Do you cycle to work ?

Trojan

"Guerrilla" campaigns, "hard-to-remove stickers" and other such suggestions will be detrimental to the cycling community by engendering more bad blood - relations with many drivers are already bad enough.

What needs to be done, as mentioned previously (and in many threads on this board) is a public educational campaign telling both cyclists and car drivers of their rights and responsibilities. That should include TV and bus ads, and updating of the Rules of the Road. Getting rid of the ridiculous mandatory cyclelane use should also be on the agenda. Annoying drivers should not.

edanto

Great job eo980 !!! The image is eyecatching and the message clear. Just the right tone too, not agressive or condescending. I'd suggest plumping for just 'is illegal' instead of the 'is illegal/an offence' as I think it's striking by itself. Anyroads, cue congratulary applause.

I don't think it would antagonise drivers, but I think it would make them talk about it and think twice the next time. That's as much as I can contribute to a public education campaign. To me, this seems like the type of grassroots movement that might not last forever, but will at least have some effect.
I paused for thought to consider the littering thing, but I think (hope!!) a guard would take a lenient position in light of the car's parking anyways.

Lovely sunny day for a bit of a cycle, think I'll head across town!

EDIT -
the image, though eye-catching, seems to have started life in Marin County, US. Would it be okay to use it?

dancin

Cycle to/from work, mon to fri. Swords to Clonskeagh, 30 mile round trip.

Stark

edanto wrote:

Great job eo980 !!! The image is eyecatching and the message clear. Just the right tone too, not agressive or condescending. I'd suggest plumping for just 'is illegal' instead of the 'is illegal/an offence' as I think it's striking by itself. Anyroads, cue congratulary applause.

Yes, congratulations, it immediately jumped out at me when I looked at it. I must go and print off a few now And yeah, feel free to take out the "illegal/an offence" and just write "illegal". When I posted "illegal/an offence", I intended for one or the other to be used on the flier

robfitz

MorningStar wrote:

I would never join that crowd because of the spokesman does more damage than good. Anytime he is on the radio they have to cut him off and he appears to be a nut. Not a big fan of joining things either way but I don't support their voice as it is so unreasonable.

MorningStar, you have an interesting stance about the Dublin Campaign, the unreasonable voice will only be changed by people activity participating to help change it's voice. Also be aware the Dublin Campaing does much more work then is heard about on the radio, a number of our members participate on a DTO cycle forum and with a number of Dublin's SPC on Transport, trying to get contra-flow cycle lanes, reduced speed limits and better standards of cycle facilities, design and construction.

daymobrew, the 1997 regulations was replaced in 1998 with regulations that made it worst for Irish cyclists.

arrietty

jman0 wrote:

Seriously instead of pestering motorists with this litter you should pester the Gards with it. It's their responsibility to enforce the rules and in a way, you are trying doing their jobs for them.
Maybe you can direct your energies toward Michael McDowell in this respect.

I dunno, jman. Do you cycle? I agree that better enforcement is needed, but as has been pointed out, a lot of drivers just aren't aware of the fact that parking in cycle lanes is illegal and dangerous.

Trojan wrote:

"Guerrilla" campaigns, "hard-to-remove stickers" and other such suggestions will be detrimental to the cycling community by engendering more bad blood - relations with many drivers are already bad enough.

I agree. I don't think that the flyer idea is too provocative, though. I feel that I should do something. If anyone wants to join me, they're welcome.

Trojan wrote:

What needs to be done, as mentioned previously (and in many threads on this board) is a public educational campaign telling both cyclists and car drivers of their rights and responsibilities. That should include TV and bus ads, and updating of the Rules of the Road. Getting rid of the ridiculous mandatory cyclelane use should also be on the agenda. Annoying drivers should not.

Yes. And I don't see it happening any time soon. I think that letting drivers know the effects of their parking habits on cyclists in a fairly direct way will hopefully make them think. Or else complain to their friends and start a debate. We shall see.

Kintarō Hattori

Hi edanto,

Yeah your right about that image. Well I said it was quick and it was really just to get the ball rolling. If it's wished, I'll email those folks and see if they don't mind having their image used for a positive non-profit campaign.

Regards

edanto wrote:

Great job eo980 !!! The image is eyecatching and the message clear. Just the right tone too, not agressive or condescending. I'd suggest plumping for just 'is illegal' instead of the 'is illegal/an offence' as I think it's striking by itself. Anyroads, cue congratulary applause.

I don't think it would antagonise drivers, but I think it would make them talk about it and think twice the next time. That's as much as I can contribute to a public education campaign. To me, this seems like the type of grassroots movement that might not last forever, but will at least have some effect.
I paused for thought to consider the littering thing, but I think (hope!!) a guard would take a lenient position in light of the car's parking anyways.

Lovely sunny day for a bit of a cycle, think I'll head across town!

EDIT -
the image, though eye-catching, seems to have started life in Marin County, US. Would it be okay to use it?

jman0

arrietty wrote:

I dunno, jman. Do you cycle? I agree that better enforcement is needed, but as has been pointed out, a lot of drivers just aren't aware of the fact that parking in cycle lanes is illegal and dangerous..

