Peter Crouch

Pigman II

Tusky wrote:

This thread is getting fairly annoying at this stage!

Agreed.

It's long and missing the initial target. Much like Peter Crouch.

p.pete

Tusky wrote:

This thread is getting fairly annoying at this stage!

and yet you still read it? (you don't have to you know).

TheMonster

Whats the verdict on the big man now? Still don't think he can cut it at that level. His general play is ok, his heading is awful.

PL Stats

Appearances: 22
Minutes on pitch: 1526
Subs. (on/off): 3/14
Assists: 2
Caught offside: 8
Crosses: 1

Goals: 4
Shots on goal: 25
Shots/goal: 5.00
Minutes per goal: 381mins
Avg goals/game: 0.18
Pens taken/scored: 0/0
Last goal: 471mins


He avergages 1 shot on goal every 60 mins :eek:

As for Morientes he doesn't even average a shot every 90 mins its 15 in 1390 mins(=92+mins)
Cisse's is 66.

BolBill

Crouch can get lost IMO. Hes a joke, how people rate him is bizarre. A few England caps and hes good. On Sundasy he wass rubbish, cheatsea defenders casually took the ball off him, it was so annoying to watch.

As I said at the start of the season, how can a player that has moved from club to club suddenly become good enough to play for the Champions of Europe ? They can't , Rafa has f88ked up bigtime with him, Moro and loaning out Pongolle. Fowler needs games, Cisse needs to leave.

redspider

My opinion of him is as it was before he was signed. He didnt look as if he had the capability to be good enough, and that still seems to be the case. Basing a teams tactics around that type of striker is a weak choice in my opinion and one that isnt working.

I'm sure a poll of Liverpool fans would show that he is just not up to the standard required, and similar polls for Cisse and Morientes would show likewise. I also have a funny feeling that by June a similar poll of Fowler would also show likewise. Thats the way its looking at the moment anyway.

One proper striker in June please Rafa, is that too much to ask for?

redspider

Guy:Incognito

I sadi he was a donkey at the start and I stickby that. 3 or 4 times ast night he was up for headers with defenders 9 inches smaller than him and won noe of them. He didnt even jump.

smemon

he's emile heskey number 2 only weaker, no pace and half a foot taller.

astrofool

'pool sure know how to pick them.

Was talking to my brother earlier (liverpool supporter), what they really need is a proven english striker, once they have that, then they can take risks on foreign stars that might or might not settle. Defoe would probably be a good example, but someone like yakubu would also be an option.

Remember, manu, who have scored the most goals in the prem league since it started, have used mostly english strikers.

When Cantona came in, so was Hughes, Cole was proven, Yorke probably wasn't everyone's first choice, but he was a proven striker, and helped utd. win the treble, sheringham, rooney, saha, all from english clubs.

Of the foreigners lately, they've had Van Nistelrooy and Forlan, one settled very well, the other didn't.

And I wouldn't count Crouch as a proven striker, the last one Liverpool bought was probably Collymore, but he had other problems which plagued him.

el rabitos

he was bought so as to be an option up front for some games, but he's been played in EVERY game. and he's not effective against *good* teams

he just gets marked out of the game and brushed aside. 7 million was a joke to pay for him

PiE

I was probably slightly on his side when he joined mainly because, while he wasn't scoring, he was contributing a lot of other qualities to our build-up play. He was taking high balls down, holding it up for others and laying it off nicely around the area.

Then he got a few goals and all seemed well.

Now the goals have dried up again and he's not even doing the contributory play at all. I can't remember the last game I saw him win a lumped ball, control it and lay it off nicely. So as far as I can see, he's worth zilch to the team at the moment. Much like the rest of our strikers as a matter of fact. So let's not lay the blame completely at his door. Spread the sh*t.

p.pete

el rabitos wrote:

he was bought so as to be an option up front for some games, but he's been played in EVERY game. and he's not effective against *good* teams

TBH I think he's actually been least effective in the type of games he was bought for - away matches against weaker teams where we dropped far too many points before. In general though we've been doing decent in those games so far.

PiE wrote:

Spread the sh*t.

Very true, Kewell is holding his hand up at the moment and say collectively all the attacking players are under performing. Liverpool are still a work in progress despite the mood before we stumbled upon teams like Chelsea and ManU. It's widely acknowledged that we still need to sign one or two players and i'm glad we didn't rush anything during the window.

