Blueface Hardware

causal

I noticed last week that blueface were no longer selling the Sipura 3100, and I see now the 2100 (or 2x00) is no longer available.

The Budgetone BT102 IP phone is still available for €120.
But newly available is the Linksys RT31P2 Broadband Router with 2 Phone Ports for €99.
This means blueface don't offer an ATA, an ATA is useful for users who have an existing gateway/router. However, if the features of the RT31P2 compare well with your existing gateway/router then the RT31P2 costs less than many of the ATAs anyway.

The device itself at a very quick glance seems fine (though I didn't notice a SPI firewall); and the price compares well with abroad; UNLESS you look at eBay where the device comes bundled with a Vonage package for $0.29 [sic] for first time customers :eek:
Maybe this is a sign of things to come, a bit like the mobile phone market - where hardware is subsidised by providers

causal

fwiw Skytel.ie only offer the Sipura 2000 - for €95.

vibe666

you can still get them off ebay.

cheaper than blueface's own ones too.

Jaden

Try:

www.italk.ie

They do Sipuras (I think), but also grandstream stuff cheap too.

ForcaBarca

Pity that Linksys Router with the Voice ports doesnt come with wireless...sigh!!!

WillieFlynn

In the US alot of the ATA which are locked to Vonage sell for the same price as the unlocked ones. Unlike mobiles you can't force the service provider to unlock them after a certain amount of time or money spent.

Most linksys VoIP hardware is the same as sipura (they used to licience it from sipura) however a few months ago cisco bought sipura. So the only difference is the box.

aaronc

ForcaBarca wrote:

Pity that Linksys Router with the Voice ports doesnt come with wireless...sigh!!!

It does. Linksys WRT54GP2-NA.

Aaron

Couch Potato

aaronc wrote:

It does. Linksys WRT54GP2-NA.

Aaron

Check this link - the UK WIRELESS version WRT54GP2-UK is due 19th July :

http://www.broadbandbuyer.co.uk/Shop/ShopDetail.asp?ProductID=2225&CategoryID=321&ShopGroupID=77

includes firewall unlike RT31P2

Shipping is £25 to Ireland...

Any chance you could get a few of these Aaron ????

Brings the cost to £83.70 (not sure about vat) = 124 yoyos

Couch Potato

router here also at :


http://www.riskfree.co.uk/shop/default.asp?ProductType=ROUTER&StartAt=75

£126.45 delivered to ireland via TNT (including vat)

causal

causal wrote:

<snip> This means blueface don't offer an ATA, <snip>

That was yesterday. And in true blueface blink-of-an-eye style I check the website today and they are offering an ATA: Linksys PAP2 ATA €75

*chances arm*
Of course blueface don't yet offer free Ferrari's to registered customers...
*crosses fingers and keeps reloading blueface website in anticipation of update*

causal

Sandals

causal wrote:

That was yesterday. And in true blueface blink-of-an-eye style I check the website today and they are offering an ATA: Linksys PAP2 ATA €75

*chances arm*
Of course blueface don't yet offer free Ferrari's to registered customers...
*crosses fingers and keeps reloading blueface website in anticipation of update*

causal

No idea what your talking about but I need to know the simplest cheapest way of connecting my ntl cable modem to my portable phones through blueface, i have 4 portables and 1 base

causal

Sandals wrote:

No idea what your talking about but I need to know the simplest cheapest way of connecting my ntl cable modem to my portable phones through blueface, i have 4 portables and 1 base

Look at the two posts above mine from Couch Potato for the answer to your question.

Also, from your other post your requirements are more than just 'simplest/cheapest'.

Simplest/cheapest is an ATA - but that's not what you're looking for, if you want a wireless network then the devices Couch Potato linked to are optimal.

causal

fisab

causal wrote:

That was yesterday. And in true blueface blink-of-an-eye style I check the website today and they are offering an ATA: Linksys PAP2 ATA €75
causal

That PAP2 ATA doesnt seem to have QOS (like the Linksys router does).
Would I be right in assuming that the QOS feature is only important for phonecalls during a download?

