What do ye want in Cork City?

boardy

I want to start a new funky business in the city centre area (off Patrick's Street). Want someplace that is fun, comfortable and hip not only for the customers, but the workers too. Along the line of an espresso and desserts bar. What do you think?

I know that there are a lot of cafes in the area, but few with the right atmosphere.

Is there some other type of business/retail outlet missing that could do well in the area?

By the way, there is an altruistic approach to my business philosophy that would need to be incorporated into this venture e.g. using FairTrade suppliers.

magpie

Somewhere that only allows Dubliners entry. A haven if you will.

dahamsta

Hookers, toast and jam, or any combination thereof.

solice

A cafe that has space to move around in but isnt cold. Tribes and Idaho can become uncomfortably busy and the ginger bread house is just not nice.

dudara

I said to myself about three years ago that it would be great to have a decent coffee/teahouse in the city, that served great cake, because there aren't any!

I want comfy seats, good coffee and tea and even better cake, ideally licensed to serve wine and open till late. I often want to go for coffee and cake late at night, but there's only Tribes and that's just horrible.

deRanged

another vote here for a coffee house.

again, decent coffee and opening late.

boardy

Jaysus, that was a fast response.

dudara: exactly what I was thinking about (but not sure about the wine due to licensing).

dahamsta: what about Hooters, toast and jam? Anyone been to the Hooters chain in the U.S.? They are a great craic.

solice: I hear what you are saying, but space costs a fortune (and rates, rent, leasehold costs, VAT on these charges, utility charges, insurance ......... arrrrgh I must be mad!). But I want somewhere warm and comfortable.

magpie: Did you mean a place that does NOT allow Dubliners entry?

dahamsta

Mmmm, cake. Hate coffee, but cake is another matter entirely. Mmm, chocolate cake. Mmmmm.

boardy wrote:

dahamsta: what about Hooters, toast and jam? Anyone been to the Hooters chain in the U.S.? They are a great craic.

There's actually one in Nottingham, but no, I've never been. Never really got the point of looking but not touching.

adam

Fysh

Decent cake.

Decent music (personally I suggest jazz/blues, as there doesn't seem to be any regular event [other than some fortnightly thing in Fermoy] where jazz or blues gets played and it'd give the place an original atmosphere).

Carefully-chosen decor. Makes a lot more difference than you'd think - the small place around the corner from the Gate is an example of how it can be done right, and the Ninjabread is an example of how it can be done wrong.

Late hours. Not pushed about booze/wine availability (though, if you're going to be open late, you might as well try for it and increase the profitability of late hours) but it'd be nice to have somewhere different to go in the evenings.

I'd also like a pinball machine, personally, but that'd probably irritate the hell out of everyone else and ruin the vibe. Ah well, I can dream anyway...

LilMrsDahamsta

My wish list: consistently good cake (note: anything involving any form of pastry is not cake); other food and soup as per pret-a-manger (i.e. fresh, reasonably healthyish and predictably edible); diet coke for the caffine-addicted non-coffee drinkers (i.e. moi); somewhere to smoke that isn't out on the street; music that is quiet enough to talk over, but not so quiet you end up overhearing half the conversations around you; staff that know not to whip the plate/bowl/cup away the second you're finished and make you feel like you should be out the door immediately...

solice

A place to go and chill out "in comfort" and spend the night drinking 10 cups of coffee too many or relaxing with a nice glass of wine. How many wine bars are in cork?

Hells_Belle

Ditto on the late night opening hours. Outdoor tables with heaters are good for us addicts, but not totally essential. WiFi gets major ++ points. And really, when you look at the cost/benefit anaysis, there's no reason not to offfer free WiFi. I mean, you spend e90 a month, and in return I bet you'd get some very, very dedicated customers.

ETA: Not sure a license is essential. A wine bar is a very different gig than a coffee bar. Also might be worth thinking about ice cream - a coffee, ice cream and dessert bar would be a delight, especially if there were really good baked goods from a variety of bakeries in cork. (As opposed to anything that comes pre-packaged in plastic. Eww. I can get that at Centra, ta.)

