Bloody hell!

Hobbes

http://www.emsnetwork.org/artman/publish/article_18337.shtml

If this is true there is going to be serious ass kicking in the government.

Some highlights (worth reading the lot)...

...the police commander came across the street to address our group. He told us he had a solution: we should walk to the Pontchartrain Expressway and cross the greater New Orleans Bridge where the police had buses lined up to take us out of the City. ... The commander turned to the crowd and stated emphatically, "I swear to you that the buses are there."...

As we approached the bridge, armed Gretna sheriffs formed a line across the foot of the bridge. Before we were close enough to speak, they began firing their weapons over our heads... We told them of our conversation with the police commander... The sheriffs informed us there were no buses waiting. The commander had lied to us to get us to move.

We questioned why we couldn't cross the bridge anyway,...They responded that the West Bank was not going to become New Orleans and there would be no Superdomes in their City....

From a woman with a battery powered radio we learned that the media was talking about us... The officials responded they were going to take care of us.... Just as dusk set in, a Gretna Sheriff showed up, jumped out of his patrol vehicle, aimed his gun at our faces, screaming, "Get off the ****ing freeway". A helicopter arrived and used the wind from its blades to blow away our flimsy structures. As we retreated, the sheriff loaded up his truck with our food and water.

A Dub in Glasgo

An absolute disgrace if even half of that is true.

This whole incompetent farce needs an independent inquiry not some Bush brush under the carpet

supersheep

Heads will roll anyways. But if that story reflects peoples' experiences, then it seems to me that government policies would have led to deaths. That article makes me so mad I can hardly express myself.

por

A Dub in Glasgo wrote:

An absolute disgrace if even half of that is true.

This whole incompetent farce needs an independent inquiry not some Bush brush under the carpet

If anything is brushed under the carpet by a Bush led enquiry it will be failing by Federal authorities.

The likes of the above will certanitly come to light because they are the failings of the local New Orleans and La. state authorities, they are the failings of the Mayor and Govenor, two people that some wish to see as untouchable vistims in this matter*

*based on me listening to people on the likes of the Gerry Ryan show and talking to people who wish to balme only Bush for this mess.

RuggieBear

christ....sounds ****ing awful. talk about taking nimbyism to a whole new ****ing level

bonkey

The likes of the above will certanitly come to light because they are the failings of the local New Orleans and La. state authorities

My understanding was that the organisation of such activity falls under the remit of FEMA, who supercede and replace local authority in the management of disasters/emergencies.

Is this incorrect? If not, then why are the Mayor & Governer the people to hold accountable? If it is incorrect, then can someone explain to me what purpose FEMA exists for, if not to manage emergencies as their name would imply.

jc

Hobbes

FEMA were not fully deployed around new orleans for some time. Least according to the other post I put up.

TomF

It is interesting to learn that Arthur Lawson, the Chief of Police of the City of Gretna, Louisiana and Harry Lee, the Sheriff of Jefferson Parish, Louisiana (in which lies the City of Gretna) are both members of the U.S. Democratic Party, that center-of-competence-in-times-of-crisis beloved by so many here in Ireland. Sheriff Lee is also Major General Lee, Commander of the Louisiana State Guard (apparently not the same as either the Louisiana Army or Air National Guard).

http://www.sec.state.la.us/cominq.htm

Sponge Bob

Another General Lee begod, what a grrrrrrrrreat pedigree .

bonkey

TomF wrote:

the U.S. Democratic Party, that center-of-competence-in-times-of-crisis

Where did you get that notion from? The Democrats have historically done no better than the Republicans in dealing with crises.

See - this is what I don't understand....why criticising the people who were selected as the best somehow implies you believe that others were / would be better.

This job has been botched. Full stop, end of story. The people who asked the nation to be put in charge ultimately carry the buck. Either they did their job well enough or they didn't. Being better than the other guy, but still crap isn't good enough.

Whatever about within America, where people have direct political agendas, this notion that criticising the incumbent means you support the other side is just another ridiculous simplification.

If and when a Democrat comes to power, I'm willing to bet right here and now that I will as critical of them as I am of Bush, but that strangely I'll find TomF agreeing with me far often than occurs now.

Draw your own conclusions. Who's got the political agenda? the people criticising specific actions (or lack thereof), or the people calling the critcs names and putting them in neat little political groups.

