march 6th

sanvean

just wondering how everyone else is thinking of voting in the on march 6th. i was thinking of voting "no", but then those freaks from youth defence were advocating a "no" vote, so now i'm confused. i'm still going to be voting no, but perhaps i'll throw a brick at some youth defence supporters, just to let them know that i wasn't voting for their crazy crazy ideas

GerK

I say educate yourself about thee implications (legal and moral) and vote with your conscience, not to spite those crasy sickos of Youth Defence or any other group.

p-t saviour

its pretty damn confuddling alright, i guess i'll have to read up on it a little more... all i can say is, fúck those freaks from youth defence!

pixe

Its all a bit of a mess really.

Basically if you vote "yes" Abortion is illegal in this country...end of story.

If you vote no, its still open to debate and leaves the whole issue very hazy..when can there be abortion...when not, something that has been debatedd for years now.
(which will probely mean that it will come in eventally due to us being in the European Union Ect ect)


However ....(this is were it gets confusing)

The Prolife People don't want to vote yes, (even though it means no abortion), because of issues that are hazy surrounding things like embros used in artifical insemation, and the morning after pill.
They want something concrete to make sure that they are protected too, and unless they are they don't want to vote yes to no Abortion..., there want to vote no, so that the debate stays open.


The Pro abortion people also want to vote no because they want abortion to come to this country,and because of other reasons ie..in this country if a prenant woman is sucidal, she can legally get an abortion. This arctical means no abortion, full stop. So they're voting no.

Then there's the all the other government parties Labour, fina gael....ect. They don't want fina fail's bill to be susscessfull so near a generall election, so they're voting no.

And lastly there is fina fial, and they say vote yes, for whatever their reasons.

Hope that makes it alittle clearer...I'm still confussed myself but I think thats the generall gist

sickle

voting no here.
we need to have a real referundum on the subject.

Ste k

I'm voting no, but that is because I have spent some serious time trying to work out the difference between the two campaigns. i.e.

Posters

Yes - "Vote yes to protect Babies"

No - "Votes no to save lives"

Idiots

To be honest if you cant decided go down and spoil your vote, scribble anything you like on it i.e. "your all a pack of stupid liars"

Either way just vote cause if the youth dont vote then the government wont listen end of story and we will never get phantomfm on the air legally

Gar_ptc

confuddled?!?!?

Thomas from Presence

The only reason why certain pro-lifers are voting no is that because they do not understand politics or philosophy. I'm voting yes personally for my own reasons and I urge everyone to consider the leaflet coming from the referendum commission with objectivity.

Of the people I have talked to about the vote most of those I talked to were voting no because 'Those Paedophile priests want a Yes vote' or, in the case of the youth defence, 'the organisation have asked it of me cos they know best (cos they're all ****ing constitutional lawyers and not emotive simpletons, oh no...)'.

If you vote make sure you know what your voting for. Be a shepard and not a sheep. Don't vote No because it is the cool thing to do or because the church says vote yes.

Vote after you've considered the facts as an individual.
For info on what its all about:

http://www.refcom.ie/RefCom/real/ref.nsf/60380ded48d4d04880256a4d006bd504/7c6af84da91c213180256b65005f5710?OpenDocument

o sleep

personally, i'm voting no, and not because of who's telling me to vote yes or no (although it is an interesting point: look at who's telling us to vote yes: fianna fail, the church, youth defence and then look at who's telling us to vote no: labour, the socialists, the adelaide hospital, the green party, FG, the green party, sinn fein ... apart from sinn fein and FG, who are a bunch of hypocritical twats the party's urging a no vote would tend to get my support every time). but i'd agree it's all so confusing, and most of the political parties are using it as a means of ensuring election victory in the forthcoming election (as was mentioned before).

for me it all falls down to whether a mentally ill woman (who is suicidal) should be able to get an abortion in ireland and not have to travel to england (which could be out of her financial reach) ...

Sinsey

Personally at the moment the most confusing part of this bill is the section that deals with complications in pregnancy which could result in the death of the mother.

It reads:
(2) Notwithstanding subsection (1) of this section, abortion does not include the carrying out of a medical procedure by a medical practitioner at an approved place in the course of which or as a result of which unborn human life is ended where that procedure is, in the reasonable opinion of the practitioner, necessary to prevent a real and substantial risk of loss of the woman's life other than by self- destruction.

Now as we do not yet have a list of approved places how do we know how limiting this clause will be?

If I’m happily pregnant, discover a serious complication while on holiday in Donegal, and cannot reach the nearest “approved place”, (which for all we know at the moment could be Galway or Dublin) on time to save my life, will the doctor in Donegal let me die, because if he carries out a termination in the hospital in Donegal he’ll be considered under this bill as having illegally carried out abortion????? Will every county have an “approved place”???
Does anyone know the answer to these questions?

As a woman this is scaring the merda out of me, and very little does, so I’m voting no.

clevenger

we've survived till now without the need to put legislation into our constitution and removing the presidential power of refferal to the supreme court is A VERY BAD IDEA in my opinion.

Whatever your views on abortion this nonsense bill insults both camps.

Vote No and lets have a propper referendum where the issue can be abortion and not this terrible ham fisted bill

Victor

Cop on guys, this referendum isn't about getting Phantom on air legally or paedophile priests or throwing bricks at people.

---

There are more detailed and mature discussion on the Politics board.

Information Point - Twenty-fifth Amendment of the Constitution
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?s=&threadid=42500

Discussion - Abortion should be legalised in Ireland
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?s=&threadid=41393

Discussion - Why isnt it just plain forward yes or no?
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?s=&threadid=42890

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Originally posted by Sinsey
Now as we do not yet have a list of approved places how do we know how limiting this clause will be?

If I’m happily pregnant, discover a serious complication while on holiday in Donegal, and cannot reach the nearest “approved place”, (which for all we know at the moment could be Galway or Dublin) on time to save my life, will the doctor in Donegal let me die, because if he carries out a termination in the hospital in Donegal he’ll be considered under this bill as having illegally carried out abortion????? Will every county have an “approved place”??? Does anyone know the answer to these questions?

It is suggested that the will be about 30 "approved places" initially, covering I imagine all the main hospitals and maternity hospitals.

WhiteWashMan

Originally posted by o sleep
personally, i'm voting no, and not because of who's telling me to vote yes or no (although it is an interesting point: look at who's telling us to vote yes: fianna fail, the church, youth defence and then look at who's telling us to vote no: labour, the socialists, the adelaide hospital, the green party, FG, the green party, sinn fein ... apart from sinn fein and FG, who are a bunch of hypocritical twats the party's urging a no vote would tend to get my support every time). but i'd agree it's all so confusing, and most of the political parties are using it as a means of ensuring election victory in the forthcoming election (as was mentioned before).

for me it all falls down to whether a mentally ill woman (who is suicidal) should be able to get an abortion in ireland and not have to travel to england (which could be out of her financial reach) ...

maybe you should learn to make up your own mind....

Thomas from Presence

Clevenger,

If a pro lifer votes no then there will never be another referendum on this issue again!


Osleep, Are youth defence not pushing a no vote? Either way I'd vote yes even if the Nazis were around calling for a yes. If the green party-labour-FG krew hoped in the fire....!

DeVore

I really dislike YD, and I've been (mistakenly) on the wrong end of their bully boys.

However, I dont condone throwing rocks at them nor this off-topic thread. Closed. Sanvean, I'd appreciate it if you kept your hot head to yourself, thanks. Civility is a watchword round these parts, it costs nothing and it puts you in a different phylum from the people you claim to despise.

DeV.