Privacy invasion

nobodythere

KnowItAll wrote:

Because they are the ones who are bombing everywhere at the moment. When other groups start doing it, watch them.

No they are just an umbrella scapegoat when you're not sure who to blame...
An important point of this is that it has very little to do with terrorism - you can't stop a guy from walking on a train and blowing himself up - that would take an insane amount of monitoring and destruction of fundamental civil liberties...

Weapons technology has eroded the right to privacy...

rsynnott

kasintahan wrote:

Off Topic - I would have said Soviet, but my sig is Romanian. Marxist was as close a parallel as I could draw.

Ah, yep (silly me). Stalinist would be closer to the mark, IMO.

SparkyLarks

People complain about records being held.

I wish that govt departmetns all had access to a central database on me.
It would make life so much easier if the revenue comissioners had access to my hospital records so I didn't have to keep all my recipts all year. ther is so often I'm dealing with one dept or another wishing why can't all this info be on a register

If by monitering my phone calls and internet connection, along with everybody elses, heps to catch criminals, terrorists, pedeofiles, drug dealers ect then I'm all for it.

If you don't want society keeping tabs on you, go off to a secluded wilderness somewhere. If you want to live with other people it is essential that you forgo some of your rights. i.e the right to shout your head off at 2 in the morning.

Up untill this centurary everybody was kept tabs on. Living in small communities people knew everything about everybody else. Who was a con artist, who was responsible, who had a temper ect. The guy sitting next to you at work might have been in jail for randomally atacking his co-workers. You should know that type of information

The guy in the apartment above you might be a rocker who plays loud music all the time. We don;t know the people we live with any more. The girl you going out wil might have had 3 husbands before and cheeted on them all, or all of them may have died in mysterious circumstances.

We now live with strangers, people we don't know.
Glases are currently being developed that can perform face recognision and then display the name of the person on the street. The idea is that in the future you could walk down the street and whoever your looked at, their name would apear on the inside of you glases. In the future that could be expanded and you could find out what other people think about the person your looking at.

Apart from the obvious benifits of finding out if the hot person across from you is single or not,( and what drink she likes) this would mean the world would truly become a global village again

People would be forced to live with the consequences of their actions. their past would follow them around.

rsynnott

That's all very well, as long as you assume that everyone in the world is ethical. If not... you're in trouble.

SparkyLarks wrote:

Apart from the obvious benifits of finding out if the hot person across from you is single or not,( and what drink she likes) this would mean the world would truly become a global village again

And creepy stalker enablement is not, IMO, a good thing.

Hobbes

SparkyLarks wrote:

If by monitering my phone calls and internet connection, along with everybody elses, heps to catch criminals, terrorists, pedeofiles, drug dealers ect then I'm all for it.

Read up on J.Edgar Hoover. He is a good example of why such information should have checks and balances and not freely available as made out by you.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/J._Edgar_Hoover

Long and short of it, he had files on everyone of importance and used those files to stay in power and ensure that the *wrong* people didn't get into power. Sure thats fine if you will never amount to much in life, but you don't appreciate how dangerous this is until your a victim of it.

BuffyBot

If by monitering my phone calls and internet connection, along with everybody elses, heps to catch criminals, terrorists, pedeofiles, drug dealers ect then I'm all for it.

If you don't want society keeping tabs on you, go off to a secluded wilderness somewhere. If you want to live with other people it is essential that you forgo some of your rights. i.e the right to shout your head off at 2 in the morning.

Well there you have it. What exactly is the acceptable balance? How much monitoring is ok. Do you want the government to be able to read your personal communications. Would it be ok if they opened your post? Listened in live to your telephone calls?

People shouldn't have to go to the wilderness to have privacy. Privacy is a fundemental right that everyone is entitled to, everywhere. This blanket record keeping is nothing but an impractical knee jerk reaction on behalf of the governments involved.

ressem

As long as access is secure and requires a court order, that is fine.

After the bombing the ISPs in the UK got a form mail from the national high tech crime unit that day asking that
content of servers (email/sms/mms/voicemail) and logs be preserved, with an addendum saying that data is exempt from the 1st Data Protection Principle, if it is processed for the purpose of prevention and detection of crime or the apprehension and prosecution of offenders.
(section 29(1) Data Protection act 1998)

So for example some UK universities warn that they will turn over data on submission of a standard form from the police stating subject and reason based on this section.

Red Alert

My private e-mails are not for the eyes of the government (nor Microsoft or advertising companies) to read. Will an post have to open every letter, photocopy the contents, reseal and send on as well???

Gurgle

Red Alert wrote:

My private e-mails are not for the eyes of the government (nor Microsoft or advertising companies) to read.

Ha!
You used the words 'private' and 'e-mail' in the same sentence.

re. The original point, the government cannot (officially) access your phone records without a court order. To get a court order, the gardai have to have evidence that you were (or are) involved in a crime.

Sparks

Gurgle wrote:

re. The original point, the government cannot (officially) access your phone records without a court order. To get a court order, the gardai have to have evidence that you were (or are) involved in a crime.

Sean Doherty mean anything to you?

