Is it really uncool to support Fianna Fail

Board@Work

I was on the Fianna Fail website and found their main aims and objectives:

To secure in peace and agreement the unity of Ireland and its people. To develop a distinctive national life in accordance with the diverse traditions and ideals of the Irish people as part of a broader European culture, and to restore and promote the Irish language as a living language of the people.

To guarantee religious and civil liberty, and equal rights, equal treatment and equal opportunities for all the people of Ireland.

To develop the resources and wealth of Ireland to their full potential, while making them subservient to the needs and welfare of all the people of Ireland, so as to provide the maximum sustainable employment, based on fostering a spirit of enterprise and self-reliance and on social partnership.

To protect the natural environment and heritage of Ireland and to ensure a balance between town and country and between the regions, and to maintain as many families as practicable on the land.

To promote the family, and a wider sense of social responsibility, and to uphold the rule of law in the interests of the welfare and safety of the public.

To maintain the status of Ireland as a sovereign state, as a full member of the European Union and the United Nations, contributing to peace, disarmament and development on the basis of Ireland's independent foreign policy tradition.

To reform the laws and institutions of State, to make them efficient, humane, caring and responsive to the needs of the citizens.


I find myself broadly agreeing with all of these. Does that now mean that i will vote for them yet never admit it?

AngelofFire

Yes but what Fianna Fail say and what Fianna Fail do are two completely different things. In their 2002 manifesto they promised to provide 200,000 extra medical cards, since then tens of thousands of medical cards have been withdrawn, they also promised to end hospital waiting lists within two years they still havnt delivered, they also promised to reduce levels of consistent poverty to less than 2% but it currently stands at 10% , not to mention their promise that only 80% of taxpayers will pay tax at the standard rate, today only 35% percent of taxpayers pay at the standard rate.

aidan_walsh

Ah, but the difference there is that their political promises have to be specific. Their manifest, as published above, can be as generic and vague as they like.

Board@Work

The same could be said say for Fianna Gael. Who unlike Fianna Fail, Labour, Greens and SF don't seem to have an 'ethos'. Or is that just how it appears.

rsynnott

Board@Work wrote:

To guarantee religious and civil liberty, and equal rights, equal treatment and equal opportunities for all the people of Ireland.

They certainly haven't kept to this one lately; they've damaged the equality acts and put gay civil unions on an indefinite waiting list.

And their thing about the needs and welfare of all the people of Ireland? Been in a hospital lately?

Their major priority seems to be to avoid raising the high-band income tax, which would upset their support base.

Dreamcatcher

**** whether it's "cool" or not! It's just plain wrong. Simple as. End of.
Sheesh! Some people!

Victor

Board@Work wrote:

To protect the natural environment

tee hee hee, remind me just how many issues the EU commission is bringing up with the government?

cyclopath2001

Fianna Fail's 'strategic cycle network' could be a metaphor for all government projects. The end-product ignores the needs of the cyclists it was supposed to help.

How many projects have there been where the outcome is so much at variance with the stated goals?

E-Voting, PULSE, Toll roads, the port tunnel, decentralisation....

aodh_rua

Board@Work wrote:

The same could be said say for Fianna Gael. Who unlike Fianna Fail, Labour, Greens and SF don't seem to have an 'ethos'. Or is that just how it appears.

First it's Fine Gael not Fianna Gael.

Fine Gael have got an ethos based around integrity and the national interest that has served the country well from the establishment of the state, through the declaration of the republic, negotiating our entry to the EEC and on to the Tallaght Strategy.

FineGael wrote:

Fine Gael is a party of the progressive centre.

That means we act in a way that is right for Ireland, regardless of dogma or ideology. Fine Gael bases its policies and its ideas for the future of Ireland on its core beliefs.

Equality of opportunity

Fine Gael wants to create a fair and caring society where everybody is engaged in democracy, and where there are no barriers to equal opportunity. Fine Gael stands for investment in our public services and sees health and education as rights, not privileges.

Enterprise and Reward

Fine Gael encourages initiative, innovation, investment and self-reliance. The Party also believes in preserving, enhancing and sharing prosperity. Fine Gael stands for a vibrant, competitive economy. To that end, we believe Government policy should encourage initiative and reward hard work, thus driving economic activity and creating jobs.

Security

Fine Gael wants to build a safe society in Ireland by protecting citizens and enforcing the law. The Party also believes in strengthening families, in all their modern forms, and in fostering communities. Fine Gael stands
for law and order. We believe in tough sentences for criminals and more Gardaí on the beat while also tackling the root causes of crime like poverty and educational disadvantage.

Integrity

Fine Gael believes in being truthful and courageous in what we do, and in promoting and upholding both the rights and the responsibilities of people. Fine Gael stands for integrity in public life. We believe in ensuring all of us live up to our responsibilities as well as enjoying our rights as Irish men and women.