Apart from that, it seems to support the same voice algorithms as the SPA-2100, so can I assume that the voice quality will be similar?

air

Just an FYI lads, I'm having some QOS issues with the Linksys box & it appears that the supposed QOS support on it is a bit rubbish.
http://www.vonage-forum.com/ftopic4187-0-asc-0.html
http://www.vonage-forum.com/ftopic1957-0-asc-0.html

WillieFlynn

The linksys PAP2 is the same as the Sipura 2000 (but in a slightly different box). Linksys licensed the design form Sipura before Sipura was bought by Cisco (Linksys is also part of Cisco).

I would be very careful buying any linksys ATA from the US as most are locked to Vonage, which sell for the same price as the unlocked ones. Also no where on the box does it say it is locked, I got caught out by this when I was over in the US a few months ago (I was lucky the shop took it back and gave me a refund).

The only difference between it and the Sipura 2100 is that it doesn't have a second ethernet port which would allow it provide QoS. Other than that it is the same.

William

WillieFlynn

fisab wrote:

Would I be right in assuming that the QOS feature is only important for phonecalls during a download?

Yes, however if there are others in you house sharing your internet connection, QoS would be useful. Also automated software updates could cause problems in the middle of a call.

The main advantages other than price for the ATA without the second ethernet port for QoS, is that they are physicaly smaller which can be useful if you want to bring it with you when you travel.

Willie.

fisab

WillieFlynn wrote:

Yes, however if there are others in you house sharing your internet connection, QoS would be useful. Also automated software updates could cause problems in the middle of a call.

The main advantages other than price for the ATA without the second ethernet port for QoS, is that they are physicaly smaller which can be useful if you want to bring it with you when you travel.

Willie.

Thanks for the info - QOS does seem like an important feature to have. Because blueface no longer sell the sipura, I've been looking at them on ebay.
Assuming they are unlocked, does the U.S. version allow for a 220-240V power rating (i.e. will they work over here without having to buy a transformer)?

paulm17781

fisab wrote:

Thanks for the info - QOS does seem like an important feature to have. Because blueface no longer sell the sipura, I've been looking at them on ebay.
Assuming they are unlocked, does the U.S. version allow for a 220-240V power rating (i.e. will they work over here without having to buy a transformer)?

Yeah there is a transformer on the plug which come with a 3 pin part (it is changeable) as whoever you buy it from if they still have it. Alternatively just buy an adapter, they cost about 7 Euro.

WillieFlynn

fisab wrote:

Thanks for the info - QOS does seem like an important feature to have. Because blueface no longer sell the sipura, I've been looking at them on ebay.
Assuming they are unlocked, does the U.S. version allow for a 220-240V power rating (i.e. will they work over here without having to buy a transformer)?

The linksys RT31P2 blueface does offer QoS. And remember most linksys VoIP products are just badged Sipura products.

The sipura ATA's transformer will work over here (I got one in the US and it is woking fine here).

air

WillieFlynn wrote:

The linksys RT31P2 blueface does offer QoS. And remember most linksys VoIP products are just badged Sipura products.

The sipura ATA's transformer will work over here (I got one in the US and it is woking fine here).

Yes but the QOS on the RT31P2 doesnt really work at all.
This is well documented, however QOS can be achieved by putting the RT31P2 behind a WRT54G router/access point which has decent QOS available for it.
I'm looking forward to the WRT54GS2P to be honest, hopefully it will have the same hardware & QOS support as the WRT54G.

Couch Potato

Couch Potato wrote:

Check this link - the UK WIRELESS version WRT54GP2-UK is due 19th July :

http://www.broadbandbuyer.co.uk/Shop/ShopDetail.asp?ProductID=2225&CategoryID=321&ShopGroupID=77

Now feckin 26th July ...

captainpat

Marx Computers still show Sipura 1001 and 3000 available.
http://www.marxcomputers.ie/

Couch Potato

Couch Potato wrote:

Now feckin 26th July ...

Now "Call for latest .... " - Damn !!!!

Couch Potato

Couch Potato wrote:

Now "Call for latest .... " - Damn !!!!

Now in Stock ...

£98.35 delivered = €142.98 ish

Couch Potato

Blueface now offering the WRT54GP-UK on website.

I has asked Aaron by e-mail if Blueface were going to get these and he replied to say that they now have a stock of 50.

€125 delivered.

PlasmaFish

Has any one bought anything off www.italk.ie?

