Matthews wishes to revert

gimmick

Alan Matthews reckons that reverting back to a 'winter' league would help crowds in the eL. There is an article in todays Mirror about it. Apparently Finn Harps are agreeable also.

Now, the 3 year trial period of 'summer season' is up at the end of this one. In that 3 years, IMO, the league has seen success beyond what we have seen in many years

Shams prgressed in the inter toto, beating a Polish side home and away
Bohs progressed beating BATE Borisov in the CL qualifiers, before losing to Rosenbourg

Cork City progressed to the quarter final of the Inter toto, winning a few games along the way
Shels got to the 3rd qualifier of the CL

Cork City in the 1st round proper of the UEFA
Shels losing to Steua Bucharest in the 2nd qualifier.

Apart from Longford, most teams who have been in Europe are making quite a go of it. They are the only team to consistently screw up against mighty teams like FC Vaduz and Camarthen Town. City and Shels on the other hand have some notable scalps like Malmo, Djurgarden, Hadjuk Split to their names.

Is it because Mattews is bitter that he has made no progress, or does he genuinely believe that these clubs would have made such progress anyways?

Does he think the eL would atract, or indeed, be able to hold onto some of its better talent, in a winter league? In years gone by, Europe was seen as one big gate, and if an irish club was drawn away first, they would strive to switch the ties so as to have an oppurtunity of a big gate. That doesnt happen anymore.

Maybe Alan Matthews should look closer to home as to why Longford Town are getting poor gates, they play shockingly poor football, which would turn off even the most ardent of fans.

Whats are peoples opinions on this???

eirebhoy

From what I've read over the last week it seems Matthews main gripe is that players don't get to take summer holidays. He wants a 2 week break in one of the summer months.

KdjaCL

Is the rumour true that Longford intend to make an attack on an opponents goal in the next few weeks?

It has its pluses and minuses i wouldnt mind going back to winter league i miss being cold at games and the lights being on. Dunno when its cold the players seem to run more

Cork may have the worst possible preseason ever if they can beat Slavia next week. They could be still playing after the league is finsihed. Same could be said for Shels had they progressed to the CL. Regardless of whether it was possible for both to do it , it was the aim.

The original aim of summer soccer was to get to this stage where we felt we could progress in Europe. So with the advent of the Setanta cup and the possibility that you could earn more in that than in Europe, is there a need for summer soccer anymore.

Im easy either way but feel attds are down during the summer months and only pickup when other leagues are in action. We would get more on a friday if there was PL and euro action on the saturday than if it was like june or somfin.

ehh there was a 2 week break during the summer?

kdjac

gimmick

eirebhoy wrote:

He wants a 2 week break in one of the summer months.

Which would probably be a good idea. A 2 week break around the start of September would be a great idea. If teams are still firing on all fronts, a break would let them rest, and less chance of burn out and/or injury.

As it stands, the close season is too long, and the season is too short. Look at the problem encountered by Cork City and Shels this season after European matches, having to go away and play again a few days later. if this league wanst to progress, our Euro representatives should be given some bit of leeway with the fixtures. An extension of a week at both ends of the season of a week would help no end. Longford themseleves have been victims of their own success in the Cups in recent seasons - having to play 6 games in 20 days at the tail end of the last 2 seasons.

However, going back to a winter league will cause more problems than it'll solve.

kdjac wrote:

The original aim of summer soccer was to get to this stage where we felt we could progress in Europe.

Do you think progress could be made in Europe at this stage if the league reverted? Do you not think that this progress has been made as a result of the switch to the summer months? Its obvious to me that match fitness is at a peak by the times our representatives Kick off in Europe.

So with the advent of the Setanta cup and the possibility that you could earn more in that than in Europe, is there a need for summer soccer anymore.

The setanta cup is still very flegling,a nd the coming seasons competition will tell if it survives. Also, the cash prize may be alot smaller this time round, as attendences in general were poor, and I somehow doubt the tv figures were huge (though I really havent a clue if they were or not).

Besides, a player wont move to LOI football to play Setanta Cup football, he will come to play UEFA/CL football, and like it or not, our league is only a few short years, in the current format, from participating in the group stages.

Running Bing

I actually much prefered winter football. I thought the atmosphere was somehow better with the cold nights and all that. Must admit after the advent of summer football I kinda lost interest and stopped going(Not just because of that obviously). Have attendences improved at all? I use to go to richmond park and at times attendences were quite good but at other times it was pretty bad.

