Use of indicator at roundabouts

0utshined

I'm gonna disagree with you Seamus. As I understand Hagar's method if Driver A had intended going round the roundabout they would (should) have been in the right hand lane not the lane.

Any system is only going to be as good as the people taking part in it but as you've said yourself at the moment there is guesswork involved when a car has no indicators on. You can be fairly sure they're going straight through but the no-indicator brigade mean you can never be 100%.

You mention that my prefered option would cause more delays. It possibly would but I'd prefer to err on the side of caution with things like this and would rather a delay than an accident.

seamus wrote:

Indication is for the benefit of other road users, to help them make decisions, which in turn aids their progress.

Ultimately both systems fall down at the same point - the drivers.

I agree with you on these points. I find the first one is missed by a large percentage of drivers in this country but that's a topic for another thread.

Capt'n Midnight

You always indicate left when leaving a roundabout.

If you are leaving on the 1st exit, you just indicate left.

If you are leaving on the 2nd exit, you don't indicate as you enter the roundabout and as soon as you pass the first exit you start indicating left.

If you are leaving by the 3rd or subsquent roundabout you indicate right as you enter the roundabout, and then indicate left when you get to your turn.

So on Walkinstown roundabout going straight through (exit 3) you indicate right as you enter it in the middle lane.

It's the 3 way roundabouts at nearly-T junctions that are really confusing - in theory you should never indicate right on them unless you are doing a U-turn, in practice you take it slow on them because no one seems to know how to indicate on them. one of the many different conventions seems to be that people indicate right if the turn is more than 180 degrees away.

DubTony

0utshined wrote:

I'm gonna disagree with you Seamus. As I understand Hagar's method if Driver A had intended going round the roundabout they would (should) have been in the right hand lane not the lane.

If a driver enters a roundabout in the left lane with the intention of going straight and uses his right indicator, the driver behind him to the right who is going right will get confused as to the first drivers intention and will have to sit back expecting the fist driver to go right by either cutting across or following the left lane all the way round, but the first driver will go straight and the driver will have been delayed by a few seconds for no reason and if 20,000 cars a day did that everyone would be confused and very late for work.

DubTony

Capt'n Midnight wrote:

It's the 3 way roundabouts at nearly-T junctions that are really confusing - in theory you should never indicate right on them unless you are doing a U-turn, in practice you take it slow on them because no one seems to know how to indicate on them.

Agreed, take it slow. Disagree with indicating. There are 3 of these things where I live and using th indicator to turn right is essential as cars coming toward you expect you to indicate if you're going to go across them. If you don't there's the sudden braking thing going. And anyway, doesn't the guy behind deserve to know that you're going right?

As for Walkinstown roundabout. Well, everyone to his own. I wouldn't indicate your way on it, but it's a free for all anyway. Strangely, I've only seen or heard of a handful of accidents on it in the last 20 years .

Seth Brundle

DubTony wrote:

As for Walkinstown roundabout.
...
Strangely, I've only seen or heard of a handful of accidents on it in the last 20 years .

Same here but it is intimidating for a newbie/nervous driver.

Regarding the best choice of signalling, etc. on Irish roundabouts - personally I don't see the point in discussing it here as people in this country cannot drive and you will always come across bad driving daily:-
* approaching the roundabout in an incorect lane
* entering the roundabout in an incorrect lane
* bad lane manouvre tactics whilst on the roundabout
* indicating incorrectly or not at all
* exiting the roundabout in the incorrect lane
* probably loads more

Given that our government cannot give proper instructions on how to use roundabouts (or on most other driving skills!) whats the point in us deciding on whats best? Until there is proper training with a coherent set of driving guidelines, followed up by proper enforcement, nothing will change!

[apols of I sound kinda cranky - I kinda am!]

_Kaiser_

To be honest I don't like roundabouts anyway because of the guesswork involved as described here where people either don't indicate at all (very common around Blanch) or have their own system which may or may not make much sense depending on your point of view.

It's a lazy solution anyway IMHO.. better to put in a proper junction with lights I think.

Seth Brundle

Kaiser2000 wrote:

It's a lazy solution anyway IMHO.. better to put in a proper junction with lights I think.

...but you still get fúckwits who don't know how to use them - amber/red gamblers, not understanding filters, not understanding yellow box rules, etc.

seamus

Kaiser2000 wrote:

It's a lazy solution anyway IMHO.. better to put in a proper junction with lights I think.