There prices are very good for an Irish supplier. Was looking at getting a Grandstream ATA Handytone 486 their only about €70 and postage is about €2
and may be an IP phone Grandstream Bugedetone 102 is €76 + €2

http://www.italk.ie/productcategory.php

Anyone see them before?

causal

PlasmaFish wrote:

There prices are very good for an Irish supplier. Was looking at getting a Grandstream ATA Handytone 486 their only about €70 and postage is about €2
and may be an IP phone Grandstream Bugedetone 102 is €76 + €2

Check out this thread

The 486 (which I have) wouldn't be my choice if I was buying now.
Give more details about your setup and requirements and you should get some specific advice.

hth,
causal

Couch Potato

Couch Potato wrote:

Blueface now offering the WRT54GP-UK on website.

I has asked Aaron by e-mail if Blueface were going to get these and he replied to say that they now have a stock of 50.

€125 delivered.

Router bought and delivered last Friday - setup took about 5 mins.

Easy peasy ....

azzeretti

Does anyone know if the WRT54GP2, provided by Blueface, has an QOS feature with it? I can't see a mention of it on the spec sheet on the linksys site and I would like to prioritise my VOIP packets if possible.

Cuauhtemoc

Yep does have it.
Got mine today...5 mins to setup and works great.

Cheers Blueface

frost

Was about to sign up for Blueface and get the WRT54GP2 but saw some negative reviews in Amazon.com about background noise.

Anyone here having that problem?

The Smircher

I read similar reviews, but the problem seems to be more related to the vonage service rather than the linksys router. I got one of the WRT54GP2 routers and so far, so good. Set up was a piece of cake. Blueface had already pre-programmed it with my user information. I dropped it into my network in place of a Buffalo Wifi router and voila I was up and running.
Quality so far has been great, no complaints.

GerardKeating

The Smircher wrote:

I read similar reviews, but the problem seems to be more related to the vonage service rather than the linksys router. I got one of the WRT54GP2 routers and so far, so good. Set up was a piece of cake. Blueface had already pre-programmed it with my user information. I dropped it into my network in place of a Buffalo Wifi router and voila I was up and running.
Quality so far has been great, no complaints.

Same here, it arrived Thurday, fully configured, just replaced the existing router and Sipura 2100 and every thing was oxo.

gerard

democrates

Forgive my newbie caution, but have I got this right:

I have an NTL broadband modem connected by ethernet to one pc with zonealarm.
I have an ethernet hub with no security which is disconnected since the broadband is now coming in on the ethernet rather than the old dial-up modem, but I need to get the network back up.

If I buy the Freedom Basic from Blueface with the Linksys WRT54GP2,
I just connect as follows:
-> NTL broadband modem via ethernet to the router
-> PC network hub via ethernet to router
-> Internal telephone network to router via traditional telephone cable
(I don't have any wireless gear yet, but may add some later)

Once I've configured the devices I'll have:
-> Firewalled broadband for the PC network
-> VoIP account with Blueface that operates through my traditional phones

Do I need any other kit, or is the setup above ok and will make the eircom phone line superfluous (the mobile will do for emergency calls during a power outage)?

paulm17781

I'm very tired so I'll try to explain this.

NTL -> Router/ATA via ethernet (cat 5)
Normal phone -> ATA via phone cable
Switch/hub (if you like) - > Router/ATA via cat 5
computer switch/hub or Router/ATA via cat 5.

ZENER

I've been giving this serious consideration for the last couple of months and have found a wireless BB provider in my area.

There's some question I've not seen asked yet.

The provider I've chosen has a D/L cap of 10GB on their cheaper product at about 35 quid and 20 GB on their 48 euro offering.

Which would be better suited to a VoIP setup with internet usage of around 5GB per month?
Is 5GB enough for a normal usage home VoIP phone in other words ?

What bandwitdth does a call take up and is it controllable i.e. can I configure it to use say 32Kbps or is it fixed and at what rate?

QOS has been mentioned elsewhere, how effective is this ?

Blueface.ie seem to have the best package at 15.99 per month Ireland & UK calls compared to some of the others at 19.99 p/m for just Ireland calls. Is there a catch ?
Their T&Cs mention a minimum call charge of 0.2cent: I presume thats for pay as you go type subscribers only ?

