Young thugs using soccer games in city for violence

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From the Indo

Young thugs using soccer games in city for violence

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TEENAGERS and young males are using Dublin soccer games as a vehicle for violence, according to a hard-hitting report from a committee chaired by UEFA disciplinary inspector Des Casey.

The Casey Committee investigated incidents that occurred at three games within a three-week period earlier this summer and concluded the Eircom League is facing a serious threat from thugs.

The report stated: "Militant elements of teenagers and young males who align themselves to National League teams view matches, especially those of a traditional crunch nature between rival clubs, as a vehicle for violent behaviour, hooliganism and general misconduct.

"If something concrete is not done to curb this trend, the committee feel strongly its clearly going to be detrimental to the league's future development."

The three-man committee, which also included Eircom League chairman Paddy McCaul and treasurer Eamonn Naughton, delivered their report to the Eircom League's Board of Control yesterday afternoon after an 11-week investigation.

The committee's work focused on incidents around three Dublin matches involving Shamrock Rovers, Bohemians and Shelbourne. The games under investigation were the May 27 meeting between Bohs and Shels, the June 4 clash of Rovers and Bohs, and the June 17 match between Shels and Rovers.

The board has pledged to implement the recommendations. It also decided to forward the report to the league's management committee where any decision on disciplinary action against the three clubs involved will be taken.

The Casey Committee expressed concerned at the blatant animosity and ill-will that seems to prevail between some club officials and noted that in the 13-month period preceding these three games, club officials from the three clubs had been the subject of 17 sanctions by the league's disciplinary commission.

It recommended that the league should introduce a code of ethics to determine acceptable behaviour levels for managers, players, club officials and supporters with strong penalties for those breaching this new code of conduct.

It has called for increased powers for the disciplinary commission to allow them the authority to initiate investigations that may not have been covered in the reports of referees or match delegates.

The committee also wants the powers of match delegates increased and has recommended for 'Category A High Risk' games there should be an obligation on the visiting club to provide a suitable number of stewards to supervise their fans.

The Casey Committee found that security and stewarding at the Bohemians versus Shelbourne game on May 27, for example, had been inadequate and this led to Shels manager Pat Fenlon being verbally abused by Bohs supporters. The committee has advocated that a proper players tunnel should be installed at Dalymount Park.

It also slammed Bohs for permitting a half-time protest by fans using flares and recommended that the league should have a zero tolerance policy on flares.

Gerry McDermott

I do not go to EL games so I don’t know what it is actually like on the ground but this behaviour coupled with the overall booze driven yobish behaviour that takes place every weekend all over the county could tarnish the good name of Ireland travelling support.
In Paris there were pockets of idiots around the place and a few exchanges of bottles between Irish ‘fans’ and locals of North African extraction.
I’d imagine something similar happening in Cyprus after a weeks drinking.
With the advent of low cost air travel it much easier for a bunch of ‘lads’ to get to an away game in a European city and after a feed of local brew start acting the same way as they would in their home town, to the detriment of more law abiding fans.

mike65

The riotous behaviour of Shamock Rovers fans was highlighted again on Mondays Liveline (RTE radio) after the weekend game against Shels. Rovers supporters were jumping on any Shels fan they could get at after the game.

Mike.

jubbly

Where are the Garda in all this ?

Shamrock Rover fans are f'ing animals

MrJoeSoap

jubbly wrote:

Shamrock Rover fans are f'ing animals

Woah there horsey! Its only a small minority of scumbags who travel to Rovers games intent on causing trouble.

Just because Rovers do have the worst (in terms of numbers) problem with hooliganism doesn't justify that statement you made.

In fairness, the study above took Bohs, Rovers and Shels into consideration and then took that as a generalisation for the entire city so straight away it is flawed. I was at the June 17th Shels-Rovers game and the Rovers fans did invade the pitch at the end and run to taunt the Shels fans in the New Stand. Other than that, I didn't see anything that I would term "hooliganism". Bohs-Rovers games have an association with violence (mostly outside the ground) as almost all Bohs/Rovers fans here will admit. Other than that, I don't really see much of a problem with violence in the league, and I've been to almost every ground in the country and visit Dublin grounds very regularly when I can't make it down the country.

