United Ireland

Sand

A united Ireland is an aspiration, but as mentioned already there will be a lot of costs involved. I voted yes, but you can imagine the troubles there would be with the likes of the Orange Order. Areas like Drumcree can be effectively policed by the British because both sides in that dispute dislike the British. Its a nice advantage to have because youre not seen to identify too much with either side. If the Irish were to try Drumcree it wouldnt be long before the Orange order felt they were getting oppressed by a pan nationalist front, whereas now they feel more betrayed by the British government. This is enough reason for JPFers to justify and exscuse terrorism, and weve got plenty of JPFers.

And then we would have Von and co saying "Well I dont support loyalist terrorism but....".
Last parts just joking. Sorta.

Kopf

Originally posted by JustHalf
That's because Catholics have sex all the time.

EVERY SPERM IS SACRED!

why do people post these messages?

The Corinthian

Funny thing is I'm not certain that even the nationalists want to be reunited with their southern cousins. There’s more in common between the two communities in NI than between northern nationalists and ourselves.

I get the impression that, rhetoric aside, bother unionists and nationalists would prefer rule from Belfast, rather than rule from either London or Dublin.

Sand

Id agree with that. With the EU theyd have a common market, the Euro would take care of their currency problems - and government tends to get better and better the closer it is to the people it governs. Only problem for them would be the massive social spending that is carried out on NI currently. However perhaps the EU could step in again here.

Only thing is nationalists would have to learn to trust unionists a lot more than they do now, and parties up there would have to start being more about the politics they represent rather than the community. The fate of the Alliance Party is not a cause ofr optimism. Given that Id think nationalists would prefer to be in a "secured" united ireland rather than a "see saw" Independant Northern Ireland.

Paddy20

Ireland is already united, except for that damn Sterling currency?. The border has gone! We are NOW ALL - European citizens - The world and the citizens of Europe have outgrown the ignorance and prejudice of the past. Lets face facts and get on with our LIVES for the mutual benefit of all the people on this Island.

GreenHell

Heres me thinking we are in a united europe, doesn't that superseed a united Ireland?

Our man in Havana

Originally posted by paddy20
Ireland is already united, except for that damn Sterling currency?. The border has gone! We are NOW ALL - European citizens - The world and the citizens of Europe have outgrown the ignorance and prejudice of the past. Lets face facts and get on with our LIVES for the mutual benefit of all the people on this Island.

It would be great if the North would use the Euro. It would make life a lot easier for all both north and south. I bet it is hurting their exports.


Note to Mod: This post is more than 1 line

Hobbes

I vote no simply because your enforcing something on a load of people who don't want it (which is what is currently happening to the other side).

A better solution is to give N.I. an independant country status answering to the EU.

bonkey

Originally posted by Hobbes
I vote no simply because your enforcing something on a load of people who don't want it (which is what is currently happening to the other side).

A better solution is to give N.I. an independant country status answering to the EU.

Which is again enforcing something on a load of people who dont want it.

Why is it a better solution?

jc

Meh

Originally posted by Hobbes
A better solution is to give N.I. an independant country status answering to the EU.

Haven't they tried letting the Nordies run their own affairs before?

Hobbes

a seperate goverment is not a seperate country. What I was suggesting it is set up as a new country where they set thier own laws, for this UK+Ireland both wash thier hands of it.

bonkey

Originally posted by Hobbes
a seperate goverment is not a seperate country. What I was suggesting it is set up as a new country where they set thier own laws, for this UK+Ireland both wash thier hands of it.

Fair enuff, but its still not what anyone in the North wants, so why is it a preferable solution, except in that it pisses everyone off equally, rather than only pissing off one faction or the other ???

jc

swiss

The current power sharing executive in the north is, IMO the best course of action the North of Ireland can pursue at the current time. We are all aware of the fact that the Catholic birth rate is outstripping that of their Protestant and Unionist counterparts. This is bound to cause tension and can enflame tensions in the North where every street in every city is seen as being either 'Nationalist' or 'Unionist'.

