Why some people shouldnt be allowed own BMWs

aodh_rua

Speaking of crimes against BMW's - I saw an '05 320ci yesterday and the muppet owner had stuck BMW across the front windscreen. Why would anyone do such a thing

Dades

causal wrote:

Nowadays, BMWs are as common as muck - and imho so are many of the recent owners.
Hoardes of slaves to the marketing image trying to buy some 'class' - but they've simply devalued the marque.

Touché!

You never see a thread called "Why some people shouldn't be allowed own Fiat Puntos"... and there's LESS of them on the road. What's the difference?

AMurphy wrote:

The "M" tag. If I owned an "M" in ROI, I'd remove it and replace it with the extreme opposite tag

And if I got a puppy I'd walk it every day

causal

The Atheist wrote:

Touché!

You never see a thread called "Why some people shouldn't be allowed own Fiat Puntos"... and there's LESS of them on the road. What's the difference?

What do you think the difference is?

causal

ds20prefecture

causal wrote:

What do you think the difference is?

causal

Oooh! Oooh! I know!

Is it because Fiat Punto drivers don't disappear up their own arse when they buy the car?

Or perhaps because Punto drivers have bought a decent car for a grand or so less than the average price for the class, and therefore don't feel it is superior to "lesser" cars? BMW owners, conversely, have bought a decent car for several thousand more than the average (even though the BMW is the average )

Or because "EVERYBODY KNOWS" that puntos are crap and BMWs are great? Someone in the trade told me, so it has to be true. I mean, if you can't trust the motor trade, who can you trust ? ......

cormie

Could someone post a link to pic of a pre modified car the same as in the original post please?

kdevitt

cormie wrote:

Could someone post a link to pic of a pre modified car the same as in the original post please?

Would look like this

The original one looks daft because of the third exhaust , I'm not a fan of the clear lights , tints or the wheels, its tacky but its hardly over the top...

Dagon

"puntos are crap and BMWs are great? Someone in the trade told me, so it has to be true"

Nope. No need for anyone to say anything, just look at the stats and you'll see that Fiats are terrible, or just buy one and experience it for yourself (I know many people who have). BMW's are good cars, but being European, they are obviously not going to be anywhere near as good as Japanses.

By the way, the car in the original post looks fine! It may be a bit silly sticking on a fake M3 badge and big exhaust (I wouldn't do it), but other than that it looks like a nice car, whatever floats the boat and all that...

HashSlinging

cormie wrote:

As someone who doesn't have a clue about cars in general and I don't know my M's from my E's or whatever you're all talking about, I think it looks nice. I wouldn't know whats modded and what's not on it but overall, I think it looks very nice. Is there a picture of the way it's supposed to be anywhere? Maybe I'm just comparing it to my Micra but I think it looks nice. And I'd choose it any day over my Micra!

ME TOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

navi_5445

See above for proper location of model number. No way that's a 328. The triple exhaust is worthy of an entry in BMW Nightmares

cormie

Thanks Kdevitt, I can honestly say I'd choose the one in the first post over the one you posted. I just think it looks nicer, simple as that. If they are the exact same car. In saying that though, now that I know owning it would make me look like an idiot to allot of BMW heads, I may think twice, but I definitely think from a point of visuals only, the top one looks much nicer.

cormie

navi_5445 wrote:

BMW Nightmares

Now they look ridiculous! :rolleyes:

ds20prefecture

Dagon wrote:

"puntos are crap and BMWs are great? Someone in the trade told me, so it has to be true"

Nope. No need for anyone to say anything, just look at the stats and you'll see that Fiats are terrible, or just buy one and experience it for yourself (I know many people who have).

OK I know were way OT here, but please point me to the stats. I know of many people who have put large mileages on various Fiats with absolutely no problems whatsoever. But this proves nothing, brands are just that - names attached to reputations. Some reputations are deserved, like Honda, some are not, like Alfa.

I think most BMW owners buy a brand. Most Punto drivers buy a car.

ds20prefecture

cormie wrote:

In saying that though, now that I know owning it would make me look like an idiot to allot of BMW heads, I may think twice, but I definitely think from a point of visuals only, the top one looks much nicer.

So you'd change you own preference based on the opinion of a bunch of marketing victims?

kdevitt

ds20prefecture wrote:

Some reputations are deserved, like Honda, some are not, like Alfa.

I think most BMW owners buy a brand. Most Punto drivers buy a car.

Sorry - but thats BS - check the JDPower survey, published every year - only luxury brand ahead of BMW is Lexus. Alfa came last, Fiat second last

cormie

ds20prefecture wrote:

So you'd change you own preference based on the opinion of a bunch of marketing victims?

