Multiple Bomb Blasts in London

Rew

spudington16 wrote:

Methinks someone dislike the taste of sour grapes and is eager to cover up to the possibility that he's wrong, perhaps? :rolleyes:

check all the websites and turn on the telly...

Home Secretary just said 4 confirmend explosions, 3 tubes and 1 bus

MT

This is a terrible and horrendous event. My thoughts are with all those that are suffering and their loved ones.

It seems that there are still some that believe the destruction of innocent lives is an acceptable way of furthering their political aims. A point we in Ireland, having experienced these sorts of actions more than most, should possibly dwell on.

danniemcq

Hobbes wrote:

Because it only had possibly the best security and most of the British police force were moved to Scotland to deal with the rioting. It would of been a perfect time to attack when there are less police services. They have also crippled the transport infrastructure of London.

what you think they care about security??? if they really wanted to hit the G8 send in a suicide squad (which this could have been). pack them with explosives and cry jihad.

bonkey

spudington16 wrote:

Methinks someone dislike the taste of sour grapes and is eager to cover up to the possibility that he's wrong, perhaps? :rolleyes:

Methinks some people are too concerned about which of them has picked the right unconfirmed reports to believe, rather than in the actual tragedy that the reports are about.

jc

growler

from a political standpoint I imagine this will have the same effect as 9/11 did in the US, Labour will now be able to pass a host of new security measures through with the acquiesence of the Tories in the name of security ( ID cards in particular spring to mind) and probably a whole lot more restrictions that will affect our civil liberties. That's completely understandable and a normal human reaction to such a tragedy, although it's likely to long term negative effects on UK society.

It won't take much for the far right to start banging their chests and getting a reaction from a wider audience than they ever could before, even more worrying.

The UK was an obvious target for a long time, I am a bit surprised given how well MI5 / 6 were at apprehending so many suspects over recent years, but they only have to get it wrong once for this to happen.


Let's hope for a measured response and sensible debate rather than a backlash.

Hobbes

danniemcq wrote:

what you think they care about security??? if they really wanted to hit the G8 send in a suicide squad (which this could have been). pack them with explosives and cry jihad.

They would be picked off before they got within distance to watch them. There is generally a few miles exclusion zone along with numerous police, riot cops, snipers, helicopters and dogs.

Rew

bonkey wrote:

Methinks some people are too concerned about which of them has picked the right unconfirmed reports to believe, rather than in the actual tragedy that the reports are about.

jc

I just dont agree with spreading details that are out of date, it helps nobody.

danniemcq

Hobbes wrote:

They would be picked off before they got within distance to watch them. There is generally a few miles exclusion zone along with numerous police, riot cops, snipers, helicopters and dogs.

not necessarily true if different areas are attacked at first all attention will be on them leaving just a core set of bodyguards and police to protect them, and you could also have the terrorists armed to the teeth after all with the funding they have they could probably get their hands on hi-tech weaponry or even just plain mortars packed with gas. It doesn't have to be a case of walking straight up to the main door

mycroft

danniemcq wrote:

what you think they care about security??? if they really wanted to hit the G8 send in a suicide squad (which this could have been). pack them with explosives and cry jihad.

And like Hobbes said die a messy death after they're shot by marksman.

The G8 summit is not a target not because they don't want to it's impossible, they're too secure, in Genoa the exclusion zone was phenominal and that was just for the blac block, anyone wandering the red zone without a pass wouldn't have made it ten foot, without being challenged and probably shot just to be on the save side.

From a terrorist point of view this is the ideal target, random, crippling a major city, and happening at the perfect time to make a wider point.

not nesseseraly true if different areas are attacked at first all attention will be on them leaving just a core set of bodygaurds and police to protect them, and you could also have the terrorosts armed to the teeth after all with the funding they have they could probably get their hands on hi-tech weaponary or even just plain morters packed with gas. it doesn't have to be a case of walking straight up to the main door

Damien, seriously stop with the Andy Mc Nab delusions. You're talking about thousands of police, thats, before you hit the special forces, and security services. You really think you'll get a couple of hundred Al Q terrorists to blend innocously with anti globalisation protestors, hiding serious fire power and then launch some absurd assault on gleneagles?

Utterly farcial.

It'd be sucide on a mass scale, and would destroy Al Q, why would they do that if they can cripple a major business center with a few martyrs and some C4.

My opinion of you is plummeting.

Rew wrote:

I just dont agree with spreading details that are out of date, it helps nobody.

Yeah, you're just assuming, you've not got any concrete sources to support your claims, you're picking one, and dismissing others, despite both having the same degree of credibility.