Hope

Fine Gael wants to build an Ireland of excellence and ambition. We hope to do this by promoting a shared vision of a confident and sustainable future for Ireland, both at home and abroad. Fine Gael stands for a climate of hope. To achieve this, we believe in enhancing Ireland's international reputation through our support for the European Union, protecting communities through balanced regional development and safeguarding our children's future through protection of the environment.

netwhizkid

Supporting Fianna Fail or its associates, the PDs and the Independent Fianna Fail TDs is about as popular as a fart at a disco in a phone box. The majority of young people find themselves aligned to more radical thinking parties like Sinn Fein, The greens and the Socialist workers party. Mark my words Sinn fein will very soon be sharing power in dail eireann if not stormont.

Mr.Nice Guy

netwhizkid wrote:

Supporting Fianna Fail or its associates, the PDs and the Independent Fianna Fail TDs is about as popular as a fart at a disco in a phone box. The majority of young people find themselves aligned to more radical thinking parties like Sinn Fein, The greens and the Socialist workers party. Mark my words Sinn fein will very soon be sharing power in dail eireann if not stormont.

Sinn Fein's policies would be disastrous for Ireland. Their economic policies would leave Ireland in an awful state. None of the big parties would be dumb enough to welcome them into a coalition government.

netwhizkid

Originally Posted by Mr.Nice Guy
Sinn Fein's policies would be disastrous for Ireland. Their economic policies would leave Ireland in an awful state. None of the big parties would be dumb enough to welcome them into a coalition government.

Sinn Fein have sound left-wing socialist oriented economic policies and do you think ahern wouldn't take in Sinn Fein, Imagine the scenario, Fianna Fail needed only 50 to 7 seat more to form government and Sinn Fein had 10 seats. Do you think the would go out on the doldrums. Bu god but they wouldn't they hop into bed with Mary Lou or Ferris and they's have a republican hooley ! I predict the PDs will be completetly erased after the next election whatever about the governements formed as a result.

Snickers Man

In answer to the original question:

Yes.

Mr.Nice Guy

netwhizkid wrote:

Sinn Fein have sound left-wing socialist oriented economic policies and do you think ahern wouldn't take in Sinn Fein, Imagine the scenario, Fianna Fail needed only 50 to 7 seat more to form government and Sinn Fein had 10 seats. Do you think the would go out on the doldrums. Bu god but they wouldn't they hop into bed with Mary Lou or Ferris and they's have a republican hooley ! I predict the PDs will be completetly erased after the next election whatever about the governements formed as a result.

Their 'socialist orientated economic policies' would ruin a solid economy.

And why would Fianna Fail get into bed with Sinn Fein when Ahern has admitted that their policies and political outlooks are too different?

netwhizkid

Socialist policies would deliver proper services and to hell with rampant economic growth do you want Ireland to be fully concreted over ? This country needs state owned and controlled services like Rail-Telephones-Power-TV-Gas need i go on capitalism is already ruinging the world just look at global warming.

Mr.Nice Guy

netwhizkid wrote:

Socialist policies would deliver proper services and to hell with rampant economic growth do you want Ireland to be fully concreted over ? This country needs state owned and controlled services like Rail-Telephones-Power-TV-Gas need i go on capitalism is already ruinging the world just look at global warming.

Well we'll have to agree to differ on that.

Cork

Mr.Nice Guy wrote:

Their 'socialist orientated economic policies' would ruin a solid economy.

And why would Fianna Fail get into bed with Sinn Fein when Ahern has admitted that their policies and political outlooks are too different?

Well across the EU the socialist governments are not match Irelands growth or employment rates.

When you look at international comparisons we are doing pretty well.

FF has never been cool. Politics itself is pretty uncool.

AngelofFire

Sinn Fein have sound left-wing socialist oriented economic policies and do you think ahern wouldn't take in Sinn Fein

Thats why they supported Public Private Partnerships in the health and education system when in government up North?

rsynnott

netwhizkid wrote:

Sinn Fein have sound left-wing socialist oriented economic policies .

Blowing people up, for example. And they don't have ANY coherent economic policies of any type...

Cork wrote:

Well across the EU the socialist governments are not match Irelands growth or employment rates.

First, there are no socialist governments in Europe (or anywhere else). Some of them are quite left-leaning. Their hospitals tend to be somewhat better

RainyDay

cyclopath2001 wrote:

E-Voting, PULSE, Toll roads, the port tunnel, decentralisation....

And let's not forget the piece de resistence - the crippling of the Freedom of Information legislation so all their nasty little secrets remain nasty little secrets.

segaBOY

Ah Fine Gael, a combination of the outlawed fascist Blueshirts (The National Guard) and Cumann na Gael, what a party, HEIL! HEIL!

Look simple as this, can anyone remember John Bruton forcing the IRA to end it's first ceasefire? Can anyone remember Bertie Ahern negogiating a second Ceasefire within weeks of being brought into power?


