Lets Take This Country By The Scruff Of The Neck (a New Political Party?)-please Read

Raskolnikov

Originally posted by Mr White


Above all,there has to be a nationalist aspect to any new party.And by that I don't mean left-nationalism,which is an imposter.

Are you some kind of Neo-Nazi or something?

You should see what some of your right-wing friends on the continent think if Irish people. Irish fans going to soccer games in Sweden, Russia etc were all attacked by Neo-Nazi's. There was a march by black and Irish people in Britain yesterday because of a disproportionate amount of them dying in British prisons. Not to mention ALL the far-right groups in Britain are to some degree anti-Irish and anti-Catholic. Then again i'm assuming you're some middle class schoolboy who has never been to places like Brixton and places in the east end of London.

sceptre

Originally posted by daveirl
*If I've misunderstood you sorry

No, you're correct (& that's what I thought you meant). Fault lies with me for not being able to read.

Mr White

Then again i'm assuming you're some middle class schoolboy who has never been to places like Brixton and places in the east end of London.

I'm a middle class former schoolboy who has never been to Brixton or the east end of London.What's your point?Do you think I should go there?

Foreign enmity confirms my belief that nationalism is the right course for Ireland:we must safeguard the future for Irish children in Ireland.Then perhaps we can work on other people's problems.

The Saint

So when the hell are we going to see this guys policies? I guess he's practising being a real politician and do things half arsed.

damien_gill

Apologies to all.

My laptop is in Dundalk at the moment being repaired (CD-ROM is not being detected)

so I cant very well convert political policies from Frontpage format to proper HTML in work. I'm expecting the laptop bakc on Monday (PLEASE GOD)

I know I'm proper little politician coming out with delay excuses (it's not an excuse it's the truth REALLY i can show you all the courier reciept if ya want)

The Saint

So you're paying off couriers now?

damien_gill

well yeah,

i thought i'd get practising on my corruption
(it will reduce the chances of me getting caught in the future)

ah no only buzzin of your bald patch kiddo

Borzoi

Originally posted by Turnip
I expect FG to collapse soon and its more competent sensible members will defect to the PD's, maybe some to Labour.

tee hee, should FG collapse, (which IMHO is quite likely, esp if another moderate party came forward,) I can't quite see the wooly headed liberal social democratic typical Fine Gaeler, jumping into the PD party of cuddly corporate facism. But that's just me.

BTW like the bold statements Biffa, but you're not my cup of tea.

Still waiting on Damien's views. (drums fingers on desk)

ReefBreak

Originally posted by damien_gill
...

I'm looking for people who are;

1: not afraid of ridicule
2: not afraid to speak exactly wot they want to in public
3: want this country to be so much better
4: want to take on th might that is FIANNA FAIL
5: is generally unhappy with the way that our government is being run.

...

YES THATS RIGHT I WANNA GET PEOPLE TOGETHER TO FORM A POLITICAL PARTY AND FURTHER MORE ONE THATS ACTUALLY FOR THE PEOPLE RUN BY THE PEOPLE.

...

COME ON PEOPLE NOW IS THE TIME WE CANNOT AFFORD TO WAIT ANY LONGER THAN WE HAVE. ENOUGH IS ****ING ENOUGH!

Sounds to me like the Socialist Workers Party. And we all know how much of a joke they are.

daveirl

This post has been deleted.

CCCP^

1) TDs Revokable and responsible at all times to the People.
2) Paid a reasonable amount- ie E300 a week would suit me.
3) Exploitation of Oil off the West Coast.

I'm convinced there is large quantities of Oil off our West Coast.

4) The Irish Transport infrastructure to recieve a radical overhaul. Think Autobhan*

I'd like to see a Train arrive on time for once. They arrive on time in Germany and France. I'd like to see Rails established in distant and isolated parts of the country. Afaik, Donegal doesnt have a rail system. I've looked at maps, there isnt any. It's hard to believe. What the ****? People dont live in Donegal? Or is it just "Not Economically viable"?

The people have a right to Cheap, comfortable and safe transportation. The Goverment has an obligation to the people to provide this.

5) Build up Irish domestic Industries - Heavy Industry in particular.

6) End the IDA. End Foreign MNC's using us. End the "Quick Fix".

Redirect capital wasted on Foreign MNC's and funnel it into Irish companies.

