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Breakthrough in dispute between Eircom and Doyle on DSL system

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    #62
    jmcc
    Registered Users Posts: 7,410 ✭✭✭jmcc


    Originally posted by SkepticOne
    Are you using these as an example of how Internet access is much better in Dublin? None of these affect the reality for the bulk of home users or very small businesses in Dublin which is metered 56k or metered ISDN.

    No just as investments in IT related operations. The broadband strategy will benefit businesses first but it may take time to benefit the ordinary users.

    Don't get me wrong, though. At the level of larger businesses, there is a major advantage to operating in Dublin. There's a far more competitive leased-line market there. If these regional broadband projects address this imbalance then that's a good thing, IMO.

    It is this issue that is that the core of the problem. Once internet companies reach a certain critical level, the incentive to migrate their operations to Dublin becomes overwhelming. This loss to the local economies is corrosive. The broadband strategy is intended to address the problem. It will also probably trigger some local WiFi ISP operations.

    Regards...jmcc


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    #63
    Boston
    Closed Accounts Posts: 17,163 ✭✭✭✭Boston


    Im betting 80 euro including vat but excluding line rental
    at im bettign esat will unsercut this and sell it at a loss, probably around 50 euro.

    have to remember, the ones that will get adsl off esat will be the ones on no limits and esat losse alot more then 10-20 euro a month on this growth.

    basically id say they bet on the wholesale price droping


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    #64
    yellum
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,025 ✭✭✭yellum


    But weren't Esat also betting on flat rate to happen and decided to offer it before it was to come in, but then got badly burned when it didn't ?

    I thnk BT might not go for that seeing as they are still laying off people in the Esat group and still are a good few billion in debt worldwide. I'd say Esat will charge around the same as Eircom maybe more.

    Will they be in direct competition though ? Looking at the various trial areas it seems not.


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    #65
    dahamsta
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 16,659 ✭✭✭✭dahamsta


    But weren't Esat also betting on flat rate to happen and decided to offer it before it was to come in, but then got badly burned when it didn't ? I thnk BT might not go for that seeing as they are still laying off people in the Esat group and still are a good few billion in debt worldwide. I'd say Esat will charge around the same as Eircom maybe more.

    On the bitstream front, unless they do as Boston suggested and sell at or below cost (which I think highly unlikely), I reckon Esat will be allowed call the shots. I don't think BT's (slowly lowering) debts will come into it. Again, I think they'll go under Eircom. But let's be honest, we don't even know if they've signed or are even negotiating contracts yet...

    Will they be in direct competition though ? Looking at the various trial areas it seems not.

    I don't think they will at the start, but it can only be a matter of time before they start to overlap. As has been suggested on this forum, there seems to be a chance that actual rollouts may even occur outside of Dublin first. It's all up in the air right now, very hard to call really.

    adam


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    #66
    Boston
    Closed Accounts Posts: 17,163 ✭✭✭✭Boston


    well you have to remember, the first thing esat will do is dump its nolimit users on to adsl, it woudl be in their interest to offer a special start up rate for this. i mean they dont want to piss off their clients to much but they do want rid of that black hole that is nolimits.

    basically i dont know, one things for sure, its bound to be cheaper in some way then eircom, but you pay for it in the end.
    maybe free installation.


    remember the cost of bitstream access is only the start, theres other costs and then a worthwhile profit margin.

    as for the country, i cant say about bitstream but adsl will be out in dublin first then the country and since bitstream has to be provided in all upgraded exchanges i cant see how bitstream will be anywhere but dublin for awhile.

    they will be in direct competition, it will be just like england, except more expensive. if you can get adsl from eircom you should be able to get it from esat.

    LLU on the other hand will be differnt, which i think a few people here are mixing it up with

    llu doesnt effect adsl, as adsl is nearly allways done over bitstream


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    #67
    lynchie
    Registered Users Posts: 1,994 ✭✭✭lynchie


    If a breakthrough has been made between the ODTR and Eircom does this mean that the ODTR's restriction on Eircom releasing i-stream has been removed? Can Eircom start selling i-stream commercially now or are there still more problems to be sorted out between them??