Jazzy

we swapped him for baros.
should have kept baros.
this time last season he was just returning from injury and had scored a hell of alot of goals in the first half of the season. lost his confidence a bit after injury and ALOT of pool fans turned their back on him. if he had his confidence and was fit he was a good supporting striker who would work very hard for the team. he also seemed to be able to finish better then cisse, moro & couch which is saying something, as baros finishing left alot to be desired at times

Triton

PiE wrote:

I was probably slightly on his side when he joined mainly because, while he wasn't scoring, he was contributing a lot of other qualities to our build-up play. He was taking high balls down, holding it up for others and laying it off nicely around the area.

Then he got a few goals and all seemed well.

Now the goals have dried up again and he's not even doing the contributory play at all. I can't remember the last game I saw him win a lumped ball, control it and lay it off nicely. So as far as I can see, he's worth zilch to the team at the moment. Much like the rest of our strikers as a matter of fact. So let's not lay the blame completely at his door. Spread the sh*t.

For "few goals", read 3. He's scored 5 goals all season, in 36 games. That's one in seven, what a record.

The goals never dried up, they never came to dry up. People slagg off Drogba but he's ten times better than Crouch, at both scoring and being a target man.

eyerer

yeah, i used to think chelsea had crap strikers. i dont think that so much any more.
i'd take either of them ahead of what we have (hypothetically of course)

PiE

Triton wrote:

For "few goals", read 3.

Which is the definition of "a few", hence my using that particular word.

There was a patch of 3-4 games when he scored those goals and we were winning easily that all really did seem well.

The Insider

Triton wrote:

For "few goals", read 3. He's scored 5 goals all season, in 36 games. That's one in seven, what a record.

He has actually scored 7. 3 less then Drogba.

BolBill

Great news : Hes injured and wont play tomorrow, also Gerrard is back - double whammy

Crouch is muck, end of.

~Rebel~

If we had someone decent to replace him with that'd be all well and good, but we'll be going from having a poor forward line to haveing another poor forward line. I assume Moro and Cisse. Right at the moment id prefer to see crouch playing, not cause he's good, but the other 2 together are godawful!! Any chance fowler's suddenly fit and could start up front with Moro? That might possible work if moro could manage to put himself about a bit. He has some good games but is usually invisible.

Triton

The Insider wrote:

He has actually scored 7. 3 less then Drogba.

Drogba has 11 goals and 6 assists in 19 starts and 9 sub appearances this year. That's a rate of less than 1 in 3 goals per game, and a few assists thrown in for good measure. His rate is better than 1 goal in every 2 games when he starts.

Crouch has had 30 starts, with 5 sub appearances and scored 7 with two assists. That's a rate of 1 in 5 or 1 in 4 when he starts. That's twice Drogba's goal return.

Jazzy

tis simple: Drogba > Crouch in every way (apart from monstrous height )
and im a pool supporter aswell

mayordenis

Triton wrote:

Crouch has had 30 starts, with 5 sub appearances and scored 7 with two assists. That's a rate of 1 in 5 or 1 in 4 when he starts. That's twice Drogba's goal return.

you mean thats 1/2 his goal return :P

TheMonster

After last nights glaring miss and totally inept performance are there still any pool fans that will defend that "excuse for a footballer"

RE*AC*TOR

TheMonster wrote:

After last nights glaring miss and totally inept performance are there still any pool fans that will defend that "excuse for a footballer"

He has a role - alongsider someone who can score goals - not alongside morientes, who can't really do anything.

TheMonster

maybe - but he should still be able to finish chances he gets also.

BolBill

As I've said before, I will say it again, how can a player that has had about 8 clubs (or different spells at clubs) SUDDENLY become good enough to play for Liverpool ? He's rubbish, the fact he gets a game for England only proves the point that Eriksson is a clown.

All the media WANT him to do well but the plaine fact is he's not good enough. A few goals for the Saints and hes great - yeah right.

redspider

I think I'm clearly down on record as saying Crouch shouldnt have been signed in the first place as he didnt have the capability to play in a team of the standard that Liverpool should be aiming for, and that if we played to his strengths it would be a very poor tactical option.