I have more ideas. but I'll stop here. I think I've bombarded you enough. Some of the idea's mentioned here are obvious, some naive, some downright idoitic. I think they do need to be addressed however.

*It's still there today isnt it?

Chaos-Engine

A suggestion:
Perhaps you should take a look at the EU political groupings. Once you have formed your party you can use some of the ideals of the grouping which most suits you and your party. Then when you have enough ground support use it as a spring board to the Dail. If that fails perhaps you could contact USI and help organise a storming of the Dail... Good luck

daveirl

This post has been deleted.

Biffa Bacon

1) TDs Revokable and responsible at all times to the People.

Who would have the power to “revoke” them? What would revoking them involve? In what sense do you want TD’s to be “responsible at all times” to the people?

2) Paid a reasonable amount- ie E300 a week would suit me.

At present, TD’s salaries are decided by some independent body (dunno the name of it). Instead of specifying some figure, you really need to propose changes in the way this body decides on an appropriate salary for TD’s.

3) Exploitation of Oil off the West Coast.

I'm convinced there is large quantities of Oil off our West Coast.

If there is, it should be left to the experts to find it. Independent oil exploration companies would have the necessary expertise here.

4) The Irish Transport infrastructure to recieve a radical overhaul. Think Autobhan*

I’m not convinced we need many large motorways in Ireland. They’re only useful in bigger countries where there’s a need for large distances to be traveled at high speeds. What we need is quality roads, i.e. without potholes, and more efficient traffic management.

I'd like to see a Train arrive on time for once.

Wouldn’t we all. How do you want to achieve this?

I'd like to see Rails established in distant and isolated parts of the country. Afaik, Donegal doesnt have a rail system. I've looked at maps, there isnt any. It's hard to believe. What the ****? People dont live in Donegal? Or is it just "Not Economically viable"?

Do we really want to be spending large amounts of money on bringing railways to sparsely-populated rural areas when their transport needs could be met by providing coaches and buses?

The people have a right to Cheap, comfortable and safe transportation. The Goverment has an obligation to the people to provide this.

I can’t agree with you there. It’s often necessary to provide a public transport system to help the economy, but no one has a right to public transport.

5) Build up Irish domestic Industries - Heavy Industry in particular.

Why heavy industry?

6) End the IDA. End Foreign MNC's using us. End the "Quick Fix".

Ireland’s economic boom of the 90’s was fueled almost entirely by multinationals.

Redirect capital wasted on Foreign MNC's and funnel it into Irish companies.

No government capital is spent on foreign mulitinationals.

ReefBreak

6) End the IDA. End Foreign MNC's using us. End the "Quick Fix".

I'm sorry, WHAT!!?? More to the point, what are you on? End the IDA? Close an organisation that has been responsible for helping to create (literally) hundreds/thousands of jobs in Ireland. End the IDA? In fact, I'll stop right now, because a comment as downright idiotic as this doesn't deserve comment.

And for ending Foreign MNC's "using us": you actually want to end one of the most effective systems of job-creation this country has ever seen?

Turnip

Originally posted by Biffa Bacon
Crime - violent criminals to be enslaved for a period of time proportional to the severity of their offence. Non-violent criminals to suffer fines rather than imprisonment. Rapists, murderers and paedophiles to be locked up for life, i.e. until they are dead.

Can't argue with that except non-violent criminals should be publicly humiliated in some fashion in addition to being fined.

Drugs – all drugs to be legalized. However, it would be an offence to consume them in a public place. All advertising of drugs would be banned. Age limit of 18 to purchase them. Addicts to be forced into cold turkey by the state.

If people take drugs they should not be entitled to any state health care.

Road safety – anyone committing a traffic violation to have their car confiscated for a length of time proportionate to the severity of the offence. Their driver’s licence would also be confiscated. And anyone wishing to buy a car would have to produce a valid driver’s licence. Also massive fines and/or enslavement for those putting lives at risk by their driving.

Agree with that, and agree broadly with abortion and oireachtas reform proposals.

Equaltiy – Equality Authority to be abolished. All equality legislation to be revoked.

Hmm, I'm not sure what the equality authority does exactly apart from excuse travellers from behaving like thugs, so I don't know about this.

Compensation culture – the principle of receiving monetary compensation over and above loss of earnings and medical expenses to be abolished.

