All In Poker

Imposter

DeVore wrote:

In the last 24 hours Antesup made 6 euro from about 7-10 people playing about 50-100 hands each. Extrapolating that makes for sweet reading from where I am sitting. Even if you get about 50 people or invitee's invites etc etc (which a blind monkey could do) you should get a few hundred a month by my maths. (YMMV)

DeV.

Finally managed to register!

As has been said by others, if you don't know many/any poker players outside of boards then you are relying on people being dropped into your downline from above. At some stage (probably sooner rather than later) that will slow to a trickle. You can get 30ish% rakeback deals on Prima on the rake you've paid through other sites.

If you are a relatively high volume or high stakes player when you consider both of those things then an optimal strategy surely means that you need to play the 750 hands per month to claim 100% of what others earn for you and then continue for the rest of the time on your decent rakeback deal. If everyone did that then the rb through all-in could conceivably be less than your rb at the other site. Then the pyramid nature of all-in starts failing from the bottom up.

Or of course it could be a great success and we could all be millionaires.

Iago

there's also the consideration that a lot of people who will sign up (from boards as well as elsewhere) will predominatly be signing up so that they can get free rakeback from people below them rather than playing themselves.

So if you combine a number of factors

1. You may not know 5 people oustide of boards who play a large volume of Poker online, or if you do you're competing with the same pool of players in a very small Irish Poker market so they may not sign up under your downline

2. You can only get two automatic referrels per level, which means that you will only have a limited amount of people in your downline if you don't get any direct referrels.

3. At least some, if not the majority of your referrels (auto and direct) will only be signing up so that they can get the benefit of "Free Money" from other players, and as such their rake upwards will be insignificant.

4. Their downlines may contain other people of a similar ilk meaning that the actual rake generated will be miniscule, never mind only getting 10-25% of it back.

So while AntesUp > Boards and maybe the first level of boards should see a reasonable amount of money, I think it's unlikely to filter down outside of that. In saying that I hope I'm wrong and look forward to writing a book and how I made my first million by doing nothing, but a dose of realism never did anyone any harm

Fatboydim

For some reason I couldn't sign up throughAntesup link and code - So I used yours Culchie.... ow who do I know whoisn't already in it?

Fatboydim

sorry my keyboard is playing up

ocallagh

$0.18 up and counting

Culchie

$.50 from just 28 hands

Juan Pablo

$0.15 from one hour of play from my one active player. If this trend continues....

Not greedy, once I can buy my 6 bed mansion in Killiney and a nice Range Rover sitting on 24's by December I'll be happy.

Iago

$.70 so far, but I've only one active player, need to get some more people signed up quickly!!

bohsman

2.43, think youve been proved wrong Des

Juan Pablo

bohsman wrote:

2.43, think youve been proved wrong Des

bohsman on his way to becoming bohsowner

Another $6 should do it

DeVore

So while AntesUp > Boards and maybe the first level of boards should see a reasonable amount of money, I think it's unlikely to filter down outside of that. In saying that I hope I'm wrong and look forward to writing a book and how I made my first million by doing nothing, but a dose of realism never did anyone any harm

Indeed a dose of realism is important. I dunno if anyone will retire from this but if I woke up every 1st of the month to find a new tank in my account, that would be nice

The other thing, Iago, that you havent considered is this: Say you have people who DON'T play (as you suggest), then 75% of their potential earnings goes into the Freeroll pool. If the downlines have a lot of them, then that freeroll is going to be quite big and everyone gets to play for it.
I expect people will at least play their 750 hands.

DeV

mewso

I find this a bit ridiculous to be honest. I don't know anyone I could ask to sign up. The idea that you could get 50 signed up is laughable. Home game? My home game is in the fitz. So sum total to date = 0.

azzeretti

musician wrote:

I find this a bit ridiculous to be honest. I don't know anyone I could ask to sign up. The idea that you could get 50 signed up is laughable. Home game? My home game is in the fitz. So sum total to date = 0.

Ditto.
I have tried referring a few but they are either not interested enough to setup a Neteller account or use a Credit Card OR they have signed up already

Iago

well you should have signed under my downline anyway

I see your point DeV and at the end of the day free money is free money, so I'm not complaining, just being realistic.

Incidentally if anybody else wants free money the link is in my signature

ahh pimpage at it's best :v:

DeVore

Muso, read my post on why YOU don't have to know 50 people. You are in Antesup's line so you might get some from us. Suppose one of them is mad keen and knows loads of Ukrainians. Next thing you know, you've got the "Boards" of Ukraine under you. (This isnt as mad as you think, JP is targetting an entire country by the looks of it!).

