Bush II - The Village Idiot, Biffo, Fatso & WMD

gwbtbahs

As Operation Iraqi Freedom (Upchuck) continues (see the link below for current stats), can we assume from the list below of countries with various types of WMD that the gob****e in the Whitehouse will not stop his murderous criminal war mongering until he has visited his war machine on them all?

I have ordered them alphabetically to make it handy for him given that he is such a cretin

Algeria
Argentina
Belarus
Brazil
Chechnya
Cuba
Egypt
Iran
Iraq
Japan
Kazakhstan
Libya
North Korea
Romania
Saudi Arabia
Serbia
South Africa
Sudan
Syria
Taiwan
Ukraine

In addition the following have nuclear weapons though he won't touch them for different reasons:

Russia, United Kingdom, France, China, India, Pakistan & Israel


This fool is in Ireland today yet our own compliant village idiot Bertie, with Biffo & Fatso, will treat him as the Worlds greatest thinker philosopher and peacemaker.

HOW STUPID ARE WE???????????????????

We are not neutral on international issues - we are neutered.

http://www.iraqometer.com/
http://globalsecurity.org/wmd/world/index.html

ReefBreak

[snipped - next time try and post something called constructive criticism. Happens again Reefbreak I will ban you for at least a week! - Gandalf]

All I can say is that the Middle East will be a far safer place now that the Butcher of Baghdad is (almost definitely) defeated.

Personally, I'm glad Ireland stayed on the side of the coalition.

juno75

[snipped - keep it civil do not react to others ignorance - Gandalf]

ReefBreak

I'll take that as a compliment!

dahamsta

People like you generally do.

adam

Lemming

Originally posted by ReefBreak

All I can say is that the Middle East will be a far safer place now that the Butcher of Baghdad is (almost definitely) defeated.

yes and no.

Yes it's nice to see Hussein being given the boot.

No it's just set the tone for massive destabilisation in the region with such a sudden and violent political vaccum being created.

The Kurds & Turkey to the North, the Iranians & the Shiite muslims in the South, etc, etc.

There's nobody holding the borders in check any more, which was part of the reason why Stormin' Norman called a halt in Op.Desert Storm. Iraq was (then) keeping Iran in check, but more than that various regional factions were being forced to toe the line also.


Incidentally, ReefBreak .. if you want to see "ill-informed" I suggest you go to yahoo news and view the pro-war commentary given by many people to various articles and tell me who the vast majority of the "ill-informed" actually are.

One veteran summed it up rather well by saying that he supported the troops, but he didn't have to like it.

Cork

This fool is in Ireland today yet our own compliant village idiot Bertie, with Biffo & Fatso, will treat him as the Worlds greatest thinker philosopher and peacemaker.

I think we did the right thing morally and economically. Sanctions did not work aganist Iraq. 1441 was newer going to be implented.

idiot Bertie

An Taoiseach. Name calling & lashing out achieves nothing.

Hopefully, the US will now bring democracy & Human Rights to Iraq. If they do, Fair play to the US + UK.

Lemming

Originally posted by Cork

An Taoiseach. Name calling & lashing out achieves nothing.

Idiot Idiot Idiot Scum-sucking Gangster is probably a far more apt title for Berrrrrtie

Or .... "inept politician"


Cork, he doesn't deserve the title of "An Taoiseach". I can think of few polticians that have done so little and done much worse to the people of this island in my time.

As for morality, what have we done right?? Sincerely tell me. That we are morally right for allowing "might equals right" to prevail? To allow bully-boy tactics to be proven to work? And then to allow a hypocrite try and preach to the parties in the north, when all he has done himself is show that "might makes right".

gwbtbahs

---

Listen Pal

Read the following. Read it carefully. Educate yourself. Click on the links. Read the content. See what Americans and Australians are saying. And above all [snipped - howabout you read the forum rules where it states people have to keep their discussions civil - next time some one posts something you disagree with report it or face a ban].


"Extending the war into Iraq would have incurred incalculable human and political costs. We would have been forced to occupy Baghdad and, in effect, rule Iraq. The coalition would instantly have collapsed, the Arabs deserting in anger and other allies pulling out as well. Exceeding the U.N.'s mandate would have destroyed the precedent of international response to aggression we hoped to establish. Had we gone the invasion route, the U.S. could still be an occupying power in a bitterly hostile land."


-- From Why We Didn't Remove Saddam by George Bush [Sr.] and Brent Scowcroft, Time Magazine, 1998


http://www.sfgate.com/columnists/morford/
http://www.theage.com.au/articles/2003/01/29/1043804405887.html

ReefBreak

[snipped].

Wonderful. Now, go upstairs and finish your homework.

gwbtbahs

There are none so blind as those who do not wish to see

There are none so deaf as those who not wish to listen


I rest my case.

dathi1

All I can say is that the Middle East will be a far safer place now that the Butcher of Baghdad is (almost definitely) defeated.

tee hee...reef stick to surfing in Spanish Point..u obviously haven’t a clue about Arab opinion...and if you think the new Shia nation in the south are going to be friends of your favorite "democratic" state; Israel you're way off the mark.

fisty

I love when people visit the political forum without doing their "homework" on the subject, lol.

