Ship Baby granted IrishCitizenship

JacquesPompidou

Now I must say that the current Irish Refugee and Asylum system is a joke, do people not agree?

People say that Ireland has problems with racism, but I think It's nothing when compared to Germany, Australia, Finland....

Here's the story:
A
Baby born on a ferry is entitled to citizenship.
A baby of Nigerian parents on an Irish vessel en route to Ireland is deemed by Law to be an Irish citizen.

The boy was born to a Nigerian woman on board an Irish ferrires vessel the M.V Normandy while it was en roue from Cherbourg in France to Wexford in Ireland.....



Now I feel that the Irish system is a Joke.

I know Spanish friends of mine who came to Ireland, drew the Welfare for free, done free courses in your Universities...
..... Took Rent allowence from the State
.... Free OIL Heat and ESB
Went home to Spain to Work for a Month

And Continued to draw Irish Welfare while working in Spain




......
I know a Woman from Zaire who has recieved immediate priority Welfare, Housing... You name it, because she has a baby.
While Irish people continue to wait 7 or 8 years.


I came to Ireland to expect a strong tradition of Irish history, a powerful culture, strong Music, Celtic art, language.....
And maybe I did find something.

But it has changed.
Ireland reminds me of London, I don't think there's much difference between the culture. All I ever see on TV are English Soaps and English Soccer...

If you walk around Dublin with your eyes closed, you don't hear Irish anymore... You hear Chinese, Spanish, Arabic, Bantu.... One would think it was a dirty run down part New York or London.


About Taking Welfare and milking Ireland for all it's worth.
I think I may do the same.

Many other foreigners are doing it, so why shouldn't I?







Ship baby stroy from Irish Times Friday.

JacquesPompidou

Irish Times Friday 17th

JacquesPompidou

,

nanook

good points.

In relation to you spanish friends firstly they are all part of the EU, the huge conglomerate that is the Europe Union that entitles all of its residents to move and pass freely within its doors and corridors, yes your friends came over here and made the most of the welfare system, which in my opinion is a huge joke at the moment, and the took advantage of our eduction system also. All i can say on this matter is that this is somthing that ireland should wake up too. OUr welfare system pays one of the highest in the country and gives no enticementfor anyone to quit it and get a job. In ireland a married man with 2 kids can go and get a job in an unskilled profession and make minimum wage, or he can sit at home and take welfare which will give him housing, medical electricity travel and what ever else goes with it, now can you tell me where the inticement to get off one's butt is in this system possesed by the irish nation.

In relation to the nigerian woman i dont know enough about the asylum laws to comment but i do know it is a joke also. i am not racist in any way but it is tooo easy to claim assylum in this country maybe some one might just tighten the strings of that in some way and make it more efficient to deal with the potentail problems that may and will occur, dont get me wrong everyone is welcome here to visit and stay if they can fend for themselves but why should someone enter this country and the first thing they do is make a bee line for the social offices.


Rant over

Twomey

Once again proving nationalist/racist b.s. is the same the world over!!!!!

Victor

Originally posted by nanook
In relation to the nigerian woman i dont know enough about the asylum laws to comment but i do know it is a joke also.

Exactly, you don't know. The woman lives in Italy.

nanook

ok i need to get somthing straight here. i said i did not know anything about the situation of the story, there was nothing untoward any nationality or race.

I have the same contempt towards anyone who is just here for the socail wither the be nigerian, irish english spanish etc. I work hard for my money and the portion that goes towards the infrastucture of the country, why cant it go to hospitals and eduction instead of the welfare system.
It is a common fact that there is no incentive here in this country to get off of the dole and hence the section called long term unemployed, i come from a rural area where there are guys who every friday are at the post office in a que to collect their winnings and bee line straight to the and it is gone by that evening.

So beleive it or dont it is up too you.

IrishGuykokoJin

?

bonkey

Originally posted by JacquesPompidou
I came to Ireland to expect a strong tradition of Irish history, a powerful culture, strong Music, Celtic art, language.....
And maybe I did find something.

<snip>

If you walk around Dublin with your eyes closed, you don't hear Irish anymore... You hear Chinese, Spanish, Arabic, Bantu.... One would think it was a dirty run down part New York or London.

I dont get it.

First of all, you will hear as much Irish in Dublin today as you did about 70 years ago - possibly more in fact. The people of this nation have been mostly speaking English for a long time.