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    #68
    irishguy
    Registered Users Posts: 3,299 ✭✭✭irishguy


    i think €70 for an uncaped 512k adsl connection is good in Ireland AT THE MOMENT. It will be snaped up by all small to medium sized business cus most of them are running on multiple isdn lines which are costing them a packet. Personaly i would pay €70 for it if i didnt have powernet, powernet is costing me £50 and it is not worth much more it is very slow at times, is down regularly and you only get a 15 min lease on your ip address. the whole limerick node [about 130 people] is running on a 2MB line so if every one is downloading a large file is slows down to 56k proportions. its crap for gaming the pings are between 200 and 500 ms also pages load very slow at times but for downloading it is realy fast but the upload is crap 10KB


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    #69
    SkepticOne
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,718 ✭✭✭SkepticOne


    Originally posted by lynchie
    If a breakthrough has been made between the ODTR and Eircom does this mean that the ODTR's restriction on Eircom releasing i-stream has been removed? Can Eircom start selling i-stream commercially now or are there still more problems to be sorted out between them??
    Not yet. The article only refers to 'industry sources' suggesting that the impasse may be coming to an end.


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    #70
    Hannibal_12
    Registered Users Posts: 366 ✭✭Hannibal_12


    Apparently we are tied with greece for the worst availability of broadband ( i.e none).
    I love Ireland, really


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    #71
    Tellox
    Registered Users Posts: 2,680 ✭✭✭Tellox


    oh my god...things are actually happening?

    are they planning on having all of ireland connected in may or are introducing it in may?


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    #72
    scojones
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,230 ✭✭✭scojones


    "i bet this price" "i bet that price" can we stop the speculation and lets just see what happens? That way not everyone will be disappointed by the final result. Too much hype over pricing == many unhappy people after outcome. BYEE!


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    #73
    seamus
    Registered Users Posts: 68,317 ✭✭✭✭seamus


    [Bugger, I edited seamus' post instead of quoting it. Such are the pitfalls of power. Seamus, my sincere apologies. - adam]

    Seamus said: Just keep in mind that STG£30 == €50, so we're not miles behind

    And then adam screwed up his post with: Again, not a like-with-like comparison. EUR€50 is the alleged wholesale price. The equivalent price in the U.K. would be GBP£14.75 (EUR€23.85 according to xe.net).


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    #74
    Typedef
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,564 ✭✭✭Typedef


    'Industry Sources'.

    I would say Esat/BT will come out with a price of 60 to 70 euro, I doubt they will go as high as eircom who will probably be somewhere reasonably between 80 and 90, though seeing as how it was going to try and fleece 'us' with dsl, eircom's eventual product may be as high as 100.
    Yeah 100 euro wouldn't surprise me at all from eircom, I'm sure they could put some moronic business pitch onto it so that managers in companies who believe 'you get what you pay for' will believe that paying 20-30 euro more per month to errorcom is somehow in their interests.
    'sigh'


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    #75
    infomat
    Registered Users Posts: 179 ✭✭infomat


    Originally posted by Quorthon


    So therefore Adam, I am probably correct in stating that Eircon will try to charge for general line rental on top of the dsl charge?


    Q

    No you are not correct ... they will not "try to charge ... " they will charge what they are already charging you and voice calls will be charged for. Eircom are not unusual in doing this.


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    #76
    Quorthon
    Closed Accounts Posts: 142 ✭✭Quorthon


    Originally posted by infomat


    No you are not correct ... they will not "try to charge ... " they will charge what they are already charging you and voice calls will be charged for. Eircom are not unusual in doing this.

    er I was only trying to establish what the "all-in" cost of this possible new service would be - most people look at it and say "€75 -€100 looks ok to me compared to my current phone bill". I think a lot of people dont realise that this is not a direct comparison because line rental and calls will be additional, and for a user like myself, for example, whose bill with ISDN including all line rentals etc rarely goes above €100, it is not the holy grail it might seem to be at first glance.

    Q


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