Idea: Over 18 Boards site...

DeVore

Hi there,

Ok, Regi and I were talking about stuff and the future of boards and what have you and we bounced an idea around for a short while. Now I havent given it a lot of thought but heres the idea...
(First I have to explain the slight problem we have....)

We are getting pretty big now as a community. Which means lots to things to lots of people.
We've a culture and a history which may not gel with some of the things we might want to do in the future.
I'm particularly talking about adult-topics.

Now, we tried PI and its working. However, it occasionally gives me and the admins a heart attack when people confess or request help for some pretty unreal stuff.
I dont want to expose younger readers to much more of that but I also STRONGLY believe that adults shouldnt be held back by childrens sensitivities...

So, we considered creating a new Boards.ie website. Yup, you read that right. A brand new website which is associated with Boards and run like boards but contains only adult boards: ie:
GLB, Cannabis Legalisation, Singles, Sex, Fetish etc etc

All the stuff that people may want to talk about without risking it being seen by kids. We're considering using a nominal charge via credit card of 5 euro a year for membership to prove that you are over 18. (We could just ASK but then every kids going to say YES and its no legal protection either).

By making it a money transaction we can create a contract too by which we cant be sued or held responsible for posts made.

So, as I said we came up with this thought yesterday and havent thought it through yet but I thought I'd whack it out for discussion to give a lot more brains on the topic.

btw, I cant think of any board that would move from here, even PI is better here I think.

This is going to need a lot of brain-crunching.

DeV.

Shinji

If you think there's a market for it, go for it. I think it'd be a useful resource, BUT - and this is a big but - you'd need to moderate it tighter than a gnats ar$e. Much more so than Boards.ie, and with much more of a view to hard-to-spot things like dodgy stalker types and what have you, because as useful as a board like that would be, it would also probably attract some pretty unpleasant lowlifes.

Turner

Originally posted by DeVore
We're considering using a nominal charge via credit card

You would be surprised the amount of boards peons that dont own a credit card.
Dont get me wrong i'd be all on for it just you might need some alternative payment methods.

Chief.

phreak

Originally posted by DeVore
We're considering using a nominal charge via credit card of 5 euro a year for membership to prove that you are over 18. (We could just ASK but then every kids going to say YES and its no legal protection either).

and if you don't own a credit card, you can't join even if your 18?

Shinji

Oh, er, one other thought comes to mind.

You mentioned the GLB board as one that should go onto this new site - which strikes me as fundamentally a bad idea, and perhaps a general flaw in your thinking about this. The fact is that most over 18s are probably the people least likely to need any kind of support group for this kind of thing (and various other issues like that) - you're talking about excluding under-18s from that sort of discussion, and they're probably the people who need advice on that kind of matter most.

Perhaps a GLB board on boards.ie /and/ a GLB board on adultboards.ie wouldn't be a bad idea - it would allow stricter moderation of the boards.ie GLB board too, because genuinely adult topics would be moved to the adult board.

bubbles

Best idea in a while DeV

Can't wait for all the **** to happen - you know. someone buts up a post and it gets locked or they get banned 'but i paid my €5'

And an over 18's board just screams of porn to me.

Why not have a 'mature' section. Where people have to fill out a form or something to given access - Isn't a digital signature i.e Tom Murphy a legaly binding contract in this country? And on this form people must provide thier landline phone number or something to register. That way you'll have their address

Dustaz

I dont know why, but for some reason this idea doesnt strike me as that great (not just because I'd be immediatly packed off to the Senility Issues board either:P ).

Boards is great as it is, irrespective of age. There are other places to discuss what the new site would do and tbph they're all a bit seedy.

I really cant explain why i think its not a good idea, it just doesnt seem right to water down boards somehow.

Ack, i know ill end up paying anyway.....stupid devore pusher bastardo

daveirl

This post has been deleted.

Celt

Originally posted by DeVore
We're considering using a nominal charge via credit card of 5 euro a year for membership to prove that you are over 18. (We could just ASK but then every kids going to say YES and its no legal protection either).

Evil.

DeVore

Ok, thanks for the feedback so far (except Celt, thats not exactly helpful).

The GLB board is one thing I hadnt really thought about. As Shinji says, it probably should exist on both the same way that PI wouldnt be moved as it serves a purpose for everyone here.

