbent was serious about enticing new customers to broadband first of all substantially more than 60% of the population should be enabled to avail of bb.

Secondly: On the product front services like this Lycos example in Germany would be appropriate:

Customers can either get real flat-rate broadband (that means no time or volume restriction) for € 9.95/month with 12 month contract or € 14.95 with 3 month contract

or

get a "flexiflat", where they pay € 5.95 for up to 5 gig, € 9.95 for up to 10 gig or € 19.95 if more is used (price automatically adjusts to the usage)

or

get a volume tarif, where they pay € 3.95 for 2 gig, € 7.95 for 6 gig, or € 12.95 for 15 gig

(all those prices are in addition to customers fixed line upgrade to either 1,2 or 3 Mb/s, which will bring up the monthly line rental to over 30 euros/month)

Eircom has no interest to bring more broadband users about in any hurry. While it is no use to bemoan Eircom's shenanigans, it is important to keep journalists and the public informed about the inadequacy of this latest Eircom offer.

Will everybody keep an eye open how the press is reporting Eircom's PR on this product?

P.

Sponge Bob

I wonder how resellers like Netsource and Digiweb and will bill a 'per minute' product when they never offered one before . The devil will be in the detail from eircom wholesale.

SkepticOne

The wholesale offering will indeed be the interesting thing. Will ComReg permit Eircom to place an arbitrary constraint on the product that has little to do with costs.

If they do, one good thing is that people will no longer regard ComReg as an unbiased regulator and we'll finally start looking for proper solutions that don't involve them.

Sponge Bob

Thn there is the issue of the recent BB wholesale regs , this is their first test and on the face of it the €20 product looks grossly non compliant with the revenue sqeeze protection for other operators.

Thats unless eircom have some interesting 'pro rata' argument to bamboozle comreg with .

If Comreg develop a backbone eircom will no doubt accuse them of acting against the interests of the consumer .

I must PM Buttsy over in the comreg agitprop department to remind him that 20 hours for €20 is a €744 a month on a strict pro rata basis , there being that many hours in a 31 day month and that Buttsy and his l33T agitprop crew are trying to protect the consumer from that kind of product in the long term.

eircomtribunal

Sponge Bob wrote:

I must PM Buttsy over in the comreg agitprop department

Dear Sir SpongeBob,

Unlike retail telephone charges, retail Internet access charges are not covered by the European Regulatory Framework and therefor ComReg does not regulate such charges. It is not the responsibility of ComReg to analyse all product offerings available in the marketplace, to compare the merits of each and to determine the optimum solution for each customer. Neither is it the function of ComReg, nor would it be appropriate, to prohibit the provision of a specific product where other product offerings are readily available to consumers. ComReg understands that Eircom will market this product specifically in a way to entice a new wave of consumers to Broadband.
ComReg's general advice to consumers is to arm themselves with relevant information on services available in the market place and to make their purchasing decisions accordingly. With this product it is not considered that there is any impediment to consumers obtaining sufficient information to make an informed choice.
I hope that this clarifies some of the points raised in your submission. ComReg can provide further detail if there are any additional queries on the use of ComReg's powers within it's remitted area.

Yours sincerely
P. W. (saving the Commissioners' time and effort)

P.

lucernarian

A question: is the new price for basic broadband sold by eircom a permanent rate now or will that just be a promotional offer lasting just a few months?

Sponge Bob

Thats what Comreg could say if they set out to deliberately misread , wilfully misinterpret and refuse to consider their job to be the enforcement of their own regulations Peter. They are quite adept at all of that as you yourself know

Yellowpack is the first new product that has been brought out since the Wholesale BB (17 pages pdf) Regulations were published in Feb 2005 . Market analysis under the EU framework established that the BB market in ireland was dominated by a single operator with SMP and therefore does come into the regulatory fuzzy algorithm (I won't call it a system) .

The test for Comreg is what they do about their own regulations here, I refer you to section 9 of the linked doc above and especially to 9.2.III and the table just after it.

If we look at section 9.2.IV there is a strong suspicion that the yellowpack product was pre approved by Comreg themselves on the basis of an 'objective justification' .

Fortunately BT have a €49.99 a month bundled product which effectively charges only €25.79 a month for BB after the €24.20 line rental is paid .
The difference between that and Yellowpack is the cost of busting your eircom time cap by a mere 2 and a Half Hours a month . Thereafter you are better off with BT. Nor do BT have a minimum contract of any sort.

I personally hope BT do not offer the yellowpack on the market and that they have the confidence to plug their existing entry product instead . Its well worth the difference.

That will set a marker for what the rest of them will do. I would personally throw the lot back at Comreg and tell them never to allow the introduction of products that require the competition to introduce per minute billing systems at short notice .

dub45

Sponge Bob wrote:

.................

Fortunately BT have a €49.99 a month bundled product which effectively charges only €25.79 a month for BB after the €24.20 line rental is paid .
The difference between that and Yellowpack is the cost of busting your eircom time cap by a mere 2 and a Half Hours a month . Thereafter you are better off with BT. Nor do BT have a minimum contract of any sort.
.............

