Kiddie pron

Hagar

Not sure if this is the right place to post. Mods please move as you see fit.

I recently received an un-solicted email with a link to a kiddie porn site.

I contacted a mod by pm for advice on what to do and I was advised to contact www.hotline.ie

I forwarded the mail to them with a cover letter and this is the reponse I got.

Greetings -

Thank you for your report to the www.hotline.ie service. Your report will be
investigated.

FOR FUTURE REPORTS: The hotline would sincerely appreciate if you would
submit the details of future reports using the online form on
www.hotline.ie. Reports sent to the hotline by e-mail, including forwarded
or attached e-mails:

- take longer to process (they are processed after all website reports
are processed)

- the most important technical information IS LOST when emails
are forwarded and in most cases the email cannot be
investigated to completion

- can inadvertently include virus's and other harmful content which can
cause
substantial disruption to the hotline service

- forwarding or attaching an e-mail that actually contains child
pornography,
could be considered illegal (as distribution of Child Pornography). The
Hotline wishes to ensure that those legitimately reporting to us do not
create
any such possibility for themselves (for example, if in error you
inadvertantly used the
wrong e-mail address in forwarding the offending e-mail to the Hotline)

- can be lost or accidentally deleted by the hotline staff if they
look like any of the volume of spam emails which are received by
the hotline on a daily basis

- severely impact of the workload of the hotline staff and delay
processing of all reports

It is therefore strongly requested that all reports are submitted via the
forms provided on our website.

The www.hotline.ie service handles cases of Child Pornography on the
Internet which is specifically illegal under the 1998 Child Pornography and
Trafficking Act. If the material you reported turns out to be confirmed
child pornography action will be taken.

Best regards


Sharon

---

www.hotline.ie Content Analyst
Tel: (local) 1890 610 710
fax: (local) 1890 520 720
web: www.hotline.ie
email: report@hotline.ie

---

The www.hotline service is a service to combat
child pornography on the Internet by providing
a facility for the public to report any such material
found whilst using the Internet.

---

Original Message

---

From:
To: <report@hotline.ie>
Sent: Thursday, June 30, 2005 12:48 PM
Subject: Fw: 5-7 y.o. pics and movies


> Original Message Content Removed by Hotline>

All they did was bemoan the manner in which I sent the information and warn me that I could be done for kiddie pron myself for forwarding the mail to them for examination. I thought they would get more info from the mail header than they would from me filling out an online form.

They seem to be just worrying about workloads and form filling.
What a shower of wánkers.
I won't be trying to help them again.

Shabadu

Hagar wrote:

They seem to be just worrying about workloads and form filling.
What a shower of wánkers.
I won't be trying to help them again.

Don't let the beaurocracy stop you from doing the right thing, please. Imagine if your child was abused and someone finding the evidence on-line didn't bother to report it due to the 'bemoaning manner' the hotline used.

I'm not saying it's not annoying, but you have to do all you can you stop this. Well done for bothering to follow up and report it, a lot of people would have just deleted the e-mail.

causal

It can be annoying when you try to do the right thing and end up being made to feel that you're the problem.
Having said that think of the frustration that the people in hotline must have trying to sift through hundreds or thousands of emails every day - all the time trying to find the real important stuff - as in your case they did say thanks and that it will be investigated.
And remember that the real enemy is whoever sent the email.

I would keep the email in case it is needed in the future - it might also be worth contacting your SysAdmin or ISP to alert them.

You did the right thing - well done

causal

Hobbes

I'd tell the cops personally. Failing that the Star/Sun.

Shabadu

^^ Actually telling the Sun is not a bad idea at all, they're like hounds on the scent for tracking stories down if they sell a few more papers out of it.

RainyDay

Did you spend 2 minutes checking out hotline.ie's advice on unsolicited email?

Hagar wrote:

I thought they would get more info from the mail header than they would from me filling out an online form.

Mail headers aren't normally preserved during forwarding, unless you drag the incoming message into your mail body as an attachment, instead of just forwarding it. The online form has a slot for including the mail header information.

Hagar wrote:

warn me that I could be done for kiddie pron myself for forwarding the mail to them for examination.

Don't shoot the messenger. You may not like this advice, but the advice they give is legally correct. Why are you moaning at them for simply informing you the impacts of the relevant legislation on you?