As I've said, this isnt an announcement of something we ARE going to do, its a call for help from me to think through the implications and results of something like that. Clearly we have people who are in favour and opposed, which shows that this is a complex issue and not necessarily a clear cut one.

the Credit Card thing: its not for the money, its not like 5 euro for a year would be a big load of cash now is it. Its more for the proof of age. Bubbles, digitally signed agreements are legal but you need to have a digital cert issued by the government so no, anything you "agree" to on the internet ISNT necessarily binding.
I understand that that law hasnt been tested thoroughly yet.

Thanks for the feedback so far, its given me more to think about so keep it coming...

I do think its important to be responsible as far as adult discussions which underage people can read go. I dont want to have a discussion on the legalisation of cannabis and have some 14 year old think "Hey DeVore says its cool to smoke" and get wasted and **** their lives up because they arent equiped to deal with it....

You see what I'm getting at?

DeV.

Boston

Hmm, you persume everyone over 18 has a credit card, and that every under doesnt. Also i dont like the idea of you have to pay to take about this, but not that. While you have said its not a money issue, a fial to see it any other way. Your talking about charging people for access to boards basically, which is fine, but all of a sudden its no longer the same baords. if you need moeny donations will allways be there. at the last boards beer, everyone must have droped at least a tenner into that bag.

bubbles

Well, then again DeV there may be 16 year olds for example who are fairly mature - even more mature than some 23 year old members - so its not really fair to exclude them because of their age.

As for credit cards? Daddy, can I use your credit card to buy something online, its only €5 - I'll give you the money.

Sure son.

You can't really use credit cards for age verification.

How about a system where you have 4 or 5 people who will decide who is responceable and mature enough to be given access. The admins know most of the hardcore members.

As for other members - how about they can't get access untill they have 50 or 100 posts under their belts.

Then they can request access. Then its up to the admins or the 4 or 5 people mentioned above to either decide the person should be given access, going on their past post record.

You could set up a page where these 5 people can log in, and the people who request access will be listed along with 3 options.

1) Yes 2) No 3) Havn't read much of the persons posts (or something.

Then these 5 people select one of these options per applicent, and if they get 3 or more yes's then they are given access.

Just an idea.

kaimera

Can you check a person identity via banks if say, aswell as credit cards for those who have them, others with bank a/c can just transfer the money?

Rev Hellfire

I think its a great Idea. As one of the older (though I stress not near the oldest member) of the boards community a board with a somewhat old crowd does appeal.
As for the posts about 'eck me no got a credit card' I think thats just compaining for compainings sake. There are few ppl these days over 18 and definately in the late 20's/30's+ who dont have a credit card. And fewer again who dont know someone with one who could do the transaction for them.

GoneShootin

i know this is totally off the wall [prob cos my brain is mush from blasted study]

but

to signup for adultboards.ie, you must submit a copy of a valid birth cert. via email / post. include all legal blurb about PSP SKILLZ etc

endIdea();

bubbles

/me opens up photoshop

Samba

A good idea in some respects and a bad one in others.


/me can see Dev passing on info about users taking part in a cannibis discussion thread


perhaps there could be an alternative solution as opposed to a credit card?

Tough one I know, but fact is many people do not have credit cards.

DeVore

see we dont want to have human interaction in the ign up process because we'd be snowed with them and then someone has to spend a LONG time setting up or qualifying users. We dont have cash to do that.

Credit Card companys insist that you take cash during the transaction , they wont allow 0 value transactions (understandably enough).

You're right about the support from the Boards beer bashes and thats something I've thought of but as I've said, its not a cash issue.we'd probably get a few thousand a year sign ups, say 1500 tops I'd imagine, and 5 euro thats only 7,500. Take 2000 for hosting alone and thats 5,500 left. Not enough for a living wage and more then we need if we arent employing someone.... so it doesnt seem like a good idea but I cant think of a better one...


Hmmm this has more issues then I had thought. Need to put my thinking head back on...

DeV.

bubbles

Then again why should you worry about children entering this area? If you put a splash page on saying must be 18+ to enter.

I mean, its the parents responcability to make sure thier children do not access mature sites on the internet. Not yours DeV. If the guardian of the child isn't responcable to monitor, there's nothing stopping the kid seeing simular content, or worse somewhere else.