But suppose you dont, you get noone, ever. Ok... play the big cash freeroll every month and treat it like any other site. It doesnt cost you anything and you get a shot at the cash freeroll (I won it last month ).

DeV.

Juan Pablo

DeVore wrote:

JP is targetting an entire country by the looks of it

LOL I have yet to fully convince Kim Il Sung II of my plan! :rolleyes:

Lafortezza

I think someone on 2+2 compared it to the equivalent of 12% rakeback with the possibility of a max of 51% rakeback.
To get more than about the equivalent of 20% rakeback you would have to put in alot of work pimping and getting people to sign up.

Is the money you get back everlasting? Or did I read it only lasts for 7 'levels' or something?

bohsman

lafortezza wrote:

I think someone on 2+2 compared it to the equivalent of 12% rakeback with the possibility of a max of 51% rakeback.
To get more than about the equivalent of 20% rakeback you would have to put in alot of work pimping and getting people to sign up.

Is the money you get back everlasting? Or did I read it only lasts for 7 'levels' or something?

You have 7 levels below you.. a total of 97000 people and you get their % for as long as they play

NickyOD

I'm getting bloody murdered on this site. The outdraws have been ridiculous.

Hand 1: I get KQ raise and call a preflop min-reraise. Boards KQ-rag-rag he goes all in on the turn. I call. He has 99 and rivers a set. I lose $100

I call a button raise with 88. flop 5 8 2. I bet the flop, he raises and I go alll in. He calls with 79 and rivers a 6. I lose $100

I raise with ATo. Flop 3-T-2 . I bet he raises. He's a loose fish so I put him all in he has A4 and turns a 5. I lose $65.

what a jopke!

Culchie

NickyOD wrote:

I'm getting bloody murdered on this site. The outdraws have been ridiculous.

Hand 1: I get KQ raise and call a preflop min-reraise. Boards KQ-rag-rag he goes all in on the turn. I call. He has 99 and rivers a set. I lose $100

I call a button raise with 88. flop 5 8 2. I bet the flop, he raises and I go alll in. He calls with 79 and rivers a 6. I lose $100

I raise with ATo. Flop 3-T-2 . I bet he raises. He's a loose fish so I put him all in he has A4 and turns a 5. I lose $65.

what a jopke!

That's the Scandinavian way it seems, it doesn't seem to matter what levels you play on it, the .10/.20 stake means nothing, they will go all in for $100 on sweet F.A anyway.
Players like you will probably retire in 6 months over the players on this site.

mewso

DeVore wrote:

Muso, read my post on why YOU don't have to know 50 people. You are in Antesup's line so you might get some from us. Suppose one of them is mad keen and knows loads of Ukrainians. Next thing you know, you've got the "Boards" of Ukraine under you. (This isnt as mad as you think, JP is targetting an entire country by the looks of it!).

But suppose you dont, you get noone, ever. Ok... play the big cash freeroll every month and treat it like any other site. It doesnt cost you anything and you get a shot at the cash freeroll (I won it last month ).

DeV.

O.k seeing as it's you I'll sit back and let it roll in

DeVore

Its not me, despite the way I sound like a salesman for the site. I have nothing particularly to do with it directly and am being swept along by the involvement of Antesup and others. On the other hand I have studied the idea behind this site closely and it has overcome my intense dislikes for pyramid schemes since it seems the people who get shagged are the Marketeers.

Nicky, this is Prima.... its the same Prima you play on with Ladbrokes and Boylesports etc. I don't know how you can say that the site is slaughtering you (unless you have never played on Prima before). Thats like saying you have different "luck" on VC and PPP ... :^/

DeV.

DeVore

musician wrote:

O.k seeing as it's you I'll sit back and let it roll in

Absolutely NOTHING may roll in. But it doesnt roll out either. Thats my point, in the worst case scenario the worst that happens is that you get a MCM freeroll entry and a cash freeroll every month for what might be a large enough sum.

DeV.

Dub13

I just hope we are all not in the Sunday World in a few weeks...all after falling out over the nasty pyramid scheme.:(

ocallagh

Dub13 wrote:

I just hope we are all not in the Sunday World in a few weeks...all after falling out over the nasty pyramid scheme.:(

lol, they could use the pic from http://www.fistfulofshamrock.com/fos.aspx and all.. Oscar the dealer as the ring leader!

Culchie

lol, we've gone too mainstream anyway, with all ya fancy fingerprint thingymajigs and card swipes anyway.

Sunday World is just what we need to boost the underground image again.