Originally posted by The Corinthian
Funny thing is I'm not certain that even the nationalists want to be reunited with their southern cousins. There’s more in common between the two communities in NI than between northern nationalists and ourselves.

I'm not quite so certain of this. I certainly don't think that I have a particular insight into the lives and aspirations of Northern Ireland's Catholic community - however given the obvious mistrust and violence still in evidence between the two communities, I do believe that a majority of Nationalists would be in favor of 'repatriation' to the Republic of Ireland.

The underlying lack of trust won't (again IMO) be assuaged by a repatriation to Ireland or Britain. I believe that an ethos of the two communities working together must be fostered in order to help overcome the underlying social divisions. This is why Sinn Féin's presence in the North is acceptable - on condition of course that they live up to their responsibilities under the Good Friday Agreement.

Excepting a return to violence by paramilitary activists, I think that an atmosphere of trust can 'creep in' should all parties be willing to work together. The current unrest stems from the population shift currently in evidence. This, unfortunately for the Unionist community, won't change. Depending on their reaction to this phenomenon we may enjoy a peaceful transition (since I believe that this transition will eventually transpire) or the North may degrade into Civil War. I am willing to give peace a chance by allowing the current arrangement, largely acceptable to all communities to remain.

mike65

Originally posted by The Corinthian
Funny thing is I'm not certain that even the nationalists want to be reunited with their southern cousins. There’s more in common between the two communities in NI than between northern nationalists and ourselves.

I would put a different slant on the above, I suspect that its
the population in the Republic who would'nt want to be
"re-united" myself...

Mike.

Paddy20

As an Irish citizen who grew up in Donegal - " The only part of Ulster that was never partitioned". I have always felt very close to the people of Derry City, maybe thats because my grandparents originated from there. Now after some 30 years of bloodshed and suffering felt deeply throughout Ireland. I realise that "THE BORDER" has disappeared??. Where are the old customs huts etc. As I stated before - "Ireland is already united". Anyone who thinks otherwise is sufferring from a mental aberration or "MINDSET" and the border or division only exists in their subconcious. So wake up - enjoy the NEW Europe, live your life - and have the grace to allow others to do the same. yours,paddy20

Our man in Havana

Wow! I dont think that anyone expected that.

I think he is mad but only he knows what trimble is thinking. I am afraid that it will only re ignite the troubles and bring trouble on the people of the south:(

mike65

Trimble knows what he's doing, namely getting the result he wants - a NO, then locking the issue up for at least another 7 years. He also knows a referenum will concentrate minds down here.

Mike.

sceptre

Think you're right Mike, especially with the auld leadership election coming up (always nice to be re-elected unopposed if you manage to keep everyone on side)

Trimble hopes to keep the issue at bay for a generation. And that's even longer than seven years. Used be regarded as 25 years, suspect with an amount of babies being born to younger parents, we may redesignate "a generation" as 20 years before long. At any rate, a long time.

Plus it'll refocus the shinners and maybe even the sdlp on something other than budgets and education as they spend time campaigning on a referendum that they can hardly win, at least within the current "generation" of voters

mike65

I mention 7 years because thats the time that must pass before another referendum can be called on the same issue.

Mike.

Rebel18

If the majority of Northern Ireland wishes to be reunited with us in the south then i would be in favour of such a move. I understand that any attempt at reunification would create a massive burden on the economy (take the example of the reunification of East and West Germany, the reunified Germany is only starting to recover now after 10 years)

But i think that the case of Germany proves a point that a country which has been seperated for so long can be unified provided it is in accordance of the wishes of the populace. Another fact that you might not have already been aware of is that many West Germans had their doubts like many of us here (15-20% did not want a reunified Germany) but i don't think that should deterr us from something which we have sought and fought over for nearly a 100 years.