Gay Bashing Protest

Swimmy

Well I do actually. Firstly if people have a complaint against the police then file them don't go around spreading rumours and all the rest...makes me vomit to be honest! I don't believe half of these rumours!

We have laws to portect gay people against bashing. More laws are useless unless they are enforced. Since Mr. McDowell opened the film festival and had so many words to say about the gay 'community' then why not meet him directly and be pro-active instead of moaning and spewing heresay!

damien

You have to wonder how many people are opposed to this march because they feel embarassed about a bunch of gay people marching and don't want these protesters making a show "in their name"?

People have a right to March. The fact that some people have said enough and are doing something about it, besides pontificating about who's harder on a webforum is quite positive. Everyone moans about this and that and what others should be doing, yet only 5% ever bother their holes doing something. Fair play to those that are taking a stand, no matter what way they're doing it.

What utter bollox people here come up with, what defeatist and cowardly attitudse to say that everyone gets attacked and infer it is somehow an acceptable way of life and so the gay community shouldn't be making a fuss.

Annasopra

Agreed Damien - personally I think some people would moan if nothing was done and moan if something is done

newgrange

I like the idea of a march.
I ABHOR the idea of a march in a democratic country converging on a courthouse.

FX Meister

I was attacked once because I came from a better area than the scum that attacked me. Do we 'poshies' organise marches against the lower classes of our society?

monkeyfudge wrote:

Are straight people being attacked because of their sexual orientation?

And to have the march on a Monday at that time! Loads of people are bound to turn up.

danielbr

Swimmy wrote:

Nobody is doubting it is a serious issue but protesting is not going to either up the punishments for gay bashers or is it going to make the streets more safe for gay people. I think that is the point people are trying to make......

Swimmy this is your opinion and is taken on board. However the protest might not achieve anything on the day but it will get the ball rolling for us to achieve the bigger objective for us all... SAFER STREETS FOR ALL OF US.

danielbr

just in relation to other comments on this thread...

It has been said already that if something is done about it, people will argue that it is not the right way to deal with it. Suggestion have been made to talk to McDowell... Well people have in the past contacted TD's etc and where has that got us.... ****ing nowhere... We need action and not words. Those who are trying to make a difference are being slated as a result of taking the inititive and going out there and doing something about it.

Why do people have to see something negative in something that is trying to make a change in society for the benefit of EVERYONE... I don't see them making positive suggestions (other than talking, cause that gets us no where) as to what we can do.

I would like to point out for the last time on this thread.

THIS IS NOT A PROTEST ON GAY BASHINGS OR ATTACKS ON THE GAY COMMUNITY. THIS MAY WELL BE STARTED BY THE GAY COMMUNITY, BUT IT IS FOR THE BENEFIT OF EVERYONE TO BE ABLE TO GO OUT IN TOWN AND NOT WORRY ABOUT BEING ATTACKED FOR WHATEVER REASON.

why can't people see that is beyond me.

BuffyBot

damien.m wrote:

You have to wonder how many people are opposed to this march because they feel embarassed about a bunch of gay people marching and don't want these protesters making a show "in their name"?

That's a little unfair don't you think?

People have a right to March.

April too!

Anyway, seriously, again I don't anyone is denying that people have a right to march

The fact that some people have said enough and are doing something about it, besides pontificating about who's harder on a webforum is quite positive.

Yeah, but the problem here is whether this incident justifies a big protest rally style march. Random assaults are a problem all the time, all over the country. Is this really so different that it merits a march? Much more serious attacks take place, and they don't seem to merit one. To me it's an over-reaction to an incident which took place. I'm not saying it's acceptable or anything else, but is the response measured in relation to the severity of the incident?

Everyone moans about this and that and what others should be doing, yet only 5% ever bother their holes doing something.

Well yes, but you find that in most walks of life. Should the people who don't agree just be silent?

danielbr

buffybot,

this is not a protest or reaction to one incident, and again people are failing to see what is all about.

THIS IS NOT A PROTEST ON GAY BASHINGS OR ATTACKS ON THE GAY COMMUNITY. THIS MAY WELL BE STARTED BY THE GAY COMMUNITY, BUT IT IS FOR THE BENEFIT OF EVERYONE TO BE ABLE TO GO OUT IN TOWN AND NOT WORRY ABOUT BEING ATTACKED FOR WHATEVER REASON.

I know i said i would not repeat it, not to sound like a complete prick, but people please read whats being said.

This protest is for better policing practices, in light of what happened on that night outside the george.