Agreed.

Education – third level fees to be reintroduced.

Yes! Common sense. And I agree with Sand that there should be more emphasis on courses which actually end up providing the state with working people who generate tax revenue. People who spending 4 years studying the history of art or something at enormous cost to the taxpayer, only to end up going to work in an office answering a phone need to be screamed at. so higher fees for stuff anybody can learn in their free time if they really want, like philosophy.

What about immigration and social welfare?

I say harsher controls for refugees and asylum seekers, penalties for liars plus a massive PR drive to end this soft touch image abroad. And introduce a cap on non-EU immigration levels. I'm not against immigration but there simply isn't room or resources for the amounts of people coming here.

Massive cuts in social welfare are needed. In Spain I think they're proposing that people must take jobs they're offered or else they lose their dole. That's a good idea. Or else if someone is on the dole longer than 3 months then just cut them off.

Turnip

I'd also like to see some form of national military service for school leavers. 6 months would be long enough. It would teach people discipline and respect for authority and others and would instill them with a sense of duty.

Hellrazer

Originally posted by Biffa Bacon
Fair play to you Damien for having the guts to at least try something like this - don't listen to the small-minded naysayers. Every single politician in this State is useless and we need to get rid of them. The time is ripe for a revolution that will wash away the old guard, if only anyone is willing to grasp the opportunity. The goal of any new party should be to achieve an overall majority at the next election.

For what it's worth, here are my policy proposals:

Crime - violent criminals to be enslaved for a period of time proportional to the severity of their offence. Non-violent criminals to suffer fines rather than imprisonment. Rapists, murderers and paedophiles to be locked up for life, i.e. until they are dead.

Drugs – all drugs to be legalized. However, it would be an offence to consume them in a public place. All advertising of drugs would be banned. Age limit of 18 to purchase them. Addicts to be forced into cold turkey by the state.

Road safety – anyone committing a traffic violation to have their car confiscated for a length of time proportionate to the severity of the offence. Their driver’s licence would also be confiscated. And anyone wishing to buy a car would have to produce a valid driver’s licence. Also massive fines and/or enslavement for those putting lives at risk by their driving.

Abortion – current constitutional amendment (whatever it is) to be revoked and replaced with one saying that nothing in the Constitution could be interpreted as guaranteeing the right to an abortion. Then legislate so as to outlaw abortion in all circumstances except where there is a direct threat to the life of the mother. All health boards to be forbidden to pay for abortions abroad. Experimentation on embryos to be banned. IVF treatment to be banned.

Oireachtas reform – Dáil to be cut to about 50 members, probably less. Members to be elected by party lists (e.g. in a Dáil of 50 members, any party getting say 20% of the popular vote would be allocated 10 seats, which would then go to the top ten people on that party’s “list”). Seanad to have all its legislative powers revoked, it would instead become an oversight committee supervising all aspects of the State. The Seanad would have the right to call any public servant, e.g. judges, ministers, civil servants, Garda Commissioners etc. to explain their actions before the Seanad. Any new legislation would have to be put before the Seanad three months before it could be passed into law so as members could discuss it and interview the responsible government ministers. The Seanad could only make recommendations, it would have no powers to delay or alter legislation. Seanad members to be appointed by the President.

Equaltiy – Equality Authority to be abolished. All equality legislation to be revoked.

Compensation culture – the principle of receiving monetary compensation over and above loss of earnings and medical expenses to be abolished.

Education – third level fees to be reintroduced.

If I think of anything else I’ll post it up later.

Jesus Biffa have you suddenly joined Youth Defence or become the Pope or something.
I agree with all of your suggested policies ie crime,drugs,road safety etc. EXCEPT this one:
Abortion – current constitutional amendment (whatever it is) to be revoked and replaced with one saying that nothing in the Constitution could be interpreted as guaranteeing the right to an abortion. Then legislate so as to outlaw abortion in all circumstances except where there is a direct threat to the life of the mother. All health boards to be forbidden to pay for abortions abroad. Experimentation on embryos to be banned. IVF treatment to be banned.
The other part which I disagree with is that "IVF treatment to be banned".
Speaking as a person who is currently undergoing assesment to see if IVF is a viable option for my self and my wife I find your statement offensive.
I hope that some time in the future you find yourself in some predicament whereby IVF is an option for you and see how you feel then regarding the banning of this line of treatment especially if it is THE ONLY line of treatment available to you.
Also I dont know if you are male/female,but if you are male then you have no right whatsoever dictating what a woman can/should do with their body.Im no pro-abortinist but I am pro choice-But thats another thread.
You also seem to come accross as extremely immature.When you get some life experience then I may take your comments seriously.