Ireland is also now economically and politically(see Nothern Ireland and Good Friday Agreement!!!) better under Fianna Fáil, just accept it

Jealous anti-republican LOSER!!!!!!-->[IMG][/IMG]

Having a good time Enda?????????

AngelofFire

Ireland is also now economically and politically(see Nothern Ireland and Good Friday Agreement!!!) better under Fianna Fáil, just accept it

Better for whom.

We currently have a crisis in the health service, spending on education as percentage of GDP is lower than mexico, the second worst public childcare in the EU, and housing prices that have gone out of control.

segaBOY

AngelofFire wrote:

Better for whom.

We currently have a crisis in the health service, spending on education as percentage of GDP is lower than mexico, the second worst public childcare in the EU, and housing prices that have gone out of control.

Ahem,go back to the last Fine Gael government, Fianna Fáil have made VAST improvements

gandalf

Ah Fine Gael, a combination of the outlawed fascist Blueshirts (The National Guard) and Cumann na Gael, what a party, HEIL! HEIL!

LOL ancient history, sure FF came from the Anti-Treaty side and are technically traitors so.

Look simple as this, can anyone remember John Bruton forcing the IRA to end it's first ceasefire? Can anyone remember Bertie Ahern negogiating a second Ceasefire within weeks of being brought into power?

So the fact the IRA couldn't keep their guns silent was all John Brutons fault, thats a tad simplistic really, there were many factors in the IRA returning to violence.

As for Bertie being the almighty saviour thats complete and utter tosh as well, sure he helped but Tony Blair has to take a large portion of the credit along with Gerry Adams and even David Trimble (until his spine turned to Jelly!).

Ireland is also now economically and politically(see Nothern Ireland and Good Friday Agreement!!!) better under Fianna Fáil, just accept it

Ireland doing well has nothing to do with the GFA, its more so to do with the upturn in the World Economy in the late 90's the groundwork done by the Rainbow Coalition. And tbh I am not sure about how well off we are doing, one of the highest costs of living in Europe (the World), First time buyers are priced out of the market in large segments of the country, infrastructure chaos and mismanagement of infrastucture projects. But the biggest failure for this government and this is something I can talk about with Authority is the Health Service, it is a complete and utter shambles and far far worse that it was before we got "economically and politically better under Fianna Fáil" which for a government that has thrown so much money at the problem is a complete and utter disgrace. They lack the vision, the will and the balls to sort out this problem.

Jealous anti-republican LOSER!!!!!!-->[IMG][/IMG]

Having a good time Enda?????????

If thats all you can offer don't bother in future.

gandalf

segaBOY wrote:

Ahem,go back to the last Fine Gael government, Fianna Fáil have made VAST improvements

List them !

marshmallow

How is it 'cool' or 'uncool' to support a certain party? In this case Fianna Fáil..
All the voting in elections are confidential so no-one will even no which party you support unless you tell them and discuss it with them.

segaBOY

Ah Gandalf what did you do to my first post????!!!!!!!!!!!

gandalf

I fixed it to a degree, hit wrong button to reply to your mail initially, thought I stopped it before it posted ! Obviously I didn't

segaBOY

gandalf wrote:

I fixed it to a degree, hit wrong button to reply to your mail initially, thought I stopped it before it posted ! Obviously I didn't

Can I put the smaller image back on? I too made a mistake with that HUGE one I posted

AngelofFire

Ahem,go back to the last Fine Gael government, Fianna Fáil have made VAST improvements

I dont support FG, but at least when they were in gov with Labour 10 years ago, first time buyers on modest income could afford houses, the A&E wasnt half as bad as it is now. 3rd level grants supported the cost of living, tuition fees were abolished, and the reg fee was only about 150 punts. Economic growth was running very high, and the phrase 'Celtic Tiger' was coined during their period in government, also in the year 1996 they brought in the first surplus in nearly 30 years and succeed in lowering unemployment from about 18% to around 10%.

Wheely

Just in response to Netwhizkid, whether or not its cool to support FF i dont know...but there is a certain perceived coolness associated with being a "lefty". SF are not a Socialist party, they are a hypocritical party..their "sound" economic policies do not exist...they would do nothing other than run Ireland into the ground economically and take us out of Europe..which along with women entering into the workforce are the 2 major factors contributing to the "celtic tiger"....FF had SFA to do with it regardless of what they like to say. Personally I dont like FF...never have their history stinks right from the Civil War, thru the Economic War...to Lemass taking credit for the 60's economic boom to Haughey the list goes on. Sadly in this country we lack a strong opposition to challenge them. SF are nothing more than thugs, FG seem to self-desrtuct from time to time....maybe(hopefully) that is turning around and Labour...while they would prob be closest to my own likings idealogically just cant seem to get the numbers. But SF are no alternative to FF...out of the frying pan and into the fire!!