Greatest Briton

simon_partridge

OK, maybe you're not interested in this being Irish, but the BBC are running a series of programmes aiming to find the "greatest Briton". The top 10 voted from a general poll are being shown and a further poll taken to decide the winner after the shows. What d'you reckon?

Dustaz

Shakespeare.

His prolific genius is rivalled only by Lennon, but since lennon had McCartney also, then willie gets the nod.

wtf is cromwell, elisabeth 1 and diana doing in there? Im guessing they were voted for by the great unwashed.

sceptre

Ah, we've just a different view of Cromwell to the English. We see him as evil because of all the massacres. They ignore the massacres because he didn't crap in his own pot and just see him as forwarding the cause of constititional equality. After Cromwell died and the monarchy was restored, the monarchy never dominated parliament again. He was still an evil bástard though.

Kind of like Lord Denning - regarded as one of the greatest minds in contract law (still), since the birmingham 6 (or maybe guilford 4, can't remember), regarded as a bit of a plonker in criminal law.

Can't start to defend the inclusion of princess Di or Lizzy wooden teeth though.

I'll go for Brunel, tempted as I am to vote for Newton or Shakespeare.

DiscoStu

Either Newton, or Darwin. Im going to go with darwin because i abbsolutly suck at calculus(and spelling).

El Marco

I voted for Isaac Newton as Mr. Bean wasn't in the top 10.

I watched the show on the night and I personaly thought it was excellant program as I was expecting it to be somewhat cheesy

But iaf what is Dianna doing there :eek:

mike65

The inclusion of Di and Lennon is barking, and frankly a surprise, but then you can make a case for the other 8. I'd vote for either
Newton or Shakespear as thier influence stretches through the centuries and is global. Its unlikely such individuals will be seen again.

Mike.

KdjaCL

David Beckham

LOL

kdja

NeVeR

???

Weres Kelly Brook, Emma Noble,Dani Behr ,Caprice,Melanie Sykes

theres tons more :cool: :rolleyes: but i will pick one and vote .just dont know yet

mike65

Someone voted for Diana! :eek:

Mike.

Slutmonkey57b

The only undeserving candidate is Di. It's a series that was well worth watching.
Why does Elizabeth I belong in the list....
Uhhh.. she only prevented the country from beign taken over by Spain and created the first British Empire and the Roayal Navy and uhhh...

Gordon

Go Isaac go Isaac go Isaac
/me does a Rikki Lake shimmy

The only reason I didn't vote for "ME" is because I'm Scottish - not British!

daveirl

This post has been deleted.

DC

I went for Darwin because of his contribution to areas like anthropology, zoology and because of his bravery in tackling the church on their Adam and Eve nonsense.

Shakespeare would be a close second, with honourable mentions for Brunel and Elizabeth I.

Ah sure, didn't Diana touch all our hearts :rolleyes:

The Gopher

Contrary to opinion here I think it is actually the more middle class folk voted for Cromwell-the average idiot in the street probably knowing very little about him.Can I ask who are the 2 people here who voted for him?Probably from Navan,seeing as Tommy Tiernan once said"Drogheda is where Navan people go to get stabbed".:D
I saw a bit of it last night and Di had 8% of the vote-obviously the tabloid brigade and your mothers must have been on the phone(if I had a euro for every feckin royal documentary my mother has hogged the tv for.God only knows how the Irish can closely follow a family which has taken part in the takeover of their homeland for 800 years).
I suppose the best was probably Churchill,despite his hostillity to our neutrality.Shakespeare shouldnt even be on the list-I sat through two of his plays in school and found them to be a load of racist and secterian(sp?) bullsh1t,in general poorly written with vague descriptive qualities.
And anybody who couldnt see a gay subplot in The Merchant of Venice doesnt have a brain,despite that our teachers insisted otherwise.:rolleyes:

DiscoStu

not to mention the slight gay vibe from those sonnets.........

simon_partridge

Originally posted by daveirl
I voted for Newton but because he was a great scientist but by all accounts he wasn't a nice guy.