Wheely

Just to add, Im completely opposed to any erosion of civil liberties especially our constitutional right to privacy which i beleive is one of the most sacred. However I dont know enough about what in the name of god the OP is talking about so therefore i cant comment. You cant just say "ise the govt is keeping info on us for 3 years" what does that even mean...its ridiculous!!! If he could elaborate maybe we could have some sort of coherent discussion. I expext ill be fobbed off with a " i dont feel like going in to it thanks..." talk about a cop-out!!! And seriously (this is to the OP also) you dont think much of Irish people who converted to Islam???? COME ON!!! What did they convert from...."Irishness"??? You cant convert from a nationality to a religion!!!!

nobodythere

SparkyLarks wrote:

We now live with strangers, people we don't know.
Glases are currently being developed that can perform face recognision and then display the name of the person on the street. The idea is that in the future you could walk down the street and whoever your looked at, their name would apear on the inside of you glases. In the future that could be expanded and you could find out what other people think about the person your looking at.

Ideas like that make me glad that oil is sky-rocketing and the technology age is going down the shítter

tim3115

Agree with the people in power statement, not trusting them etc. We need a strong leader, voice for the nation, not some woman walking around shaking hands. Someone to be held accountable for.


Anyways, I read that the Government is keeping a close eye on 24 Israeli extremists. Why are they still here? Why were they let in to this country in the first place?

rsynnott

grasshopa wrote:

Ideas like that make me glad that oil is sky-rocketing and the technology age is going down the shítter

Yes, oil is rocketing in cost, and getting rarer; it will be replaced by ideally nuclear fusion, more realistically nuclear fission, or (hopefully not) coal. The "technology age" is not dependant on oil.

Hobbes

tim3115 wrote:

Anyways, I read that the Government is keeping a close eye on 24 Israeli extremists. Why are they still here? Why were they let in to this country in the first place?

Linkage to story please.

Kare Bear

Anyways, I read that the Government is keeping a close eye on 24 Israeli extremists. Why are they still here? Why were they let in to this country in the first place?

What the hell do they want.Should never let Israelis into the country.:mad:

Gurgle

Sparks wrote:

Sean Doherty mean anything to you?

Tapping phones for political gain is and was illegal.

Sparks

Gurgle wrote:

Tapping phones for political gain is and was illegal.

Still happened though, didn't it?
Me, I'd rather not be the dead body on the side of the road whose owner knew that the truck driver was driving illegally when he failed to stop and hit me...

Red Alert

Suppose a private company gets the task of collating all this data, what's to stop them matching it up with your CIE Travelcard, your Superclub/Tesco Card, your Library Card. Looks like the thought police to me.

Hobbes

Somewhat funny flash on it.. http://www.aclu.org/pizza/

Taking it to the extreme though but is getting the general message across.

Snickers Man

rsynnott wrote:

"I am not a RACIALIST, but, and zis is a BIG BUT, de National Botialist Party says...."

Wow. You're o-o-l-l-d-d!!!!

Not many people here would remember the North Minehead by election.

jman0

rsynnott wrote:

Yes, oil is rocketing in cost, and getting rarer; it will be replaced by ideally nuclear fusion, more realistically nuclear fission, or (hopefully not) coal. The "technology age" is not dependant on oil.

Not quite that simple rsynnott. It's called Energy Returned for Energy Invested. And nuclear power is not all it's cracked up to be. The amount of energy (currently entirely fossil fuel based) that goes into the construction and operation of the reactor, and necessary building materials outweighs the energy return we get from it.

nobodythere

rsynnott wrote:

Yes, oil is rocketing in cost, and getting rarer; it will be replaced by ideally nuclear fusion, more realistically nuclear fission, or (hopefully not) coal. The "technology age" is not dependant on oil.

Millions of cars don't run on nuclear fusion, but I suppose you might have a point about technology...

nobodythere

Kare Bear wrote:

What the hell do they want.Should never let Israelis into the country.:mad:

It's interesting to observe the racist psychology that makes everyone so vulnerable to government rallying. The Nazi's did it well...

tim3115

Hobbes wrote:

Linkage to story please.

Don't see anything on the internet, read it on the newspaper - from Monday possibly. Irish Independent, check it out. You'll love it.

Hobbes

tim3115 wrote:

Don't see anything on the internet, read it on the newspaper - from Monday possibly. Irish Independent, check it out. You'll love it.

So you are telling me that only one newspaper in the whole world reported the story?

tim3115

I'm telling you I read it in the Irish Independent.

pete

tim3115 wrote:

Anyways, I read that the Government is keeping a close eye on 24 Israeli extremists. Why are they still here? Why were they let in to this country in the first place?

tim3115 wrote:

Don't see anything on the internet, read it on the newspaper - from Monday possibly. Irish Independent, check it out. You'll love it.

From monday's irish independent letters page:

Sir - Having just returned from London, scene of the disgraceful suicide bombings by Islamic fanatics, I see that authorities this side of the water are monitoring the activities of 24 Islamists suspected of terrorist activities.

israeli / islamic sure what's the difference - they're all foriegners and shouldn'd be let into the country, right?

tim3115

I obviously meant Islamic. Apologies, since the paper wasn't there in front of my eyes.


As for the foreigner statement : It's not like Pete to sidetrack now is it?

pete

tim3115 wrote:

As for the foreigner statement : It's not like Pete to sidetrack now is it?

eh?

tim3115 wrote:

Why were they let in to this country in the first place?