Using standard analogue phones into ATA's - is the phone powered from this?
Does the user hear a standard dial tone or something else ?

Is it possible to keep your existing Eircom number as your VoIP phone number?

Would a cheap 500W UPS serve as a decent backup for the VoIP ATAs and BB Router do you think ?

Sorry if some of these are obvious but they may help clear up some issues for others too.

ZEN

paulm17781

VOIP doesn't use much bandwidth, I'm too tired to work it out now, it was posted before (aksed by me). I think it uses 87.5 kbps with about a 30% saving for silent momnets. I think if you use it 24 hours perday for a month solid it comes to about 24GB but I am too tired to try to work it out.

Blueface are extremely good, best phone company I have had. You can get your eircom number ported and get an 076 number. Word of warning if you are with an Eircom reseller (BT/UTV/etc.) get your calls and line rental moved back to Eircom now. They use this to hold on to people a bit longer if you try to port your number.

causal

democrates wrote:

Forgive my newbie caution, but have I got this right:

I have an NTL broadband modem connected by ethernet to one pc with zonealarm.
I have an ethernet hub with no security which is disconnected since the broadband is now coming in on the ethernet rather than the old dial-up modem, but I need to get the network back up.

If I buy the Freedom Basic from Blueface with the Linksys WRT54GP2,
I just connect as follows:
-> NTL broadband modem via ethernet to the router
-> PC network hub via ethernet to router
-> Internal telephone network to router via traditional telephone cable
(I don't have any wireless gear yet, but may add some later)

Once I've configured the devices I'll have:
-> Firewalled broadband for the PC network
-> VoIP account with Blueface that operates through my traditional phones

Do I need any other kit, or is the setup above ok and will make the eircom phone line superfluous (the mobile will do for emergency calls during a power outage)?

The WRT54GP2 has a builtin router with 3 ethernet ports (RJ45); it also has two phone ports (RJ11); it also has wireless capability (802.11G+B).
Unless you need more than 3 wired (RJ45) devices connected to the router then there is no need for the hub; although it can be connected in the manner you specified to add more ports. The WRT54GP2 can serve up to 253 internal IP addresses.

The WRT54GP2 has SPI firewall, and NAT, and the other usual features DHCP, UPnP, VPN passthrough, WPA, WEP etc. You'll need NAT to share your one IP address amongst many netwrok devices, and DHCP is quite handy for assigning those local IP addresses automagically.
The RJ11 ports will take a traditional DTMF (but not pulse) phone. The most popular choice is to use a wireless DECT basestation plugged into the router, with multiple handsets located where required.

The only other kit you might need (if you don't already have it) is network adaptors for each device you want to network - be they wireline or wireless.
As for emergency calls during a power outage - you could also deploy a UPS to power your modem, router, dect base-station in the event of a localised power outage. But I'd be curious to know if the NTL network (or the cellular network) is independently powered, or has independent power backup - from the normal ESB network.

hth,
causal

GerardKeating

causal wrote:

But I'd be curious to know if the NTL network (or the cellular network) is independently powered, or has independent power backup - from the normal ESB network.

Don't think so, there was a major power outage in Galway this week, in the newcastle area.

When the power in Newcastle went at 17:00hrs, the NTL (TV & BB) went out in most of the west side of Galway, even in area which still had power.

We later lost power (from 18:30hrs until 20:30hrs) but NTL did not come back until after 23:30hrs, which is when the power was restored to Newcastle.

causal

ZENER wrote:

Is 5GB enough for a normal usage home VoIP phone in other words ?

Taking a rate of 80kbps for a call = 10kBps
5GB / 10kB = 500,000seconds = 139 hours talking per month.

What bandwitdth does a call take up and is it controllable i.e. can I configure it to use say 32Kbps or is it fixed and at what rate?

As above and can be configured for less (but lower quality), in practical terms it's not an issue.

QOS has been mentioned elsewhere, how effective is this ?

Great on your own network, but once you hit the internet it can't be guaranteed. A small voice in my head is saying something about IPv6 having 'prioritisation' capability but I can't recall .

Using standard analogue phones into ATA's - is the phone powered from this?

A standard phone yes, but not a dect basestation or telephones with additional power requirements - but they're typically supplied with their own mains power adapter.

Does the user hear a standard dial tone or something else ?