Personally, I wouldn't let my children full access to the internet until they where ready for it, whatever age that would be. Seen way to much sick and wrong stuff out there that I wouldn't want a child of mine exposed to.

DeVore

yeah I agree with you bubbles... thats why I'm thinking hard about this one...

You , kids... EUW!! The Genepool needs some chloride.

DeV.

bubbles

Thats a terrible thing to say about our son DeVore! You're not getting custosy of him tomorrow now. So you might as well return the handcuffs.

Gordon

How about a small fee for Private boards? Not for every user but for the board.

I for one would pay a small fee to have the *ahem* kittencake board every year.

BuffyBot

I'm with Dustaz here. I don't know why I don't like the idea - but I don't. It seems silly to water things down at this stage

Can't be more specific, but I just don't think it's a good idea

Ste-

Originally posted by Gordon
How about a small fee for Private boards? Not for every user but for the board.

damn it i was gonna suggest that.
and im 20 and aint got a credit card wudn't trust myself with all the "films" available to buy.

Boston

I also think you overstating the popularity of this thing, its one thing to give 5 euro to support boards.ie, its another to give five euro just to sit around talking about hash and period pains.

I honestly thing free flow of ideas is the best way forward

yellum

Originally posted by Gordon
How about a small fee for Private boards? Not for every user but for the board.

I for one would pay a small fee to have the *ahem* kittencake board every year.

Jesus ! I agree with Gordon, I'd pay for a private board too. In fact I'd pay for Gordon to have his Kittencake board at this stage once he ****s off to it and never mentions the mixing of cats and cakemix on the rest of boards.

Gordon

Heh, maybe I should do an auction - highest bidder gets the glory of getting rid of the kittencake activists and have kittencake to be a censored word.

Surely there would be a huge amount of people wanting to contribute for custom avatars and other such possibilities. After this is up and running then maybe another new, bigger invention could be close at hand.

The_Bullman

I would disagree with a new board, but unlocking more mature options would interest me. Options would include the swearing not filtered, and also the adult boards pages. If at all possible it would be good to keep them all available from the boards main page.

koneko

I'm with Gordon on this one. Anything that would allow us to get Kittencake is good.

PiE

I really think you're overestimating the demand for such a board in Ireland (I know people from other countries could join, but surely you'd be looking for mainly Irish).

Ok, maybe some of the older boards.ie people would sign up, but people who don't arrive at the new site through this one wouldn't be happy just handing out €5 for access to a messageboard. I know for sure that as soon as an unknown site mentions money to me I head off in the other direction. The boards.ie users would have an idea what they're getting into... the non-boards people wouldnt... or something.

Anyway... no, don't think it'd be a good idea tbh.

mike65

Dont like this idea at all, boards should be for all, or no-one.

The idea of paying to read the outpourings of others depraved minds is'nt attractive either!

If it has to be done can't a special encrypted board be set up with
posting via e-mail or somesuch. (me no clue about net tech stuff)

Mike.

DeVore

Hmmm, well I'm going to think about it some more but I dunno if it will work.

I honestly dont think we could have an "S&M" board on boards as we are at the moment. I'd want it to be adults only especially anything pertaining to the discussion of drug legalisation.

The money thing isnt important, we're sorting out the finances of Boards.ie currently (setting up bank accounts and the like...) so we'll have more about that hopefully before the new year.

Anyone else got an opinion about the topic at hand?

DeV.

PhilipMarlowe

Singles, Sex, Fetish etc etc

If you dont charge for these type of boards they would surely be populated by fluff....
Multi-signups saying "Hi, I'm a 19 year old slutty babe, send me your man pictures now..." type stuff (I'm thinking boston here)
Even charging might not make it worth the effort.

Shinji

Quick comment on the credit card thing:

Yes, kids can say "daddy can I use your credit card" and their parents might not check what they're using it for, but that is NOT your problem. Credit card verification is considered to be legal proof of age - basically it means that you, the provider, have done everything within your power to ascertain age, and if utterly píss-poor parenting has foiled you, then that's not your fault.

As to those without credit cards.... *shrug* Tough. The internet operates on the basis of credit card payments.

