Irish Times DSL story

Dangger

Here we go again......(I am meeting with Forfas at 10 today, just a reminder), I intend to ask them why no one is listening to them.



http://www.ireland.com/business/news/2002/0418/news7.htm

"The proposed retail price of €80-€90 for DSL services here would be substantially higher than in the UK, where providers currently offer services for below £30 sterling (€48.70). "

"......the service here will be targeted at small businesses rather than the average household user. "

"Mr Philip Nolan, chief executive of Eircom, said yesterday he had not ruled out introducing a consumer product in the future. But he said the firm already had a number of broadband technologies including ISDN. "

Ah yes I must have overlooked the rip roaring speeds of ISDN when I took up this job, thanks for lowering the price recently Philip.


Will the last one to leave the country please turn the lights off.

:mad:


In the print version of todays Times it adds...

"The telecoms regulator has warned that enforcement provisions in the Communications Regualtion Bill would result in a "slow process" to resolve cases."

How much slower can they get?

rymus

Originally posted by Dangger
But he said the firm already had a number of broadband technologies including ISDN.

/me proceeds to rip his hair out

sceptre

Originally posted by Dangger

In the print version of todays Times it adds...

"The telecoms regulator has warned that enforcement provisions in the Communications Regualtion Bill would result in a "slow process" to resolve cases."

How much slower can they get?

Oh, I think we may be very surprised.

Does the ODTR have a staffing problem? In other words when DSL actually becomes available, do they believe that the number of complaints/queries/and so on will overwhelm them?

longword

Originally posted by rymus
/me proceeds to rip his hair out

There are one or two dictionary definitions of the word "broadband" which could include ISDN. It's a bit of a stretch, but it can be done - good enough for any marketeer.

Giblet

"Mr Philip Nolan, chief executive of Eircom, said yesterday he had not ruled out introducing a consumer product in the future. But he said the firm already had a number of broadband technologies including ISDN. "

Wait a second. Unless a 56k modem is broadband(!), there is only one mainstream one, ISDN, or a leased line. So two then.

gandalf

1 is a number

Gandalf.

Lemming

Originally posted by Giblet
Wait a second. Unless a 56k modem is broadband(!), there is only one mainstream one, ISDN, or a leased line. So two then.

I'd not put ideas in Eircom's heads about 56k being classified as broadband. KNowing then, they'd probably manage to justify it in their own eyes.

They'd roll out the whole history of 14.4, 28.8, 33.6 and then say how 56k is superior to them that it MUST be broadband :rolleyes: weeners

gandalf

I think Eircom define broadband by the amount of money they generate out of a line, not the actual throughput.

PSTN per Minute Dial = "Excellent Financial Broadband"
ISDN per Minute Dial = "High Speed Financial Broadband"
Leased Line = "Sir Tony can buy a new pair of designer socks!!"

TBH I think Eircoms marketing department are living on another planet.

Gandalf.

mdf

"The telecoms regulator has warned that enforcement provisions in the Communications Regualtion Bill would result in a "slow process" to resolve cases."

That's because it has to go to the DPP and through the courts, not a staffing issue

Lemming

Originally posted by gandalf
I think Eircom define broadband by the amount of money they generate out of a line, not the actual throughput.

PSTN per Minute Dial = "Excellent Financial Broadband"
ISDN per Minute Dial = "High Speed Financial Broadband"
Leased Line = "Sir Tony can buy a new pair of designer socks!!"

TBH I think Eircoms marketing department are living on another planet.

Gandalf.

ISDN = "It Still Does Nothing"


And that's all that needs be said on that one methinks

dahamsta

Whoa there Flossy!

Eircom: We will have one million DSL customers in two years.

Eircom: The service will be targetted at business.

So over a quarter of the population now run their own businesses, eh?

Liars.

adam

Ronan|Raven

This would make the new technology available to about one million customers by 2004 and radically change the availability of broadband services in the Republic.

Thats great, then I can expect to see DSL arrive in Roscommon around 2006,thank christ ill soon be leaving Ireland (briefly or longterm is to be decided). Its redicilous really the way that eircon have brought this country to its knees in the Internet Connection sense. Then they have the cheak to put on these ads with that bloody mouse! proclaiming the amazing speeds on ISDN! its amazing really they trumpet how they great they are lowering the price of this invaluable business tool! My relations in Germany have had ISDN as their standard conenction for some time as far as I know and pay the same standard phone line charge on it. I know that its a much larger country than here, but its telecom indusrty was in a bit of a shambles for some time.

Ah well who knows maybe eircon will astonish us all and give flat rate dial up services soon, even that would be some start as this lark of paying over e150 every month or so for pitties poor service is gone redicilous.

infomat

Originally posted by dahamsta
Whoa there Flossy!