This happens far to often and the protest is not because of ONE attack, but the result of years of people not bothering their arses to do anything to help stop them from happening.

The fact that people from the gay community ARE proactively doing something about it does not make it into a "gay march" or an "excuse for gays to take to the streets to make a point" as I have read and heard. This is for the benefit of everyone who goes to town, WHY CAN'T SOME PEOPLE SEE THAT!!!!!!!

ixoy

Well look at raghallaigh's posting:

THIS PROTEST IS IN RESPONSE TO ATTACKS AGAINST THE LESBEEN, GAY, BISEXUAL AND TRANSGENDER (LGBT) COMMUNITY IN DUBLIN LAST WEEKEND!!!

The emphasis there seems to be because of the homophobic attacks and not just general scumbag attacks. What you're saying danielbr is more to what I posted should be done, but the original posting by raghallaigh seems to suggest a different agenda.

BuffyBot

this is not a protest or reaction to one incident, and again people are failing to see what is all about.

Well no, not quite.

As ixoy pointed out, no one seems quite sure exactly what it's about. A knee-jerk reaction to an incident seems to be whats occuring, rather than a well thought out protest against a very valid problem.

WHY CAN'T SOME PEOPLE SEE THAT!!!!!!!

Perhaps when the message being given out is clear, they might.

AARRRGH

We can debate all week whether or not this rally is ridiculous, but at the end of the day, if the rally takes place a few TD's will say, "Look, a bunch of gay's are protesting, oh wow."

It will make no difference whatsoever.

If you really want to get "the powers" aware of some kind of gay bashing mentality in Dublin (which I don't really believe is a problem) write to your local TD explaining your plight.

the_syco

A few people get slapped, and a large group of weirdo's intimidate the guy they claim to have done it. If it happened to a normal person, the guy would get a fine, but the weirdo's seem to think he should get life, as he breached their "special space".

swiss wrote:

or a situation where they decide to punch a group of people because they're walking down the street.

Sounds like the scumbags hit a few people, who happened to be gay.

ixoy wrote:

According to the Queer ID thread, one of the attending Gardai said something to the akin of "Let's get out of here as quickly as possible" and "You [the victims] probably deserved it".

Sounds like chinese whisper to be, tbh. Make a formal complaint, otherwise stop slandering the pigs.

dermo88 wrote:

It just feels that there are enough of us to kick the **** out of skangers when and if its required. That sounds worse than it actually is, but I have been involved in one lynching of a basher. I was the bait. Good fun too when we caught one.

So... skangers beating up gays is wrong, but gays beating up skangers is right? Sorry lad, but this is not acceptable behaviour, and you shall get your just deserts.

danielbr wrote:

A possible retaliation occurred on Friday night, when two men exiting The George assaulted two others on Dame Lane. No arrests were made, but those attacked were taken to hospital suffering from facial bruising. A garda spokesman said yesterday: "Maybe they [the attackers] were anti-heterosexual."

So, the two gay attackers got off scot free?

danielbr wrote:

SAFER STREETS FOR ALL OF US.

All I saw was a march defending gay people.

=-=

The idea behind it is good, but I think the way you're going about it is bad. If you wanted to highlight the lack of a gardai presence in the city centre area, you could have liased [spelling?] with other groups. To me, the march says one thing. Gays got attacked, and now gays want special treatment, instead of people got attacked, and people want extra gardai on the streets of Dublin at the hours when nightclubs close.

dermo88

Sorry the syco.

You did'nt see what happened to my mate, who was a barman at a well known Birmingham gay venue.

One night he came out of work, and was beaten up. And this was not an isolated incident as we found out.

The police could not prove anything, so nothing could be done.

What can be done in such situations. Well, we phoned the police, and I informed officers that we knew who did it, but if they were not dealt with and an ABSO served on this individual, he would be barred from the area.

Unfortunately, the officers could not do anything, and I understood and respected that. Racist accusations could also be made against the force if they targetted this specific individual. But there was a subtle hint that a blind eye would be shown if the guy in question was dealt with since he had a criminal record as long as your arm.

So myself (I'm a complete wimp), an ex SAS officer pal of mine, and 2 more decided to go and get him.

Waited till the Gale (nightclub) closed, I made a phone call, then went the opposite way to normal. Set alarm on mobile phone for two minutes, and walked up Essex Street in the danger direction. Where noone walks unless you are cruising for a bit of illicit action.

The guy came after me. Voila, dealt with.

If thats wrong, so be it. Do I feel good, not really. Was it necessary, unfortunately so.