Biffa Bacon

Originally posted by Hellrazer
Speaking as a person who is currently undergoing assesment to see if IVF is a viable option for my self and my wife I find your statement offensive.

Sorry but those are my views and I stand by them.

I hope that some time in the future you find yourself in some predicament whereby IVF is an option for you and see how you feel then regarding the banning of this line of treatment especially if it is THE ONLY line of treatment available to you.

Maybe I would feel different; I'd like to think not but who knows. But until then I have to go with what my conscience tells me.

Also I dont know if you are male/female,but if you are male then you have no right whatsoever dictating what a woman can/should do with their body.

Yes I'm male and yes I do believe I have a right to dictate what a woman can/should do with her body if that means protecting human life.

You also seem to come accross as extremely immature.When you get some life experience then I may take your comments seriously.

You said you agreed with all my policies except those two!

bonkey

Originally posted by Hellrazer
Speaking as a person who is currently undergoing assesment to see if IVF is a viable option for my self and my wife I find your statement offensive.

You find it offensive that someone could be against something which you hope to receive benefit from, but at the same time have no problem with agreeing that a number of other things should be banned because you're against them......without consideration of the people who hope to receive benefit from them.

Obviously your statements will be equally offensive to anyone who wishes to make use of those other areas, and they can level the same criticisms at your narrow-minded, blinkered view of hte world as you have just done at Biffa.

Which kinda means you should be careful about trying to assume some moral high ground. Your opinions are no better (or worse) than Biffas. They will be equally (or moreso) offensive to others.

For example....you have no problem agreeing that "elective" abortions should be banned. Have you any idea how offensive that is to people who find themselves in a situation where they believe it is the only course open to them? Id say about on par with the offense you've just taken. And yet you're right to say these should be banned, when Biffa is wrong to want IVF banned?

And before you go "there is always another option to abortion", I would point out that there is also alternatives to IVF. One is called not having kids. Theres a second option called adoption. Just because they're options you may not wish to choose doesnt mean they dont exist.

jc

Mr White

I say harsher controls for refugees and asylum seekers, penalties for liars plus a massive PR drive to end this soft touch image abroad. And introduce a cap on non-EU immigration levels. I'm not against immigration but there simply isn't room or resources for the amounts of people coming here.

A cap is a sensible idea:I propose zero.We can't just drift into a multiracial experiment; there must be some mandate.

Under Art.1.B.1 of the Geneva Convention a signatory country can accept refugees from either Europe only or from the whole world.We should apply option A,and I'd bet we did until the 1990s.Something changed at that time to cause a steep increase in the number of applications(from 0 to 10,000pa now).

CCCP^

Originally posted by CCCP^


I have more ideas. but I'll stop here. I think I've bombarded you enough. Some of the idea's mentioned here are obvious, some naive, some downright idoitic.*I think they do need to be addressed however.

* Sure glad I put that there

daveirl

This post has been deleted.

Hellrazer

Originally posted by bonkey
You find it offensive that someone could be against something which you hope to receive benefit from, but at the same time have no problem with agreeing that a number of other things should be banned because you're against them......without consideration of the people who hope to receive benefit from them.

Obviously your statements will be equally offensive to anyone who wishes to make use of those other areas, and they can level the same criticisms at your narrow-minded, blinkered view of hte world as you have just done at Biffa.

Which kinda means you should be careful about trying to assume some moral high ground. Your opinions are no better (or worse) than Biffas. They will be equally (or moreso) offensive to others.

For example....you have no problem agreeing that "elective" abortions should be banned. Have you any idea how offensive that is to people who find themselves in a situation where they believe it is the only course open to them? Id say about on par with the offense you've just taken. And yet you're right to say these should be banned, when Biffa is wrong to want IVF banned?