These facts came home to roost last night.

There are several signings that Rafa has brought in that have not been good enough:

Pellegrino
Josemi
Morientes
Crouch

I also think that
Garcia
Sissoko

are just average.

Kromkamp
Agger

perhaps ok for the future, but who knows.

Alonso
a Brilliant buy, and I hope it was not just luck.


For me, Benitez has a low success rate with his purchases. Up front is where we are worst, and given that he was instrumental in letting Baros go, and getting in Morientes and Crouch, that is not a sign of a perfect manager, far from it. (Owen was already going when he came on board and Cisse was already coming in).

I would let Crouch play in the World Cup, buy a striker (pay 20m or something) and try and offload Crouch after the World Cup. Hopefully he will score a goal or two to increase his value. Bring back Pongolle, Mellor and give them some run-outs. Its ludicrous to allow Morientes to play so many matches when he is just not good enough anymore.

redspider

RE*AC*TOR

Pellegrino - was free - and was just for squad backup
Josemi - has since been traded for Kromkamp
Morientes - agree has been a dismal failure.
Crouch - think he has a future
Garcia - 15 goals last season - some v. important ones in the CL
Sissoko - can play excellently - needs a little maturing
Kromkamp - looks good so far
Agger - ditto - great composure
Alonso - pure talent

You're also forgetting:

Nunez - a makeweight in the Owen deal - was crap
Zenden - on a free - which looks like a good deal - shame about the injury
Reina - solid, reliable

redspider

RE*AC*TOR wrote:

Pellegrino - was free - and was just for squad backup
Josemi - has since been traded for Kromkamp
Morientes - agree has been a dismal failure.
Crouch - think he has a future
Garcia - 15 goals last season - some v. important ones in the CL
Sissoko - can play excellently - needs a little maturing
Kromkamp - looks good so far
Agger - ditto - great composure
Alonso - pure talent

You're also forgetting:

Nunez - a makeweight in the Owen deal - was crap
Zenden - on a free - which looks like a good deal - shame about the injury
Reina - solid, reliable

Even if players come on a free transfer, they still need to be payed wages and if they are actually played on the pitch and are below what we need, that has to be called out.

So, for me:
Not good enough:
Pellegrino, Josemi, Morientes, Crouch, Nunez (thanks for reminding me!)

Average:
Garcia, Sissoko, Zenden, Fowler(?)

Good enough:
Alonso, Reina

Too early to judge:
Agger, Kromkamp


Thats not a good success rate for Benitez, and any report card reading of that would say "Must Do Better".

Btw, in terms of spanish-isation, there are 7 spanish players in that bunch. Rafa has brought in 13 players, thats a full team, yet only 2 are good enough in my books.

redspider

RE*AC*TOR

redspider wrote:

So, for me:
Not good enough:
Pellegrino, Josemi, Morientes, Crouch, Nunez (thanks for reminding me!)

Average:
Garcia, Sissoko, Zenden, Fowler(?)

Good enough:
Alonso, Reina

Too early to judge:
Agger, Kromkamp

How's about this - we take out those he spent no money on for a start, in footballing terms you can't expect the world to be set alight from a free transfer.
Pellegrino, Zenden and Fowler and those that are too early to judge, Agger and Kromkamp.
I would say Crouch should be bumped up to Average. That leaves Josemi, Nunez and Morientes in the not good enough category.
Only Morientes is still at the club. And I can't see him staying beyond this summer. I think Sissoko is on the brink of moving from average to "good enough" - assuming he recovers from his eye injury. Garcia looked a talent last year - but hasn't really capitalised on it this year. Which is a real pity.

Davei141

I agree about crouch's misses last night, but he creates stuff, and whenever he plays we get more chances. Morientes as a strike partner is not doing him any favours. How many chances did morientes get? None, because hes either too lazy to jump, too lazy to get in on the crosses and too lazy full stop. Im more optimistic when i see crouch's name on the team sheet than not, and that must count for something.

Guy:Incognito

Davei141 wrote:

I agree about crouch's misses last night, but he creates stuff, and whenever he plays we get more chances. Morientes as a strike partner is not doing him any favours. How many chances did morientes get? None, because hes either too lazy to jump, too lazy to get in on the crosses and too lazy full stop. Im more optimistic when i see crouch's name on the team sheet than not, and that must count for something.

