Ad's that fu.ck your favorite band in the ass.

Dustaz

sorry, i should have put in the word solely.

Karl Hungus

You know, this is possibly the funniest thread I've read in quite a while.
I think this has to be put in perspective.

Please, have a look through this thread: http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?s=&threadid=51164
And take notice of comments by Dustaz.

This one is a prize:

Originally posted by Dustaz
blink182 are about as close to punk as kylie and you know it.

What's this? Is Dusty perhaps angry about bands like Blink 182 and Sum 41 proclaiming themselves as punk? When clearly, they're not!

Got to love a man who can chop and change an opinion at whim.

Pigman

Originally posted by darthmise



What i dislike are musical elitists, who would nearly stop listening to a band if they got too big , popular or well known.


So pigman who are mad at exactly,

people who listen to the dandy warhols who haven't done so before they sold there music to an ad company

No. Everyone's gotta find out about a band from somewhere.

Or is the the ad company for poaching a band you like.

No. Every band who ever made it has ended up being the property of someone at some stage or another.

Or should it be directed at the band for "selling out"?

No. They've got to pay the bills and for all we know they might not have much say in where their music ends up.



To answer your question I am angry at ad campaigns in as much as they (inavoidably) shoot out 15 seconds of a song which people whom I could only describe as zealots anchor onto and make their obsession because they 'need music in their lives'. This is the only place (or one of few place) they are willing to be exposed to it.

By their very nature, these people whom I speak about never develop any real interest in the band yet will proclaim their 'love' and 'interest' to you me and the postman. This is fine to have a periperhal interest in something as long as you don't come to me and start telling me you love something that I hold important also yet when I engage one of these zealous individuals in conversation about the group that they profess to love you'll soon realise that there is nothing there below the exuberant surface.

These are the kind of people who have more movie soundtracks in their CD collection then actual LPs. These are the kind of people who'll never have more than one LP by any act because their interest in a band won't even last long enough til the next album is released. I'll admit that that might be an overly general definition of the people I am talking about but I'm sure you know who I'm talking about and you might even recognise some of them in the people you know, which is not to say they are bad people! Just their attitudes to music.

In essence I'm guessing this rant is more against the people eat up music like Big Macs rather than the ad campaigns which feed them. But I'm just saying here that it is things like ad campaigns that inform these individuals more than anything else out there, which is sad imho.

Pigman

I was able to take one general glimmer of hope from your previous post...

Originally posted by Dustaz

Why do you care if a few ppl decide they love the warhols off the back of 2 singles? Maybe they bought the album, or a t shirt or two.

...MAYBE being the operative word because I find that people who are exposed to music in this way do in fact NOT go out and buy the album and/or a Tshirt or two. In fact from my own experince they will MAYBE end up cogging it off someone they know, listen to it once and then spend the rest of thier energies proclaiming to all and sundry their undying love for said music.

Once again, I want to make it clear that I don't care if you never by a single by band x or if you buy one single, never listen to it and end up using it as a coaster for your beverage. As the slogan goes, its your money its your choice. What I am saying is if you are an individual that approaches your appreciation of music this way and then at the same time trys to convince all around you (including yourself) that you are the worlds greatest fan then you should stop.

Pigman

Originally posted by AngelWhore

Got to love a man who can chop and change an opinion at whim.

I hadn't seen that thread but yeah I had already formed that opinion of the guy. Also where you put the 'love' I would have put 'laugh at in a disparaging way'.

Dustaz

Originally posted by AngelWhore
Got to love a man who can chop and change an opinion at whim.

Point please gothboy?

Dustaz

Originally posted by Pigman
Blah Blah.

Look, Your point is self-evident. Of course theres going to be people who say they love a particular band and only ever buy one album. These people form a sizable portion of the music buying public. They number a hell of a lot more than 'your type' (probably includes me). This is nothing new, and TV ads dont make the situation too much worse. Isnt it much better that more people are exposed to the band so that they have the chance to go on and become proper fans?