Secondly, you came to Ireland. Yet you complain that Dublin is no longer full of Irish. So what? Are you saying that you should have been let in, but those after you should have been refused?

Thirdly, I fail to see how hearing foreign languages makes it feel "dirty" or "run down". I'm really interested in hearing a rationalisation for that. Or is it just that you automatically equate multi-linguism with poverty or something. Perhaps you should come and visit Switzerland - we have multilingualism almos everywhere. I wonder if walking through the streets one of Europes richest cities and hearing multiple languages would also make you think of "dirty, run-down" places.

jc

JacquesPompidou

Originally posted by JacquesPompidou
Yes, it's nice for Countries like France, England, Holland, Ireland to be open minded, it's nice for them to allow Immigrants of all colour and religion into the country.

But sometimes the country extends its hand and it gets bit.

What I mean is a country can make a great effort to become open-minded and multi-cultured but sometimes certain foreigners don't make the effort to intergrate into the country.

If you go to another country, what do you do?

If an Irish man goes to Russia to work and live. Will he constantly shout at the Russians "Hey! Speak English" Why don't you do things the Irish Catholic way Commie?"

If "Amp" goes to India, will Amp criticise the Hindu ancestory of the Indian culture, will you slaughter "Cattle" so you can eat your beef steaks?

My point is many Countries like Canada, Germany, Australia have made a point now, that people living in the country have to learn and live with the Culture of their new Country. Maybe Ireland should do this too??

Now Amp if you continue to see this point of view as Racist, then the only "muppet" here is YOU!!

Why should French, German and Irish citizens who are honest workers have to pay Tax for people who just come in to spounge of this system, people who will make no effort to contribute to society , people who are lazy bums regardless of their race, skin colour, religion. ...

Ireland change your system 'cos it's Cr@p!


Ship baby stroy from Irish Times Friday.

Yes, I have visited the Swiss and they have one of the richest and nicest countries in the world, they have 4 offical languages French, German-Swiss ( Majority 70% ) , Italian and Romansch ( 0.5% ? ). Such an amazing place but.. Of course the rest of we Europeans haven't had such benefits as the Swiss bank leeches had, and they did make it very difficult for the Italian and Turkish working class to be granted citizenship.

Elmo

What is the point of this thread?

The social welfare system is crap and should be change so we get people into the work force. If we changed it you would be saying the oppisite and saying the government should put more money into the social welfare system.

You all talk about how "Foreigners" take advantage of the system. What about the Irish.

Here is an irish story for you.

This guy from Tallaght has a nice well paid job in a nice factory, decideds that as he sees all his friends on Social welfare/ the dole why the F U C K should he work and leaves the job.

As a nationalist i am not A racist and Irish Nationalist that is racist is a "muppet", Because you have to remember that we had to fight for freedom to rule our country, speak our lanuage to have our religion recognised. And we went to other countries and took advantage of their systems.

Everyone should be free.

To put it another way because we are different.

bonkey

Originally posted by JacquesPompidou
Yes, I have visited the Swiss and they have one of the richest and nicest countries in the world, they have 4 offical languages French, German-Swiss ( Majority 70% ) , Italian and Romansch ( 0.5% ? ).

Such an amazing place but.. Of course the rest of we Europeans haven't had such benefits as the Swiss bank leeches had.

You should really study your European history and find out the real reasons why Switzerland is an affluent country. I'll give you a hint. Mercenaries.

Also, I would point out that riches do not make a country. Will you aregue that Iraq is a wonderful place because its one of the richest countries in the world? Of course - the rest of the world hasnt had such benefits as massive oil fields.

Oh - wait - Iraq isnt such a wonderful place. So - exactly what do riches have to do with anything?

they did make it very difficult for the Italian and Turkish working class to be granted citizenship.

Really? When? How?

You still havent answered the question by the way. If you closed your eyes walking through some Swiss city, would the multilingualism make you think of "dirty" and "run-down" places like London

jc

Keep on Trekin

The Welfare scheme is dire, not only does it grant tons of Irish bums and wasters cash every day.
But it is also an open invatation for the rest of Europes Gypsies and Bums to come in and do the same.

Elmo

The Welfare scheme is dire, not only does it grant tons of Irish bums and wasters cash every day.
But it is also an open invatation for the rest of Europes Gypsies and Bums to come in and do the same.