So just take my word that it was necessary, and while I am not overly fond of skangers, they have just as much right to exist as any camp barman walking home after changing from drag.

The guy was dealt with, and sufficiently discouraged from attempting his antics again. He was subsequently sentenced to 18 months for targetting men on gaydar.

Hmm_Messiah

Good fun too when we caught one.

Do I feel good, not really. Was it necessary, unfortunately so.

Not very consistent.

And Danielbr, the newspaper article you post, and get yourself quoted in, seems entirely contradictory to what you are posting here. The article is about a "gay" protest becuase of gaybashing incidents.

Again I applaud any one who acts rather saying "some one should act", but this seems a bad idea; maybe some one should poll it, so instead of hearing the same views repeated by a few, we'd get an impression of what people on this forum think.

I also notice messages from the gay liaison officer saying he'd only discovered some websites, bulletin boards ; would it not of been part of his job to research all these resources a bit more ?

I would hate to feel threatened on a night out, but I've not had the experience. The solution remains one of policing, and perhaps other initiatives within the remit of politicians. I don't think a march of "about 100" will influence either. I personally think if each of those people individually wrote to the Supt or the Dept of Justice they would be more noticed.

btw a march on a Monday at noon, not only excludes those working at that time, but all so significantly portion of those feeling threatened, who travel up to the George etc on weekends and aren't anywhere near they citycentre on weekdays. Or maybe those people don't count ?

danielbr

Sounds like the scumbags hit a few people, who happened to be gay.

This was not an attack on someone who happened to be gay, this was an attack on someone BECAUSE they were gay.

So... skangers beating up gays is wrong, but gays beating up skangers is right? Sorry lad, but this is not acceptable behaviour, and you shall get your just deserts.


So, the two gay attackers got off scot free?

There was actually a mix up as to what happened about this. The article you copied from and read was incorrect. The attacked were gay and the two who attacked them were arrested.

To help clarify what is happening, people will say that it is a march/protest for gay people to show their disgust at what happened, which is 100% and yes this march is in retaliation to what happened, but the bigger goal here is for safer streets and more gardai to help prevent attacks on the punters of this city

Annasopra

The syco

A few people get slapped, and a large group of weirdo's intimidate the guy they claim to have done it

- people were more than slapped and I obect to being called a weirdo for supporting this

Sounds like the scumbags hit a few people, who happened to be gay.

Or perhaps they were targeted for being gay? now who's starting chinese whispers

So, the two gay attackers got off scot free?

This part of the article in the Sunday Tribune does not seem to be accurate - so you can't really use that as an argument

To me, the march says one thing. Gays got attacked, and now gays want special treatment, instead of people got attacked, and people want extra gardai on the streets of Dublin at the hours when nightclubs close.

Daniel has said several times that while members of the gay community have started the ball rolling that it is more than the gay community asking for extra presence outside the George -

Also Put this another way - if this was a racist attack would people be saying racial minorities shouldn't be complaining because everybody gets attacked by racists

Annasopra

Again I applaud any one who acts rather saying "some one should act", but this seems a bad idea; maybe some one should poll it, so instead of hearing the same views repeated by a few, we'd get an impression of what people on this forum think.

It's actually pretty clear to me that most people on this forum are against this protest but that doesn't seem to be as much the case on other forums

Hmm_Messiah

Conor Coughlan has just been on the radio where it was reported as a ga protest, and he sad it was against queerbashing and also homophobia/racism within the gardai.

SO erm...it seems some one's insistence here , several times, in nice big CAPITALS, that it isn't ..is a loadof ***

danielbr

Look whether u agree or not, this protest is obviously about homophobic attacks in Dublin as that is something which I feel strongly about, and that is the main point of this march. AS well as other issues.

In relation to Conor Coughlan's Interview, i heard it and was talking to him about it afterwards, he is calling for better policing startagies, and better policing, which is not an attack on Gardai,

Hmm_mesiah, your comment on what conor said is not correct, it is nothing to do with queer-bashing in the Gardai,

There are many issues people will be taking to this march, all with the same objective,

making town a safer place to go out in.

Hmm_Messiah

Sorry if I was unclear, conor said it was about queerbashing and ALSO homophobia in the garda (edited post)

(was a big jump to understand that I said he was complaining about queerbashing from the gardai considering not mentioned in the other 70 posts)


Your latest post is significantly different; ah I see, it now lacks :-

THIS IS NOT A PROTEST ON GAY BASHINGS OR ATTACKS ON THE GAY COMMUNITY. THIS MAY WELL BE STARTED BY THE GAY COMMUNITY, BUT IT IS FOR THE BENEFIT OF EVERYONE TO BE ABLE TO GO OUT IN TOWN AND NOT WORRY ABOUT BEING ATTACKED FOR WHATEVER REASON.

