Where to now?

gimmick

(Ive posted this on another forum as well, but am interetsed to hear peoples thoughts on the below)

Well, after tonight, it looks like Irelands World Cup qualifying aspirations are all but dead. Now, dont get me wrong, this isnt a knee jerk reaction to one poor result, its a reaction to 3, possibly 4 bad results. Let me explain -

Swiss Vs Ireland.
Ireland took an early lead, and decided to sit back on it. The Swiss inevitably equalise, and can feel somewhat disspointed they didnt go on to win. That said, Ireland made no effort to go forward after they went ahead.
Verdict: 50/50 between point gained or 2 lost.

Israel Vs Ireland.
See above really, except the Israelis offered nothing going forward except for one great strike at the death.
Verdict: 2 dropped most certainly.


Ireland Vs Israel
2-0 up on a poor side, it should have been a cricket score, instead, its another bloody draw. Poor tactics, and awful substitutions are Irelands undoing here.
Verdict: 2 dropped again.

And then there was tonight, were Ireland offerd nothing agaisnt a very comfortable French side, and cannot feel aggrieved at losing.

So the question is, whats to be done?

Is Kerr the man for the job? Does he need more time, or has his 30 months thus far been enough to prove himself?

If Kerr isnt the man, who is? Is there deadwood in the squad? If so, who should be drafted in?

Me, I really dont know.

Thoughts?

whiskeyman

I'll be short.
Kerr should stay.
We're still going through a transition of sorts, but it's sure taking its time.
We just havent performed well enough, and I still believe this team has more potential.
Lets hope its running at full steam for Euro '08

treefingers

not going to comment on most of that just yet (i'm tired and emotional!) but can anyone name anyone out there who would do a better job than kerr and be willing to take the job at this moment in time??

cause i certainly can't....

evilhomer

Don't think we have the quality in attack to be up there with the best teams.

MrJoeSoap

evilhomer wrote:

Don't think we have the quality in attack to be up there with the best teams.

I agree, other than Robbie and Clinton, who can blow very hot and cold, we have nothing waiting in the ranks.

Gary Doherty? Gimme a break.

Guy:Incognito

treefingers wrote:

not going to comment on most of that just yet (i'm tired and emotional!) but can anyone name anyone out there who would do a better job than kerr and be willing to take the job at this moment in time??....

Thats two different questions. Just because nobody else wants the job doesnt make Kerr the best man for it.

applehunter

Maybe we aren't good enough.

Im still living in hope.

el rabitos

Maybe we aren't good enough.

MAYBE?? when the hell did people start even thinking we were a good team?

we have 1 good keeper, 0 good defenders, 1 over the hill world class midfielder, a world class winger in duff, and a decent player in reid, keane is half decent up front, not exactly prolific

treefingers

Stekelly wrote:

Thats two different questions. Just because nobody else wants the job doesnt make Kerr the best man for it.

ok. i don't think kerr is the best man for the job. the best manager for ireland would be the best manager in the world, whoever that is. (different argument again ) but right now hes the best we can get.

we are not a footballing superpower. can't just pick and choose managers. so i think it wouldn't make sense to sack kerr seeing as there are no alternatives...

applehunter

We are spoilt I suppose.

I wasn't around through all the near misses of the 70's and early 80's.

Jonny Arson

gimmick wrote:

(So the question is, whats to be done?

Is Kerr the man for the job? Does he need more time, or has his 30 months thus far been enough to prove himself?

If Kerr isnt the man, who is? Is there deadwood in the squad? If so, who should be drafted in?

What's to be done? Kerr has to go.

He doesn't need more time. He's had plenty of time to prove himself and he hasn't. Yes, I did take McCarthy 5 years to qualify for a major tournament but I have not seen such poor and lackluster displays from any Irish team since the last year of the Charlton era. In the McCarthy era we were moving forward, developing new blood and playing decent football, with Kerr we are taking two steps backwards are sliding down the world order.

Don't know who would be his successor. David O'Leary is the immediate name to spring to mind. At Leeds he did well and at Villa he's done very well with limited finances.