But not everyone is a bum and a waster and it is important to provide services that will help the honest people of the world and to remember that there are more honest people then there are Dishonest bums and wasters in the world.

seamus

The American way is the way to do it (I think the english probably do it as well) - if they're looking for a job, but can't get one, they are still entitled to the dole. If they're sitting on their ass at home, and collecting their cheque every week, and not doing anything about getting a job, snip, instant welfare cutoff.
Also, if they have any kids, they should be yoinked into foster care, until the parent(s) gets a job (if they're not trying).

Of course these kind of rules wouldn't apply to people who physically can't work, and single mothers/fathers should be entitled to subsidised childcare, to allow them the chance to try get a job, and the unemployable should get free training........ Naturally there's no black and white here. It's all a rich tapestry of reform and being hard on people that's needed. (Just like for everything else in this country :rolleyes: )

Elmo

The American way is the way to do it (I think the english probably do it as well) - if they're looking for a job, but can't get one, they are still entitled to the dole. If they're sitting on their ass at home, and collecting their cheque every week, and not doing anything about getting a job, snip, instant welfare cutoff.
Also, if they have any kids, they should be yoinked into foster care, until the parent(s) gets a job (if they're not trying).

Of course these kind of rules wouldn't apply to people who physically can't work, and single mothers/fathers should be entitled to subsidised childcare, to allow them the chance to try get a job, and the unemployable should get free training........ Naturally there's no black and white here. It's all a rich tapestry of reform and being hard on people that's needed. (Just like for everything else in this country )

The American system isnt the best in the world.

Everyone would have to be means tested for your idea which would mean we would have to employ more Civil Servants for doing nothing (But then at least people would be out working)

We dont have enought foster perants to go round.

Again your idea of free training means putting money into the system why not just keep it the way it is. And people would just go on these courses as frequently as possible.

Some people have this idea of if there is a loophole use it.

You'll note that FAS is free and also you get money for doing it.
Also all education is free anyway, not so in america/britain where you pay for most of it.

Victor

What does this have to do with a baby getting citizenship?

---

Originally posted by Elmo
This guy [lets call him "Deco" - Victor] from Tallaght has a nice well paid job in a nice factory, decideds that as he sees all his friends on Social welfare/ the dole why the F U C K should he work and leaves the job.

Meanwhile his mate Anto, who was getting €118 a week on the dole (but didn't get 'the rent' because he was living with his ma and was, luckily, healthy enough not to need a medical card), now has his Deco’s job and is getting €400 a week.

With 80,000 unemployed and about 160,000 on the “live register” (includes part-time workers entitled to some benefit), there were perhaps 62,000 - 72,000 people who were in Deco's position. Out of a work force of 1,825,000 there is not huge room to radically increase employment without (a) a huge increase in the participation rate of older housewives (b) a big increase in immigrant workers or (c) putting inflation through 10%. Kindly note that in the EU only The Netherlands and Luxembourg have lower unemployment and they have exhausted option a, are using option b and do not want option c.

http://www.ireland.com/newspaper/breaking/2002/0530/breaking36.htm
http://www.cso.ie/publications/labour/qnhs.pdf

Elmo

What does this have to do with a baby getting citizenship?

The point of the story about "Deco" was that it is not just Emmigrates that use the Irish System its also the Irish.

The other point I was trying to make was that not many Irish or "Foreigns" use the system, Most either work or have a right to the money social welfare provided.

So in conclusion people should not just think that its just foreigners that rip the system, and those that do are below 10% of the foreign population living/working in Ireland at the moment and also that its only around 10% of the Irish population that rip off the system.

so now do you get were i am coming from sure as the writer of this tread points out while in rome.......

Many other foreigners are doing it, so why shouldn't I?

If you had read the first post, Vico, you would have realised that this tread was about the welfare system in Ireland not About some babies citizenship. The tread is mis-titled. It should be titled

Why the F**K should i work when others don't, I should rip off The Irish too, Stupid Paddies.

Elmo

Why the F**K should i work when others don't, I should rip off The Irish too, Stupid Paddies.

I do not agree with this, by the way. OK.

Kim Tae-Woo

Don't bother working, Keep on popin them out!

TwoShedsJackson

Don't bother posting anything intelligent, keep on bumping long-dead threads with a cretinous remark!!

TetsuoHashimoto

Good idea but

Is this Niece Treaty going to affect Nigerian babies born on Irish ships?

bonkey

Do you guys go out of your way to try and resurrect old threads with irrelevant commentaries?

Sheesh...

Thread locked.

jc