Dub13

The Sunday World today tracked down the man behind a pyramid scheme which took some gullible poker players for thousand's of euro.Oscar Fred said from his hide out on the Costa Del Sol (known to some as the Costa Del Crime) that his Irish based solicitor was looking after this matter and he was in the Lap Dancing club to relax and not talk business.He did say Father Ted like that "the money was just resting in my account.."


Mr Fred sometimes goes by the name of "bohsman" which is a reference to a Association Football team called Bohemians who have a big hooligan element.Mr Fred pictured above is staying at an exclusive resort while his victims remain out of pocket.

Dub13

Amanda Brunker can come around and interview me about this,I will be ready and waiting for her...;)

mewso

DeVore wrote:

Nicky, this is Prima.... its the same Prima you play on with Ladbrokes and Boylesports etc.

Funny you should mention that. I was fairly sure this was the same as the Ladbrokes network so I dutifully said I had played on the Prima Network before. Tried to find my code or whatever and Ladbrokes wasn't on the list so I can't play on the site unless I lie and say I haven't played on the Prima network before. Anyone know how to solve this one?

hotspur

musician wrote:

Funny you should mention that. I was fairly sure this was the same as the Ladbrokes network so I dutifully said I had played on the Prima Network before. Tried to find my code or whatever and Ladbrokes wasn't on the list so I can't play on the site unless I lie and say I haven't played on the Prima network before. Anyone know how to solve this one?

Ladbrokes isn't on the Prima network, they just use the same Microgaming software, they don't share the player base so you haven't played on the Prima network before if you have only played on Ladbrokes.

pokertroll

Ladbrokes uses the same software by Microgaming but is not on the Prima Network.

DeVore

I believe that Pyramid schemes are characterised by the "mark" having to pay something to the introducer on the promise that future marks will pay him. Also they have infinitely wide top lines and no max to how far you can go down.

Antesup has people in its seventh line now and so their invitees will not contribute to our income. It doesnt take 97000 people to get there, 7 invitees in a chain should do it.

DeV.

Ste05

Just to add another little point here, does anyone realise what constitutes as a "raked hand" on this site......

PokerTracker was telling me I had played over 250 hands and their members lounge thing was only saying 63 :eek: I couldn't find the definition of a raked hand anywhere on the site so I e-mailed them. Apparently it only counts as a "raked hand" if the pot is raked AND you contributed to the rake in that Pot....

I'm not sure if this is the same as on all Prima sites, but certainly it's a bit excessive from my experience bonus whoring on other sites....

P.S. As Nicky says the outdraws are savage on this site....:mad: :mad:

Shortstack

Ste05 wrote:

Just to add another little point here, does anyone realise what constitutes as a "raked hand" on this site......

PokerTracker was telling me I had played over 250 hands and their members lounge thing was only saying 63 :eek: I couldn't find the definition of a raked hand anywhere on the site so I e-mailed them. Apparently it only counts as a "raked hand" if the pot is raked AND you contributed to the rake in that Pot....

I'm not sure if this is the same as on all Prima sites, but certainly it's a bit excessive from my experience bonus whoring on other sites....

P.S. As Nicky says the outdraws are savage on this site....:mad: :mad:

1: The members lounge hands played updates every 24 hours so it may be behind.

2: It is every pot where you pay part of the rake, a minumum of two per round of the table. Some use this, some just allow any hand you are dealt, some how much money you put into a pot (PPP).

RoundTower

DeVore wrote:

I believe that Pyramid schemes are characterised by the "mark" having to pay something to the introducer on the promise that future marks will pay him. Also they have infinitely wide top lines and no max to how far you can go down.

Antesup has people in its seventh line now and so their invitees will not contribute to our income. It doesnt take 97000 people to get there, 7 invitees in a chain should do it.

DeV.

You pay a portion of your rake to the players above you, on the promise that you will get rake back from player below you. If you were on a normal rakeback deal you could be getting what, 15% extra on your own rake? All in poker offers you the chance to exchange that for 15% of other people's rakes.

I'm not saying it's a bad idea or a fraud or anything, I certainly don't believe that, but it's not convincing to tell people "this is not a pyramid scheme". People who run pyramid schemes generally tell their customers that.

Hitchhiker's Guide to...

RoundTower wrote:

It's not convincing to tell people "this is not a pyramid scheme". People who run pyramid schemes generally tell their customers that.

Slightly circular logic there - by this rational everything could be a pyramid scheme.

E.g.

Company: "Buy our fresh milk"

You: Is this a pyramid scheme?

Company: No, this is not a pyramid scheme, it is an opportunity to buy a carton of milk.

You: A-ha - so, you are denying that it is a pyramid scheme; did you know that "people who run pyramid schemes generally tell their customers that"?

Company: Damn, you caught us...

careca

I had to do a double take there. I thought Roundtower had lost it, having a go at himself.