I hadn't seen that thread but yeah I had already formed that opinion of the guy. Also where you put the 'love' I would have put 'laugh at in a disparaging way'

If you want, i could concentrate on your own ignorance and laugh at you for that? Dont know who the walls are? Pfft. Think that song sounds like 1979? duh. Refuse to accept the realities of life and the music industry? Hehe, good boy.

darthmise

Pigman you are a Musical Elitist.

There is nothing worse than talking to someone who thinks they are more of a music afficeniado than every one else.
People who have the attitude "i've been a fan since day 1, you just like them since they made it big, therefore i'm a bigger fan tan you"


Angel Whore, whether Blink 182 or Sum 41 are pseudo punk or not is way off point here. Where were you going with that one?

atonal

I think it is cool when good music is used in advertising, this helps expose people to more obscure music that maybe they wouldn't have heard otherwise... better than having every commercial with Britney Spears of stupid jingles anyway. As long as the product or use of the song is not totally contradictory to the songs original meaning.

Moby for one I think was pretty slick with Play using adverts to push his tunes, he realized they were not radio-friendly but they were perfect for commercials. Why is self-promotion and profit-making seen as such an evil by so many people, most artists I belive would like to reach the largest potental audience and be compensated as much as possible for their work. If a good tune is used in a commercial it is still a good tune.

I would love to see any of the independant artists I like become more popular through a commercial and make some money off it than toil in obscurity forever. With so little acess to new and different music in the mainstream media I think advertising is an increasingly viable format for new and different music to be heard.

po0k

just in refernce to the apt use of music....
Anyone see Higher learning? The one about the neo nazis? Rage Against the machine was used there, the skinny nazi lad was listening to it in his room.
Yet RATM are just about the most anti-nazi, anti-facist band I know of.
The tune was playing when he pulled the gun on the two other lads too.
Good use musicly (lovely build up and then the climax ), but not the best setting - the nazi having the weapon and the power etc.

Giblet

Seriously dustaz, If you think that a band forms only to become popular, you are just being ignorant. Do you think I formed my band to become popular, I dont think so mate. I formed a band because I wanted to make music, and to do that I need a drummer, singer and bassist. And if you think anyone can make up a song, you are mistaken, as boards band proved, many people have trouble using their instruments. Theres a difference between making up a song, and playing random chords and coming up with sub-standard lyrics eg: Nickleback. All these bands are doing is getting their daddys to give them money for a demo/ep and then mtv start playing their overly produced pieces of rubbish, just because they were told to. I wouldn't class them as muscians, I think actors is more appropiate in most cases. Fame would just be a consequence of my music. Not the reason for it. (In my case anyway)

Dustaz

I retract my comment. Reading back, it didnt come out exactly right and i look like an arse.

However, Nickleback and thier mates have more money and fame than you Giblet, so i think they would argue with you on some of your points there.

Giblet

There still shít though, and my point was that they got the money first, then the record deal, which they messed up by the way and had to get more money from daddy to "convince" the record execs to let them try again. Do you think that they got so much airplay from a good song, or from the "brilliant" albums they released, no its because they had the money, they had the contacts, and they didn't have to do anything. MTV and all the radio stations gave them unbelievable amounts of coverage. They are sub par musicians, chad is a run of the mill singer, and dont tell me you haven't seen a singer in a pub band that sounded better than him and their songs are atrociusly bad.
These people have no talent, and were bought into where they were, these people didn't have to work too hard to gain success, and i dont think I could bring myself to class them as a band.
Sams thing happened to Kula Shaker, and they died on their asses when they were found out.

atonal

Originally posted by Giblet
There still shít though, and my point was that they got the money first, then the record deal, which they messed up by the way and had to get more money from daddy to "convince" the record execs to let them try again.

dont tell me you haven't seen a singer in a pub band that sounded better than him .

I dont feel like knocking Nickleback (i have no opinion on them other than they bore me) in particular but both of these statements are kind of universal issues... I did not realized that Nickleback were a "daddy's money" band like The Strokes.

also I have seen many a damn fine musician in pubs who are far more talented most mainstream bands or musicians.. that is the truth indeed

and yes I belive most people who work their asses off creating and performing music are in it for the love cretainly not for the money and really there are cheaper and easier ways to get popular.

