Questions

flowerpotfrog

Question:

Does the Islam faith see Roman Catholism (and a lot of Christianity) as polythesic (Jesus, God, The holy spirit)? And do they interpret the crucifix and similar as a form or idolism? (~the worship of objects)

?

marco murphy

Salaams,

First of all - The Qur'an does not advocate hate to anything or anyone anywhere in the book.
Muslims are forbidden to be close freind with christians or jews only when they are fighting islam.
Even then the book doesnt advocate hatred.

Some christians agree with assertions of the Qur'an and some will not.
Such as - there is no god but one god.

Christians would'nt say god is one of three in a trinity, but is made of three persons, father, son and holy ghost.
Here is the Qur'ans disagreement. Surah 3 Verse 64(or very near )

"O People of the Book! come to common terms as between us and you: That we worship none but God; that we associate no partners with him; that we erect not, from among ourselves, Lords and patrons other than God." If then they turn back, say ye: "Bear witness that we are Muslims (bowing to God's Will).

Thats that.

I shall try and answer next question when i finish playing a game online

flowerpotfrog

i don't think you answered my question at all. imo, god is god, i won't try an explain the holy trinity, but do muslims, or do they not, view the holy trinity as a form of polythesim?

Hobbes

flowerpotfrog wrote:

i don't think you answered my question at all. imo, god is god, i won't try an explain the holy trinity, but do muslims, or do they not, view the holy trinity as a form of polythesim?

Bare in mind he is not the voice for the forum. I am sure others will post trying to answer your question.

marco murphy

I just posted an answer - i never stated such.

Wibbs

Poblachtach wrote:

First of all - The Qur'an does not advocate hate to anything or anyone anywhere in the book.

However many would contend it does promote aggression, especially to non Muslims. From my reading of the Quran, it seems charity and non aggression is only for brothers and sisters in the faith. For non believers it's much more a grey area. Certainly there are passages that say respect "people of the book"(Christians/Jews), though they have to pay a religious tax if they're not Muslims. Equally there are passages that seem to contradict that(especially in the treatment of the Jews). Every other religion(idolators) seem have a little protection.

http://www.usc.edu/dept/MSA/quran/009.qmt.html#009.123

http://www.usc.edu/dept/MSA/quran/009.qmt.html#009.005

Fight, enslave and slay seems to be the general gist. In fact the early Islam followed those instructions quite a bit. The prophet himself led a "holy war" to ensure the foundation of the Islamic faith and the Islamic state. How does this make easy bedfellows with the idea of a peaceful Islam?

Muslims are forbidden to be close freind with christians or jews only when they are fighting islam.

http://www.usc.edu/dept/MSA/quran/003.qmt.html#003.028
Where is the proviso in the above quote that it's only when they are fighting Islam? It seems a general instruction to me.

This is not meant as an attack on Muslims. It is not a comment on recent history. It is more about questions I have about the faith itself. More to the point, the militaristic, aggressive elements that appear to me to be much more inherent in Islam than any other mainstream faith.

I would just like to hear what most Muslims think about this. I hear some Muslims say that Islam itself means peace. Others say it means submission. Submission is a much more loaded word, given the foundations of the faith itself.

tonyinuae

Wibbs, Islam means 'submission' and I agree with the concerns you voice regarding these general instructions. They make me uneasy, too. Muslims assure me that these instructions to slay, enslave and subdue are only to be applied to those non-believers that actively fight against Islam, but where is that written? Could someone find a quote?

marco murphy

Well i have posted in threads before that there is no permission for agression unless the muslims are being opressed.

Hobbes

tonyinuae wrote:

Wibbs, Islam means 'submission' and I agree with the concerns you voice regarding these general instructions. They make me uneasy, too. Muslims assure me that these instructions to slay, enslave and subdue are only to be applied to those non-believers that actively fight against Islam, but where is that written? Could someone find a quote?

I have put a link to misconceptions about Islam into the Charter. You should read it. covers what you want to know.

Undergod

flowerpotfrog wrote:

Question:

Does the Islam faith see Roman Catholism (and a lot of Christianity) as polythesic (Jesus, God, The holy spirit)? And do they interpret the crucifix and similar as a form or idolism? (~the worship of objects)

?

Well the Catholic church, and the mainstream Christian religion in general, forbids the worship of idols. The ten commandments warn against "graven images" (depending on translation), and as such the rosary, or the crucifix, or whatever, don't count as idols because the worship isn't directed at the object itself.

Whether other religions see it this way, I don't know.

bug

flowerpotfrog wrote:

Question:

Does the Islam faith see Roman Catholism (and a lot of Christianity) as polythesic (Jesus, God, The holy spirit)? And do they interpret the crucifix and similar as a form or idolism? (~the worship of objects)

?

As far as i know, Jesus is recoginised as a prophet, according to a Malay muslim I know, amongst many prophets.

and just for note: according to catholism, the wearing of the crucifix is not worship of an object, but a reminder of the idea, that Jesus gave his life to save the sins of people. Its not considered a lucky charm item in itself, and unless you are a catholic this "reminder" would mean nothing to an individual anyway and possibly would be construed as a form of idolism.

Also the whole idea of the trinity was three aspects of the one god. One who feels what it can be like as flesh (like us) one who represents our soul, and One who represents the divine. As far as I can rememeber with the whole shamrock thing,it was a representation of God, as many religions do have.
I know,you know, Im just I'm just pointing it out

It would be nice if there were more muslims about to request their views.
Maybe google will help this forum out in the long run

r3boot

Jesus is considered a prohpet in almost all sects in all current forms of islam.

The holy trinity is not seen as a correct concept simply because it implies some of the features of humans in the devine. In islam god has none of the features of humans but human adjectives such as "all seeing" are used to describe some of his/her infinite abilities so to divide gods essence into three factors does not make sense to muslims since the number 3 is irrelevant to god (its like relating breathing to a rock; a rock doesn't need to breath so therefore the whole concept is confusing to everyone who hears the phrase).

When it comes right down to personally it I really don't give a s++t what your religion is. I just know this stuff because I was force fed it as a child.