Well I wouldn't really want my car and reg being posted on a site for public mockery

As I say, I'm basing it purely on visual. If I was to choose between the two cars, visually I would go for the top one. Nicer colour nice windows, nice alloys and the spoiler does look quite well too. I wouldn't care for a fake badge to make it look like something else. Even if it had lada or Fiat (;)) on the back I'd still think it's nicer. If the post didn't say it and if the cars didn't have the badges, I wouldn't be able to tell what cars they were anyway. I'd say most people would choose the first one if they had the same car/brand knowledge as me.

kdevitt

cormie wrote:

I'd say most people would choose the first one if they had the same car/brand knowledge as me.

Would you have three exhausts on the back???

causal

kdevitt wrote:

Sorry - but thats BS - check the JDPower survey, published every year - only luxury brand ahead of BMW is Lexus. Alfa came last, Fiat second last

So let's put Skoda in place of Punto in his statement:

I think most BMW owners buy a brand. Most Skoda drivers buy a car.

causal

cormie

well i really wouldn't care if it had 3 or two, I don't think the 3 look terrible or anything and I have no clue what the techinical aspects of having 3 over one or two is anyway. I wouldn't choose one over the other because the exausts.

kdevitt

causal wrote:

So let's put Skoda in place of Punto in his statement:

I think most BMW owners buy a brand. Most Skoda drivers buy a car.

causal

Skoda aren't a luxury brand, and they don't drive like a BMW...

I think you don't have a clue

ds20prefecture

kdevitt wrote:

Sorry - but thats BS - check the JDPower survey, published every year - only luxury brand ahead of BMW is Lexus. Alfa came last, Fiat second last

What is BS? I never said BMWs were crap - that would be plain stupid. They are fine cars, with mostly good engines, nice handling characteristics and very good build quality. The 3 is a little cramped, a little bland and a little sparsely equipped. They are very much overpriced, which you'd hope would lend them a little exclusivity.

The way some BMW owners go on, you'd swear their 316i was a one of a kind, hewn from solid gold, blessed by Jebus himself and never ever ever has anything go wrong with it.

My point is that brands are stronger than product when it comes to selling cars, which I think is a shame. BMW have probably the best brand out there, and to be fair some pretty strong product to go with it. But the premium charged has failed to protect the brand: if everybody is willing to pay it, the brand will suffer even if the company doesn't. BMW's profits are staggering - they launched a completely new model range in the last 3 years with only a small dip in profit. Unbelievable for such a relative minnow in terms of overall size.

Personally I'd prefer the product to speak for itself, without the carefully crafted image - nice to see Škoda number 2.

Regarding Alfa and Fiat at the bottom of the ownership satisfaction survey - I blame the dealers, not the product. I have met very very few alfa drivers who don't love their cars. I've met even fewer who would rate their dealers.

causal

kdevitt wrote:

Skoda aren't a luxury brand, and they don't drive like a BMW...

I think you don't have a clue

You're thinking is flawed.
What luxury does a BMW have that a Skoda doesn't for similarly priced cars?

causal

ds20prefecture

kdevitt wrote:

Skoda aren't a luxury brand, and they don't drive like a BMW...

Excellent - I'll have a Škoda so.

Say you were buying new, you'd be willing to pay €44,500 for a base 320d versus €29000 for a loaded Octavia 2.0TDi so that you could say you drive a luxury brand?

This is the definition of a marketing victim.

The Octavia is more spacious, more comfortable, more economical and has more goodies.

The BMW has excellent handling (but the ride is a little firm) and a marginally stronger engine.

Both are fairly bland cars, but one has the image of "sports saloon" to live up to - which it clearly does not. It's a 4 cylinder diesel for chrissakes.
Both have excellent reliability records.

But with the money you save buying a Škoda, you could also buy this

kdevitt

You said that Alfa don't deserve their reputation - they blatently do. They're rated appalingly in quality for mechanical reliability, interior and exterior quality, as well as the aforementioned dealer service and ownership costs.

You also said that BMW owners have simply purchase a brand - which is true of some people, but they'd be a minority (I'd reserve that accolade for Porsche Cayenne owners), most buy the car because is consistently rated by the motoring press at the top of its class or thereabouts, for its range of award winnings engines, handling , looks and build quality (do I sound like an advert yet?)

Yes, Skodas are fantastic cars, have recommended them to plenty of people who were considering a Golf or Passat - the Fabia and Octavia both made the top 3 in their class (Octavia came first in the family section) - neither of which are in the same sector as the 3 or 5 series.

Anyhoo, you asked to be pointed to the stats and they're there in black and white... and revised every year!

Keyzer

ds20prefecture wrote:

Excellent - I'll have a Škoda so.