Also, if you have cake and ice cream, you can offer to host children's birthday parties. Parents are starting to get even more competitive with these, and will pay top-whack per head for something a bit different, especially in a funky venue.

Serendipity in NYC is a good model for that:

http://www.serendipity3.com/

It is very upscale place popular with adults in the evenings, but weekend afternoons they do one birthday a day and you have to book in more or less at conception. These are not traditional games and activities rugrats running rampant birthdays; they're more like Mad Hatter tea parties for short people...

Just a thought

dimerocks

someplace like tribes but before they changed it last week.that place is comfy to sit in and the like.that would be grand.we need big couches and whatnot too.and smoothies made with bannanas

boardy

Thanks for the replies.

I posted the same question over in the peoplesrepublicofcork web site. Besides the ladyboys and strippers suggestions, the concensus was for free (yes, really free) wi-fi. Totally agree with Hells_Belle. It's definitely worth the cost. And the jazz/blues genre is also a good idea (you know, for people to chill out). Everyone agrees on the late-opening. I'm only recently back home after years in foreign lands, and can't believe how early cafes and restaurants close. I don't drink (anymore) and would like somewhere else to go, rather than a bar.

Ice Cream. Mmmmm, I love Ice Cream.

Hells_Belle: I will look into the Serendipity concept. (Froozen hot chocoloate .... excellent).

dahamsta

Only problem with free Wifi is that you run the risk of people sitting around all day taking up valuable space and buying nothing. Free for a half hour or something, sure, and apply for a new DHCP lease at the desk if you need more (and get a cup of coffee and some cake while you're up there).

adam

simu

Late night café, late night café, late night café!

netron

dahamsta wrote:

Only problem with free Wifi is that you run the risk of people sitting around all day taking up valuable space and buying nothing. Free for a half hour or something, sure, and apply for a new DHCP lease at the desk if you need more (and get a cup of coffee and some cake while you're up there).

adam

to be honest, that's all i wanted, the last time i was in Cork. I found the so called "free" wifi was a confusing mixture of Bitbuzz, BT, Eircom, and Smart. An hour for a cup of coffee and a sandwich would be ideal for me.

And more importantly , it would entice me to frequent this establishment over the others. Less hassle.

simu

and a loyalty card!

netron

"And the jazz/blues genre is also a good idea (you know, for people to chill out)."

now that would be very nice... maybe with a bit of the French jazzy/loungecore influence. i'm getting to like this idea. this "place" you have in mind.

boardy

A loyalty card does work. I'm like an idiot carrying around 2 of them in my wallet and paying 4 bucks for a coffee in order to get the 25th one for free (bit of an exaggeration).

A late night café would suit me down to the ground.

dahamsta: Wouldn't I need a DHCP server for leases? Don't want to be concerned with server and equipment. Only really wanted a run-of-the-mill wireless router for Internet access, which would assign the leases. Ideally, I would like the system to inform the user that the lease is about to end, and request a key for a new lease, which can be obtained at the counter. This might guilt them into buying another coffee or slice of chocolate cake.

Hells_Belle

netron wrote:

And more importantly , it would entice me to frequent this establishment over the others. Less hassle.

Exactly! I have to say that in coming to cork from further shores, I find this "we'll swap you 30 minutes for a cup of coffee" semi-paid WiFi thing a total pain in the rear and somehow kind of offensive. Like I'm so stupid I don't know how much they're paying for their WiFi connection? Are they going to charge me for loo roll, too, or can I get one sheet for every biscotti I buy?

I honestly don't think people would randomly crash with no purchase at all. I think it will get feet through the door, and that those people will then come back (with friends) for the great atmosphere, good coffee and yummy cake.

And I am totally digging the blues/jazz thing, too.

nesf

Hells_Belle wrote:

I honestly don't think people would randomly crash with no purchase at all. I think it will get feet through the door, and that those people will then come back (with friends) for the great atmosphere, good coffee and yummy cake.