ReefBreak

I've moved on - SP is far too small, I'm taking on 10 footers in Doughmore these days.

Altough Daithi, I hope you're not anywhere near any anti-war marches. Your pro-Palestinian-Terrorist views means that your Anti-War views count for nothing. Sorry.

ReefBreak

Originally posted by dathi1
...and if you think the new Shia nation in the south are going to be friends of your favorite "democratic" state; Israel you're way off the mark.

Perhaps...would you prefer Saddam Hussein?

The Corinthian

Originally posted by Cork
I think we did the right thing morally and economically.

Morality is immaterial in matters of diplomacy and statecraft. I assume you’re bright enough to realize this. If something moral is achieved from all this, it will be nothing more than an altruistic by-product of national self-interest.

And the topic of national self-interest would bring us to the second point - that of “right thing... economically”. Here I would agree, that economically both the US and UK are likely to benefit from this. But you are not American or British; as much as you may wish you were Cork (unless there’s something I don’t know about your lineage). The reality is that Ireland’s economic interests are probably more aligned to France and Germany’s in the long run, than the US or the UK. We hardly joined the EEC all those years ago to become more dependant of British trade, did we?

We may get a few scraps from the table (such as US firms being able to hire more Irish labour due to the profits of this war bonanza), but Ireland will not see any strategic benefit from it, realistically.

An Taoiseach. Name calling & lashing out achieves nothing.

Do I detect a one of De Party’s Soldiers of Destiny in our midst? :rolleyes:

Hopefully, the US will now bring democracy & Human Rights to Iraq. If they do, Fair play to the US + UK.

This is the thing that confounds me of the pro-war sympathisers. Surely they cannot be so naive as to think that altruism is ultimately the motivation of such conflicts. History has repeatedly taught us this, over and over again.

I can respect support for this conflict based on patriotism or even utilitarian self-interest. And if you are a US or UK citizen, you are entitled to do so (were I one, I probably would too). But I cannot respect a position based upon some childish delusion of morality that ignores practically every Western intervention in the last half century.

Victor

Originally posted by Cork
Name calling & lashing out achieves nothing.

Thats why I think Bush should stop ("axis of evil" and the invasion of Iraq).

dathi1

Altough Daithi, I hope you're not anywhere near any anti-war marches. Your pro-Palestinian-Terrorist views means that your Anti-War views count for nothing. Sorry.

Pro War in defence of Palestine? ...yep 100%

Perhaps...would you prefer Saddam Hussein?

The guy the CIA and sucsessive US admins backed over the past 30 years (WMD sales Super Gun etc) Na..perhaps the UN might have been a better option.

comet

yes we're neutral, lets roll up in a ball, cover ours ears and eyes.....see no evil, hear no evil. The reality is evil is out there and it isn't George Bush, he may be a poor misguided fool but he ain't no evil dictator, whatever cynics say he is the democratically elected leader of the US. So we're giving some of their planes some fuel..... big deal. It's us Irish getting all excited about our importance again. Other countries don't gives a f**k what our position on this war is, our stopover thing is not a logistical issue in this war, they can just stop somewhere else so we might as well make a few quid out of it. Peoples superficiality shows, Blair gets away with it cos hes got a big smile and looks good, it seems Bush (and to some extent Bertie) looks too ordinary so hes considered dumb, don't judge a book by its cover. Bush is too easy a target.

SkepticOne

Originally posted by The Corinthian
The reality is that Ireland’s economic interests are probably more aligned to France and Germany’s in the long run, than the US or the UK.

Ultimately yes. I think Bertie's support for the US in the current conflict is designed to put off that eventuality for as long as possible.

All I can say is that the Middle East will be a far safer place now that the Butcher of Baghdad is (almost definitely) defeated

You have got to be joking. The whole middle east has just been fed with a new surge of hatred for all things western. In their eyes, western nations have caused more strife to the Arab nations than anyone else. The invasion of Iraq, is just a re-affirmation that the west is willing to make rules in regards to wars, but is more than willing to break em, when its inconvenient.

Also, consider that in 6 months, Iraq will be forgotten by the world. The US will probably have found some new country to invade, and the world will focus on that. Considering the lack of posts in here for the past three weeks, in regards to afghanistan, it does bear out that peoples attention spans are very short.
Once the Coalition leaves Iraq, don't be too suprised if you start hearing horror stories, of what happened to the Iraqi people that supported the coalition against Saddam. Give the country 2 years, and there will probably be a arab militant group in power, with harsher policies than Saddam had.

I was glad when Saddam was deposed. However i'm not innocent enough to believe that things will be rosy for the Iraqi people.

I think we did the right thing morally and economically. Sanctions did not work aganist Iraq. 1441 was newer going to be implented.