Kali

Originally posted by atonal
I think it is cool when good music is used in advertising, this helps expose people to more obscure music that maybe they wouldn't have heard otherwise... better than having every commercial with Britney Spears of stupid jingles anyway.

exactly, think what using stem in a guinness ad done for dj shadow.. (a re-release was even issued shortly after the ad went on air), got everyone back talking about the guy and copies of endtroducing started moving a little more.

what i don't particularly like myself is pos bands/groups trying to jumpstart music careers off the success from one small snippet of ad music (typically 20~40 seconds long).. see multiple levis ads for example.

Clintons Cat

Originally posted by SyxPak
just in refernce to the apt use of music....
Anyone see Higher learning? The one about the neo nazis? Rage Against the machine was used there, the skinny nazi lad was listening to it in his room.
Yet RATM are just about the most anti-nazi, anti-facist band I know of.
The tune was playing when he pulled the gun on the two other lads too.
Good use musicly (lovely build up and then the climax ), but not the best setting - the nazi having the weapon and the power etc.

its not uncommon for anti nazi groups or musicians to provide the soundtracks to films with a neo nazi content.a similar thing happened with the soundtrack to romper stomper.it prevents neo nazi groups from profiting from royalties and albumn sales/increased profiles.

]Originally posted by kali
what i don't particularly like myself is pos bands/groups trying to jumpstart music careers off the success from one small snippet of ad music (typically 20~40 seconds long).. see multiple levis ads for example.

babylon zoo...shudder actually i am old enough and sad enough to remember when levi's and guiness briefly raised the consiousness of a generation of thatchers kids to the delights of classic motown and blues...Muddy waters,Ben e king,sam cooke,marvin gay,jackie wilson,nina simone and louis armstrong...those were the days <nostalgic sigh>

The Gopher

Giblet-Do I get the feeling your one of these tits who think a decent band is crap as soon as they have a hit?If Nickleback reached an all time chart high of 173 they would be a great band that nobody likes.But if they get to numvber 1 they suddenly become pop.Grow up.

Giblet

Gopher don't be stupid, I know what im on about, and what I have said is true. And it's not a great song in any sense of the word. The album is also a rip off, it was about 22 euro, and it barely breaks half an hour Have you ever heard the first album either. It was rubbish, it got panned in America, for being rubbish naturally, and they didn't release it here. But after they got "success" with How you remind me, They decided to release it here. And it still got slated. Decent bands are Led zeppelin, Guns n Roses, Pearl Jam, Radiohead. Not Nickleback. I have a feeling your one of these tits that latches onto any song that isn't pop, and declares it the worlds finest in song writing.

Pigman

Originally posted by Dustaz


Look, Your point is ... SNORE SNORE ... proper fans?

THIS IS MY ENTIRE POINT, which is YES they do. People who like music a lot will in general not draw their influences from ads. They instead will probably listen to radio stations or talk to their friends a lot about to find out about the kind of music they like..

People who don't care as much will just hook onto the most accessible avenues of exposure ie MTV or a movie soundtrack or A TV AD etc. Bear in mind this is not to say the music they will hear is necessarily bad or uncool. In fact It's not even to say that it's not ok for these people to just enjoy their music to that extent without having to make it an obsession.

But what it is to say is that out of these latter group come a subset of people who like to think of themselves as ‘die-hards’ (or whatever you want to call it) even though they’re clearly not invested the time or interest in the subject to warrant the description. Nobody can be blamed for the kind of people they are but ad’s can be blamed in part for the kind of music they listen to and this is my point.

If you want, i could concentrate .... WAFFLE WAFFLE.... good boy.

You can if you like. It'd be more interesting than reading your endless stream of dogma about how we 'can't beat city hall' and ‘don’t rock the boat’ etc. If we all thought you then we might as well just sit down and die in the streets because we can't change anything? I hope that cleared it up for you grandad?

Pigman

Originally posted by darthmise
Pigman you are a Musical Elitist.

There is nothing worse than talking to someone who thinks they are more of a music afficeniado than every one else.
People who have the attitude "i've been a fan since day 1, you just like them since they made it big, therefore i'm a bigger fan tan you"

You’ve got it totally wrong.