RoundTower

Roundtower2 wrote:

Slightly circular logic there - by this rational everything could be a pyramid scheme.

E.g.

Company: "Buy our fresh milk"

You: Is this a pyramid scheme?

Company: No, this is not a pyramid scheme, it is an opportunity to buy a carton of milk.

You: A-ha - so, you are denying that it is a pyramid scheme; did you know that "people who run pyramid schemes generally tell their customers that"?

Company: Damn, you caught us...

Brilliant. It's still a pyramid scheme though.

Shortstack

There are some things that people need to get their heads around with this new idea.

1: Under no circumstances is is a pyramid scheme. There is no financial commitment and there is a maximum number of levels.
2: The system of commission going back up a downline is used by many successful firms - Amways, Betterware and Kleeneze are some that you may have heard of. The difference with them is you have to sell a physical product and everyone back up your downline gets part of the margin. All of the products are sourced by the parent company and any materials needed to sell the products also supplied (at a cost usually).
3: There is no repeat selling needed with All In Poker (not to the same customers anyway). Once you have introduced someone it is down to All In to provide the service and product to retain them.
4: In a usual system like this any unqualified commission goes to the people at the top. However with All In Poker all the unclaimed revenues goes into Freeroll tournaments. These freerolls will require you to play some hands (if it is the same as during beta testing, which I think it is then it is only 1 raked hand). When there were only a few players these were worth a $1000 a month.
5: Work out how much rake you would get from yourself with a 35% deal playing 750 hands and then work out how much you would get from having 10 similar players playing beneath you on All In. There is nothing to stop you playing your 750 hands on All In and playing the rest on a different skin with your own rakeback.
6: You can put positive or negative spin on anything and make it sound realistic.
7: You cannot lose (unless you are crap at poker).

Daithio

Well it kind of is a pyramid scheme, just one that is slightly modified so that it will work.

Iago

Shortstack wrote:

There are some things that people need to get their heads around with this new idea.

7: You cannot lose (unless you are crap at poker).

well that's me screwed again so

PPP-Pit Boss

Shortstack wrote:

2: The system of commission going back up a downline is used by many successful firms - Amways, Betterware and Kleeneze are some that you may have heard of

OOOOOOOOhhhhhh Kleeneze :0) now there is a quality giftstore and a novel marketing approach.
Yes thank you I would love one of those reallydoesntlooklikeastonetohideyourkeyinatallatall products.
Quality stuff!

Culchie

PPP-Pit Boss wrote:

OOOOOOOOhhhhhh Kleeneze :0) now there is a quality giftstore and a novel marketing approach.
Yes thank you I would love one of those reallydoesntlooklikeastonetohideyourkeyinatallatall products.
Quality stuff!

You wouldn't be worried now or anything would ya?

What's 750 hands per month between friends ?

Marq

Pyramid scheme.

Culchie

The Law

http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/1980_27.html


I'm not lawyer, but no payment is being asked from anyone, therefore it is a redistribution of profits, and therfore not a pyramid scheme.

If it takes off, you can be sure one or more of the Poker companies will be testing the law very quickly.

Instead of giving to Marketing Agencies (we won't go there again:p ) hundreds of thousands of euros for very short advertisment campaigns, they give it back to their players. Good Luck to them

mewso

hotspur wrote:

Ladbrokes isn't on the Prima network, they just use the same Microgaming software, they don't share the player base so you haven't played on the Prima network before if you have only played on Ladbrokes.

pokertroll wrote:

Ladbrokes uses the same software by Microgaming but is not on the Prima Network.

Thanks for the info. So too late to play in that freeroll I got invited to. Oh well.

karlh

it really is a shame the prima software is so icky

DeVore

musician wrote:

Thanks for the info. So too late to play in that freeroll I got invited to. Oh well.

you will be able to play tomorrow's qualifier.

DeV.

PPP-Pit Boss

Culchie wrote:

You wouldn't be worried now or anything would ya?

What's 750 hands per month between friends ?

I concur with "icky"

;0)

It sounds complicated but I am not raining on the parade of such a creative concept.

Doc Farrell

Culchie wrote:

The Law

http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/1980_27.html


I'm not lawyer, but no payment is being asked from anyone, therefore it is a redistribution of profits, and therfore not a pyramid scheme.

If it takes off, you can be sure one or more of the Poker companies will be testing the law very quickly.

Instead of giving to Marketing Agencies (we won't go there again:p ) hundreds of thousands of euros for very short advertisment campaigns, they give it back to their players. Good Luck to them

the voice of wisdom as always, Mr. Culchie.

since its not costing me a dime I'll wait and see.