Never really thought summer football would work(attendence wise) with people going on holidays and I never felt there was any truth in the theory that people would become more interested with no English football on. So whats it like these days?

applehunter

I think Matthews need to look closer to home.

His philosophy of football comes from his years under Keeley's wing.

There are pros and cons to both.

I do think that the quality of play is much better and skillul players can prosper.

gimmick

Babybing wrote:

Have attendences improved at all?

For some teams, yes. For CCFC it has been a roaring success. But to measure and rate a summer season, purely on an attendance barometer is wrong. Attendances may have stayed the same (dont anyone tell me it has a very noticable bad impact), but, and this is the crux of the matter, our teams participating in european competition have started making good progress. No longer is it a fluke or a novelty for an irish team to progress, its expected.

This will have a knock on effect ie in attendances. If our nation of barstool football watchers se that there actually is a domestic game which looks glamorous, like Skys product, they will start going, and realsie there is more to wwatching football than sitting in a pub/on the couch, drinking a beer. Its most certainly alrady happening in Cork, and Shels defo have a few more fans following their exploits last season.

I thought the atmosphere was somehow better with the cold nights and all that.

If by 'and all that' means the cold pissing rain, games being called off due to waterlogged/frozen pitches is better than watching a game in a tshirt, wearing sunglasses, well then, we msut be very different human beings

I admit, the winter season has merit. I miss Citys game at Xmas singing "oh what fun it is to see Cork City win away", but other than that, the summer season has so much more going for it.

applehunter wrote:

His philosophy of football comes from his years under Keeley's wing

Keeley was a succesful manager!

KdjaCL

I dont think summer soccer has anything to do with better players at the better teams, fair enough they were fitter when the Euro games came around but still the same players mostly professional.

The opposite side of that was they were unfit for setanta.


kdjac

Slash/ED

Which will no longer be an issue when it starts in November or so from now on.

And the games under the lights having better atmosphere is reason to keep summer soccer. It means the crucial league decideing games have that atmosphere

Afterall, the season doesn't start and end in the summer. Reverting wont actually solve any problems at all, it's an idiotic suggestion.

applehunter

gimmick wrote:

Keeley was a succesful manager!

So, is Matthews.

I prefer to see teams going out to win instead of going out "not trying to lose"

That sounds the same but its different.

gimmick

I could be wrong in saying this, but is the next Setanta Cup happening in November?

EDIT: Ah, I see Slash has that answered for me

applehunter

We still have 2 1/2 months of football under lights left.

KdjaCL

bah lightweights, dont you miss having 5 pairs of socks on Belfield and still not feeling your toes? Or your xmas piss up with Pats/Cork/Shels fans wearing santy hats to the games etc

Football on a sunny friday night is just wrong and we been **** since the change .


kdjac

MrJoeSoap

I'm still all for the summer soccer myself. I can't see a decent argument against it.

Alan Matthews came out and said that he wanted a two week break because some of his players were only part-time and wanted holidays during the summer. I can understand the case for a two-week break from the "injury/burnout" perspective Gimmick gave but if Longford's players want to take summer holidays in the middle of a season, I think they need some new players.

Matthews is doing the best he can do with what he has, usually it means sitting back and trying to soak up as much pressure as he can. His team play a boring style of football and as a result, the attendances suffer.

There is no reason why summer soccer shouldn't work. There are no postponements due to frozen or waterlogged pitches (*Cough* Buckley Park, *Cough* Tolka Park), the weather is significantly better for most of the time; meaning improved ground conditions and training facilities, and the attendances, in my opinion do not directly suffer.

I was a regular Shelbourne fan for the past 8 or 9 seasons, attending games whenever I could, or whenever I felt like it, until this season when I purchased my first season ticket. Not exactly much of a case-study, I'll admit, but I'm sure there are plenty more like me. I've been to every home game this season and I have to say that I haven't noticed much of a change in the attendances. The bigger games, like the derby games, always get a good crowd, the away support always seems to swell at Tolka Park (*Cough* Pats - sorry, I've an awful cough tonight) and the Shels and Cork European games are great occasions, as well, I'm sure as the rest of our representatives in Europe.

Also, when the European games come around, our players are usually fully fit compared to the opposition who may only have a game or two of preparation done. The change in Irish clubs' European results has been undeniably better since the switch, as Gimmick pointed out.

