Anyone with experience renovating a period property?

Andrew Duffy

I'm looking at lots of these at the moment, and would like a very rough budget for the biggest renovations. If anyone has had any of these done on a period house, I'm very interested to know how much it cost:

- Restoration of sash windows
- Repointing (lime mortar)
- Lowering of a basement floor
- Rewiring
- Installation of central heating
- Roof repair
- Any major renovation I've left off the list

MorningStar

It is a big question and really how long is a piece of string. I have experience but the prices are out the window these days either way. Except for the roof which to replace one side of double A georgian roof cost €20k but that is 2 years ago now so I guess it is more now.

You will need to at least say the size of the house and how many rooms to get any useful information.

From what you are saying it is going to cost a fortune. Unless the final finish is great you may spend a lot more money than will increase the property price. I know you are thinking about personal use but a loss is a loss . What has the surveyor said?

Andrew Duffy

Unfortunately it is a piece of string - I'm still viewing properties, so no surveys yet. They will all be in the region of 1000 - 1300 sq. feet, and likely to need at least one of the jobs above done. I'd like to be able to gauge whether the work will cost 25K or more like 100K while viewing - it should help me decide whether to offer, get a survey and quotes or just walk away.
Thanks for the ballpark for roof repair - it's the job I know most about already, but not neccessarily for a protected structure. Was your Georgian protected?

Victor

What period? Victorian or especially Edwardian can be nice and will be better built. Not every period building will be listed.

If you have any doubts about the structure, get someone to assess it for a few hundred euros as to whether you are buying a lemon or not.

Andrew Duffy wrote:

- Restoration of sash windows

€1,000-3,000 for restoration, less for repair.

Andrew Duffy wrote:

- Repointing (lime mortar)

€50-100/m2

Andrew Duffy wrote:

- Lowering of a basement floor

€150/m2

Andrew Duffy wrote:

- Rewiring

€100 per point + fittings

Andrew Duffy wrote:

- Installation of central heating

€1,000 per rad + bathrooms / kitchen

Andrew Duffy wrote:

- Any major renovation I've left off the list

Structural repairs. Levelling / strengthening floors, replacing door lintols.

Damp proofing.

Plaster repairs.

Decorative work.

Kitchen.

jhegarty

Andrew Duffy wrote:

I'm looking at lots of these at the moment, and would like a very rough budget for the biggest renovations. If anyone has had any of these done on a period house, I'm very interested to know how much it cost:

- Restoration of sash windows
- Repointing (lime mortar)
- Lowering of a basement floor
- Rewiring
- Installation of central heating
- Roof repair
- Any major renovation I've left off the list

i'd head over to the diy forum, there was a very long thread on house renovations a while back...

Thomond Pk

The market seems to make it very difficult to buy these properties do them up and turn a profit these days as properties in very poor condition appear to be bought by people who wish to do total revamps a la 'about the house'. It is also more difficult to get salvaged building materials in ROI these days since the protected structures legislation was introduced but you can still source a lot of this stuff in the North of England/Wales if you are prepared to head over with a trailer on spec.

My gut feeling is to look for a very 'tired' period house that has had a very bad 1970's makeover done but is structurally intact with dated electrics and heating systems and with much of the fabric stripped out such as doors, architraves and possibly covered in poorly inserted chipboard built ins.

On costs as you probably know yourself long-term damp problems and structural timber replacements can be very expensive. I would also try a few of the salvage yards first to check up on flooring, door and rad prices, something tells me you would be attempting a lot of the work yourself.

MorningStar

Andrew Duffy wrote:

Thanks for the ballpark for roof repair - it's the job I know most about already, but not neccessarily for a protected structure. Was your Georgian protected?

It wasn't protected as such but we had no other choice but to replace like for like. I wanted to make a single pitch and stick in another room. I checked with planning (well known family friend) and he siad I might be able to get permission but it would be a long fight and he wouldn't give permission if it was his area unless I managed to convince the whole line of houses.