Deadwood? Richard Dunne, Kevin Kilbane are simply not good enough, Clinton Morrison tries but doesn't have the cutting edge, Gary Doherty has to be one of the worst players to ever wear the green jersey, Ian Harte is past it, Matt Holland is also gone wayward recently. With Keano coming to the end of his days and a lack of young talent all of a sudden I'm getting a bit worried.

applehunter

Richard Dunne was excellent tonight.

Chardee MacDennis

kerr is not the man for the job, i am sorry but he did brilliantly with the u16s and worked his way up, but i personally think we should move on - his contract is up at the end of the group stages and it should not be extended. we need a manager with european experience, why dies he have to be irish do waht the japanise and the s.koreans did, get a great manager in and change the team.

we are a very weak team unfortunately up front nothing really too special, if keane doesnt perform that seems to be it most of the time. Youth like elliot hasnt been given the experience in friendlies that is required to make the jump - friendlies have been wasted trying out new formations and sticking to the same old 11.

midfield when keane leaves - ie when we dont qualify - who have we? kilbane, holland, doenst instill me with a lot of confidence.

in defense cunningham hasnt much intl football left in him and the fact Kerr turned away Knight from the irish team upsets me, a good player not the best but young and a consistent starter.

in hindsight we do have Duff, Reid(occasionaly does something special, but never gonna make an impact from the right wing), O'shea, Given.

so we do have two of the best wingers in the prem, a decent CB,LB,CM in O'Shea and one of the best and most consistent Goalkeepers in the Prem. we need to build on that, but for a country the talent is either coming through or not.

McGeady looks good but so did liam miller 18 months ago. i dont see where this squad is going and with Kerr leading them i dont see them finding a direction. its a sad state of affairs but we need to qualify for europe in 2008.

evilhomer

applehunter wrote:

Richard Dunne was excellent tonight.

I agree, we have a few good players, but we don't have any strenght in depth, and very little talent coming through!

Paddy McCarthy, McGeady, Whealan, Potter, Kelly, Willow Flood. are the only ones I can think of that will break into the Ireland team in the next 4 years. but still no big strong striker or a defensive midfielder with a cutting edge.


Our options off the bench tonight were a joke, we will never be able to compete with the big teams with a bench like that.

applehunter

Willo Flood wasnt up to much last night at Turners Cross. He has good ability though and has heart so he is definately a hopefull choice.

Paddy McCarthy could be an excellent player and Kevin Doyle could make that breakthough in the next few months.

The Muppet

I blame the Manager for changing to defensive tactics against the weaker teams when we take the lead. The OP is spot on with his observations about points thrown away.

[Jackass]

This campaign has exposed Kerr's lack of tactical versitility, and he almost certainly get's it wrong every time.

His answer to French goal? Wait untill there's 10 minutes to go, allowing the french to completely kill the tempo of the game, then, when it's gone flat, throw on a defender, who cant even get his game in the championship, play him as a striker, punt the ball up to him, and hope he wins a free kick around the box....also, bring on your best free kick taker.

That's not a tactic! That's desperation that played into the French hands, as they were prepared for that (RE: Israel game) and Doherty won 0 free kicks and gave away about 5.

Can you imagine mourinhio or ferguson doing that?? No! You put on Elliot (clearly hasn't learned from his mistakes) and you take a risk elsewhere on the pitch. Either 3 in midfield, or 3 at back and get keane/o'shea to play deep and protect back 3. Don't go for the most basic, unimaginative tactic, with the most incompitent player in the squad, out of position!! Also i've complained about his timing before...he just cant get anything right tbh.

He is a fantastic man manager, organiser etc. etc., but i imagine hughton is responsible for 99% of the match plan before the game, and when it comes to the big calls in the game, kerr is hesitant, conservative, unimaginative, and inadequet.

It's vital we keep him in the FAI and involved in the backroom atunderage or main team, but we need a real manager.

I also think the FAI have gradually become more organised and more compuitent, and they really got it right on this occasion by waiting untill after the group to discuss contract negotiations, even though kerrs is due to run out then, let's just hope they now prove we have higher expectations by removing him from his current post if we don't qualify (and after the WC if we do.)

MrJoeSoap

Plenty of talent to come through but not for quite a few years. Potter, Whelan, O'Brien, McGeady, Doyle. In terms of Euro Championships 2008, I'm not expecting much unless we get a very favourable draw for the qualifying groups.