"We" did nothing. The use of Shannon wasn't decided by Irish people. It was decided by our government. Shannon was the only input the Ireland had on this war. And i doubt the coalition even remember using it all that much.

1441 was never going to be implemented? Are you a prophet? But then again the US have stopped the chance that it would have worked. Cork, remember that Blix, your hero, stated that the decommisioning of arms was going very well, just prior to the war. The Coalition smashed 1441 into the ground, for their own reasons.

Altough Daithi, I hope you're not anywhere near any anti-war marches. Your pro-Palestinian-Terrorist views means that your Anti-War views count for nothing. Sorry.

Well considering that Israel/Palestine is in constant termoil, either stand on the issue, counts against anti-war views. But then again, i'm pro-Israel, while still being against this war, and all it "stands" for.

ReefBreak

Originally posted by dathi1
Pro War in defence of Palestine? ...yep 100%

Sooo... You support the deliberate and intentional murder of innocent civilians by terrorists? Do you support the Omagh bombing? Or Enniskillen? Or Claudy? Or the Dublin & Monaghan bombing also? Also, try and see if you can find anywhere in Boards.ie that shows that I support the IDF.

dathi1

You support the deliberate and intentional murder of innocent civilians by terrorists?

eh...no...I support any action by any citizen or force against the occupation. ie: You Steal/ "settle" on my land bomb and kill my relatives ..I have the right to defend myself.

Also, try and see if you can find anywhere in Boards.ie that shows that I support the IDF.

eh....where does it show on boards that I support killing innocent civilians.
Sadam is gone........Sharon should be next (occupation, invasion and lots of WMD)..oh no he’s "Democratically elected"

ReefBreak

Originally posted by dathi1
eh...no...I support any action by any citizen or force against the occupation. ie: You Steal/ "settle" on my land bomb and kill my relatives ..I have the right to defend myself.

Does "defending myself" include exploding bombs in University canteens, buses, wedding receptions? This is exactly the type of warped reasoning that the IRA and Real IRA have used in the past.

Originally posted by dathi1
eh....where does it show on boards that I support killing innocent civilians.

Everywhere. If you make excuses for Palestinian Terrorists, then you're making excuses for the deliberate and intentional murder of civilians. Apologies if I'm repeating myself, but I think this bears repeating again and again.

dathi1

Does "defending myself" include exploding bombs in University canteens, buses, wedding receptions?

u mean mossad?... again defending youself against the IDF a occupying force occupying and stealing your land.

then you're making excuses for the deliberate and intentional murder of civilians.

no as we have seen recently and since the begining of the second intifada..the IDF are masters at this type of activity.

bonkey

Originally posted by dathi1
eh...no...I support any action by any citizen or force against the occupation. ie: You Steal/ "settle" on my land bomb and kill my relatives ..I have the right to defend myself.

And how does one break from the circular logic which ensues?

The Palestinians say "you kill my people, I have a right to defend myself". Off we go and bomb some people.

The Israelis say "you kill my people, I have a right to defend myself". Off we go and bomb some people.

Conclusion - tit-for-tat violence all of which is perfectly justified (except for perhaps the initial act, if anyone can remember exactly what it was) by your reasoning.

Interestingly, I see headlines about a Palestinian school having been blown up by Israeli extremists. I wonder how long before those extremists are denounced as "not representative of Israelis in general" while the Palestinian extremists will continue to be representative of their nation.

url : http://www.arabicnews.com/ansub/Daily/Day/030410/2003041011.html

jc

dathi1

no JC its simple....I have said that these people have a legimite right to wage war in self defence agianst a military occupier / invader / agressor......I never said anywhere that people should ge out and bomb innocent people or whatever tit for tat.

dathi1

And how does one break from the circular logic which ensues?

You break the mindset that somehow a person for some biblical reason can steal your land, occupy it and then label you a terrorist for resisting that occupation weather by peacefull means or not.

Bateman

How could you leave out Iran as a country with nukes??

Lemming

Originally posted by bonkey

Interestingly, I see headlines about a Palestinian school having been blown up by Israeli extremists. I wonder how long before those extremists are denounced as "not representative of Israelis in general" while the Palestinian extremists will continue to be representative of their nation.

There is actually a lot of doubt as to whether or not that group carried out the bombing. Apparently not the first time they'd have claimed responsibility for somethign they didn't do.

You break the mindset that somehow a person for some biblical reason can steal your land, occupy it and then label you a terrorist for resisting that occupation weather by peacefull means or not

it wouldn't be such a problem to most people if the Palestinians restricted themselves to military targets, but they don't. More often than not, its civilian areas that are hit. The responses by Israel are terrible, but no worse than what these "freedom fighters" are doing.

As to the occupation of territories, i'm not totally for it, however, considering Palestine tried invading Israel, at one stage, its undertstandable. Will you call Iraqi troops that resist US occupation throughout the next couple of weeks, "freedom Fighters"?