I saw a post yesterday elsewhere which stated that BT require a minimum of €25 of calls per month is this the case? It so it would make the product less attractive for a lot of people. (The BT T&C's are not easy to find I had a look for them).

Sponge Bob

Thats is an additional product where you can get unlimited calls to landlines (up to 1 hour long) day or night for €25 a month Dub45. I think that would be €25 on top of the €49 .

eircomtribunal

One third of a page ad in today's Sunday Times, business section, for the new Broadband offer.
"Broadband time is available from 7th July"

On eircom.ie/time they also announce a new bb home starter product for €29.99

P.

damien

Peter, what page was that on?

eircomtribunal

page 3.16, or page 16 in the business section.
What's the girl's name?

P.

parasite

kathryn thomas

Cryos

Mr_Man wrote:

does anyone know anywhere else in the world where a BB connection has been metered in this way? Or is this an Irish solution to an Eircom problem?


M.

Yes T-DSL (T-Onlines DSL dept) offer "DSL ZEITTARIFE (Time Tariffs"

30 Hours for 9,95 (without your STANDARD LINE! i.e this type of system gives you the option to select a line speed and then a package)

60 hours for 16,95 (without your STANDARD LINE!)

Mehr infos :

http://service.t-online.de/c/15/04/59/1504594.html

eircomtribunal

Piece on siliconrepublic about eircom's latest broadband joke.

...IrelandOffline argued that Eircom was effectively turning back the clock, so to speak, insofar as it resembled the dial-up regime prior to the introduction of FRIACO (fixed dial-up charges). “To charge €20 for 20 hours and then include a €2.40 an hour penalty for staying online and enjoying the benefits of broadband is scandalous. Eircom is introducing entirely artificial pricing mechanisms with this product,” stated committee member Aidan Whyte.

“Unlike a phone call, it costs Eircom nothing for a broadband connection to be permanently connected. This is little more than a cynical ploy by Eircom to price gouge consumers new to broadband who know no better,” Whyte said.

P.

Mr_Man

Listening to a radio advert for this product, I was struck by the fact that it is for first time connections only. It would therefore seem that you can't downgrade to this service even if you wanted to.....

M.

cgarvey

Mr_Man wrote:

Listening to a radio advert for this product, I was struck by the fact that it is for first time connections only. It would therefore seem that you can't downgrade to this service even if you wanted to.....

M.

Correct. At least that was what we were told at a marketing research group for the product. They may change that after a while though?

damien

Where are you guys seeing/hearing these ads?

Scruff

i heard it yesterday morning, i think it was on Newstalk 106fm in dublin during the Dunphy morning show between 8 and 9a.m. About 90% positive thats where i heard it. 10% chance it was TodayFM between the same times.

damien

The Government's own definition of broadband is listed here:
http://www.broadband.gov.ie/bbinfo/Broadband_WhatIs.aspx

"Broadband is an always-on Internet connection that gives you high-speed
access and downloads for a flat rate monthly charge"

The Internet Advisory Board stated here
http://www.iab.ie/FAQs/DefinitionofTerms/ that:
"With a broadband connection your system is continuously connected to the Internet that means no dialing up and instant connectivity. "

eircom using the term "broadband" to describe this is incorrect. If people feel that the advertising of this is deceptive and will lead to confusion then they can always complaint to the ASAI: http://www.asai.ie/complaint.tmpl

dahamsta

What's the official name of the product?

eircomtribunal

Massively also on RTE.
Eircom uses this ****e of a product for PR. As a vehicle to make sounds about Eircom doing something for broadband, when the product in fact does nothing positive.
There's nothing in the ad about this new sensationally cheap broadband offer having a 20 hour limit.
Was on the phone for over half an hour with a girl on the eircom 1800 503303 number.She insisted the tariff limit was 30 euro overall.
Would anybody bother to ring there just to find out whether they all know by now that the limit is 49 euro?

P.

damien

dahamsta wrote:

What's the official name of the product?

eircom broadband time.

Sponge Bob

dahamsta wrote:

What's the official name of the product?

either Corkmans Broadband or "eircom broadband time"

crawler

Ah kids - ye have not even seen the beginnings of the mass confusion and complexity of this "broadband" product yet...

Painting a picture - 2 way Voip service running as a 2nd phone line service...10 mins later connection disconnects, phone is no longer registered etc etc...or phone has "keep alive" = constant activity = whopping great big bill!!!

This product is the biggest load of cack I have had the misfortune to ever see raise it's head.

dahamsta

damien.m wrote:

eircom broadband time.

Thanks Damien. I'll listen to the radio on my way to my NCT retest. Fingers crossed for dahamsta everybody!

adam

damien

We'll pray to baby jebus for you.

crawler

dahamsta wrote:

Thanks Damien. I'll listen to the radio on my way to my NCT retest. Fingers crossed for dahamsta everybody!

adam

Ex BT engineer now NCT test dude eyes Adam's Mechanically propelled Motor vehicle with both glee and suspicion as it chugs in the door...