Now if the only reasons against summer soccer are:

1/ That people enjoy cold weather as it proves their masculinity ,
2/ That people want to sing the X-Mas songs ,
3/ That part-time Longford players want to go on a two-week piss-up to Ibiza,
4/ That Irish people tend to holiday in the Summer.

... then I think we will be enjoying many many more succesful years of summer soccer.

KdjaCL

Your all big girls, there is no for and against either way i dont see how anything has changed. What happened in europe would have happened anyway imo. There is a slight attd drop. I dont mind summer soccer or winter but given a choice would go with winter.



kdjac

Slash/ED

I don't think you can say that about Europe. Take Cork v Djurgardens, I've no doubt they'd have lost if it was winter football as Djurgardens, playing summer football themselves, would have been so much fitter.

I mean pre 2004 an Irish team had only played three or more rounds in Europe once ever. We've had three in the last two years now.

KdjaCL

Slash/ED wrote:

I mean pre 2004 an Irish team had only played three or more rounds in Europe once ever. We've had three in the last two years now.

Pre2004 noone had a good 11 only a good 7 or 8, now there is a good 11 with one or 2 quality players on the bench. For instance Bohs in their good games brought on Harkin as a winger shels brought on hoolihan , Cork brought on some who was also good. Bohs only had a few decent players whereas Shels and cork have more than 11 (picking them at the same time maybe shels problem )

Summer soccer didnt make the teams and players better, evolution did being fitter in the Euro games is a bonus. But those players and clubs are not stupid and would have prepared better than ever whether it was a winter or summer league.


kdjac

gimmick

So you think it is a coincidence that squads are getting better, standard of football is improving, and eL teams are progressing in Europe - and the move to a summer season just happened to come about before all of this?

KdjaCL

So you think it is a coincidence that squads are getting better, standard of football is improving, and eL teams are progressing in Europe

Was heading that way pre summer soccer, with pro clubs , better players more money in wages for players.

It was inevitable that the above would happen with progress made pre summer soccer. So no not coincidence more inevitability.


kdjac

Corben Dallas

The summer season seems to be working well, its really good that EL teams are match fit when they play their Euro games and thats a major benefit becuase it will give them a better chance to progress, rather than first round exits all the time.

They should build in a 2/3 wk summer break (like they do with Formula1) maybe around Aug so that the players & their families get a proper break.

MrJoeSoap

Corben Dallas wrote:

They should build in a 2/3 wk summer break (like they do with Formula1) maybe around Aug so that the players & their families get a proper break.

August is the height of the European campaigns for Irish clubs, they need to be playing reasonably regularly to ensure the best possible preparation. A two week break in June would be acceptable I guess.

applehunter

The league should not have to bow to this pressure from the weak.

We already have this weird format of 33 games thanks to the weaker clubs demanding that the Eircom league being expanded to 12 teams.

Töpher

Thats more of a problem than summer soccer in my books, but what can ya do, they'll keep fiddling till they find some magical fix.

I'm convinced the benefits of summer soccers are too good to turn away, they've all been mentioned above, so no point in me dwelling on them, merely adding my disgust at Matthews demands!

MrJoeSoap

http://www.eleven-a-side.com/shelbourne/irish_soccer_detail.asp?newsid=19159

Derry boss backs summer schedule

September 17, 2005

Derry City manager Stephen Kenny has pledged his support to the current domestic soccer schedule, insisting that the standard of play has risen significantly since the eircom League changed to a summer calendar three years ago.

Longford Town manager Alan Matthews urged the league to revert to an August-May format, as clubs were suffering from a drop in attendances and part-time players were unable to take family holidays during the summer months.

However, Derry supremo Kenny disagrees, insisting that attendances will improve once the standard continues to rise.

He said: “People can say crowds haven’t been up but you need more than a change of season to do that.

“I think the standard has risen. The better players can express themselves better. Summer soccer is a definite success in terms of training facilities, good players and good pitches.

“Do people really to go back to January and waterlogged pitches and high winds games decided by wind, one half with the wind, one half against?”

Jonny Arson

applehunter wrote:

The league should not have to bow to this pressure from the weak.

We already have this weird format of 33 games thanks to the weaker clubs demanding that the Eircom league being expanded to 12 teams.

IMO the 12 team structure with 33 games and 3 matches vs each team is better than the 10 team system introduced a few seasons ago. The same teams playing each other over and over again every 10 weeks was tedious.