Torc Programming Positions

DermotGallagher

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?s=&threadid=39094

We've a couple of positions to fill, so check it out and follow it thru if you're interested!

Evil Phil

Atm, the positions are soley what you can do for us in your spare time, but there's the real possibility that these will be paying jobs in the very near future.

:rolleyes: Bloody typical. You're a project manager aren't you?

Hobbes

If your not offering pay, then you can't call it employment? Work Experience prehaps.

btw your website doesn't really speak volumes for your company. At least update the plans or remove them. And suggesting DX7 as a good download?

DermotGallagher

Originally posted by Evil Phil




:rolleyes: Bloody typical. You're a project manager aren't you?

Not really. Just a programmer trying to get a games company off the ground looking for like-minded people.

DermotGallagher

Originally posted by Hobbes
If your not offering pay, then you can't call it employment? Work Experience prehaps.

btw your website doesn't really speak volumes for your company. At least update the plans or remove them. And suggesting DX7 as a good download?

Don't see the mention of 'employment' yer chatting about. Just see reference to 'positions' that have opened up - much like the other 10 positions that different people are currently filling (most for over 3.5yrs) in the hope of creating something in this industry, in this country.

Kinda need DX7 to run the TechDemo in Direct3D - hence the link.

Evil Phil

Originally posted by DermotGallagher

Not really. Just a programmer trying to get a games company off the ground looking for like-minded people.

Sounds to my like you a programmer looking for people who will work for free for your benefit.

Evil Phil

Originally posted by DermotGallagher


Don't see the mention of 'employment' yer chatting about.

I think that's the point Hobbes is making, it's certainly the point I'm making. You're asking people to do the work for nothing, there's nothing in it for them. No return, no money, no job. All you offer is a maybe, and in Software Development 'maybe' is worth even less than 'thanks for working for free'.


However, we try to help people on this board. FÁS have very good programming courses an will pay you to take somebody on and they'll pay their salary for the first year. Go talk to them, or would that be to honest?

DermotGallagher

Originally posted by Evil Phil


Sounds to my like you a programmer looking for people who will work for free for your benefit.

Its a double-edged sword in that both parties benefit. I need help on these particular modules as I'm up to my eyes in other areas, and whoever comes on board gets the chance to work deep inside our new engine and the learning opportunities that affords.

Atm, our game FATE is freeware so there's no real rewards for anyone to come out of that, other than maybe putting it on a CV in the hope that it leads to something else - much like working on a mod.

If we get the investment we're currently negotiating, then FATE stops being freeware and its full-time jobs all round for everyone involved - everyone benefits.

Evil Phil

If we get the investment we're currently negotiating, then FATE stops being freeware and its full-time jobs all round for everyone involved - everyone benefits.

Will you guarantee this in writing for everybody who takes up you're offer?

DermotGallagher

Originally posted by Evil Phil


Will you guarantee this in writing for everybody who takes up you're offer?

Absolutely - it's part of the package.

I'm just trying to get a handle on who's out there, what they've been doing and if they think they've something to offer.

I'm not just talking experienced game programmers here - I'd take someone on board who doesn't have the experience, but shows a little talent and most importantly has the hunger to learn.

Evil Phil

You should have said, would have reduced the flameage

[additional]
And you really should check out FAS.
[/additional]

Greenbean

"I think that's the point Hobbes is making, it's certainly the point I'm making. You're asking people to do the work for nothing, there's nothing in it for them. No return, no money, no job. All you offer is a maybe, and in Software Development 'maybe' is worth even less than 'thanks for working for free'."

Ok, I think people over-reacted here and perhaps it wasn't clear enough what Dermot was offering - but it certainly wasn't an attempt to dupe people. When you're working so deeply with a project and its part of your everyday life you can forget that other people don't know all the same details that you might know. To me I would imagine this is a Grade A opportunity, absolute top drawer, if you don't know why then you're probably not the type of person for the opportunity. I'm pushing to get into games development sometime in the future and I'm pushing to improve my programming skills... and I'm just bloody mad about games in general. What Dermot is offering is the chance for anyone who is enthusiastic enough to grab this opportunity to be in a home-grown dev team that looks serious enough to do the business.

I'm sending my email off now.

Evil Phil

I don't think I was over reacting. He should have mentioned the written guarantee. If it had been an attempt to dupe people into working for nothing and reaping the rewards from their efforts it wouldn't have been the first time a software company have done this. Lets face most of not all* of them do it to their existing staff everyday, so it had to be questioned.

Grade A opportunities come with a salary.


*except for Spin, please don't kill me

Trojan

Phil, while I agree with you that Dermot could have provided a little more information, I think that we need to remember that this is a communitity bbs: they are asking fellow members of the community to give them a hand in return for possible opportunities etc.

You can't really call this trying to dupe people - who would possibly sign up for something like this without really the bold print, nevermind the fine print?

Nice flaming btw, but I must criticise one thing: you came accross a little to logical and reasonable to be really effective - start reading some of WWMs old posts, they'll show you how to really infuriate people

Have a look at http://www.torcinteractive.com/news.htm

Al.

Originally posted by Evil Phil
I don't think I was over reacting. He should have mentioned the written guarantee. If it had been an attempt to dupe people into working for nothing and reaping the rewards from their efforts it wouldn't have been the first time a software company have done this. Lets face most of not all* of them do it to their existing staff everyday, so it had to be questioned.

Grade A opportunities come with a salary.


*except for Spin, please don't kill me

Evil Phil

/me stamps feet

Ok I was a little over the top in my accusations for which I apologise to Dermot. But there wasn't even a mention of print bold or fine in the original post and it seemed quite dubious to me.

But as you said this is a community board and I, as a member of the community, can expess my opinion as long as its genuine. An opinion cannot prevent somebody forming their own or applying for the position/work experience/whatever. If you don't agree with the opinion say so, or go complain on the admin board but don't give any:

I think that we need to remember that this is a communitity bbs:

bs.

DermotGallagher

I admit I should maybe have had more info in the original post, but this kinda hits the nail on the head in regards to the audience it was intended for.

Originally posted by Greenbean
...if you don't know why then you're probably not the type of person for the opportunity

Anyways, thanks to all who responded.