ITDirect: ANYONE ELSE HAVING PROBLEMS WITH THEM?

Blub2k

I recently bought a sound card for a disabled mate of mine, as he uses dragon sound is very important also being in a wheelchair his mobility is extremely limited. I brought this back to his home installed it and was amazed at the clarity of sound until after a few minutes the pc locked up and produced a loud beep. I phoned Creative and they told me they know of the problem with dell pc's and not with Gateways in fact with no other pc.
Anyway I did a few things that were described on the creative suppport and even tried some open source drivers always with the same result. I then phoned ITDirect and they said ok for a refund you need to phone Creative and get a customer number(?) they explained this was to save me time.
I did this and then when I had a free Saturday I decided to bring the card with customer number and receipts to the shop. When I arrived on the Saturday then I was told no refunds unless the manager is there, he had not mentioned that on the phone when I spoke to him. I was not asked for the receipt on the first day as it did not get that far. So I phoned the shop today (Monday) to be told that I would have to bring in the card for them to test.
My main question would be who allowed ITDirect to rewrite consumer law when it comes to devices which are not suitable for their purpose to be sold to unwitting customers? Why should the device have to be tested when it clearly does not work in the system which it is meant for? The manager of the shop seems adamant that THEIR procedures will be followed and otherwise the disabled friend is 140 euro lighter and has a sound card which is no good to him. The employee or the manager (dunno who) has also decided to embellish the story by saying that I did not have a receipt with me that Saturday. I have now wasted a weekend day to help a disabled friend and he is still crippled and unable to use his voice activation software and the guy in the shop is calling us liars hmmmm.
So has anyone else had a horror story with these guys? I would not recommend them to anyone and am interested if this is the way they operate or is this an isolated case?
Thanks for any feedback.

Mork

Sorry to hear your woes Blurb2k,

I've been there with those To$$ers and had similar problems, I've pm'ed you the full "experience" I had ITDirect. In a nutshell you

I'd never buy anything from them again and recommed other people to avoid them like the plague.

I buy all my components from http://www.komplett.ie never had any problems from them at all. Have a look at the komplett forum on boards, customer service is second to none.

-Mork

Rambo

What sought of sound card did you get?
what os or you using?

1. Before installing did you make sure you disabled any on board sound cards that may be on the system

2. make sure the sound card fits in correctly on to one of PCI slots

I have got many things of Itdirect and only had one problem and that was with memory they replaced it straight away no hassle..

my computer system is built on parts on got from ITdirect and its working fine ..

I think you should double check every thing before you go back to Itdirect or creative because it may be something silly like the sound card being lose.. or some setting in the bios

Well you said the sound card was working for a few minutes

what happens now when you switch on computer?

Gerry

Firstly, don't post with caps lock on. It makes you look like a child.
Calm down and think about what you are saying.
The reason that they told you to ring creative is that there is a fair chance that this will speed up proceedings. As far as I know, you are only entitled to a full refund on the spot if you give back the product as it was sold to you ( i.e. so it can be resold ).
Otherwise, if the card is not actually faulty, itdirect are left with 1 card that they can't sell, or send back to creative.

Now itdirect are not innocent here. They should not have turned you away just because the manager wasn't there, ordinary staff should be authorised to deal with refunds. I'd also say it was quite stupid of the staff member to say you did not have the receipt with you.

Now I don't know if the card is faulty, but lets just say for a minute that it is not. So that means that when itdirect test it, it will work.
"Why should the device have to be tested when it clearly does not work in the system which it is meant for?"

Well there are millions of hardware combinations out there, unfortunately the card may not work off the bat in all of them. Some systems may need a bit of fiddling to get the card working. Just because it doesn't work in your system doesn't mean its not of merchantable quality. Its
an incompatibilty between your pc and the card. There are numerous possible causes for this, the system may need new chipset drivers, changes to bios settings, changing the pci slot the card is in, and many more. This is not the shops fault, its the hardware manufacturers.

If they test the card and it actually is faulty, they can offer you a refund or a replacement.

As a little background, I worked in maplin electronics for about 2 years, and itdirect for a few months ( about a year ago ), and in 99% of cases of hardware returns, the hardware was not faulty. But that didn't stop the customer swearing at me. I usually ended up testing the hardware there and then, and showing the customer the card working in a machine to convince them.

I suggest you go in with the card, see whether its faulty or not, and then go from there.

Blub2k

Yeah well I am also a hardware and software engineer and there is clearly an issue with the creative audigy2 and the intel chipset that is on the machine that it has been put into.
A refund by law is available when the product sold is not suitable for the purpose for which it is sold, most shops appear to ignore the law on this one. In the end we spoke to customer support in Creative who are sending out a taxi to pick up the whole system today and they were disgusted with ITDirects handling of the situation and will be onto them as it sounds. Anyway I'm sure they appreciate your loyalty Gerry but when there is an issue with a device then the device is not suitable unless there is an admission made in the documentation about an issue and in this case there is not as then it is not suitable for the purpose for which it was sold. This is being resolved to the satisfaction of my mate in the chair but no thanks to ITDirect who will probably be receiving a call from the Creative Brand manager who was also very interested in the case.