All it counts towards is your psychiatric evaluation. He's muck and not worth £7 never mind £7m. It doesnt matter how many chances he gets (in fact it makes it worse) if he doesnt score any.

Davei141

Which strikers would you rather upfront instead? Morientes? Cisse? Fowler? Atleast crouch makes chances for others.

NotWormBoy

Well, while I'm not disputing the fact that Liverpools strikers are 'muck' and that they've turned out to be bad buys (for this season anyways), you do have to have some sympathy for Benitez.

Cisse - top scorer in the French (ok, its the French, fine) League the season before, wasn't he? Off the top of my head... top two anyways.

Morientes - has been lethal in the past, had just had an excellent season at Monaco.

Crouch - scored a **** load at Southampton, with **** service. He's failed at Liverpool though.

So their credentials did say a lot in their favour, they've just turned out to not fit in at all.

I think Benitez is coming out alright in the transfer market - better than average, I feel. Zenden and Fowler are good for free transfers. So long as Fowler is only put on as a match winner for the last thirty minutes or so... He doesn't have the pace or fitness to play a full game.

Thanx 4 The Fish

redspider wrote:

Not good enough:
Pellegrino, Josemi, Morientes, Crouch, Nunez (thanks for reminding me!)

Average:
Garcia, Sissoko, Zenden, Fowler(?)

Good enough:
Alonso, Reina

Too early to judge:
Agger, Kromkamp


Btw, in terms of spanish-isation, there are 7 spanish players in that bunch. Rafa has brought in 13 players, thats a full team, yet only 2 are good enough in my books.

redspider

I only get 6. FYI Pellegrino is an Argentinian International born in Leones.

meldrew

So long as Fowler is only put on as a match winner for the last thirty minutes or so... He doesn't have the pace or fitness to play a full game
You could hardly call Fowler a match winner since he came back

ButcherOfNog

meldrew wrote:

So long as Fowler is only put on as a match winner for the last thirty minutes or so... He doesn't have the pace or fitness to play a full game
You could hardly call Fowler a match winner since he came back

How many glaring misses has robbie had since hes returned? Hes put the ball in the back of the net 3 times since he arrived, yes all disallowed but he still stuck it away. Moro and Cissie will go, Mellor isn't good enough, Pongolle might well be tho. We need at least 1 top notch goalscorer, and another wide player. Traore will be offloaded too, he was brutal last nite and caused a degree of nervousness i've not seen in a very long time in the pool defense, I'd rather have Titus Bramble.

I actually thought that the Benfica keeper made a great save from crouch last nite, did brilliantly to bring his leg across when crouch aimed inbetween them. Crouch was bought to bring "something different" as Rafa said at the time, not to score 20 goals a season, hes never going to be the main goalscorer.

NotWormBoy

meldrew wrote:

You could hardly call Fowler a match winner since he came back

No, you can't. But thats what he was bought for. And, to be fair to the guy, I think he has the capability to be a match winner. He's got more guile, experience and finishing ability than three Peter Crouch's and Djibril Cisse's put together.

Traore is a joke - the only bigger joke is the fact that he has himself a Champions League winners medal. You could hear the groans from the crowd everytime he got the ball. He's a liability.

Guy:Incognito

He can hardly be expected to come on, settle in and scroe a hat-trick in the last 20 mins. He should have been on from the start last night as we needed goals. He's been unlucky with having 3 goals dissallowed, meaning he's getting there and putting them away. Thats more than can be said for the other lot. His movement has been very good and he's doing well with no support. I was at the charlton game on Saturday and he was given the ball numerous times and then no support came to help. But fair play to him, he didnt give it away but held on til somethign came free.

ButcherOfNog wrote:

did brilliantly to bring his leg across when crouch aimed inbetween them/QUOTE]

In fairness, that's clutching at straws, it was a terrible miss. He should have done what any half decent player would and lifted it over the keeper. Thekeeper was down on one knee before it was hit, it wasn't that difficult.

BolBill

Where are all these chances that Crouch creates ??? I must look away when that happens. Hes rubbish and the fact that those eejits on Sky rate him only makes it more annoying.

zAbbo

Crouch v Newcastle.

Scores 1, assists the other, and gets fouled for a Peno.