Tbh, people would skive for nothing. It's not nice, but people are like that. For every decent person who'd buy a cup or two of tea to go with their surfing you'd get 4 muppets who'd bring in their own water and sandwiches, and who'd bitch about the prices there.

nesf

boardy wrote:

A late night café would suit me down to the ground.

Tbh, be open late at night, ie 3am+ and have a good selection teas and I can promise you'll have at least one loyal customer.

Insomniacs are not catered for at all in cork.

dahamsta

You could go with a bog-standard AP, sure, however you're not going to be able to do timed leases with it, and there are other factors too, like managing abuse and security. Security in particular, since you're the one that's going to have to answer questions if your network is used for criminal activity; which is increasingly likely these days as nefarious types pop into free wireless zones to run their eBay and advance-free frauds, even a little spamming. You need logging (and CCTV) to protect against this.

Possibly more expensive AP's support lease management and logging and the like, but I'd bet you'd buy a second-hand machine and a modem and wireless card off someone for the same price or cheaper, and there's plenty of Linux-heads on the CLUG mailing list that'd happily help you set something up. I'd nearly do the basics meself on the cheap just to have a go off it, never set up a café before. But best post on CLUG if you're interested, you might get one of the whizkids at a loose end.

EDIT: And of course you could run your website and email off the same machine, run a proxy server to keep the real nasty stuff out, etc.

adam

boardy

I hear what you are saying nesf. Probably the same reason why All You Can Eat Buffets won't work in Ireland.
But why should they mess it up for everyone else?

No outside drinks or food allowed (Community Rule Number 1).

Oh yeah, for music. People can bring their own compilations and see if others like it. We will have an MP3 player.

boardy

You're hired Adam (for all you can eat chocolate cake for the day). I'll buy a cheap linux box and we'll figure out a security solution. My biggest concern is porn though, especially the type that can get me arrested. Wonder how Starbucks blocks that. I know that you can block the usual suspects but what about the fly-by-nights sites? It's easy to monitor logs but that's after the fact. Maybe if a key word was found on a log, then an audible popup message could go to the counter with the terminal ID.

But that's a whole other thread .....

dahamsta

boardy wrote:

You're hired Adam (for all you can eat chocolate cake for the day). I'll buy a cheap linux box and we'll figure out a security solution.

I'm a little bit more expensive than chocolate cake - although you wouldn't think it to look at me - but sure, when you're ready to go gimme a shout and I'll see what I can do. If I can't help you, I know people that can.

My biggest concern is porn though, especially the type that can get me arrested.

It just so happens I'm a CensorNet reseller!

Nah, CensorNet wouldn't actually suit you because you'd need an additional box, however there are alternatives such as Dan's Guardian and ClarkConnect. Subscription required if you want to do it properly, but not that expensive in my experience.

adam

netron

just use a squid proxy on your linux box. that'll block the pr0n sites.. there might be a list of banned ip addresses or websites you can download and add to your squid ban list.


oops - just read dahamsta's post above. i'd go with that. sounds like he knows what he's on about.

rymus

netron wrote:

just read dahamsta's post above. i'd go with that. sounds like he knows what he's on about.

I vividly remember a conversation in the pub that went along the same lines as the above

dudara

nesf wrote:

Tbh, be open late at night, ie 3am+ and have a good selection teas and I can promise you'll have at least one loyal customer.

Insomniacs are not catered for at all in cork.

Ditto, and did I mention that I want really good cake! So important.

The wifi is a great bonus, because if you were a late night cafe, I'd be a dedicated customer, so getting a benefit like surfing would be just the icing on the cake!

Re the loyalty cards, at the moment in my wallet I have cards for Cafe Gusto, Nosh + Coffee, Insomnia, the cafe near the Gate, and also one for the Gate Cinema itself. I love things like that!

D-Generate

Call the place "Coffee Cake" or "Pie and Wi-Fi"