Illkillya

MrJoeSoap wrote:

Plenty of talent to come through but not for quite a few years. Potter, Whelan, O'Brien, McGeady, Doyle.

Kearney...? once he's grown a few feet and gained a couple of hundredweight

MisterAnarchy

Kerr should go,he is far too cautious as a manager and Ireland under him have only played 1 decent away match (France)
In every other away match they have looked extremely poor and negative.
Every time they get a goal up they sit back and try to soak up pressure against inferior teams.
They should be trying to finish these teams off early .
The Irish players have a mind block in away matches as they have defended for huge chunks of vital away matches over the last 5 years .
Its come to the stage now whereby Ireland would be happy to hold on for any 1-0 away victory against any opposition.

masterK

Kerr has got to take responsibility for the situation we find ourselves in. As the OP said look back at the positions we have been in and how he responded to them. Leading in Switzerland he changed to a totally negative approach, the same at home and away to Israel.

If we don't qualify for the world cup we can't complain that we haven't had our chances, we have and we've blown them, I blame Kerr's negativity for this.

I think he has to go at the end of the qualifiers, he just doesn't have the tactical knowhow to succeed at this level.

As for who should replace him, that's a much tougher question, I can't think of anybody Irish so it would have to be somebody from abroad.

Chardee MacDennis

what really sums up kerrs philosophy:
beating portugal in a friendly with 5 mins to go, and irish players are running the ball into the corner... WTF, i felt so ashamed that night, i mean if we were NI with the same result it MAY have been ok coz they hadnt won at home for like 5 years, but for the irish team in, what?, the top 20 of the world? bloody disgraceful.

StickyMcGinty

gimmick wrote:

Well, after tonight, it looks like Irelands World Cup qualifying aspirations are all but dead

rubbish. we win our last 2 games and we're in the playoffs

jubbly

im sick of reading posts like
Kerr should go blah blah blah....

Its wasnt all kerrs fault. We are really suffering with the squad rotation in the EPL. Its only the very very top players that are getting regular first team football. A lot of average players in EPL only get every other game at best.

This Ireland team isnt like Ireland teams of old who were playing week in week out and were tough as nails and determined.

We still have to win our next matches like we have always have. Its just that we dont have Roy (who is a legend IMO) and A.Reid. We have enough players to beat Cyprus and providing France do us a big favour it all comes down to the last game 4 days later.

Can we really BEAT (not draw) the swiss ?? Honestly ? Im not sure. If we have everyone 101% fit then maybe. If we can manage all that then we make it to the play offs, who do we face there ? it could be Spain England or anyone. A very tall order

por

VinnyL wrote:

rubbish. we win our last 2 games and we're in the playoffs

I have seen nothing from this Irish team over the qualification period to give me confidence that we can beat the Swiss.
With Keane, Reid and Morrison gone for the Cyprus game winning that is not a banker either.

This was lost due to Kerr's negitave taticts in game we were leading, and why the hell did he not bring on a sub as soon as France had scored last night !!!.

As for qualification for Euro 2008, well I only whsh we had won that competition to host it with the Scots.

jubbly

Lets not go into Euro 2008. We dont have the stadia. We will never have the stadia unless we take sport seriously in this country. Taking soccer serisouly starts with the league

evilhomer

por wrote:

why the hell did he not bring on a sub as soon as France had scored last night !!!

Because if he had changed things too soon we may have conceded again.

But I do think that the substitution he made in the end was the wrong choice.

He should have gone to 3-4-3 with Elliott up front.
Doherty is a waste of space and should not be in the Irish Squad.

LFCFan

Kerr's tactical and substitution decisions leave a lot to be desired. The game against Israel was pathetic. 2-0 up. Cruising. Under no pressure whatsoever and looking like we could score a few more and he goes totally defensive, sits back and for me ruined our chances of automatic qualification. For this game alone he deserves the boot. Last night was another example of his tactical prowess. Leaves it till the 80th minute to bring on Doherty and Harte. FFS. As soon as France scored he should have brought on Elliot for Kilbane and played him up front and gone 4-3-3. Apart from some dodgy ball watching on the edge of the box, our defense was doing a pretty good job of keeping them out so we needed to go for it a lot more. His substitutions showed sheer despiration.