I've been to so many Dublin derbys I can't even begin to count them and I've never seen, let alone been involved in, any major fights (before last Friday).

Maybe its just because I'm a Shels fan . . .

Draupnir

I couldnt agree more with this. I've said it before on this forum, the mob mentality within certain Eircom League clubs is crazy. Its the reason I dont go to Dalymount anymore.

20 Times 20 Times

Draupnir wrote:

I couldnt agree more with this. I've said it before on this forum, the mob mentality within certain Eircom League clubs is crazy. Its the reason I dont go to Dalymount anymore.

Never let anyone stop you from going to see your team play EVER ! i think thats terrible reason your giving , you dont have to stand with these fans the ground is big enough to find a place for you to watch and take in the game and never mind what is going on around you . Why should you stop going to see your team play because of a small manority ?

Draupnir

The atmosphere is at times, unsavoury and I would prefer not to be associated with these people.

20 Times 20 Times

Draupnir wrote:

The atmosphere is at times, unsavoury and I would prefer not to be associated with these people.

Your a barstool supporter then ! FACT

The Insider

jubbly wrote:

Shamrock Rover fans are f'ing animals

I am a rovers fan does that make me a f'ing animal??
As MrJoeSoap as said it is only a small minority of scumbags, not all rovers fans who cause the trouble.

talla

jubbly wrote:

Where are the Garda in all this ?

Shamrock Rover fans are f'ing animals

Comments like that are not allowed on this baord. There does appear to problems with a section of their support but theres no way you can get away with comments like that. It's the exact same if you turned around and said the same statement and called all united/ Liverpool/ Aresenal (substitute whatever team you want in here) animals.
Banned for a week.

Einstürzende and redspider also banned as sponsors.

MrJoeSoap

More Fines dished out today, each of which relates to the games studied in the above article.

Draupnir

Sarge wrote:

Your a barstool supporter then ! FACT

Not completely true, I went to every home game in the 2002 season and a lot in the 2001 season. I just gave up when I started to dislike the atmosphere and the way the club and league was heading.

If the clubs and league were promoted and aimed at the right kind of demographics and if policing/stewarding was at a higher more professional level. I would go back no problem.

Bateman

Can't believe it took so long for jubbly to be banned. Don't have time to go into this report at the moment (I'm busy making offensive flags), but I will be on here quite a bit in the next week or so...

KdjaCL

Draupnir wrote:

If the clubs and league were promoted and aimed at the right kind of demographics and if policing/stewarding was at a higher more professional level. I would go back no problem.

Be glad you never went in the 80s, tbh this is nothing compared to what used to on. Its exactly the same as what goes on at every football ground or around the area of one whenever any 2 teams are playing. Its never going to stop, not on the small few Bohs fans to the thousands of fenerbache fans.


Not going to any game because of it is kinda ludicrous, i was at a Leeds vs Utd (when Leeds were good)game a few years ago and some of the **** i seen was unreal. I went back to house we were staying at and stuck on Sky news expecting so see the mass riots and beatsing Utd fans got but oddly nothing not a mention of it, not even in the papers the next day. I was shocked but the mates fmaily who lived in leeds filled me in on why its never ever mentioned in the media unless its english fans away.

The idea behind it will never stop, there will always be scum at games intent on causing trouble.

kdjac

Jonny Arson

KdjaC wrote:

Not going to any game because of it is kinda ludicrous, i was at a Leeds vs Utd (when Leeds were good)game a few years ago and some of the **** i seen was unreal. I went back to house we were staying at and stuck on Sky news expecting so see the mass riots and beatsing Utd fans got but oddly nothing not a mention of it, not even in the papers the next day. I was shocked but the mates fmaily who lived in leeds filled me in on why its never ever mentioned in the media unless its english fans away.

If people feel that they are in danger going to football matches then why should they go to games feeling that way? People should put their safety before any football team. Forget what's going on in England. In England there is far more people going to games. There are clubs in this league who get attendances of 2,000 and have a hooligan problem. If this country had the same amount of people going ot games I guarantee you there would be a far serious hooligan problem.