Which, I suppose, raises a question about what you mean by "great"... if it's just someone who made a massive difference then you can throw in people like Hitler. Maybe they should be called "anti-great" or something?

Two examples - he invented differential calculus at the same time as some guy in Germany (I think) and he refused to acknowledge that he should share the accolade.

Yeah that's right, Leibniz came up with the calculus simultaneously, and is reckoned to have expressed it in a far better way - Newton only ever applied it to functions involving time (such as his motion equations) whereas Leibniz's method is usable throughout maths.

Dustaz

Originally posted by The Gopher
Shakespeare.....in general poorly written with vague descriptive qualities

rofl

Karl Hungus

Originally posted by simon_partridge
if it's just someone who made a massive difference then you can throw in people like Hitler.

Yeah, ffs! VOTE HITLER!!!

Terminator

Darwin's revelations turned the world upside down. Gets my vote.

Manach

Voted Churchill. Leaving aside his ambigous record regarding Ireland, he shone during WWII in rallying the Allied cause.
If this was a PR system, my 2nd vote would goto Shakespeare, as how his plays touch on generic issues which cut across all cultures.


Bottom 2:
Nelson, only fair sailor, discipline problem & Sidney was a better Admiral.

Cromwell, lost Ireland for being an integral part of common UK political structure.

PH01

Isaac Newton, beacuse he was Irish!

mike65

Originally posted by PH01
Isaac Newton, beacuse he was Irish!

eh? He was born near Grantham in Linconshire.

Mike.

Thorbar

Darwin got my vote, then for second its a toss up between Newton and Shakespear. Based purely on how much their work has affected my outlook on life.

PH01

Originally posted by mike65
eh? He was born near Grantham in Linconshire.

Mike.

Yeah I know - I was only taking the pi$$.

davej

This has to a toss up between Newton or Shakespeare.

Shakespeare has had the most profound effect on what it means to be a human. His work really does appear timeless. His exploration of the human condition - the concept of romantic love, jealousy, madness, anger. He invented thousands of words and phrases that are still common use today. Every day you are speaking Shakespeare and you probably don't even realise it.

As for Newton, he was a genius - inventing a whole branch of mathematics (calculus) because he needed to. Newtonian physics was the pillar for what was to come in the 20th century. All rocket science is based on classical physics. Also all of you gamers out there..classical physics is very important for realism in games.

The other contenders are a joke compared to these two guys. While Darwin made one of the greatest discoveries ever, I don't think the man himself is up to par with Shaky or Newton.

davej

Harper

Originally posted by sceptre
Ah, we've just a different view of Cromwell to the English. We see him as evil because of all the massacres. They ignore the massacres because he didn't crap in his own pot and just see him as forwarding the cause of constititional equality. After Cromwell died and the monarchy was restored, the monarchy never dominated parliament again. He was still an evil bástard though.

Kind of like Lord Denning - regarded as one of the greatest minds in contract law (still), since the birmingham 6 (or maybe guilford 4, can't remember), regarded as a bit of a plonker in criminal law.

Can't start to defend the inclusion of princess Di or Lizzy wooden teeth though.

I'll go for Brunel, tempted as I am to vote for Newton or Shakespeare.

That's Rubbish, the English Kings , Queens and Generals persecuted and murdered many Welsh, French and English.


The greatest of the people, Moore

Thomas More (1478-1525)


Figure of the Renaissance. He was hanged gutted and beheaded by Cromwell and King Henry VIII because More opposed Henry's actions in taking control of the Church in England, thereby placing the King as spokes person for Justice and above God.

In 1935 More was made a saint by the Pope.


This film shows a man sacrificing high office, his position in society, and ultimately his life, for religious principle. It introduces Sir Thomas More, a most extraordinary man. The film also provides an introduction to the history of England in the sixteenth century.