The five euro fee is an excellent idea, partially because of the credit card thing, but mostly because you can put an AUP up saying what does and doesn't go on the board (strictly worded) and point out that NO refunds are applicable to anyone kicked out under the terms of the AUP. Bingo, no more "d3v0r3isgh3y" accounts, because it costs a fiver a pop for them to register them, only to have them banned a minute later. Makes it much easier to have a mature, sensible discussion.

Blade

The only way I can see people paying any kind of a fee for an adult site would be if it's a proper adult meeting ground and discussion forum. I don't think this is what you have in mind? I only flew through this thread so I mighta missed something.

If your idea is for a purely adults moderated discussion forum then I don't think it will attract enough people it would need to succeed as a new web site even if it was totally free. A new area here with warnings and net nanny protected would do. Bubbles is right, it's only a discussion board not a porn site so warnings will be enough.

p

I'd imagine that when boards.ie started up most/a lot of it's regular posters were under the age of 18. Remember those days. I'm sure there was plenty of 'mature' and immature discussions that wen't on.

The older you get the less credit you give teenagers for being mature.

I think this should be avoided at all costs.

The only possible reason to do it would be for a legal reason, but I don't think any of the topics Dev mentioned at the start would have any legal implications or reasons for not allowing udner 16s to discuss the matter.

- Kevin, remembering surfing the web when he was 16

Originally posted by Blade
The only way I can see people paying any kind of a fee for an adult site would be if it's a proper adult meeting ground and discussion forum. I don't think this is what you have in mind? I only flew through this thread so I mighta missed something.

If your idea is for a purely adults moderated discussion forum then I don't think it will attract enough people it would need to succeed as a new web site even if it was totally free. A new area here with warnings and net nanny protected would do. Bubbles is right, it's only a discussion board not a porn site so warnings will be enough.

I agree entirely with the above.
Heck, discussions while sometimes bordering on infantile have taken place on the PI board, lots of under 18's aparently are well able to hold their own subject to heavy moderation with adult material.
As mentioned already, personal issues and adult issues aren't exclusive to over 18's obviously, and heavily moderated advice should be available to all in my honest opinion.
mm

Boston

Originally posted by Licksy20
I'm thinking boston here)

There's a first, dont hurt yourself now, the poor little tike is all tuckered out awh

Shiminay

It's not a bad idea, but I'm with Dusty - I'm not sure it'll sit right within the existing entity that is boards.ie

I'm all for the idea of mature discussion of adult only topics, but setting up a seperate site - I dunno, I'm not sure it would work out. I'd pay my €5 for it no problems if it did go ahead though.

DapperGent

I don't like the idea of having a seperate site.

I wouldn't mind paying the fiver or anything or have a problem with the suggested forums but wouldn't it be better to just fence off bits of boards?

That way it would all still be the same community-just with an adults table. I think hiving off new ideas would dilute whats here which wouldn't be good.

DeVore

Hmmmmm.

ok, firstly thanks to everyone for the loan of their brains. Its really helped (as ever) and spotted a few problems with the idea.

For the moment we're going to shelve the idea and look at other ways to support mature communications going forward.
Blade's (?) comment about the Raison D'etre of the site made me sit back and think a bit. We're not in the porn industry so I'm not interested in anything like that. We wouldnt want to set up a dating service (although some of you seem to treat Boards Beers as that! *cough*). So whats to be afraid of...

I dunno, time to go back to the drawing board.

Thanks again guys, I had a feeling that that was one idea that needed a group effort to think it through...

I hate backing off anything, even if its for sound reasons so I'm going to create the GLB board now and see how it goes. If it causes too much muppetry I'll shut it down again.

DeV.

monument

I'm going to have to say I'm with Dustaz two.

But DeVore if/when you do it, you would want to be v. carefull about making people know its not about/for porn or dating.

the main reason for this would be it could harm boards.ie image,

there are a lot of people out there with twisted views of the internet. even if it was only used indirectly for some twisted people to contact each other.

just be carefull when messing with fire!

bubbles

Very god point monument - I'm sure last thing the admins want is to get boards.ie blocked in places of work and college - They'd be getting very few hits indeed!

DeVore

Yeah, that was why we were going to make a totally separate site with them...

I think the idea needs a lot more thought so I'm tossing it back on the backburner.

DeV.