Rew

LOL, watching a few too many movies I reckon...

dathi1

"The Secret Jihad Group of al Quida" in Europe has claimed responsibility.
Tragic and Terrible though this event is...is anybody really surprised by this??? I'm surprised it took so long.

Rew

mycroft wrote:

Yeah, you're just assuming, you've not got any concrete sources to support your claims, you're picking one, and dismissing others, despite both having the same degree of credibility.

Actually I went with what they were all saying at the time not one. Not to mention I would always consider the police commissioner and home secretary more credible then sky news etc.

dearg_doom

PHB wrote:

I love that attitude, he doesn't agree with me, thus inturn he is ignorant.

spudington16 wrote:

Methinks someone dislike the taste of sour grapes and is eager to cover up to the possibility that he's wrong, perhaps? :rolleyes:

FFS Lads, jeez, I know this is the interweb, and that we are all men with egos as big as our knobs, but this one-upmanship bollocks has to stop!

I didn't set out to imply ignorance at all. Rew seemed to only want to post the facts that he had heard confirmed and not speculation, which were proved right.

Nothing anyone says here is a personal attack surely? I know my post wasn't, I was just spreading info. There's no need to get all offended and defensive.

danniemcq

mycroft wrote:

From a terrorist point of view this is the ideal target, random, crippling a major city, and happening at the perfect time to make a wider point. You're talking about thousands of police, thats, before you hit the special forces, and security services. You really think you'll get a couple of hundred Al Q terrorists to blend innocously with anti globalisation protestors, hiding serious fire power and then launch some absurd assault on gleneagles?

i never said the G8 was a target. i agree with you (yes i know a shocking statement for a politics thread!) when you say it'd be a damn impossible job but don't feel there would be no need for hundreds of terrorists as yes that would be an unrecoverable blow, a small hardcore group would probably work better. long range attacks etc

oscarBravo

There goes my weekend in London - I have a ticket for a flight to Gatwick this evening. Still, I suppose it's better than having flown there yesterday and being on a tube this morning...

I was quite worried when I couldn't reach my brother this morning. He usually answers his landline, and the mobile networks are knackered. Got in touch with him though - he's ok.

bonkey

danniemcq wrote:

long range attacks etc

You're still dreaming.

You do know that there's an 8km exclusion zone?

Look at "long-range" attacks in the likes of Baghdad. Mortars from maybe a klick or two away, which are doing well to land in the compound they're aimed at, let alone being accurate enough to actually target individuals. Thats it.

Gleneagles would be 10x the range, requiring god-knows how much more accuracy and/or destructive power to achieve anythnig, and thats uignoring how you're gonna get your hardware and team in place with the securtity outside the exclusion zone.

Seriously...its ridiculous. This is the real world, in 2005.

jc

bonkey

oscarBravo wrote:

Got in touch with him though - he's ok.

Good to hear.

mycroft

danniemcq wrote:

i never said the G8 was a target.

Yes You did

if they really wanted to hit the G8 send in a suicide squad

i agree with you (yes i know a shocking statement for a politics thread!) when you say it'd be a damn impossible job but don't feel there would be no need for hundreds of terrorists as yes that would be an unrecoverable blow, a small hardcore group would probably work better. long range attacks etc

Again, lunacy.

Ever been to a G8 summit? No?

Well I have. The police, miltary presence is staggering, phenominal, "a small hardcore group" FFS mowed down in seconds. Chem or Biological? The secret service plan for that kind of eventuality.

When you're taking exclusion zone you're talking the finest snipers on the planet with a shoot first ask questions later carte blanché. What get, a "small hardcore group, within range, set up, find their range and pop off some shells"? before they're riddled is just nonsense, utter, utter nonsense.

Again you've been playing a tad too much splinter cell, you're in dream land.

Kingsize

911 was aparently orchestrated by 15 men armed only with craft knives

jank

mycroft wrote:

Yes You did

Again, lunacy.

Ever been to a G8 summit? No?

Well I have. The police, miltary presence is staggering, phenominal, "a small hardcore group" FFS mowed down in seconds. Chem or Biological? The secret service plan for that kind of eventuality.

When you're taking exclusion zone you're talking the finest snipers on the planet with a shoot first ask questions later carte blanché. What get, a "small hardcore group, within range, set up, find their range and pop off some shells"? before they're riddled is just nonsense, utter, utter nonsense.

Again you've been playing a tad too much splinter cell, you're in dream land.