I am not against people who find out about a band after I did. I am not against people just because they only like one song and that is all. I am not against people just because they know less about a band then I do.

What I am against is people who profess to love a band when they clearly don’t because it cheapens what the band means to you. It's like telling everyone you meet that you love them. You'll find that word will soon starts to have no meaning anymore.

Kali

Originally posted by Pigman
But what it is to say is that out of these latter group come a subset of people who like to think of themselves as ‘die-hards’ (or whatever you want to call it) even though they’re clearly not invested the time or interest in the subject to warrant the description. Nobody can be blamed for the kind of people they are but ad’s can be blamed in part for the kind of music they listen to and this is my point.

this is pretty much the only paragraph i understood.
and let me try and figure out exactly what your putting forward..
that there are a group of people that think themselves music afficinados simply because they know the names of ad music?
and you're saying therefore that because they have limited musical inputs they can't be true fans?
well i'd agree with that (if that is what you were saying), but again just because someone doesn't like listening to the radio or opening up their ears to new horizons doesn't make their opinions less valid. sure to people who like their music its all a bit crazy (i know ppl who haven't heard albums like pet sounds/revolver/debut/harvest yet still think of themselves as music critics).. all you can do is gently nudge them in the right direction

What I am against is people who profess to love a band when they clearly don’t because it cheapens what the band means to you. It's like telling everyone you meet that you love them. You'll find that word will soon starts to have no meaning anymore.

ahh but by saying that, you are acting somewhat as a "music elitist", who are you (or anyone else for that matter) to say what people like and don't like? what people latch onto? see above

Makaveli

I think Pigmans point is quite clear.
His problem is with people that hear one song, maybe go and buy the single, and claim to be this band/artists biggest fan.
When in reality they know fuck all about this band/artist but would like to act like they do.

An example of this which I have personally come across.
The Wu-Tang Clan released a track in 2001 or 2000 cant remember called Gravel Pit. This song got a lot of air time on MTV and a lot of people liked it.
You would however find then people saying they love Wu-Tang and know everything about them. So you would say, ask them a question about another song or earlier album and be returned with a blank stare. These people that profess to be die hard fans really dont know anything about the group except this one song.

This is what I believe to be his problem.
Why it is a problem I dont know. The fact is this will always happen, and well I think the title of this thread is wrong because obviously it's not a fuck up the ass of a band if they become more popular and generate record sales.

The way Pigman has gone about this rant though has made it look like he felt it was more like the ad fucked him up the ass because bands he was/is passionate about are now liked by people who would claim to be into them as much as him but dont actually know anything about them other than that one song or 50 seconds of it they hear.
This IMO is why everyone thinks he is coming across as elitest in his attitude when really his arguement makes kinda sense.

Anyway it's not a problem until you let it become one. So what if they claim to be into a band but really arent. It's no skin off your nose.

Pigman

Thanks Makaveli, I had just about given up trying to explain myself on this one so I'm glad at least one person understood what I was talking about in the end.

//

For anyone who still doesn't understand who I'm moaning about take a read of this exagerated scene from 'I'm Alan Partridge':

Ben: Bang & Olufson? Wow, that’s serious, man. Whose is it?

Alan: It’s mine.

Ben: I didn’t know you were into music. I know you’re a DJ, but I’ve heard your show.

Alan: Oh, yeah. I like all the bands. I’ve got a broad taste, you know. From the britpop bands like UB40, Def Leppard, right back to classic rock, like Wings.

Ben: Who’s Wings?

Alan: They’re only the band the Beatles could have been.

Ben: I love the Beatles.

Alan: Yeah, so do I.

Ben: What’s your favourite Beatles album, then?

Alan: Tough one. I think I’d have to say ‘The Best of the Beatles’.

//

Finally, Sorry for any bad comments to Dustaz. It's a pain in the ass when threads get a little bitchy.

The Gopher

Originally posted by Makaveli
An example of this which I have personally come across.
The Wu-Tang Clan released a track in 2001 or 2000 cant remember called Gravel Pit.
.