So over a quarter of the population now run their own businesses, eh?

Liars.

adam

When you say something is a quote you should at least be accurate ... I have cut an extract from the Eircom Press Release which is included below:

"eircom plans to install DSL capability in 100 telephone exchanges throughout the country, making DSL available to approximately 1 million customers over the next two years."

Making ADSL available to 1 million customers is not the same has getting 1 million people to use the service. If they target business users there in no contradiction.

However, such a claim would indicate that they believe that all lines (or close to all lines) will be suitable for ADSL which is very interesting as I know many people who were not accepted for any of the trials because their lines were deemed unsuitable.

El_MUERkO

Will the last one to leave the country please turn the lights off.

sad but true

Tellox

very true.... makes me so angry...

gurramok

Originally posted by infomat

"eircom plans to install DSL capability in 100 telephone exchanges throughout the country, making DSL available to approximately 1 million customers over the next two years."

Making ADSL available to 1 million customers is not the same has getting 1 million people to use the service. If they target business users there in no contradiction.

Dahamsta did not say 1 million people will be getting the service.
It will be available to 1 million people and as that article says:

"......the service here will be targeted at small businesses rather than the average household user. "
which means that those 1 million people which it will be available to must be business users according to the article.
Alot of contradiction in the irish times article, whether its true or not.

longword

Originally posted by gurramok

"......the service here will be targeted at small businesses rather than the average household user. "
which means that those 1 million people which it will be available to must be business users according to the article.
Alot of contradiction in the irish times article, whether its true or not.

You're missing the point here - the subtle difference between users to whom the service is available and users at whom the service is targeted. There is no contradiction. Any of those million people can sign up, business or not, but Eircom won't be targeting them with a marketing campaign. They won't require a business line as opposed to a residential line.

Ba$tard

Lads,
I dunno about ye, but I'm grabbin' the team humvee and heading off to Eircom HQ give them a bit this and that...would someone gracefully man the gatling gun on the roof please?

Ok here it is in my eyes ....
The world now revolves around business sense first, self-perservation second then humanity third....just as Eircom does but they completely left out the 3rd factor here obviously.

Think about it...
It DOESNT make business sense(revenue) for Eircom to introduce DSL.....they dont want to ever give us flat rate....they will stall this as much as their little lawyers and accountants can with litagation, excuses and the like....

They want to squeeze every last drop out of the per/minute system they have now....fact is...its a massive money spinner...and obviously they know this....

If you work out how much a home user can download over a month at the cost of 79 Euro (lets say this is final home price)

56k
For 79 Euro[irP62.21] you get 6,221.25 minutes @ 1p/min
which means 373275 seconds @ 4kb/sec = 1493100kbs
which means 1.4931gig in total over a month

DSL
For 79 Euro[irP62.21] you get max mins(approx 35,000) per month - off + onpeak
Max D/L before penality is 3gig

So, for the same price on DSL, you can download twice the amount of data which means more bandwidth requirements for Eircom and you get more for your buck.

Plus the fact you dont suffer a nervous breakdown when you get DC'ed at 98% ftp completion with DSL*

* remains to be seen in the i-Scream implementation

What we need is for the top 5 Eircom corportate customers to say 'right so, you wont provide proper telecoms at a resonable cost? As soon as LLU is complete, we are off to Esat. bye now'

Pressure from business like this IMHO will make Eircom realise their days are numbered
J.

Hannibal_12

Bastard, you just tell me when and where and I'll use that gatling gun to its full potential.
Your post makes quite a lot of sense as I am sure Eircom have performed a similar calculation, perhaps resulting in the ridiculously high initial price they wanted to charge (to get as much as they get from per minute) but since they were stopped doing that then it only stands to reason that they will delay DSL for the home consumer for as long as possible.
I echo the sentiments of many people here when they express a desire to leave Ireland because of the still backward nature of so many things in this country.
DSL is particularly annoying as the internet is now such a vital resource and to be using it with such slow unreliable connections simply to keep an obstinate avaricious company like €ircon in business/profit is shameful.

infomat

Originally posted by gurramok


Dahamsta did not say 1 million people will be getting the service.
It will be available to 1 million people and as that article says:


Heres is his exact quote:

quote:

---

Eircom: We will have one million DSL customers in two years.

Eircom: The service will be targetted at business.

---

This quote does not correspond to any claim made by Eircom so I do not understand how one can claim that they are "Liars" based on the quote in question because the quote is not accurate.

Even if the quote was accurate the two statements do not contradict ... they can target business but accept non-business users as customers and doing this would make a lot of sense.

dahamsta

Infomat is of course correct. Eircom are not liars, they are deceptive. My apologies.

adam