I disagree. There are plenty of times when a roundabout is the logical choice so as to cause minimum delay. Especially in the evenings, roundabouts allow you to navigate quiet roads effortlessly and efficiently without having to stop for lights when no other vehicle is using the junction.

Unless you're saying that the Blanch roundabout is a lazy option where I agree. All motorway interchanges should be pure slip road, and no lights.

mike65

here's my 4 turn roundabout diagram.



I have'nt crashed or being crash into on a roundabout yet.

Mike.

mackerski

mike65 wrote:

here's my 4 turn roundabout diagram.

That's exactly right - though you omitted the possibility of approaching in the right lane for straight on. Your diagram does a particularly good job of illustrating why the conventions are the way they are - your lines don't cross each other, ergo, they represent a usage that will not cause collisions.

Dermot

Hagar

It has to be said Mike that's an excellent diagram.

Seth Brundle

Good diagram as already mentioned. However, not all roundabouts are as straight forward. M50/N3 (Blanch) roundabout springs to mind. Heading outbound the roundabout suddenly changes from being a wide two laner to a three laner with no notice. Frequently people don't know which lane to be in and whether or not they need to indicate as they may or may not really be changing lane depending on how you view it!

BrianD3

TBH, there's always going to be confusion when it comes to roundabouts. Even in this thread there seem to be differing opinions as to what you're supposed to do if you're taking a 2nd exit which is past 12 o'clock on an imaginary clock face. My ISM instructor taught me to treat this like a 3rd exit (approach in RH lane, indicate right and then left) and this method feels "right" to me. But then others say that it's irrelvant whether the exit is past 12 o clock or not, that a 2nd exit is a 2nd exit and that you should just indicate left after you pass the 1st exit. Does the ROTR say anything about this?

One other thing to mention is that sometimes the design of the roundabouts and inconsistencies in design can confuse people. Eg 3 lane roundabouts where road markings tell you that you can take the 3rd exit from the middle lane. Drivers see this and then apply this principle to all roundabouts and use lanes other than the rightmost lane to take the 3rd exit. So then we get the annoyance of drivers going all the way around a 2 lane roundabout in the left lane and cutting up drivers who are going straight.

hmmm

I wouldn't mind some advice as to how to indicate on those insane roundabouts off the M50. E.g. approaching the Red Cow roundabout from the Long Mile road direction, where lanes change in the middle of the roundabout itself. It's all very well if you know what is about to happen (but even then..), but if you're new to the area you end up indicating in about 20 different directions to move left, on the roundabout, so as to try and get into a lane which will let you hit the M50 northwards.

BrianD3

hmmm wrote:

I wouldn't mind some advice as to how to indicate on those insane roundabouts off the M50. E.g. approaching the Red Cow roundabout from the Long Mile road direction, where lanes change in the middle of the roundabout itself. It's all very well if you know what is about to happen (but even then..), but if you're new to the area you end up indicating in about 20 different directions to move left, on the roundabout, so as to try and get into a lane which will let you hit the M50 northwards.

I'm not familiar with the Mad Cow (thank god) but the Lucan roundabout has improved in the last few months thanks to a slight change to the road markings and layout. Now, if you're heading south along the M50 and want to head west at the roundabout, you no longer end up changing lanes in the middle of the roundabout. Also, the way it's setup now it's much less likely that you'll get muppets going all the way around the roundabout while keeping left.

Capt'n Midnight

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roundabout

Animated Gif showing how to indicate and use lanes (86KB) - http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/e/ec/UK_Roundabout_8_Cars.gif

magic roundabout pic
http://carcino.gen.nz/images/image.phpi/7db3cb30/roundabout.jpg&cb=1115204527

Another one

Hagar

Would anyone like to explain how to negotiate this roundabout...

A bright shiny penny for anyone who can

The Magic Roundabout, Swindon, UK

Capt'n Midnight

Hagar wrote:

Would anyone like to explain how to negotiate this roundabout...

A bright shiny penny for anyone who can

The Magic Roundabout, Swindon, UK

You could go clockwise on the outer roundabouts taking the second exit each time until you get used to it. Then you'd have the option of taking the the third exit on one of the miniroundabouts and and go counter clockwise around the middle.

Hagar

Aha.. but where would you indicate...

I favour putting a revolving amber light on each corner of the roof and hope for the best.

PM me and I'll organise your penny.