King Henry VIII (1491 - 1547; reigned 1509-1547) was concerned about a renewal of civil war if he was a little usless at producing heirs as some English were, and did not leave a male heir. His wife of 16 years, Catherine of Aragon, bore him a healthy daughter, but their sons were either stillborn or died shortly after birth. Entranced by the young and vivacious Anne Boleyn, and convinced that she would bear him a son, the King sought to annul his marriage to Catherine. .The King's response was to sever England's relationship with the Church and to set up a new Church of England with the King at its head, representor of God.

All of this occurred against the background of the growing strength of the Protestant Reformation in Northern Europe and in England. More was loyal to the Catholic Church and believed that Western European Christianity should remain united. He correctly foresaw that a separate church in England would encourage Protestantism. When More refused to endorse King Henry's policies, Henry imprisoned him. When More would not relent but instead wrote books and pamphlets opposing Henry's plan to persecute others, place the King in a position above God and separate the Church in England from Rome, Henry gave him a slow and terrible death.




He was a man of medieval piety but also a leading figure of the Renaissance, a movement which increased the secularization of society. More wore a hair shirt and prayed extensively each day. More believed the Catholic Church was the visible communion of Christians that was the permanent and living sign of Christ's presence. Ultimately, he gave his life for this belief. More considered his persecution of heretics to be one of his greatest achievements, requesting that it be specifically mentioned in his epitaph. But More was also a leading humanist, advocating reforms in education and creating a classic of Renaissance literature which envisioned an ideal society that was religiously tolerant and not dominated by Christians.


Thomas More was both a man of literature and a man of affairs. He wrote many books and is a world famous author. His Utopia is still read and studied more than 500 years after it was written. It established a genre of literature in which books describe an ideal society. Among More's several other books was a biography of King Richard III (on which Shakespeare based his play; see Learning Guide to "Looking for Richard"). While the accuracy of More's biography has been questioned, it is recognized as a masterpiece of prose, perhaps the best produced during the reign of Henry VIII. It is the beginning of modern historical writing in English. But success as an author was just one of More's accomplishments. He also served as a respected lawyer, a revered judge, and an official in the royal government. Due to his talent and his indefatigable industry, More served in the positions of under-sheriff of the City of London, ambassador, secretary to the King, Speaker of Parliament, administrator of large portions of the kingdom, and finally Chancellor of England, the highest post that a commoner could attain. At the height of his power More had more prestige than any member of the nobility. He was one of the few persons who had the courage and moral authority to give advice that the King did not want to hear.



More excoriated heretics and he personally ordered several to be burned at the stake. Yet his Utopia visualizes a religiously tolerant society without a Christian Church.


More was a man of great seriousness, but also a wit, a jokester and an entertaining dinner companion.


More was a man who loved life and loved his family but he mastered his fear of death and sacrificed everything for what he considered to be the greater good of his own soul and of Christendom.


English students who don't study how cruel and evil their Kings were are simply ignorant.

Beruthiel

Mr. Isaac Newton gets my vote followed by Mr. Darwin

Harper

The Dutch and French writers hate
"Darwin"

The think his survival of the fittest theories were an excuse for the expansions and hundreds of invasions by the English on other lands, and massacres of peaceful Nepali, Navite Americans and Pakistani tribes

Thorbar

That's a bit like blaming god for what the Spanish did to south and central America.

leeroybrown

I gave Brunel a vote as he's an interesting choice

monument

I had to at the bbcs having two or three irish people, but the uk people voted them in!:p

walt

steven seagal and arnold schwarzenegger get my votes

mike65

Churchill wins with about 450,000 votes with Brunel just under 400,000 and Diana third with 222,000 votes.

Mike.

sceptre

Originally posted by Harper
That's Rubbish, the English Kings , Queens and Generals persecuted and murdered many Welsh, French and English.

Not 3000 in the one town in the past 500 years. And none of your murdering kings, queens or generals made the list.

What any englanders got up to in France doesn't even support what you were trying to say.

Wossack

I was waiting for one of those nobodies from Big Brother to get voted in :rolleyes:
ah well