Here's a hint...one side will offer what they think should be done. The other side wait till something is done and then agree with it and call the critics names.

jc

Hobbes

TomF wrote:

are both members of the U.S. Democratic Party, that center-of-competence-in-times-of-crisis beloved by so many here in Ireland.

Actually go look up what Clinton did around a serious Hurricane was predicted to hit land. I'm sure you can even get some right wing spin on it...

But the point is WTF really. Should it fuking matter if they were Rep/Dem/Aliens. These people need to go to jail (if they are lucky).

TomF

Thoroughly corrupt political parties produce incompetent office-holders

The Louisiana Democratic Party is thoroughly corrupt

Therefore, office-holders produced by the Louisiana Democratic Party are incompetent.

The Governor of Louisiana, the Mayor of New Orleans, the Sheriff of Jefferson County, Louisiana and the Police Chief of Gretna, Louisiana are office-holders produced by the Louisiana Democratic Party.

The completion of the logic is left as an exercise for the reader.

supersheep

Of course, your first assumption (I can't remember the word for a part of a logical argument) is flawed - it is not a given that corrupt political parties will produce incompetent office holders.
As for your second assumption, got any proof? News stories? Anything?

That is not to say that they are not incompetent...

TomF

You know, given Mississippi's efficient handling of the effects of Hurricane Katrina there, maybe corrupt political systems can throw up effective elected officials.

However, I am having a very hard time trying to think of any uncorrupt Louisiana Democratic Party politicians, but maybe given a few days I can come up with a few that might support the old saw, "the exception proves the rule."

Have a look at: "Public Corruption in the United States", a Report released by Corporate Crime Reporter, January 16, 2004, National Press Club, Washington, D.C. It ranks the most corrupt states in the U.S.A. and has this:

"Louisiana ... is not the most corrupt state in the country,
as its reputation might indicate. It comes in third. Illinois, living up to its
reputation, comes in fifth. New Jersey, believe it or not, comes in 16th. Rhode Island is even less corrupt than New Jersey – it comes in 20th.

The most corrupt state in the country is Mississippi (7.48).
According to our survey, the ten most corrupt states in the country are:
1. Mississippi (7.48)
2. North Dakota (7.09)
3. Louisiana (7.05)
4. Alaska (6.06)
5. Illinois (5.26)
6. Montana (4.95)
7. South Dakota (4.86)
8. Kentucky (4.59)
9. Florida (4.58)
10. New York (4.56)"

I think most of these states are in the pocket of the Democratic Party (including even North Dakota). You can read for yourself in the site I posted earlier from the Louisiana Department of State (N.B., no relation to the U.S. Department of State) that practically every political office in the flooded part of Louisiana is in the hands of the Democratic Party.

I found the report on public corruption at:
http://66.102.9.104/search?q=cache:14gKao6bkRYJ:www.corporatecrimereporter.com/corruptreport.pdf+louisiana+corruption&hl=en&client=firefox-a

supersheep

Heads are already rolling...
Just a few minutes ago, Michael Brown was removed from his position overseeing the Hurricane Katrina rescue efforts. From NBC:
FEMA Chief Michael Brown Removed From Katrina Relief
Apparently, there were discrepancies between his CV and reality...
Glad they removed this fool, alhough it's probably a bit late... This is the guy who left the USS Bataan, an amphibious warfare ship with a 600 bed hospital and space for 2000 marines and their equipment, offshore for a week while people were dying in the Superdome.
TomF, I wil respond to you in a few minutes, when I get a chance to read that link you posted.

supersheep

OK, I don't want this to go too off-topic, so I'll only address this briefly, as I only checked up on it briefly.
Louisiana does seem pretty corrupt, true. And the named instances I could track down were Democratic. Unfortunately, I couldn't find enough examples to say whether this corruption is endemic in Louisiana Democrats. And, of course, saying that does not mean that it's not also endemic in Louisiana Republicans... Anyways, any further discussion of this is probably for a new thread...

bonkey

TomF wrote:

The completion of the logic is left as an exercise for the reader.

The implication that there is logic to be completed is false.

Hobbes

Appears the Mayor also confirmed people being denied to escape NO.

http://onegoodmove.org/1gm/ (look for Mayor on the bridge).