I'm considering not going to matches involving Shamrock Rovers and Bohemians in the future. At the last 4 matches I've been to as a Shelbourne fan involving these two clubs I've felt nervous and unsafe going to them. Last June after the Tolka match I had my head kicked in by Rovers fans and after the Bohs match last month I was assaulted by a Bohs fan. What happened on Friday night at Dalymount made me feel frightened and I feared for my safety. It can't go on. There is a serious problem with hooliganism involving Bohs and Rovers and giving them warnings is not good enough. Attendances are falling. Gosh I wonder why? Action needs to be taken because someone is going to get badly hurt. It's a ticking timebomb waiting to happen.

applehunter

Rovers have banned those fans and if there is any credibility with the new ownership then they will get rid of this element once and for all.

The last owners let it go on for way too long.

Jonny Arson

What I find annoying there has been no statement from the 400 club condeming what happened on Friday night. Are they afraid of some of the thugs in their fanbase I wonder?

KdjaCL

Zane from MTV2 wrote:

What I find annoying there has been no statement from the 400 club condeming what happened on Friday night. Are they afraid of some of the thugs in their fanbase I wonder?

I could name 3 who are in the 400 club and were "involved" with the Shels fans. Previous regimes couldnt do anything as 90% of the element were keeping the club alive, now the new regime will have to do something.


kdjac

Jonny Arson

KdjaC wrote:

I could name 3 who are in the 400 club and were "involved" with the Shels fans.

I find that quite unsettling.

blu_sonic

some of the 400 club have been banned, i was at the shells match in question and i happened to be right beside the hooligan element (i have a spot i stand at and i go there regardless) and all through the match there were shels fans inching there way over to the divide and start motioning for the rovers fans to "come and have a go", (i've never seen the like with shels before,and i prsume they were there for violence alone) they lurched around the back of the shed end and were twice approached by the garda, i left with 5mins to go, so i never saw the fighting.


the previous match was in derry w/Rovers, the rovers fans fought themselves, a flag got thrown into the crowd, it kicked of from there, a fine of €1000 and the threat of behind closed doors games ensuied but has since declined

also remember the setanta cup?

there will be a casual support with anyclub generally, if they fight themselves away from the football going public, away from the matchs and don't drag in the clubs then i wouldn't care, but it tar's us all, i can see wht that chap made a silly statment about all us hoops being animals, poeple say nonsense like this as a knee jerk reaction

sorry to drag up such an old post, but i was trying for membership when i read it the 1st time

blu_sonic

ps. you'd be surprized at how old some of them are

Jonny Arson

blu_sonic wrote:

some of the 400 club have been banned, i was at the shells match in question and i happened to be right beside the hooligan element (i have a spot i stand at and i go there regardless) and all through the match there were shels fans inching there way over to the divide and start motioning for the rovers fans to "come and have a go", (i've never seen the like with shels before,and i prsume they were there for violence alone) they lurched around the back of the shed end and were twice approached by the garda, i left with 5mins to go, so i never saw the fighting.

Apart from a bunch of 10 year old idiots kicking the crap out of each other over the divide area no Shels fans went anywhere near the divide. On the ultra MB, Rovers fans were saying this group who were ''motioning'' and ''gesturing'' for a fight were at the front of the Shed which happened to be where I was standing with my mates. We were accused on the site of gesturing for a fight and we were also accused of being hooligans because we didn't wear Shels shirts and because were sending text messages to our friends. :rolleyes: Not one of us ever gestured for a fight and not one of us are hooligans.

At the back of the Shed that night there were a few muppets (5 or 6 of them) who we call the DGB (Dutch Gold Brigade). I didn't keep my eye on them in the 2nd half been at the front but if there were any trouble makers amongst our fans on that night it would have been them but that pales into comparison the disgusting acts of some of your ''fans'' that night. I've not heard any of our fans talking about the DGB on that particular night (we have always bashed them in conversations or on shels.com when they've been up to no good) so my suspicion is that Rovers fans are looking for yet another excuse for their actions. Gestures or not Rovers fans would have been waiting outside for us no matter what.