Speaking of the wu tang clan.............:D (this is a good one)


Old Dirty Bastard Arrested Yet Again
New York, New York:For the 50th time this year, famed Rapper Old Dirty Bastard has been arrested yet again, this time for jaywalking. ODB was caught on Tuesday by NYPD officers as he crossed Broadway Avenue while eating an ice cream cone, and immediately was arrested.

"This guy has got to be kidding," said Captain Lou Albano, leader of the NYPD Detective Unit. "Does he think we have all the time in the world? Christ. We have criminals to hunt. He's always doing crimes!"

Old Dirty Bastard has been caught for a number of offenses in recent weeks, including burning leaves without a permit, hitchhiking, walking barefoot on a highway, selling alcohol to a minor, disturbing of the peace, and for inciting a riot which devastated a suburban shopping mall.

"Yo! It not be like 'dat, niggaz!" said ODB in a press conference on Wednesday. "I just be eatin' my Hagen-Daaz when these bitches be all on my ass! Whassup wit' 'dat you stinkin' pigs? They's even took my freakin' ice-cream treat!"

NYPD Police headquarters stated that ODB will be held temporarily in custody, until a court case is scheduled. They also maintained that the ice cream treat was not removed from his custody--it had simply melted beyond practical consumption, and was taken so as not to "make a mess".

ODB's lawyers are seeking to file charges against the police, for unnecessary brutality and discomfort to their client. "The police had no right to arrest Old Dirty Bastard," said Howard Cohen., famed trial lawyer. "They were simply targeting him because of his high profile...that and his committing of crimes, I guess."

Representatives of the Wu-Tang, ODB's vaunted rap group, issued this statement. "Yo! Yo! Yo! Shoutin' out to Brooklyn! Let our people's go or we get nasty on yo' ass! Wu Tang forever!"

Mr. Rogers, children's television show host and friend of ODB, denied that Old Dirty Bastard is a criminal. "He is just the sweetest guy I know. He even wears cardigans JUST like me." He then proceeded to put on a purple cardigan and sing his "Neighbour song." He then opened up his '45, popped in a clip, and ran out the door, screaming.

Old Dirty Bastard's music career is yet again a question mark. Before his arrest, ODB was rumoured to be planning a series of concerts with pop group the Backstreet Boys, with Hanson as the opening act. He also expressed intentions of performing a duet with Wesley Willis, Chicago schizophrenic street vagrant, who has released over 10 albums. Willis was best know for the popular single "Alanis Morisette". There is no word on whether the Y2K bug has any relevance in this situation whatsoever.

Old Dirty Bastard isn't really all that old.

---

http://deluded.hypermart.net/odb.html

Pigman

Originally posted by The Gopher




"This guy has got to be kidding," said Captain Lou Albano, leader of the NYPD Detective Unit. "Does he think we have all the time in the world? Christ. We have criminals to hunt. He's always doing crimes!"

Lou Albano eh? I wonder if that's the same Lou Albano who was a pro-wrestling manager in the 1980s?

Rufus T Firefly

Thought I'd chip in on this thread, seeing as I write ads for a living. Sometimes for a TV commercial I'll commission a piece of music to be composed for it - not requesting a rip-off of another piece of music, simply looking for something that enhances the mood I'm trying to create.

So why and when would we use an existing piece? Usually it's when something already out there perfectly captures the feel of the visuals. The Levis ads are a perfect example. To be honest, it would be unusual to find session musicians who could create music with the atmosphere and quality of a Moby, Ben E. King, Hendrix etc. Then it's up to the record company and/or artist to decide whether they want to take our filthy lucre.

At best, this can result in a band with a small following getting a larger one. Whether they deserve it or not is totally a matter of subjective opinion. At worst, the artist(s) then have more money to keep them warm in their old age.

I have to say I've never met anyone who claimed enormous knowledge or devotion to a band offa a TV commercial soundtrack. Usually they just say, 'liked the music off the Guinness/Vodafone/Tampax commercial'. Perhaps I've just been lucky. And, as someone pointed out, it changes the quality of the music not one jot. Jimi Hendrix is currently being used for a car commercial. His music's still great (you young people should check him out sometime) and if means more people get interested in his music this way, then all the better.