Yes of course. I just think drivers are weirdly protective of their cars and no matter how politely worded the leaflet, the majority of them will be a little irked about having it pushed on them. It may cause a reaction where the motorist now pays extra attention to find fault among cyclists and will be quicker to audibly assault us with their horns.
Besides i think some of these people park on cycle lanes because they see another car already there.

kenmc

I think the flyer idea is good, and have thought about sticking them (with superglue - yeah I know - I'm a vindictive bast@rd at times) to their windows, but my main reason for not doing so would be that it'd slow me down on my commute even further than I already am slowed by having to navigate parked cars. Stop, take off my bag, get out the flyer(/glue) and post it, bag shut, back on the bike.....
edit: yes I know that superglueing things to windows is bad mkay. i just thought about it. same way as i thought about getting a RPG mounted to the handlebars.

Gegerty

Stark wrote:

How about.

"Parking in the cycle lane is illegal/an offence and puts my life in danger."

followed by a little street diagram with a cyclist veering out of the way of a parked car into the path of traffic coming from behind.

Flyers isn't enough, it'll just make them do it even more. Now flyers along with a sharp key to the side of the car, that'll sort them....

edanto

eo980 - nice one. wasn't trying to be pedantic, it just kindof happenned. good call sending them a mail.
arrietty, great post - I agree wholeheartedly!

jman0, I think the educational (it's illegal to park here) side of the leaflet outweighs any annoying side effects. Course I'd like to hear what drivers think of the idea?

Original Poster, what do you think? And I guess we kindof hijacked your thread...maybe us flyer-posters should get our own thread if we're gonna keep talking about it?

Victor

eo980 wrote:

Hmnn the flyer was a good idea, it's a pity no-one took it on. I'm not arty, I was stuck for time, but at least it's a start. Take it away and modify it!!!

Theres a risk it reinforces the "cyclists aren't allowed out of cycle lanes" mentality among a lot of drivers.

Zaph0d

kenmc wrote:

yes I know that superglueing things to windows is bad mkay. i just thought about it. same way as i thought about getting a RPG mounted to the handlebars.

bikes with dual mounted RPGs were of course used in WW2
http://www.toysunlimited.nl/images/Jupp_Bauer.jpg

kenmc

ohhh handy...
where can I get my hands on one of them??

Kingsize

I quite like the graphic myself but perhaps the yin yang thing is a step
too far? You average driver will probably think its the work of crackpot anarchist hippies !! Im joking but you do know what i mean....!

Zaph0d

kenmc wrote:

ohhh handy...
where can I get my hands on one of them??

I wouldn't be surprised if Ratzinger had one in his attic.

randomname2005

While i think the flyers are a good idea, i agree with earlier posters who said it would slow down their commute and make drivers more aggressive.

While i hate having to swerve into oncomming traffic because some inconsiderate fool has parked illegally, the police are never going to enforce these rules. People complain that the police are under-resourced, dont spend enough time chasing 'real' criminals etc. If they were to go and ticket every car parked in a cycle lane they would never have time to do 'real' police work. They dont even ticket cars parked illegally when they walk past them!
There are two police stations i have to cycle past, pearse street and rathmines. The number of cars parked illegally (either on double yellows or cycle lanes) around and near these stations is crazy and probably cars belonging to gardai which will never be ticketed. Even if a separate, independent traffic police force was introduced, i dont think it would solve this problem.

Im not sure if it was discussed in this thread or another thread, but there are two types of cycle lanes (on road at least), the ones enclosed with solid white lines and dashed white lines. Nobody seems to know the exact rules regarding either. I think the dashed ones can be driven in.

If people are going to put flyers on cars, they need to be careful that the cycle lane is in opperation at that time. Some cycle lanes have signs at the start of them indicating when they are cycle lanes, and outside of these times people are free to park in them. Incorrectly flyering cars would really get drivers pi55ed off.

R

ciaran76

edanto wrote:

Original Poster, what do you think? And I guess we kindof hijacked your thread...maybe us flyer-posters should get our own thread if we're gonna keep talking about it?

I don't mind but you might get more people involved if you start a new thread as they will know what you are talking abaout. Anyway i know have started cycling to work and find i have much more energy etc etc. Only have had one close shave so far with one idiot truck/van driver who was mm's away from hitting me :mad:

Dutchboy

Not totally sure but i think its a 8mile round trip, From Clonskeagh to Merrion square, takes about 15mins with favoruable lights! My ride is a 1994ish Gazelle Dutch tourer with 28 inch wheels, 3 gears and a oversize 27inch frame!

vector

rugbug86 wrote:

i would cycle to work but
...
iii) i would be too hot n sweaty when i arrive cos there's no shower place

yep, perfect point

vector

Metrobest wrote:

Remember, cars do not have a god-given right to use the road. It was Ireland's politicians and planners who, many decades ago, decreed that pedestrians and cyclists should have to be second-class citizens in favour or an unsustainable, damaging means of transport otherwise known as the car. ...

Well while I cycle alot I can see the motorist point, they pay for mandatory road tax which supposedly paves the roads (and mandatory insurance) while cyclists pay nothing

cyclopath2001

daymobrew wrote:

I looked up the statutes, searching for "cycle track".
Found an item that says it is illegal to drive along or across a cycle track. I would assume that parking on a cycle track is illegal because you have to drive on it to park on it.

That regulation was changed the following year in SI 274 to read:

(5) (a) A mechanically propelled vehicle, other than a mechanically propelled wheelchair, shall not be driven along or across a cycle track on the right hand edge of which traffic sign number RRM 022 has been provided, save for the purpose of access to or egress from a place adjacent to the cycle track or from a roadway to such a place.

RRM 022 is a continuous white line associated with a cycle track. It is rarely used.

Thus, drivers are allowed drive in cycle tracks. This makes it easier for the City Council to construct cycle tracks as it's no longer necessary to set aside dedicated space for cyclists.