I hear a dialtone like you get on hotel phones, more of a birrrr, than a beeee. Grandstream made available a tool to convert mp3, and wav sound files into ringtones for their IP phones.

Is it possible to keep your existing Eircom number as your VoIP phone number?

Yes, and you can get an 076 numbers too (076 are thenon-geographic VoIP numbers, that nationally are charged at local rates).

Would a cheap 500W UPS serve as a decent backup for the VoIP ATAs and BB Router do you think ?

Your modem also requires power, and as Gerards post clarifies your ISP network requires power too - so if it's local you might be ok, but if it hits your providers power then
fwiw the WRT54GP2 power adapter can supply 12V at 1A, then have peek at this article and get your calculator out

hth,
causal

democrates

Thanks paulm and causal, looking forward to this blueface gig big time.

air

causal wrote:

But I'd be curious to know if the NTL network (or the cellular network) is independently powered, or has independent power backup - from the normal ESB network.

hth,
causal

Cellular base stations have a battery back up that last anything from 2-24 hours depending on the load & bank size on the particular site.

democrates

Cellular base stations in telephone exchanges have the telephone exchanges emergency supply to draw upon. In the first case this is a bank of lead-acid batteries producing 50v dc for the switch as well as mains via an inverter, then there's a diesel generator which kicks in, I think they're all automatic now and don't require a call-out.

As for NTL, I wonder do they take a local mains feed, or have they their own power supply out to their local 75 ohm break-out boxes? It seems it would be a good idea to run their own power out, and if this could be integrated to the 75-ohm coax to the home, enough to power a voip adapter and a handset, emergency call problem solved. Or what about batteries?

In fact if they're serious about replacing PSTN they could do worse than look into this issue, I'm sure the cable broadband industry as a whole could come up with some standards.

GerardKeating

air wrote:

Cellular base stations have a battery back up that last anything from 2-24 hours depending on the load & bank size on the particular site.

Also a few times in Dublin, when i lived in Raheny, a power cut in the Killester area would take out the NTL, even if we had power in Raheny.

This was pre-BB eara now.

nava

GerardKeating wrote:

Also a few times in Dublin, when i lived in Raheny, a power cut in the Killester area would take out the NTL, even if we had power in Raheny.

This was pre-BB eara now.

Same happened to me last week, the electricity went in the Old Bawn area and the NTL TV and Internet was gone in my area (Aylesbury), is about the 3rd time the internet goes in 3 years.

democrates

Here's my proposed network
Does this look ok?

causal

That would work fine.
However, if the physical wiring facilitates it, I'd be inclinded to plug your two most active connections directly into the WRT54GP2 - the third port being used for your hub (just to reduce traffic, number of hops, ping time, etc.)
Then plug your two least active connections into the hub - so you may not need the hub on 24/7.
Again, depending on the physical location of your network devices this may or may not suit.

causal

democrates

Spot on causal, I'll do that.

shabbyroad

causal wrote:

The 486 (which I have) wouldn't be my choice if I was buying now.
Give more details about your setup and requirements and you should get some specific advice.

I'm looking at getting ATA and using either Blueface or Broadtalk as my VOIP provider.

Why would you not now go for the Grandstream ?

causal

shabbyroad wrote:

I'm looking at getting ATA and using either Blueface or Broadtalk as my VOIP provider.

Why would you not now go for the Grandstream ?

Because now there are devices better suited to my requirements than were available at the time I bought the Grandstream. I can't really fault it for what it does, but ATA's now can come with two VoIP ports and plenty of configuration options that the Grandstream simply doesn't have.

But which device to get is determined by your particular requirements and current setup.

causal

Cabaal

causal wrote:

Because now there are devices better suited to my requirements

Agreed, best to review what kind of setup would work best for you,
If I was getting equipment all over again I'd get the Linksys ATA/Wireless/Router as it would save space and plugs in my already plug limited sitting room

I'll propably sell my ATA soon,

shabbyroad

Makes sense. I'll have a look at what is out there.

I notice that the better Sipura ATAs support 2 independent lines while the Grandstream ATAs don't.

I see how this would be useful - one line for the office and another for the kids phone (so they can take incoming calls and make landline calls without tying up our home and business lines... and I can block calls to mobiles on that line).