The size you have mentioned sounds really small for an old house unless you are looking at the old work bungalows. Victor seems to have quoted with knowledge but old buildings can throw up costs like you wouldn't believe.

When dropping a floor in a victorian house you can run into a huge problem as many don't have foundations.

http://www.salvoweb.com/Ireland-Rep./CoDublin/directory.html

Useful for salvage and helping find somebody who is used to doing up such properties.

You can hire a surveyor on a rate to look at a few properties. Only doing full surveys on real goes.

After living in such a house I can say you really fall in love with the house but it's hard to get them as comfortable as a modern house and they are expensive to run.

Andrew Duffy

Thanks for everything, especially Victor's extremely useful reply.

MorningStar wrote:

The size you have mentioned sounds really small for an old house

Not really - virtually all the two storey Victorian and Edwardian stock in Drumcondra/Phibsborough is in that range. The workers' cottages are more like 700 sq. ft. or smaller.

you really fall in love with the house

I know - I looked at a Georgian on the NCR recently (incidentally, also under 1300 sq. ft.) and am having a hard time forgetting about it, despite its needing a complete reorganisation of layout.

MorningStar

Andrew Duffy wrote:

I know - I looked at a Georgian on the NCR recently (incidentally, also under 1300 sq. ft.) and am having a hard time forgetting about it, despite its needing a complete reorganisation of layout.

I guess you are right on the size but I thought you were going for the bigger houses. Iona Road is pretty nice in Drumcondra. Would have be a dream to live in some of those. Fairview is worth a look too
I missed out on a house in North Strand and still think of it and it still never sold. The house must be a complete mess now inside which is still a bugger. There is also a lovely georgian house beside the Protestant church on North Strand Road. It used to be fine but now it's boarded up. If I had the will and time I'd try to see if I could find out who owns it. They have to pay derilick fee now so they might want rid of it for the right price. It's really unlikely property developers own it.

Victor

MorningStar wrote:

I missed out on a house in North Strand and still think of it and it still never sold. The house must be a complete mess now inside which is still a bugger. There is also a lovely georgian house beside the Protestant church on North Strand Road. It used to be fine but now it's boarded up.

Is it next door to the Credit Union? If so its been like that for a long time, but the CU manager might know.

MorningStar

Victor wrote:

Is it next door to the Credit Union? If so its been like that for a long time, but the CU manager might know.

I know the one you mean which I actually think is part of the credit union. The one I mean is between the funneral home and church towards Fairview but before the overhead railway bridge. Straight down the road there. Only boarded up in the last year maybe two.

Thomond Pk

Is that the particularly fine Villa at the end of the road with the corrogated iron sheeting on the windows?

MorningStar

Thomond Pk wrote:

Is that the particularly fine Villa at the end of the road with the corrogated iron sheeting on the windows?

That's it! A spooky quite road in the city and a big property when you have a look at it. You could probably add a floor without effecting it much either. A bit like a country property and a shame to see it not used. There is another lovely house beside it which I think used to be the vicars house.

deedee lepoopoo

A Few Resources For Restoration Would Be:

The Irish Georgin Society On Merrion Square. They Have A Series Of Booklets On Elements Of Houses And Restoration And A Library.

Dublin Civic Trust,castle Street (beside Christchurch). They Have Resources And Exhibitions On Different Periods And Features. E.g. They Had An Exhibition On Windows And The Different Types And Periods.

I Know Ventrolla Windows In The Coombe Area Specialise In Restoring Sash Windows. I Am Not Too Au Fait With The Pricings Now.

Good Luck, And It Is Good To See People Genuinely Interested In Restoration Rather Than Taking The Easy Route......

Andrew Duffy

Thanks for that, although I know about the Irish Georgian Society already. They have a great online building skills register:

http://www.irish-architecture.com/igs/register/index.html

There's also these excellent booklets from the Department of the Environment:

http://www.environ.ie/DOEI/doeipub.nsf/wvInfoView/17407B65C95D10D280256F0F003DB979?OpenDocument&Lang=en

... which are conservation manuals for tradesmen.