Say you were buying new, you'd be willing to pay €44,500 for a base 320d versus €29000 for a loaded Octavia 2.0TDi so that you could say you drive a luxury brand?

This is the definition of a marketing victim.

Typical stuff... Too many flash harry's in this country driving BMW's.
These people think that if you drive a BMW you will be perceived as wealthy, successful and you have a great job.
On the other hand, people who know cars will know that that BMW is getting blander by the model, and they are boring. The new M5 is horrible looking for example, but it when you hit the M button its supposed to turn into an absolute beast of a car.

Having said that, I would go for the Skoda Octavia purely because I know they are good cars from experience. Press the S button on the dash and it automatically saves you a fortune.

alias no.9

The numbers of 3 series on the roads certainly dilute the brand. There are too many people swallowing the marketing line thinking they're getting the 'ultimate driving machine' but an ultimate driving machine does not come with just 4 cylinders and anyone who springs for an 'M' pack on their 316i or 318i ahead of spending the money on a 6 cylinder model does not know what to do with an 'ultimate driving machine' except pose.

kdevitt

ds20prefecture wrote:

Say you were buying new, you'd be willing to pay €44,500 for a base 320d versus €29000 for a loaded Octavia 2.0TDi so that you could say you drive a luxury brand?

I'd take the Skoda as well.... but if it were a choice between the new Skoda and a two/three year old fully loaded 320d I'd take the BMW...

ds20prefecture

kdevitt wrote:

Yes, Skodas are fantastic cars, have recommended them to plenty of people who were considering a Golf or Passat - the Fabia and Octavia both made the top 3 in their class (Octavia came first in the family section) - neither of which are in the same sector as the 3 or 5 series.

Sigh. This is that superiority complex I was talking of earlier.

The Octavia is firmly in the same class as half of the 3-series range. The remainder of the range are large engined variants, which account for a small percentage of sales. Like the car in the original post (remember that?) some BMW owners associate themselves with these halo models. I reckon this is why BMWs look so alike - The owner of a 316i identifies himself with the owner of the M3, or even the M5, because they share the same kidneys and Hoffmeister kink. BMW, to their credit, have used the massive profits these victims provide to produce some pretty special cars - the M5 is a bit of a bargain if you can get by the badge, and I am a huge fan of the old Z1.

You said that Alfa don't deserve their reputation - they blatently do

If you read the threads elsewhere in this forum, it would seem that Alfa owners are almost as rabid in praise of their cars as BMW owners. I stand by my statement that I have met very few Alfa owners who were dissatisfied with their car, but many who were dissatisfied with their dealers. I myself had no problem with my Alfa. But this is OT, and has been covered extensively elsewhere.

You can have the last word now, I'm tired of this.

528i

This thread is laughable, why are you people comparing nasty econoboxes and cheap Italian crap like untos and alfas to a luxury prestige marque ? Don't you know anything about cars, next thing you'll be equating your sad little scoda fabia\polo\[insert ridiculous little item here] to a Mercedes S-class or a maybach in an effort to feel good about yourselves.

I think most BMW owners buy a brand. Most Punto drivers buy a car.

The reality of course, is that most punto drivers cannot afford the BMW, but would give their left testie for the chance to even polish the finely sculpted lines of a bavarian masterpiece.

The rancorous mindset and half-witted perspicacity from a despicable proletariat raise'th its ugly head once more.

Dades

528i wrote:

The reality of course, is that most punto drivers cannot afford the BMW, but would give their left testie for the chance to even polish the finely sculpted lines of a bavarian masterpiece.

Now these are the finely sculpted lines of a bavarian masterpiece...



And no, driving a BMW won't get you one.

Cyrus

kdevitt wrote:

You said that Alfa don't deserve their reputation - they blatently do. They're rated appalingly in quality for mechanical reliability, interior and exterior quality, as well as the aforementioned dealer service and ownership costs.

Can you point me to where alfas are rated appallingly for interior and exterior quality? the 156 has a nice interior, a lot more character than a 3 series has (ive driven both), the 166 has a fabulous interior, the 147 is the best in its class

Alfas can have mechanical gremlins, so can most VAG cars and plenty of BMWs its a bit blown out of proportion tho base don cars released 20 years ago,

have you ever driven a 156? i doubt it

528i wrote:

This thread is laughable, why are you people comparing nasty econoboxes and cheap Italian crap like untos and alfas to a luxury prestige marque ? Don't you know anything about cars, next thing you'll be equating your sad little scoda fabia\polo\[insert ridiculous little item here] to a Mercedes S-class or a maybach in an effort to feel good about yourselves.

Alfas are cheap now? BMW luxury? not if you have a base 316i buddy? Do you really think having an M5 makes you the envy of everyone here? is that all you worry about?

Anyway get a 911 its a proper sports car