Boston

damien.m wrote:

You have to wonder how many people are opposed to this march because they feel embarassed about a bunch of gay people marching and don't want these protesters making a show "in their name"?

People have a right to March. The fact that some people have said enough and are doing something about it, besides pontificating about who's harder on a webforum is quite positive. Everyone moans about this and that and what others should be doing, yet only 5% ever bother their holes doing something. Fair play to those that are taking a stand, no matter what way they're doing it.

What utter bollox people here come up with, what defeatist and cowardly attitudse to say that everyone gets attacked and infer it is somehow an acceptable way of life and so the gay community shouldn't be making a fuss.

The very first post I made on this forum, I outlined that unless you're going to actually interact with people and tell them what this is all about, they will reach their own conclusions. I remember a thread here, about how embrassed you felt at the antiques of the gay pride march/bus in cork. It too was a case of people "doing something", but not nessesarily the right something. As far as I can see they are now changing the focus of this march/ or maybe clarifing what the focus allways was. If a little bit more thought had gone into it in the first place, 90% of the criticism on this thread wouldn't have been posted. I've no problem with marching, it's merely the implimentation of this march which has me concerned.

Health Project

Attacks on Young Gay People and their Friends last Saturday Night
Press Release Monday, 3rd of October, 2005

GLEN (Gay and Lesbian Equality Network) condemns the attacks on gay men and their friends outside one of Dublin’s gay pubs last Saturday. “This incident and other recent attacks directed against lesbian, gay and bisexual people shows the ongoing seriousness of anti-gay violence and harassment” according to Keith O’Malley, Chief Executive Officer of the Gay and Lesbian Equality Network.

“GLEN calls on the Garda Commissioner to build on the work of the Gardai on this issue by establishing a Working Group comprising the Gardai, the lesbian gay community, venue owners and other stakeholders to develop a strategy to prevent these attacks” says Keith O’Malley.

GLEN has scheduled a public meeting to take place in Outhouse, the gay community resource centre in Capel Street Dublin, to address the issue of safety outside gay venues in Dublin. Those attending will include Garda Superintendents from the relevant Garda districts. The meeting will take place at 7.30 pm on Monday the 17th of October.

“Broader actions at a national level are also necessary to address anti-gay violence” says O’Malley. “GLEN calls on the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform to establish a National Task Force on Violence Against Lesbian, Gay and Bisexual People that would include a range of Government Departments and State Agencies relevant to preventing anti-gay violence and dealing with its effects” says O’Malley. “GLEN also calls on the Minister to bring forward specific legislation to deal with hate crimes” says O’Malley.

“Everyone is entitled to walk the streets without fear of intimidation, harassment and attack” says O’Malley.

“Very positive progress has been made by the Garda Síochána on this issue with the appointment of Garda Liaison Officers to the lesbian, gay and bisexual community and the development of information materials. This provides a good base to build more extensive responses in the future” says O’Malley

Annasopra

Just pegged it down during my lunch hour to support the March – over 100 turned up. Groups such as Belongto, Johnny, USI, ICTU Youth, Pavee Point, Labour LGBT (supported by Joe Costello TD) were there. There was lots of media including Free Magazine, GCN, TV3 and loads of radio stations.

BIG CONGRATS TO THE ORGANISERS

Hmm_Messiah

Ok 1pm news on RTE 2fm lead with "queerbashing" (hate that term) and the March. Joe Duffy's Liveline program opened with a guy talking about being attacked on Friday night.

Only fair to congratulate the media coverage achieved.

Whether anything else will be achieved I remain doubtful.

damien

If it made one person, gay or straight more secure for just one evening then it was worth it. The fact that it is bringing discussion of violence on the streets into the mainstream media is a good thing.

damien

http://www.breakingnews.ie/2005/10/03/story223627.html

Boston

damien.m wrote:

If it made one person, gay or straight more secure for just one evening then it was worth it. The fact that it is bringing discussion of violence on the streets into the mainstream media is a good thing.

It's a fair point.

Boston

Watched the Network2 coverage of this just a second ago, I don't know about any other coverage, but I was fairly impressed with what I saw. Having some of the victims speak really carried it for me. Credit where it's due, this seems to have gone off very well from a Pr point of view, which was my main concern.

Annasopra

I think from a PR perspective that had a lot to do with Daniel and Conor Coughlan