Saruman

A quick google finds this. Since i dont have the model of the Dell i cant be more specific but it looks like a bios update has been released for a lot of the models it has the problem with. Did you check that before? Anyway at least Creative are getting it sorted!

Also someone mentions its down the the wiring of everything in the system, even down to the psu being done wrong.. and down to PCI latency and the like..

leeroybrown

Firstly, don't post with caps lock on.

Thats not much of an annoyance compared to reading a block of text with no discernable spacing or paragraph structure. This is something that there has been quite a proliferation of on boards recently.

It's almost as annoying as people who use non-line-wrapping mailers on mailing lists.

Blub2k

Yes there is an issue with Dells but unfortunately they are not Gateways. In any case Creative are sorting it out for him and my advice re ITDirect stands, they do not care about a guy in a wheelchair who needs his voice activation software to work and all they were prepared to offer him was the standard response of well have you tried this, I dont have the time available to fix it for the guy and already I give up quite a bit of my free time to help him and dont invoice him for it. ITDirect are not customer focussed if you are aware of this and buy from them then good luck. I was also not impressed that they lied and whereas they started out quite friendly and at no stage refused a refund they bend the law to suit themselves and if Gerry could explain how opening a box to find out the product does not work then bringing it back in that practically virgin state to be told it needs to be tested does not infringe on your consumer rights?

Lucutus

In fairness to IT Direct, they do have a good manager, Glen or something I think his name is.

Unfortunatly, they also have an idiot boy register biscuit. This kid is undeniably stupid when it comes to dealing with customers.

When dealing with IT Direct, always ask for the manager, if the manager is not on the premises, ask for his number or for register biscuit to call him, or a time when the manager will be there, and talk to the manager (IT)directly.

Luc

The_Bullman

Let me see..

So you are saying that I could buy a chip burn it out and return it a few days later and expect them to give me my money back?? Just because I used the original packaging. A little naive I think

Blub2k

Who posted with Caps lock on? You mean my subject line? Gerry if you want to patronise someone you have the wrong address man, I understand that you might wish to have your rules enforced but to post in caps as I would know it would be to capitalise the whole post, but then I think you wished to begin by using that as some sort of lame attempt to delegitimise my point. Anyway you are a mod and your word is probably law or something.


Funny enough lucutus it was the manager who really got the goat up and he is the one telling me I was lying. Gareth is his name.

Bullman: Interesting interpretation of what I said are you reading another post? So what you are saying is that once you open packaging you are stuck with what you bought, please, MS try this on their windows cd's too but it does not work in the real world, they are not allowed to attack your basic consumer rights that is a fact.

leeroybrown

While the treatment recieved may not be of the best quality, I can sympathise to a certain degree with staff having to test it.

My main question would be who allowed ITDirect to rewrite consumer law when it comes to devices which are not suitable for their purpose to be sold to unwitting customers? Why should the device have to be tested when it clearly does not work in the system which it is meant for

The fact that the device didn't function properly in your friend's PC actually bears little relation to whether it is working or not. If the device is tested and found to be fully functional then it's fit for the intended purpose and the problem is at your end.

Normally in cases like that, retailers exchange the items out of good faith and customer relationship.

Testing is essential for hardware as between 30% and 50% of all returns to Computer Hardware retailers is genuinely not faulty and doesn't need to be replaced.

My normal line in situations is to be nice to the people I'm dealing until I'm sure theres a problem.

Blub2k

When there is an issue with a piece of hardware that I possess and I have not been informed of this by the manufacturer then it is not my problem. If their FAQ mentioned problems with the chipsets etc and I had not read them then I would say yeah my problem but not in the case where the device will not work because there are undocumented hardware conflicts, this I do not accept to be my problem and this device is a working device that I know but it will not work in the system that it was bought for and as a result is unsuitable, I have done RMA's before as well I have been a hardware tester I know the process but this is something I disagree with and you can talk policy all you want it is against the law, Creative even said that they would have expected the money returned within 31 days with no questions asked, dont let your brainwashing at the hands of companies policies influence you on this, most of these policies are contrary to the law, that is reality, most people do not challenge this atitude this is also reality. I have been speaking to an Irish lawyer about this before and I know that the law is not being upheld.

leeroybrown

Could you please use paragraphs?

Rambo

If the sound card does not work with your computer and the card is tested ok then Itdirect will take the sound card back with original package..
and receipt and will refund you money back.
they will then resell it a lower cost to next buyer..