Hagar wrote:

They seem to be just worrying about workloads and form filling.
What a shower of wánkers.

So given that their role in life is to fight child porn and given that they have a finite set of resources, do you want them to be able to investigate one email per day (when forwarded like yours), or 10 emails per day (when reported through the online form). It's simple common sense for them to be worried about workload and optimising the time they can spend on this.

Hagar wrote:

I won't be trying to help them again.

Aw Jeez man, this isn't about 'helping them' - It's about child porn - You don't 'help them' by reporting this, just as you don't help the guards when you report a drunk driver. You fix the problem. Stop sulking and keep focused on the important thing - stopping child pornography.

boidey

Feckin bureaucrats Could they possibly sound any more officious.

Hagar

Rainy Day who are you to accuse me of sulking?
I'm not a child, I'm a responsible adult trying to do something useful and finding bureaucracy (sp) making it difficult.

If they took 2 seconds to click on the link on the mail they would have known immediately whether or not kiddie pron was involved. I don't know where you get this "spend all day investigating one mail" from.

All this crap about how badly I did the report is just so much bullshít.
How many of the people who have read this thread and criticised me have come across kiddie pron but not reported it?

Rozie

Oh, I blame the gays. They should all be locked up. The liberals too. Yes.

RainyDay

Hagar wrote:

If they took 2 seconds to click on the link on the mail they would have known immediately whether or not kiddie pron was involved. I don't know where you get this "spend all day investigating one mail" from.

OK - so they take their 2 seconds, click the link, see some child porn - what happens then? That's the start, not the end. Next step is to look at email headers, which are probably not visible if you just forwarded the email straight off (i.e. didn't include the message as an attachment). If you are seriously concerned about child porn, why is it such a big deal to expect YOU to take 60 seconds to fill in the online form and let them take it from there.

Nevyn

Rozie wrote:

Oh, I blame the gays. They should all be locked up. The liberals too. Yes.

not funny Roszie,
post reported to the mod of this forum.

Hagar

I have no wish to get into a personal slagging match with anybody.
If you find me, my views or my actions offensive please feel free to add me to your ignore list.

Here is a quote from hotline.ie which Rainy Day has grown fond of quoting at me. It expalins the futility of trying to send an email as an attachment to hotline.ie

Unsolicited emails
Unfortunately, there is very little which can be done about Unsolicited Commercial Email including Adult UCE. However, let me give you some personal background on Adult UCE....

First of all, in 99.9% of the cases the email headers are forged and sending a reply to them is only sending a UCE from you to the unfortunate person whose email address was taken and only upsets an innocent party.

That is why forwarding the email is just as usefule as filling a form.
If the site can be identified by clicking on the link. Surely then follow-up action can be taken against the site host? Isn't that the object of the exercise?

Rainy Day have you ever encountered KP?
Have you ever reported it in any manner to any reponsible authority?

Talliesin

Forget hotline.ie and go to the cops.

Talliesin

Thaed wrote:

post reported to the mod of this forum.

foxinsocks doesn't seem to be around.

I'm banning Rozie for a week.

RainyDay

Hagar wrote:

Here is a quote from hotline.ie which Rainy Day has grown fond of quoting at me. It expalins the futility of trying to send an email as an attachment to hotline.ie

That is why forwarding the email is just as usefule as filling a form.
If the site can be identified by clicking on the link. Surely then follow-up action can be taken against the site host? Isn't that the object of the exercise?

You're being selective in the lines you quote. Here's some more stuff from the same page;

However, it IS possible to determine from which location (not which user, nor which address) on the Internet the email was sent. If you are able to look at the email headers you will be able to determine the IP address of the ISP who allowed the email to be sent. It is sometimes possible to send an email to the abuse@isp address to complain about the email. However, adult emails are not illegal in many jurisdictions including Ireland.

This is forwarding an email is NOT just as useful as filing in a form - because they won't get the IP address in the email headers.

Hagar wrote:

Rainy Day have you ever encountered KP?
Have you ever reported it in any manner to any reponsible authority?

I have a vague memory of emailing hotline.ie with a link to a questionable site many years ago. I recall getting some kind of acknowledgement, but I don't think I heard anything else.

But I see you're still not answering the key question - If you are genuinely as concerned about the KP as you make out, why don't you take 2 minutes out of your day to fill in the form?

Hagar

I give up. You win. Do you feel better now?