My knob is bigger than your knob! :rolleyes:

Villain

It's too early to discuss the political fallout from this, however I think the little support that Blair had for the war on Iraq will fall very quickly now.

If suicide bombers begin to attack the UK it could get very vert serious.

I fear the Muslim community in the UK could come under attack as a result of this.

As I said it really is too early to discuss the political issues, while people are fighting for their lives.

sceptre

Jank, if you'd like to continue posting here after a comment like that you might want want to pretend you're older than four in the future.

mycroft

Kingsize wrote:

911 was aparently orchestrated by 15 men armed only with craft knives

And the planes weren't surrouned by a couple of armies and a massive exclusion zone. Try attacking the G8 summit with some bread knifes.

My knob is bigger than your knob!

Thank you for the intelligent contribution to the debate

Kingsize

8km is fukk all of an exclusion zone to a jetplane on full throttle & intent on crashing

dathi1

It's too early to discuss the political fallout from this, however I think the little support that Blair had for the war on Iraq will fall very quickly now.

I don't know about this. The Brits tend to put on the stiff upper lip when under siege and get very militaristic when stuff like this happens. We've seen it albeit on a smaller scale in the past with the provos etc. Aznar made a mess of it in Spain when he tried to capitalise extra votes on the Madrid train bombings by blaming them on ETA. It all depends on how the Blair media machine works over the next few hours. They will have to keep Bush miles away...he's on the "this is what the war on terror is all about" scenario. www.cnn.com If Blair joins him on this it may have the opposite effect.

mycroft

Kingsize wrote:

8km is **** all of an exclusion zone to a jetplane on full throttle & intent on crashing

And again for those of us new to the game, even before Sept 11th (genoa) SAM sites, constant fighter aircraft patrols and an air exclusion zone are standard for a G8 summit.

Kingsize

i agree with you mycroft but i was just making the point that nothing is 100% safe.
Post 911 I never wouldve imagined that some goon dressed as osama bin laden could get within stabbing distance of the future king of england.Or that some twats would gain acces to the main chamber of the houses of parliament.

But they did

jank

Sorry spectre just too many wanna be SAS agents on here talking ****e and turning this thread into a testosterone filled self indulgent spiel.

What happened today is appaling but im surprised it didnt happen sooner as London was always a top target for AQ or other terrorist organisations.

May all those who died RIP*



*At least someone says it

Orizio

It seems strange that they didn't attack before London got the go ahead for the 2012 olmypics.

Anyway this bares very few hallmarks of a RIRA attack or of an Al-Qaeda attack.Lets remember here that al-Qaeda as we knew it,is pretty much destroyed.It was always a small centralised group,and since 9/11 funding,communications and man power have been significantly reduced.While the Tabloids will put this on OBL,its highly unlikely imo that he had anything to do with this.Near impossible really.

Sand

It seems strange that they didn't attack before London got the go ahead for the 2012 olmypics.

Why? Does Al Queda suddenly care about the Olympics? They care as much as they care about taking focus away from trying to solve Africas debt.

That said, its looking like a terrible atrocity but I wouldnt be surprised if it was committed by a local cell inspired by Al Queda rather than the actual group itself, which is somewhat disrupted by the events in Afghanistan. I was struck by the fact that there didnt appear to be secondary bombs in the stations to catch people fleeing the first explosions which was the case in Madrid. And the bus bombing - I guess that was a case of a premature explosion, much like what happened to the IRA guy a few years back. I cant see any terrorist viewing a bus as "spectacular" enough to be a target.

The fall out from this will probably stiffen British resolve to stay in Iraq. I cant see the Sun doing anything other than invoking memories of the Blitz and taking on the Luftwaffe - Any anger is most likely to be directed against the terrorists - so far Blair seems to have handled it well.

If it turns out to have been some local cell of 2nd generation British or recent immigrants I can see them deporting anyone even slightly dodgy - the British public opinion wasnt keen on immigration prior to this, if its linked back to this then things will get an awful lot stricter.

And the ID cards will probably be easier to sell in the aftermath of this attack.

I guess therell be one guy wholl be twice as upset as anyone else over this. Last Saturday in the Irish Times some columnist was writing that public opinion was changing against the Iraq war, that people were accepting there was no threat to them from terrorists, and he hoped that there was no attacks from terrorists in the US or Euope that might change their minds back. Its settled now, there is a threat.

And if anyone thinks these attacks are due to British involvement in Iraq, police broke up a cell attempting to do a similar job to the Paris metro not so long ago. The French, who if anything are hopelessly anti-american. Didnt do them any favours.