And before you go "there is always another option to abortion", I would point out that there is also alternatives to IVF. One is called not having kids. Theres a second option called adoption. Just because they're options you may not wish to choose doesnt mean they dont exist.

jc

Firstly Biffa I know their your opinions I just dont agree with them.I dont mean to sound ignorant to your views.
Secondly as I already stated the pro abortion/choice etc is for another thread which Im sure has already been done
.And as for whether you would feel different if you were told that IVF is the only option for you I can guarantee that you would.When I was a bit younger I used to have opinions like yours ie.that I never wanted kids,that I could handle being told that Id never have kids,that I never wanted to bring kids upin the world as it is,but when you are actually hit with something like that your opinions definately change.

Bonkey,
We`ve already looked into adoption but because of the mess up that is the state run adoption agencies the waiting list is anywhere up to 10+ years to adopt.
.As for not having children thats not an option for us.
I wouldnt consider myself to have a "narrow minded,blinkered view of the world".
And as for supposedly assuming some high moral ground Im not the one who wants to ban IVF,stop abortions of all types and start telling people what they can and cannot do with their lives.Id say thats more assuming high moral ground.I
never stated anything about their being another option to abortion- you forget that Im not the one who wants it banned.
Richie

Ajnag

If people take drugs they should not be entitled to any state health care.

Well then we had better make sure it applys to all drugs then, most notably alcohol and tobbaco.So lets make sure that anybody who has an accident with alcohol is left to die on the road side.Also being the defination of a drug what it is, lets not treat those who attempt suicide, or those who overdose on pharmacuitial drugs accidental or otherwise.If some Idiot od's on Viagra why should my taxs heal the horny bastard.but lets not stop there,
All those who through their own irresponsibility fall in to bad health are to immediatly be refused access to Healthcare
So all those fast food eaters are to be allowed to die as well.
Forget the fact that their Familys are also tax payers, Its their own fault.But **** lets not stop there, The Handicapped in many cases are unable to work and being that although their familys pay tax they do not!, as such they should be rounded up and sent to "camps", but that given Travellers, In most cases they dont pay taxs so they too can go to these camps, Hell lets just send the jews as well just for the fun of it!.

Biffa if you go anywhere near lenster house, Im gonna get me a nice Grassy knoll.

The Saint

I have a fiver in my pocket, thats a start.

daveirl

This post has been deleted.

bonkey

Originally posted by Hellrazer
.As for not having children thats not an option for us.

Prove it. Prove to me that there is no circumstance where you and your partner could end up childless.

I'm not trying to be heartless here. Im trying to point out that there is a difference between available options and options youre willing to take.

And as for supposedly assuming some high moral ground Im not the one who wants to ban IVF,stop abortions of all types and start telling people what they can and cannot do with their lives.Id say thats more assuming high moral ground.

Excuse me. You agreed with all points of Biffas except IVF. This is as much telling other people what they can and cannot do with their lives as Biffa was doing. You say they cannot do all these other things, but IVF is ok. If thats not "can and cannot" I dont know what is.

And yet, because Biffa disagrees on that one point, he is being offensive. You have no problem agreeing with several other points which tell other people how to live their life, but telling people they cant have IVF is, in your view, offensive.

So why isnt telling them they can or cannot have elective abortions offensive? Or state-funded trips to england for abortions? Or any of the other points that Biffa raised that you agreed with?

Your stance is equally as offensive as Biffas. Personally, I dont find either offensive in the slightest, but if you are going to start getting all high and mighty because someone disagrees with something you want to take advantage of, then you can only accept that others have the right to get all high and mighty with you for anything you believe in.

I never stated anything about their being another option to abortion- you forget that Im not the one who wants it banned.

I think youll find that you agreed with all of Biffas comments, except the one about IVF. Care to go back and read what you wrote, or do you need me to supply a quote to prove it to you?

This means you agreed with his comments about "elective" abortions being banned. Which means you are one of the people who wants it banned.

So, yes, you want abortion banned. This is OK, but wanting IVF banned is offensive?? Come off it.

jc

damien_gill

OK point taken not 752 people but altough I'd actually like to know how many people have viewed this thread.

But still this thread has generated enough interest for it viewed 752 times whether they are by the same people or not do you not agree?

Turnip

Did anyone see the channel 4 programme on the BNP's Mark Collett last night? That's the class of character we'll have running around causing trouble if something isn't done about immigration and if someone doesn't stand up to the liberals and the lefties ludicrous claims that a multicultural society will be some sort of a utopian paradise. Bear that in mind for this party.