The 400 club are the owners of Shamrock Rovers Football Club and the now fact that some of the them are nothing but football hooligans IMO is a complete outrage and disgrace. Shelbourne Football Club or it's fans have not recieved an apology from SRFC or the 400 club. How on earth Rovers only recieved a fine and yet another slap across the wrist about that night is a disgrace.

blu_sonic

all due respect i know waht i saw, when the 2nd goal was scored they ran (yes ran) forward towards the advertising boards and gave the come on gesture, i never once said that rovers were innocent, there is an element that should be removec i agree but the post you just left makes the shels crowd sound like the boy scouts on parade.


i'm not looking for an excuse nor should any rovers fan but atleast admit that there was a hooligan element in your crowd

also i wouldn't know about who was on mobile phones or wearing jerseys, that is a non-runner in my book, short of some trigger happy tv lad asking for a firm of cashies to turn up mobile mean nothing, (sure i rang for a lift home w/10 mins to go, i'm no cashie) jersey or not doesn't make a fan, my mate doesn't wear colours just isn't into that

Jonny Arson

blu_sonic wrote:

all due respect i know waht i saw, when the 2nd goal was scored they ran (yes ran) forward towards the advertising boards and gave the come on gesture, i never once said that rovers were innocent, there is an element that should be removec i agree but the post you just left makes the shels crowd sound like the boy scouts on parade.

I was one of the people celebrating the goal scored from the penalty and I climed the advertising boards to celebrate so i don't have a recollection of who was doing what at that particular moment but could you describe what were the exact gestures? I think every fan (including the angelic me :rolleyes: ) gives some sort of gesture towards rival fans be it a fist in the air or waving your arms but a ''come on'' gesture I'd find hardly reeks of hooliganism TBH unless if it's right in the faces of the opposition fans. Something like a cut-throat gesture or pointing a finger to a certain area outside the ground I'd find serious but a ''come on'' gesture is something that goes on in next to near every eL game be it Shels, Rovers, Bohs, Bray or UCD.

Ronan|Raven

And then you have a sizeable crowd that were down supporting shels last night in longford singng songs about the john carthy incident in Abbeylara. Tossers is the only word to describe them.

MrJoeSoap

Those muppets were at the Shels-Pats game too. That was the first time I've heard that song. Can't say I recognised any of them either.

Ronan|Raven

Were you there Joe? Would have bought you a steaming hot mug of tea if I had known! No beer till the license is in!

They seemed an odd bunch allright, the guy who hopped on the pitch after the 2nd goal seemed to think he was the real hardman. There was some tit as well walking past us (was stood in section o) when they were moving behind the goal for the 2nd half carrying a toygun. Found it all most odd!

Jonny Arson

Ronan|Raven wrote:

And then you have a sizeable crowd that were down supporting shels last night in longford singng songs about the john carthy incident in Abbeylara. Tossers is the only word to describe them.

I've heard this song been sung for the past couple of weeks. I thought it was some silly piss take at the gardai since I didn't even know who John Carthy was or where Abbeylara is so I didn't take it seriously but realising about what the song is about has brought my impression of that song from being a silly piece of idioticy to something quite sinister since it was sung right infront of the Longford fans and someone brought a toy handgun to the match. I'm not denying that we have a few muppets amongst our fanbase and the fact that some of the lads are pushing things to the limits but I want to reiterate that we do not have a hooligan element but a few mindless idiots amongst our fanbase who need a wake up call. I don't like to hear about things like this and I do not like to see our generally excellent supporters recieve a bashing as a result of some idiots without a brain and too much alcohol on them.

BTW I wasn't at the match.

MrJoeSoap

I wasn't in Longford unfortunately. I work Saturdays so don't get to those away games. Can anyone tell me the reason behind the Abbeylara song? I just find it so incredibly stupid. Is it meant to provoke the Gardai or what?

Slash/ED

It's a song about how incompetent the police are, not glorifying his killing or anything like that. Quite the opposiate really.

Though it has nothing to do with football obviously. I wasn't singing it myself, but if it caused offence to anyone then I'm very sorry to hear that.

As for the toygun, some kids brought that I think. No idea why, but Digger got a hold of it and pretended to shoot the Shels fans, along with his other typically heroic antics. Can't believe that'll be the last I see of him, one of the ELs best characters.

MrJoeSoap

'Digger the Human Highlighter' will be missed alright.