Cyrus

eeem mate no offence but if u bought the card and its functional then it direct are prfectly right not to refund you. its not their fault that it is incompatible with a particular chipset.

did you tell the guy you were buying from what motherboard u were putting it in? and did he guarantee it would work? if not then its not their problem and imo its between u and creative?

A refund by law is available when the product sold is not suitable for the purpose for which it is sold

the product was suitable for what it was sold, it just didnt work in your pc, you are trying to twist the legislation in your favour but your interpretation of it wouldnt stand up, and i know ive studied law for four years now.

eth0_

I don't think you can brand a card faulty just because it doesn't work in your machine. If IT Direct test the card and it works ok for them then I don't see why they have an obligation to refund you because YOUR PC doesn't work with the card.

As for them not telling you it'd be compatible...come off it. How can a small retailer like them know every single piece of kit that is incompatible with another?

Hopefully Creative will be able to sort it for you anyway mate.

Raz

I have to agree that if it's a problem with chipset compatibility it's then between yourself and creative, and not IT Direct.
If the board were improperly soldered or something like that then of course IT Direct should roll over backward for you.
But the fact that it works for a time before it shuts off gives the impression of a compatibility issue. That's not IT Directs problem.
That's what you should have researched.

But that said, it doesn't excuse them from the treatment which you recieved at the counter. IMO an employee who is dealing with a customer should give that customer the benefit of the doubt until such time as irrevocable proof can be shown that the customer was wrong.
I think that businesses in general treat their customers with very little respect and treat them as unwitting idiots who don't have a clue what their doing.

Gerry

A number of points to address here.

I merely expressed my annoyance at you using caps lock for your thread title. I didn't do this in a moderator capacity, I would be annoyed about it on any board. It does make you look foolish, theres no need for caps lock except very occasionally to emphasise one or two words.

No-one is disagreeing that IT-Direct have treated you badly. I do think that you should have received a refund if you brought back the product in near mint condition, saying that you just wanted your money back. However, you came back saying it was faulty. Normally, this implies that you want a replacement card, not a refund. This usually means that the shop will have to test your card, do you expect them to send a fully working card back to creative and ask for a refund?

With the benefit of hindsight, you are now saying that it is an issue between the sound card and the motherboard chipset. Presumably you accept that the card works in most other machines. Hence it is not faulty, in the sense that the manufacturer regards it as a working card. It has incompatibilities, which as a software and hardware engineer you seem to be quite ignorant of. This happens with an awful lot of hardware, sometimes for quite inexplicable reasons, sometimes because of design oversights.

Since the SBLive, Creative have a history of producing sound cards which have incompatibities with various hardware chipsets. I know this, from building machines for the last god knows how many years. About a year ago, I built a machine for someone who wanted to use their machine to professionally ( well at least semi-professionally ) record songs. Unfortunately they were on a budget, so we ended up with a via chipset, and a lot of tears until we could record and playback without crackles. It took months to get the problems sorted out. Who do I blame for that? The shop ? I don't think so mate.

You seem to have ignored the fact that IT Direct did not design and build the card, Creative did, and you seem to be letting Creative off the hook. Its not IT Directs responsibility to guarantee that every piece of PC hardware is inter-operable, unless they build your pc for you. Creative made slip-ups in the design of the sb-live, which they still have not corrected. But because they are a massive company, they can send out a taxi, and pass the blame to IT Direct.

Yes, IT Direct treated you like crap, but then again its not their fault the card didn't work. Sorry this post went on so long...

elexes

well tbh i like it direct . i have always thought that the staff in there knew what they were talking about to a degree . in the past ive ordered stuff off them and have had probloms but every problom that i found got sorted on the spot just cause i went in there with a easy attitude and explained to them what had happened .

u do have a point your product that you purchased dose not work with your computer . but i bet it works with mine the ones in my work and a load of others . it is usualy up to the person purchasing the item to make sure that it will work in there computer b4 buying it . i have this problom in work a lot and explain to everyone that if it dose not work with your pc and u have opened the box or made sh!t of it i will not take it back as it will of been used and i cannot sell somthing like that .

in reality i do take back most parts unless the person is a ass . by the sounds of things the card worked for 2 min's then stoped . try updating your bios make sure the irq's arent conflicting

Raz

Originally posted by elexes
if it dose not work with your pc and u have opened the box

Bit of a paradox there! How you meant to know if you don't open the box?:rolleyes:

leeroybrown

Normally you can find known incompatabilities/problems by using google, hardware review sites, etc.

The point is that while 99% of the time retailers test and then take back parts that fail to operate correctly with other hardware they can reasonably claim if they want that it is fit for the purpose described and hence your issue is with the manufacturer.

Luckily, normally they are nice about it.

elexes

well id normaly look to make sure everything i buy will work the way i want it to and with my current hardware b4 i buy any product

like buy a car that you wont get insured in then bring it back and ask for a refund